2024 US Presidential Election

[moose eater]

if you just wipe out a cartel you create a void that other cartels will fill
we need to go to the top. the mexican gov are turds and its all out war!
or we can cut off a lot of the free money being given people and enforce the laws here in the us that fuels the whole drug trade

but im still all about invading mexico

There were observations made about wolf behavior in the Kenai Moose Refuge in the early 70s. It wasn't a formal study, but it rendered some very useful information. Though many continue to ignore the lessons learned... Humans...

And the wolves, once the people and bounty hunters began efforts toward eradication of packs or partial packs, the wolves did -exactly- as you described. In the end, they ended up with MORE wolves, not fewer. And more packs.

And packs will generally grow to a certain size, then splinter off for unoccupied territory.

Imagine that!!

You've raised a known and established -logical- result of doing what some here are advocating to be done.

 

[Microbeman]

It may be surprising how difficult it would be to 'take out' the cartels. Also there are many thousands of Americans here. Also China owns the largest shipping ports here and would have Mexico's back

Mexico is doing pretty good for semi-failed state. The peso outperformed the USD in 2023 and most of 2024. I make 11% on my money here. Whadya make there in the land of opportunity?

 

[moose eater]

The United States of America. Why? Because we share a border with Mexico and American weapons are easier to get than Russian made that have to come from the other side of the world.

I'm not chanting USA USA USA when I talk about something like this. It's not some slogan. People would die. But in the end more people would live.

I just don't understand why so many are not looking at this option. There are a bunch of so called experts that say it wouldn't work and point to Columbia. That was something entirely different. That was some black ops/CIA assisting the corrupt Columbians not a force of US soldiers determined to wipe out the enemy just a few hundred miles from our border.

Some people are happy that less people are dying from overdoses. Some people are not going to be happy until we reduce the out of control overdoses.

When you have a hose that's leaking at one of the fittings at the end you don't just keep wrapping tape around it. You cut the end off and put a new fitting on. That solves the problem.

I grew up working farms, starting at age 9. I still grow crops. Your experience with repaired hose ends differs from mine.

 

[moose eater]

It may be surprising how difficult it would be to 'take out' the cartels. Also there are many thousands of Americans here. Also China owns the largest shipping ports here and would have Mexico's back

Mexico is doing pretty good for semi-failed state. The peso outperformed the USD in 2023 and most of 2024. I make 11% on my money here. Whadya make there in the land of opportunity?

Many US savings accounts are at .5% to .05%, depending on what type. Time-lock Certificates of Deposit that once made large dollars in return are now lucky to return 4-5% in many cases.

As a now-deceased acquaintance in the Yukon Territory told me 20-some years ago, the era of the US Empire has ended, it's just that the sound of the ivory towers crashing into the sea hasn't yet traveled to the ears of the residents there.

And yet still, like hopeful optimistic children, they cling on to fantasies of yesteryear. Klingons, once again. Clinging on.

 

[xtsho]

If "screw international law!" is a serious battle cry (and no, it's not true that no one follows it, though the US certainly doesn't), then what someone's saying is that "might makes right, your word on a contract or treaty amounts to nothing, and there's no honor remaining, and we can all just do as we please if we have a bigger gun or a stealthier strategy."

Doesn't -really- sound like the world someone really says the want. But it lets the testosterone loose in a Rambo-like (or similar movie) sorta' way. Unfortunately, in reality, as opposed to movies, there are consequences for cultivating such an approach to life.

But if we want to talk about the insurmountable untamable force that is the US military, I think there's some Taliban and some Viet Cong who'd like an opportunity to add some accurizing foot-notes to that nationalist fantasy stuff.

The thing with the Taliban and the Viet Cong is that they were fighting for an ideology. These cartels are just in it for the money. They would rather be broke and alive than die fighting for something they believe in. They would run and disperse. It's an entirely different dynamic.

Think about it. People will risk their lives for money but they are not going to knowingly die for it. The Taliban and Viet Cong have/had many willing to die for their beliefs/cause. Nobody is going to strap a bomb to their body and blow people up for the cartels except under duress.

 

[pop_rocks]

If "screw international law!" is a serious battle cry (and no, it's not true that no one follows it, though the US certainly doesn't), then what someone's saying is that "might makes right, your word on a contract or treaty amounts to nothing, and there's no honor remaining, and we can all just do as we please if we have a bigger gun or a stealthier strategy."

Doesn't -really- sound like the world someone really says the want. But it lets the testosterone loose in a Rambo-like (or similar movie) sorta' way. Unfortunately, in reality, as opposed to movies, there are consequences for cultivating such an approach to life.

But if we want to talk about the insurmountable untamable force that is the US military, I think there's some Taliban and some Viet Cong who'd like an opportunity to add some accurizing foot-notes to that nationalist fantasy stuff.

if you loosened the roe the us is unstoppable, but we pander to pu$$y politict$$ all the time
a fight is a fight

There were observations made about wolf behavior in the Kenai Moose Refuge in the early 70s. It wasn't a formal study, but it rendered some very useful information. And the wolves, once they began efforts toward eradication of packs or partial packs did exactly as you described. In the end, they ended up with MORE wolves, not fewer. And more packs.

