WTF is w/feminized genetics,

[freefields]

Iwanagetsohi, leave the trolling out, it's just detracting from a sensible discussion.

Hi Gerrit. I happen to have a load of CS here that I just made, I have reversed female plants before through spraying, it just occurred to me the other day that I hadn't read of anyone trying to apply it to a rootzone rather than spraying.

 

[englishrick]

I happen to have a load of CS here that I just made, I have reversed female plants before through spraying, it just occurred to me the other day that I hadn't read of anyone trying to apply it to a rootzone rather than spraying.

people have done it beffore,,,,

 

[freefields]

You mean people have applied CS to the rootzone before? What was the outcome?

 

[Gerrit]

About the "attacks and defence", there is no need for that.
If rick does not know which "bold statements" I refer to, he is in title to ask what I mean.

I wrote a little more about this but think it's better to send it to rick in a PM, this thread has gone off topic enough already.

I have no real issue/problem with Rick and I don't get the impression he has one with me either.
I thought he was jumping conclusions in regards to the pissing contest comment, so I replied.
Maybe I should not have shown my frustration with the "not sure about you" remark, but I'm human too.
I did not expected it would turn into a lengthy discussion.

Back on topic now;

people have done it beffore,,,,

Interesting, can you tell more, like frequency, timing and dosage, or better yet, was it successful?

 

[Guest423]

Gerrit, do you use CS as your "conventional method"? CS is all that I've used so far for reversals. I'd like to compare notes sometime if thats your method.

 

[englishrick]

About the "attacks and defence", there is no need for that.
If rick does not know which "bold statements" I refer to, he is in title to ask what I mean.

I wrote a little more about this but think it's better to send it to rick in a PM, this thread has gone off topic enough already.

I have no real issue/problem with Rick and I don't get the impression he has one with me either.
I thought he was jumping conclusions in regards to the pissing contest comment, so I replied.
Maybe I should not have shown my frustration with the "not sure about you" remark, but I'm human too.
I did not expected it would turn into a lengthy discussion.

Back on topic now;



Interesting, can you tell more, like frequency, timing and dosage, or better yet, was it successful?

its cool man,,,,im cool with you!!,,,,,i know we got our wires crossed,,,,i respect you man!!,,,i can tell we can get allong, even if we do have a difference of opinion,,

im not going to go into firther depth on the CS rootzone matter because im not going to back it up to anybodys standards,,so id rather not...i know some people who would explain it propperly but i doubt they would want to enter into this dicution the way its been going lately,,,an thats nothing to do with you gerrit,,,there is just simply way too mutch nitpicking and neggativity floaating round this thread now

 

[elmanito]

That's not really what I would call elaborate, what do you expect me to do, google it and figure it out myself?
I'm only asking out of genuine interest, not to start a pissing contest.
I would appreciate it a lot if you could be a bit more specific than "feral hemp"

What exactly have you (or others) discovered/experienced in/with feral hemp, and how did that convince you that males are needed to avoid deleterious mutations in a variety?

Thanks in advance for your answer.

LMAO, Hmmm you sound like Snoop Doggy Dog in the Twister Transistor video with his anger management.

I was not trying to pissing you of, but just referring to feral hemp.In wild populations of cannabis there is always the female male pattern, not female with some male flowers pollinating the rest.Question is why is that perhaps of this

In terms of the driving force, it is tempting to consider
dioecy as simply the most extreme mechanism which avoids
the deleterious effects of inbreeding.

Nice video about feral hemp

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R5IQ2PrSWG4

P.S. I had a friend in the past with the name Gerrit, but he could dance like Michael Jackson.Could you also dance like MJ.

Namaste

 

[hoosierdaddy]

In wild populations of cannabis there is always the female male pattern, not female with some male flowers pollinating the rest.

Perhaps the plant doesn't feel that there are always going to be males around.
IMO, the wild plant has mechanisms in place to account for times when males are not present. Hence the intersex genes and triggers.
Their presence alone is what leads my layman's logic to say that there probably isn't male specific information that is necessary for continued survival without undue mutation.

 

[englishrick]

why is no1 questioning the evoloution of the Y chromozone????

