gardenfather
Active member
I know this thread is old but any news? id love to hear if things are getting better or got better? and if this method really works
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What's the difference between smoking and ingesting Phoenix Tears capsules?
- Thread starter immaculate
- Start date
Observations
Observations
Then here's some good news and a warning.
Not all oil is equal.
There may be issues with, not only what it's extracted from, but with the extraction method as well.
We have a Glioma patient that showed no growth for a full year.
A misfortune caused us to switch him from Naphtha/Ethanol derived oil to a Butane extraction based oil about 2 months ago.
The Astrocytoma began growing again.
At the time I was also treating a melanoma topically.
I had to switch to locally purchased, Butane extracted, oil, part way through that treatment.
The Naphtha kine was drawing gobs of "stuff" up through the lesion.
There were 5 or 6 "gobs" per day stuck to the band aid.
Some with 2mm. "roots"
The BHO based treatment stopped drawing.
After a week, of that, a local hero rode to our rescue and donated a large supply of Naphtha base oil.
The melanoma dis-assembly resumed!
Have just sent some to our Glioma patient.
If it halts the progression, we may have learned something.
This proves nothing, but pragmatically, I'd recommend sticking to the known-to-work extraction method.
Room temperature Naphtha.
Aloha y'all
Weezard
Disclaimer:
I'm not a doctor. I have no "papers".
Heck I don't even wear shoes.
Just reporting my observations.
Make of them what you will.
Observations
Then here's some good news and a warning.
Not all oil is equal.
There may be issues with, not only what it's extracted from, but with the extraction method as well.
We have a Glioma patient that showed no growth for a full year.
A misfortune caused us to switch him from Naphtha/Ethanol derived oil to a Butane extraction based oil about 2 months ago.
The Astrocytoma began growing again.
At the time I was also treating a melanoma topically.
I had to switch to locally purchased, Butane extracted, oil, part way through that treatment.
The Naphtha kine was drawing gobs of "stuff" up through the lesion.
There were 5 or 6 "gobs" per day stuck to the band aid.
Some with 2mm. "roots"
The BHO based treatment stopped drawing.
After a week, of that, a local hero rode to our rescue and donated a large supply of Naphtha base oil.
The melanoma dis-assembly resumed!
Have just sent some to our Glioma patient.
If it halts the progression, we may have learned something.
This proves nothing, but pragmatically, I'd recommend sticking to the known-to-work extraction method.
Room temperature Naphtha.
Aloha y'all
Weezard
Disclaimer:
I'm not a doctor. I have no "papers".
Heck I don't even wear shoes.
Just reporting my observations.
Make of them what you will.
gardenfather
Active member
Wow Thats Great News Thanks So much 
ill have to get my hand on some Naphtha.
ill have to get my hand on some Naphtha.
gardenfather
Active member
what brand or what product should i look for to get Naphtha base oil?
T
Truthman
Actually, no.
There are chemical differences
Terpenes can boil-off and oxidize when exposed to the heat of smoking.
THC gets' decarboxylated inefficiently when smoked, much of it gets oxidized and thus, wasted.
There are some new compounds that are created by the burning plant material as well.
They do not exist in unburned weed.
These are the minor differences.
But the main reason that smoking does not shrink tumors is blood levels.
It is physically impossible to get a high enough blood level through smokin vs. ingesting.
Believe me when I say I have tried!
View attachment 138741
Have smoked heavily, for 43 years.
Made my own hash oil in the '60s, but dipped cigarettes in it and toked 'til we fell over.
'bout 5 years ago, I turned up with a little cancer.
The kind that radiation and chemo don't fix because it grows as slow as normal tissue.
The better news is, I can monitor it's approximate mass with a blood test.
Just started making my own Phoenix tears and am taking 120mg. twice a day.
My last test was promising.
Showed slower growth which means a longer "doubling rate", which means a longer survival.
That's all I need it to do, really, it gives me back a normal life expectancy.
(Something else will wear out before the big C can take me down).
Been keeping this on the "down-low" until I have some proof of remission.
(false hope is cruel, yah?)
So, in 6 months I should know if this dosage is effective for my situation.
Either way, bet that I'll document it on ICMag and a few other boards.
Stay tuned.
Aloha,
Weezard
I wonder if vaporizing cannabis will get the results near to ingestion being that you can avoid all the negatives associated with smoking?. You can boil off the terpenes with very little oxidation, if you start at a low temperature, and get the cannabinoids, when you raise the temperature. Of course you will need a good vaporizer but, they are out there. You will also have to change your view of seeing clouds as a way to see if your vaporizer is working because, that is wasting herb just like smoking is.