And packs will generally grow to a certain size, then splinter off for unoccupied territory.

Imagine that!!

You've raised a known and established -logical- result of doing what some here are advocating to be done.

thats why im advocating all out a return all out war
am a sensing a little hesitation here

its your choice, killing babies with fent or invading mexico

 

[moose eater]

The thing with the Taliban and the Viet Cong is that they were fighting for an ideology. These cartels are just in it for the money. They would rather be broke and alive than die fighting for something they believe in. They would run and disperse. It's an entirely different dynamic.

Think about it. People will risk their lives for money but they are not going to knowingly die for it. The Taliban and Viet Cong have/had many willing to die for their beliefs/cause. Nobody is going to strap a bomb to their body and blow people up for the cartels except under duress.

The cartels come from impoverished backgrounds in large part, at least the soldiers do, and from what I understand, their families are under threat if they don't oblige the heads.

Ideology is a drive for some, home turf is a bigger drive, and that influenced the 'Cong and the Tallies like nothing else (it was THEIR home, not someplace they'd been sent to do a 'job'), but basic survival weighs HEAVY on any chart. Take a look at Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs.

 

[moose eater]

if you loosened the roe the us is unstoppable, but we pander to pu$$y politict$$ all the time
a fight is a fight

thats why im advocating all out a return all out war
am a sensing a little hesitation here

its your choice, killing babies with fent or invading mexico

The rope was pretty loose in Afghanistan, and both the US and Soviets (in reverse order), had far superior weaponry, yet they got their asses whipped, but rag heads hiding in caves.

Obama was launching CIA drone missiles into places that there weren't even supposed to be any combat efforts, not to mention what went on in the mountains the US was shelling ad bombing.

The resistance is the US getting into illegal war after illegal war, always with the trumpets and confetti and someone talking about the bravado of nationalist fanfare, while breaking down any semblance of order in the process, illegally killing millions of others, and tens of thousands of our own, and still, typically coming home with tails tucked from places we had no business being in the first place... and the issue that we were supposedly addressing, still alive and well...

There is and has never been a 100% eradication of any problem that revolves around home turf defense or survival among those who haven't been comfortable in life.

Doesn't sound all that pragmatic or positive in outcomes to me. Nor, in reality, has it ever been.

 

[moose eater]

its your choice, killing babies with fent or invading mexico

National Trends in Pediatric Deaths From Fentanyl, 1999-2021

This cross-sectional study examines the trends in deaths due to fentanyl poisoning in the US pediatric population.

jamanetwork.com

 

[Microbeman]

Some write as if the cartel soldiers are gathered at headquarters where the bwave American GIs could throw some surgical stwikes and move in. This is not the case. They are everywhere proximal to decent people. They even act as justice, stopping neighborhood burglaries. How is a military force going to handle that? Just intelligence gathering might take years. In Mexico, once you know where a place is, a year later, you do not. The Jalisco cartel is so well organized that they kept functioning for a year without most knowing their leader had died.

 

[xtsho]

I grew up working farms, starting at age 9. I still grow crops. Your experience with repaired hose ends differs from mine.

I'm referring to 50ft standard garden hoses with 3/4" fittings. Not industrial sized irrigation. I go to Lowes and buy a hose clamp and a new male or female end. I've actually gotten several hoses from people I know that didn't know they could cut the end and fix it for $5.

About hoses, I got one of these metal ones. I absolutely loved it. The claims were correct. It didn't kink and I could drag it around the yard effortlessly. The problem is that the metal isn't connected to what looks like a strain relief. The coiled metal is just crimped to the connector.

The reason that's a bad design is that when you're dragging the hose around you're going to be holding the sprayer. That puts all of the stress on the coiled metal below the crimp. After time it spreads out and the synthetic hose on the inside will become exposed.

As much as I liked this type of hose i don't think I'll buy another one. The one I purchased was 100' so I could reach everything. They're relatively cheap. There also those expandable ones with a latex core.

Any suggestions?

If you don't have any experience with either type of hose you are forbidden to reply or comment.

 

[pop_rocks]

The rope was pretty loose in Afghanistan, and both the US and Soviets (in reverse order), had far superior weaponry, yet they got their asses whipped, but rag heads hiding in caves.

Obama was launching CIA drone missiles into places that there weren't even supposed to be any combat efforts, not to mention what went on in the mountains the US was shelling ad bombing.

The resistance is the US getting into illegal war after illegal war, always with the trumpets and confetti and someone talking about the bravado of nationalist fanfare, while breaking down any semblance of order in the process, illegally killing millions of others, and tens of thousands of our own, and still, typically coming home with tails tucked from places we had no business being in the first place... and the issue that we were supposedly addressing, still alive and well...

There is and has never been a 100% eradication of any problem that revolves around home turf defense or survival among those who haven't been comfortable in life.