 

[Gerrit]

LMAO, Hmmm you sound like Snoop Doggy Dog in the Twister Transistor video with his anger management.

Geez man you guys are doing my head in, if I need to go watch movies or whatever to have a grasp about what you are talking about, I rather stay ignorent.

In wild populations of cannabis there is always the female male pattern, not female with some male flowers pollinating the rest.Question is why is that perhaps of this

Could be many reason for this, but how does this convince you that males are needed to avoid deleterious mutations in a variety?
I fail to see the connection.

I had a friend in the past with the name Gerrit, but he could dance like Michael Jackson.Could you also dance like MJ.

Lol, well I honestly don't know, and I sure as hell have no intention to try ha ha.

@ Rick,

im not going to go into firther depth on the CS rootzone matter because im not going to back it up to anybodys standards

I can understand your reason, but in that case there isn't really much point in stating it has been done at all.
At least I would not know how this could be of any use to freefields, it does not bring him any further than not knowing if it has been applied at all.

 

[Gerrit]

@ Time2unite,

Gerrit, do you use CS as your "conventional method"? CS is all that I've used so far for reversals. I'd like to compare notes sometime if thats your method.

No STS, but CS might be less harmful for the plant when applied this way.

 

[JackTheGrower]

Fact is that sexual expression within cannabis is a complex matter and notoriously unstable.
I can't grasp what exactly is going on on a molecular level either, but until someone comes up with some real scientific backing or at least a well founded theory why it's dangerous or bad, I don't take them very serious.

Lastly, for reasons stated above, it's my opinion that anyone that claims to have "hermaphrodite free" lines, whether they are feminised or regular is either lying, ignorant, or more skilled and lucky than I could ever imagine to be possible.

Done with the rant now, thanks for listening.

Hey nice post. I'm always happy to read an intelligent person's opinion.

How do you feel on the theory of intelligent reproduction?

That the plants have the ability to influence their own seed production.

Do you think the plants themselves have some ability to reason? I hope reason is a reasonable word.

 

[englishrick]

Geez man you guys are doing my head in, if I need to go watch movies or whatever to have a grasp about what you are talking about, I rather stay ignorent.

honestly gerrit,,,and i speke from the heart bro,,,,you didnt do yourself many favours when you started talking about pissing matches in your opening statement

but to be fair,,,,i dont care,,,,it makes no difference,,,,,,i still love ya

el is cool,,,,,i know your gona love eachother

Could be many reason for this, but how does this convince you that males are needed to avoid deleterious mutations in a variety?
I fail to see the connection.



Lol, well I honestly don't know, and I sure as hell have no intention to try ha ha.

@ Rick,



I can understand your reason, but in that case there isn't really much point in stating it has been done at all.
At least I would not know how this could be of any use to freefields, it does not bring him any further than not knowing if it has been applied at all.

will you please provide some sorta evidence to say the Ychromozone is more capable of avoid deleterious mutations than the Xchromozone?

i was just letting freefields know "its been done",,,,and its has positive aplication,,,that is all

 

[Dalaihempy]

@ Dalaihempy, You seem to have taken a very strong stand against feminised seeds based on the experience from OTHERS too.
Although I can understand that you value the information that is posted about feminised seeds, your interpretation of that info is shaky to say the least i.m.o..

The only thing I agree on is that indeed there are more hermaphrodites REPORTED from feminised seeds than from regular but...., that does not have to mean its a fact that fem lines actually contain more hermaphrodites than regular lines.
There are many factors that can play a role in this.

Hi Gerrit well yes i have taken a strong stance on what i believe to be a very unnatural process and yes i have read lots of reports from other growers on it as i my self would not grow them out i make no secret of that.

There are hermaphrodites that show them self at sexing in some lines along side females and males that stay as female and males then there are the modern lines that will throw hermaphrodites at sexing early into flowering or even half way threw there flowering some are related to stress like lite leeks or heat or even drought lack of watering growers folt but then there are many that do it under optimum conditions.