If anything, when done right, you can get more of the substances you want due to not excreting a lot of these things as you will with ingestion.The only thing is, I don't know if you will make a lot of thc-11, if you just vape, as you will if you ingest the herb.
I hope everything works for you.
Rusty Trichome
Member
If I'm not mistaken...cannabis smokers still get cancer(s) and I've never heard of someone vaping themselves to remission. Perhaps the combusted (smoked) compounds retard abnormal cell growth, or help to slow it's feeding. Some day Big Pharma will figure it out, and the pharmacies will make bank on not selling it. (more profitable to treat, than to cure)
But were I to have cancer I wanted to treat...I'd stick with what has been reported to work time-n-time again. RSO per the Phoenix Tears methods of extraction, doses and timeframes, and preferred strains. Shaken, not stirred...
Any difference in quality or effects with the Butane extraction? Does it's makers use negative air pressure to purify it further? Are the effects similar to Naphtha?
BTW...Hi Weez... Long time no see, lol.
But were I to have cancer I wanted to treat...I'd stick with what has been reported to work time-n-time again. RSO per the Phoenix Tears methods of extraction, doses and timeframes, and preferred strains. Shaken, not stirred...
Any difference in quality or effects with the Butane extraction? Does it's makers use negative air pressure to purify it further? Are the effects similar to Naphtha?
BTW...Hi Weez...
Long time no see, lol.
I've read somewhere that when delta 9-THC passes through the liver it is metabolized into a different compound, delta 11-THC previous to being released back into the blood stream.
I can't recall where I read this but it may be a place for you to start looking.
I've also read:
-Smoking cigarets increases the risks of contracting cancer.
-Smoking cigarets AND cannabis increases that risk even further.
-Smoking cannabis alone will nearly halt lung cancer progression.
and again, I don't recall the source information but it may be something to look into.
Howzit, Snype?
Howzit, Snype?
Because it's cheap, easy to procure and is composed entirely of volatiles.
There a different focus for medical oils as opposed to recreational oils.
Always test the Naphtha first by evaporating an ounce or so in a glass cup.
If there is any residue at all, do not use it!
And my experience with butane extracted oils is they will get you very high, but are less effective as an anti-cancer agent than the Naphtha derived oils.
When I switched to butane derived "tears", disassembly of abnormal cells just stopped.
When I switched back the the Naphtha derived oil, it resumed.
My theory is that butane is too selective and leaves behind some of the medically effective components of the cannabis.
Ethanol and isopropyl alcohol are also effective anti tumor solvents, but so far as I have experienced butane just isn't.
We are rapidly running out of test sites.
Need some melanomas to continue testing where we can directly view and photograph the actions of different extractions in real time.
Mine was not a melanoma.
Turned out to be a keratinoid.
Just abnormal enough for the oil to work on but benign.
Took 2 months.
Minus 2 wasted weeks with "'tane" derived oil.
My friend's were melanomas and the oil worked quite rapidly
50% shrinkage in a week.
Good to see you back.
Aloha,
Weeze
Howzit, Snype?
Because it's cheap, easy to procure and is composed entirely of volatiles.
There a different focus for medical oils as opposed to recreational oils.
Always test the Naphtha first by evaporating an ounce or so in a glass cup.
If there is any residue at all, do not use it!
And my experience with butane extracted oils is they will get you very high, but are less effective as an anti-cancer agent than the Naphtha derived oils.
When I switched to butane derived "tears", disassembly of abnormal cells just stopped.
When I switched back the the Naphtha derived oil, it resumed.
My theory is that butane is too selective and leaves behind some of the medically effective components of the cannabis.
Ethanol and isopropyl alcohol are also effective anti tumor solvents, but so far as I have experienced butane just isn't.
We are rapidly running out of test sites.
Need some melanomas to continue testing where we can directly view and photograph the actions of different extractions in real time.
Mine was not a melanoma.
Turned out to be a keratinoid.
Just abnormal enough for the oil to work on but benign.
Took 2 months.
Minus 2 wasted weeks with "'tane" derived oil.
My friend's were melanomas and the oil worked quite rapidly
50% shrinkage in a week.
Good to see you back.
Aloha,
Weeze
gardenfather
Active member
So what brand of Naphtha are you using?
and wouldnt isopropyl alcohol be a better option?
seems Naphtha is poisonous? so wouldn't that cause cancer to people? just trying to get as much info as i can before i test this, I dont want to make a harmful batch by using the wrong chemicals. and if you use isopropyl alcohol do you still follow the same instructions just switch naphtha to isoprply?
and wouldnt isopropyl alcohol be a better option?
seems Naphtha is poisonous? so wouldn't that cause cancer to people? just trying to get as much info as i can before i test this, I dont want to make a harmful batch by using the wrong chemicals. and if you use isopropyl alcohol do you still follow the same instructions just switch naphtha to isoprply?