Doesn't sound all that pragmatic or positive in outcomes to me. Nor, in reality, has it ever been.

im not going to argue the war in iraq/afg , but the ropes were pretty tight as far as what the us could do
/the plane has bombs but its not able to drop them on know bad guy locations because you might blow up their mud hut
if any nation wanted to invade the us i would like to see them try
im not for war but i think osb wasa pos and deserved to die
mex is not a good neighbor
https://www.nbcsandiego.com/news/lo...ter-a-year-of-water-contact-closures/3629624/

 

[pop_rocks]

Some write as if the cartel soldiers are gathered at headquarters where the bwave American GIs could throw some surgical stwikes and move in. This is not the case. They are everywhere proximal to decent people. They even act as justice, stopping neighborhood burglaries. How is a military force going to handle that? Just intelligence gathering might take years. In Mexico, once you know where a place is, a year later, you do not. The Jalisco cartel is so well organized that they kept functioning for a year without most knowing their leader had died.

hahaha, just like the taliban, aqi and all the other turds in the world
insurgent warfare is more than just a da on the the key players
if you really want to make a change you need to hold ground
its the mexican government that has no balls and allows this shit to fester
thats why you go to the root of the problem

 

[xtsho]

Some write as if the cartel soldiers are gathered at headquarters where the bwave American GIs could throw some surgical stwikes and move in. This is not the case. They are everywhere proximal to decent people. They even act as justice, stopping neighborhood burglaries. How is a military force going to handle that? Just intelligence gathering might take years. In Mexico, once you know where a place is, a year later, you do not. The Jalisco cartel is so well organized that they kept functioning for a year without most knowing their leader had died.

Are you serious?

We know who they are and where they are.

If the Israeli's can compromise the pagers of Hezbollah then we can compromise the electronics of the cartels. We know what's going on and where people are.

I actually don't like calling them cartels because that seems too broad. It's more like a variety of factions. People hear the term "cartel" and they envision a singular entity at the top when in reality it's more like an affiliation of different entities that are somewhat aligned against a different entity but still fight amongst themselves.

They are highly organized as far as manufacturing, transporting, and distributing large quantities of the product they are selling.

They are very efficient at getting their product delivered. You have to give them credit for being good at what they do.

 

[xtsho]

Some write as if the cartel soldiers are gathered at headquarters where the bwave American GIs could throw some surgical stwikes and move in. This is not the case. They are everywhere proximal to decent people. They even act as justice, stopping neighborhood burglaries. How is a military force going to handle that? Just intelligence gathering might take years. In Mexico, once you know where a place is, a year later, you do not. The Jalisco cartel is so well organized that they kept functioning for a year without most knowing their leader had died.

Their motivation is money. Nothing more.

Ideology is powerful. Money is weak.

 

[dramamine]

Lunacy is watching chaos continue when you have the ability to end it.

And what would happen? Mexico wouldn't do anything except cry about the bribes they won't be getting anymore.

If we made the decision to go in there is nobody that could stop us.

What would happen? Tell everyone. I will if you can't. What would happen is we would wiped out the cartels and that would be that.

...and create a power vacuum and then the agencies would have to go to the trouble of finding someone else to work with.

 

[xtsho]

The rope was pretty loose in Afghanistan, and both the US and Soviets (in reverse order), had far superior weaponry, yet they got their asses whipped, but rag heads hiding in caves.

Obama was launching CIA drone missiles into places that there weren't even supposed to be any combat efforts, not to mention what went on in the mountains the US was shelling ad bombing.

The resistance is the US getting into illegal war after illegal war, always with the trumpets and confetti and someone talking about the bravado of nationalist fanfare, while breaking down any semblance of order in the process, illegally killing millions of others, and tens of thousands of our own, and still, typically coming home with tails tucked from places we had no business being in the first place... and the issue that we were supposedly addressing, still alive and well...

There is and has never been a 100% eradication of any problem that revolves around home turf defense or survival among those who haven't been comfortable in life.

Doesn't sound all that pragmatic or positive in outcomes to me. Nor, in reality, has it ever been.

Afghanistan is completely different. Different religion. Mexico is Christian. Many other differences.

 

[pop_rocks]

Afghanistan is completely different. Different religion. Mexico is Christian. Many other differences.

afg is halfway around the world, mexico is right in our backyard

...and create a power vacuum and then the agencies would have to go to the trouble of finding someone else to work with.

thats why you take the ground and annex it into the usa! problem solved
starbux for all!

 

[moose eater]

Afghanistan is completely different. Different religion. Mexico is Christian. Many other differences.

Superficial differences at best. Rationalizations for why something will work out differently, aside from it being against the treaties we've signed as a nation, are not a guarantee in any way of it actually being different in the end..

Tell me, if a person or nation develops a reputation for not being true to their word, what happens over time to that nation or person?

 

[moose eater]

afg is halfway around the world, mexico is right in our backyard

thats why you take the ground and annex it into the usa! problem solved
starbux for all!

You don't think there are areas of rampant lawlessness in the US, and for many decades now?

I can remember close to 40 years ago where there were areas in Detroit that the cops simply would not patrol.