Well maybe other people that support female seeds info is shaky as from the research i have done on this to date the male role in a sexual line has a very important role to play lets be honest what research has been done of the female seeds from cannabis nil correct from a neutral body meaning people not out to make shit loads of money with little effert.

hermaphrodites are not found more in regular lines mate maybe poorly breed lines not well breed lines.

For example, an early hermaphrodite which shows male flowers on the first nodes but would revert back to female dominance further in life, would most likely be classified as male and disregarded if found within a regular line.
But a similar plant would be reported as a hermaphrodite within a female line, just because people do not expect or accept it when anything other than a female comes from those seeds.

Well not from were i sit if any plant at sexing or early flowering or mid flowering was to show both male and female flowers it would be a hermaphrodite and culled never used for breeding i do have a line that will produce say 5 or so seeds from a large out door grown plant but its to special to cull but would never use it to breed rule is normal cull..

Another common difference is that feminised plants are often put into flower at a very young age and often have to go through stress like topping bending or (the horrible i.m.o.) supercropping.
Most regulars however, are grown at least to a certain age so sex will show itself, and at the same time it's more common to hold back the original mom, and use cuttings for flowering which make they can be flowered at a smaller size and without added stress factors to reduce their height.
Aside Ethylene there are many more substances (sorry, can't come up with a better word in English) that play a role in the sexual expression of cannabis, many of those are also produced by the plant to combat/resist stressful situations.
He he, it's all they can do as they can't run away lol.

Well i have heard many thearys threw my time on line about things like by not allowing a plant to fully veg it will reduce potency well that is not true i have run many plants indoors and out clones is a good example genetic copy's now the ones grown a full long summer under the sun were no different in potency to the plants that got 2 weeks veg now stressing plants like tipping them as we call it or bending is done by many what i think many people fail to understand is cannabis grows very well with out the hand of man in far from perfect conditions there a lot more hardy than many give them can deal with many extremes throw at them from nature.

So far, I have found no proof at all that any of my female lines show a higher rate of hermaphrodites than the regulars, more the opposite.
There is also no indication at all that the vigour or quality is compromised by the feminisation process/technique.
I have to admit that the amount of plants that are evaluated leave quite a bit of room for "statistical error", but at least I have some practical experience on the subject.

I don't wont to sound harsh here my friend but if you are seeing more hermaphrodites in reg seeds you need to find better genetics.

Your a supporter and seller of female seeds fine that is not the problem what is a problem is many that sell them or support them often blame the grower of the seeds the fem seeds being sold when the growers does report problems how much real research has gone into this before these seeds were sold how can a process of turning a female plant to a male using chemicals be as stressful as picking tips off a growing plant or bending it its far more stressful and no one really knows the impact these genetics will have to the non fem seed genetic lines that are left you and me both know these seeds are being sold to all corners of the world those that grow them will breed with them like gm food its all ready spreading threw non gm food stocks.

Your arguments against feminised seeds carry as much weight as the moralistic arguments most politicians have against cannabis/drugs in general.

No politicians talk complete shit and then go play golf with the person they just spent the day fighting i don't play golf and many people also shear the same vue on this as i do run a pole see for your self.

Most educated people know the value of this plant we call cannabis and its positives that come with it they the politicians doctors and others wont openly say it as its not politically correct that will change this is not about morals this is about people that play with nature that really have no credible research to back there product up.

Fact is that sexual expression within cannabis is a complex matter and notoriously unstable.
I can't grasp what exactly is going on on a molecular level either, but until someone comes up with some real scientific backing or at least a well founded theory why it's dangerous or bad, I don't take them very serious.

No you cant but they can show how impotent the role a male is in a plant line and have yet for reasons beyond me some feel its completely fine and natural to chemically change a female to a male then self pollinate its self and then say its better than regular seeds that is made by a male and female plant its beyond me.

Lastly, for reasons stated above, it's my opinion that anyone that claims to have "hermaphrodite free" lines, whether they are feminised or regular is either lying, ignorant, or more skilled and lucky than I could ever imagine to be possible.

Done with the rant now, thanks for listening.

 

[Gerrit]

Hi Jack,

I'm not to sure it can be considered reason unless you think our reason is nothing more than a biochemical reaction as well, but that's a whole other discussion, lol.