Rusty Trichome
Member
For my liking...alcohol extractions are TOO aggressive, and will strip more than the desirable compounds from the leaf. Seems to extract everything but the cellulose, especially if you let it soak for a couple minutes too long. Not at all sure if these 'additional' compounds (chlorophyll, for instance) that the alcohol strips...will negatively impact the quality of the oil or the action of the active compounds that actually fight the cancer tissues, disrupts it's feeding, or cut's it's blood supply.
Also...alcohol absorbs moisture, which is a disaster if you are storing the product in gel caps. Makes a gooey, gelatinous mess if ANY water-moisture is present. (from experience)
If you are leaving residual Naphtha (Kleen Strip VM&T Naphtha - Home Depot. Blue 1-quart cans) in the prepared oil...you're not doing it right. And to be honest...following direction from those that have actually CURED their issues with the oil, is probably a better idea than pretending we know enough chemistry to make a change in the formulation or extraction techniques. If all you want to do is smoke the oil...perhaps go for the alcohol or butane prep(s)...or get the cheap stuff from the dispensary.
Is there a chemist in out midst that can help to clarify this?
But if you want to make RSO as a cancer or MS treatment, I'd follow directions on the video's and quit worrying so much about the evils of Naphtha. Would suck to make the oil inert (or harmful to a patient) by dicking-around with the formula or process.
Frankly...if you're taking the RSO as a treatment...the potential residuals in the original formulation (Naphtha) are outweighed by the potential results Naphtha provides. I'd worry more about smog or radon. Is there an MSDS regarding the smoking of residual alcohols?
Also: When alcohol catches fire...it has a colorless flame. If you go the alcohol route...use appropriate caution and don't burn-down your garage. Naphtha can catch fire, too...but at least you KNOW you're on fire. Keep a fire extinguisher handy at all times through the process.
Also...alcohol absorbs moisture, which is a disaster if you are storing the product in gel caps. Makes a gooey, gelatinous mess if ANY water-moisture is present. (from experience)
If you are leaving residual Naphtha (Kleen Strip VM&T Naphtha - Home Depot. Blue 1-quart cans) in the prepared oil...you're not doing it right. And to be honest...following direction from those that have actually CURED their issues with the oil, is probably a better idea than pretending we know enough chemistry to make a change in the formulation or extraction techniques. If all you want to do is smoke the oil...perhaps go for the alcohol or butane prep(s)...or get the cheap stuff from the dispensary.
Is there a chemist in out midst that can help to clarify this?
But if you want to make RSO as a cancer or MS treatment, I'd follow directions on the video's and quit worrying so much about the evils of Naphtha. Would suck to make the oil inert (or harmful to a patient) by dicking-around with the formula or process.
Frankly...if you're taking the RSO as a treatment...the potential residuals in the original formulation (Naphtha) are outweighed by the potential results Naphtha provides. I'd worry more about smog or radon. Is there an MSDS regarding the smoking of residual alcohols?
Also: When alcohol catches fire...it has a colorless flame. If you go the alcohol route...use appropriate caution and don't burn-down your garage. Naphtha can catch fire, too...but at least you KNOW you're on fire. Keep a fire extinguisher handy at all times through the process.
gardenfather
Active member
Rusty Trichome
Member
I "see" your YouTube Homey, and "raise" you the OG of oil. Granted, I'm not going to watch the whole frigging video, as you could just as easily made your point without all of us having to sit through the video. Speaking of which...what IS your point?
Phoenix Tears (<<< it's a link)
Specifically...the "Make Medicinal Hemp Oil Safely" video in the Video Vault,
and the page titled "Make The Medicine". (<<< that's a link, too)
Likely I'm a tad anal about following the RSO recipe as closely as possible. But if I'm doing this for my cancer or my friends cancer...I would feel pretty shitty taking shortcuts that can quite possibly do more harm than good, just because it's easy or convenient for ME to make it however I want with whatever I want.
And if you have to explain those shortcuts at the Coroners Inquest...well...you not only played doctor...you played God. At least respect your patient(s) enough to make 'em the RSO, not some cheap knock-off crap.