But I do think that plants can "react", to their environment.
I'm far from a scientist but sometimes read a blurb of text or abstract and recall a publication that some if not all plants are able to switch on certain genes from their ancestors when required.
It's possible that I've sort of ripped it out of context but am sure someone will correct me if that's the case.
Other than that I have no feel on the theory, as it was not there until you put it in my head, thanks (?) lol.

 

[Gerrit]

Hi Hempy,

It looks (to me) that you have not been reading well but it will take me way to long to respond in full on such a long post right now so it will have to wait.

But to put it short, you are putting a lot of words into my mouth that I never said.
On top of that:

about people that play with nature that really have no credible research to back there product up

So you claim that the "defendant" is guilty cause he does not have proof of his innocence?
How about the accusing party backing up their accusations?
I still have not seen much of that, other than hearsay and assumptions.

Back on the subject tomorrow, goodnight

 

[Dalaihempy]

Quite clearly hempy doesn't understand the mechanism behind sexual expression in cannabis and doesn't understand the real debate here. Seems to me he has this narrow-minded, blinkered opinion that 'fems are shite' and he will argue it forever, regardless of any proof to the contrary. Reminds me of the people who refuse to believe in evolution cos some stupid book says god created the heavens and earth.

Is that right maybe you need to read more here some of value that shows the importance of a male.


Sex Involved In Plant Defense Why do some plants defend themselves from insect attacks better than others? New evidence shows that the difference might be due to whether they're getting any plant love.....
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases...0713201448.htm


Plants Spice Up Their Sex Life With Defensins— Since the beginning, plants and animals have deployed various mechanisms to fight pathogens. Proteins have always played an important part in this armoury, and a broad variety of defensin proteins have become part of the immune system of plants, insects and other animals except mammals. Now scientists from Regensburg discovered that those proteins also play a role in the "sex life" during the fertilization process of plants.
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases...0601171711.htm




I am so sic of the half ass bull shit from some people that think they know it all i don't know it all or ever will time the rest of you start admitting it to get off your knees and stop licking ass think for your self s for a change and stop putting people down because you think it makes you look good you don't you look like a ass.

 

[hoosierdaddy]

I still have not seen much of that, other than hearsay and assumptions.

The anecdotes are still being claimed as well, yet we haven't seen anything to back up their existence. Perhaps there are other boards where we could see the reports of folks finding an over abundance of hermies, and what they think are males, in femmed seeds?
One would think as discerning as our crowd tends to be, there would be no hesitation by someone to link us to such posts and complaints. But, all we ever really see is Hempy making the claim that he reads this all the time.

Isn't it supposed to be the one that asserts bears the responsibility of backing it up?
Of course it is. Now, let's see those reports.

 

[Dalaihempy]

Hi Hempy,

It looks (to me) that you have not been reading well but it will take me way to long to respond in full on such a long post right now so it will have to wait.

But to put it short, you are putting a lot of words into my mouth that I never said.
On top of that:

No i have been doing a lot of reading and research in fact my friend and i am not putting wards into any ones mouth what i as are many others across many boards who don't like fem seeds are just expressing there argument to why female seeds are not a welcome site in the seed market.

So you claim that the "defendant" is guilty cause he does not have proof of his innocence?
How about the accusing party backing up their accusations?
I still have not seen much of that, other than hearsay and assumptions.

Back on the subject tomorrow, goodnight

Well i and other supporters of normally breed seeds over fem seeds seam to be guilty as you put it here and no matter how much we bring to the table are wrong / guilty of ignorance well all were getting from fem seed supporters is just that hearsay and assumptions.

 

[hoosierdaddy]

I am so sic of the half ass bull shit from some people that think they know it all i don't know it all or ever will time the rest of you start admitting it to get off your knees and stop licking ass think for your self s for a change and stop putting people down because you think it makes you look good you don't you look like a ass.

Then stop making bullshit assertions that you damn well can't back up.
It is simple. By passing along bullshit you are doing the community no good whatsoever. That is why it is imperative that you be challenged each and every time you try to perpetuate the bullshit on this issue.