Phoenix Tears (<<< it's a link)
Specifically...the "Make Medicinal Hemp Oil Safely" video in the Video Vault,
and the page titled "Make The Medicine". (<<< that's a link, too)
Likely I'm a tad anal about following the RSO recipe as closely as possible. But if I'm doing this for my cancer or my friends cancer...I would feel pretty shitty taking shortcuts that can quite possibly do more harm than good, just because it's easy or convenient for ME to make it however I want with whatever I want.
And if you have to explain those shortcuts at the Coroners Inquest...well...you not only played doctor...you played God. At least respect your patient(s) enough to make 'em the RSO, not some cheap knock-off crap.
gardenfather
Active member
Ive never made it i just found this video of the guy using 99% alcohol just show people that are asking if they should use it instead of Naphtha or i just said could use it. This guy seems to have no problem using it and gets great results. im sure doing it with alcohol is better then Naphtha, for those who dont know how to fully evaporate Naphtha.
That was all.
That was all.
Rusty Trichome
Member
Not too sure I'd rely on a homey in a Bob Marley hoodie and a bandanna on his face to instruct me in ANYTHING, let alone my meds. And I'd like to see proof the alcohol prep is, as you put it, "better". Better at what? Outgassing...? Nope.
Having made multiple batches with Naphtha, Isopropyl and Everclear, Naphtha is the way to go for your meds. Any questions about how to PROPERLY make the RSO for the patient...should be referred to the original video, which is available for free on The Phoenix Tears web site.
Yes...alcohol(s) and other solvents can be used. I personally wouldn't prepare it that way for a patient, but I have the luxury of choice. I choose to prepare it as instructed by Rick Simpson himself. Were I making the RSO for smoking, and I had no Naphtha on-hand...I'd likely do the alcohol prep again. But again...not for the patient. In my eyes it's ok to be anal with providing the patient with the highest quality product, and I'm not likely to sway from that stance.
But I guess there will always be that dividing line between those that just want to get high (really, REALLY high)...and a patient trying to save their life. My efforts are usually on behalf of the patient, so I'm less flexible by choice.
Having made multiple batches with Naphtha, Isopropyl and Everclear, Naphtha is the way to go for your meds. Any questions about how to PROPERLY make the RSO for the patient...should be referred to the original video, which is available for free on The Phoenix Tears web site.
Yes...alcohol(s) and other solvents can be used. I personally wouldn't prepare it that way for a patient, but I have the luxury of choice. I choose to prepare it as instructed by Rick Simpson himself. Were I making the RSO for smoking, and I had no Naphtha on-hand...I'd likely do the alcohol prep again. But again...not for the patient. In my eyes it's ok to be anal with providing the patient with the highest quality product, and I'm not likely to sway from that stance.
But I guess there will always be that dividing line between those that just want to get high (really, REALLY high)...and a patient trying to save their life. My efforts are usually on behalf of the patient, so I'm less flexible by choice.
"This guy seems to have no problem using it and gets great results. "
Wow!
Well, you can't be blamed for not knowing the difference.
So, from folks that do know, that tutorial stinks on ice.
It's not about homies, hoodie, or bandit bandanas either.
(A wise man learns more from a fool . . .)
But that fool is sloppy and clueless.
Which is not a crime, until he tries to play mentor.
A sloppy, and dangerous "teacher " does more harm than good, yah?
What a waste of trim, and our time.
"But I guess there will always be that dividing line between those that just want to get high (really, REALLY high)...and a patient trying to save their life."
Amen to that R.T.
IMHO, anyone who needs to get that high, that fast, is doing it for all the wrong reasons.
All I can wish them is good luck.
Weezard's 2 pennies
Wow!
Well, you can't be blamed for not knowing the difference.
So, from folks that do know, that tutorial stinks on ice.
It's not about homies, hoodie, or bandit bandanas either.
(A wise man learns more from a fool . . .)
But that fool is sloppy and clueless.
Which is not a crime, until he tries to play mentor.
A sloppy, and dangerous "teacher " does more harm than good, yah?
What a waste of trim, and our time.
"But I guess there will always be that dividing line between those that just want to get high (really, REALLY high)...and a patient trying to save their life."
Amen to that R.T.
IMHO, anyone who needs to get that high, that fast, is doing it for all the wrong reasons.
All I can wish them is good luck.
Weezard's 2 pennies
gardenfather
Active member
yeah for sure i agree with you, but cant u just do the R.S method and instead of Naphtha use alcohol? thats all i was getting at, i dont care about the guys video, i just saw it and thought it was worth a post to show that he was using alcohol.
gardenfather
Active member
ill just stick to watching these http://phoenixtears.ca/video-library/
