Vote YES or NO on Prop 19

[mr noodles]

if Californian dont support prop 19...they cut the throat of the whole planet in term of hope and we will sink in the dark ages of repression for at least another 10 years .cops will take a no to prop as a carte blanche for systematic enforcement because they will chant 'its illegal' very loud after a referendum who support repression of marijuana .

in canada if you cali vote no....harper is sending us to 6 mandatory jail months for 6 plants , they closed all the compassion club in my province, its terror here ! if cali vote no.....harper aka canadians nazi pm is going to go on a full american war on drugs program, if you vote yes...harper is fucked for ever and the whole planet will follow cali...then we all going to be able to change things in favour of larger grower .

you guy should get any legalization first and save you ass and then you got ground to work to improve things....

try to ask shit ass grow show after the buffer period where pot will be a totally non issue...after 6 months cops will not even look at pot if you vote yes...

be patient and go baby step at the time , get the fucking door open first and then you can try to change thing .

a no vote is a bullet for the gun who will blow your head off

please !!!!!! the world depend on you !

 

[Snowberry]

Are you brain-dead or what......?

If you don't like what's on the table....re-set it after you Cali-folks pass #19.

Sincerely...Snowberry

 

[IGotTheCottons]

Are you brain-dead or what......?

If you don't like what's on the table....re-set it after you Cali-folks pass #19.

Sincerely...Snowberry

Exactly!

It's much easier to alter an existing bill, than it is to get a new one on the ballot.

Vote yes on 19, then work on fixing 19's problems.

Much better than voting no on 19 - then hoping and praying that a better bill comes along later... Because there's no guarantee another one will come along...

 

[ClosetAdvocate]

Wow all you CA MMJ residents are spoiled....

While Prop 19 isn't the best legislation possible it's still a hell of a lot better than the current system (even with the current prop 215).

What about all of those people jailed for possession, sale, and cultivation that aren't prop 215 patients?

Certainly Prop 19 will be a great help to them.

Regarding Jack Herer's previous opposition to Prop 19: Yes, he would've preferred that cannabis in all it's forms would be completely legal with as few government regulations as possible, but iirc he originally didn't support Prop 215 but eventually rallied around it because it was better than the current system.

I think were he here today (RIP Jack) he'd certainly rally around Prop 19.

http://blog.norml.org/2010/08/17/from-the-family-of-jack-herer-the-hemperor-would-support-prop-19/

Don't forget, how you vote in November for Prop 19 will have far reaching effects in the other 49 states.

Please, Please, Please support Proposition 19 and urge everyone you know to register to vote and support and vote for it too.

 

[ClosetAdvocate]

Exactly!

It's much easier to alter an existing bill, than it is to get a new one on the ballot.

Vote yes on 19, then work on fixing 19's problems.

Much better than voting no on 19 - then hoping and praying that a better bill comes along later... Because there's no guarantee another one will come along...

Exactly.

I'll be the first to admit that Prop 19 is NOT perfect, but it's still a heck of a lot better than the current system.

Currently non-card holders cannot grow, possess, buy or sell marijuana in any amounts.

If Prop 19 doesn't pass you're shooting yourself in the foot because, even though many (myself included) feel California's pretty backwards on many things, other states will follow suit.

 

[rubbanutz420]

First off, I dont live in CA, but before reading this thread, I was on the fence, but leaning "NO", after reading thsi thread and really thinking about it, i would have to say "YES".....Its by far not the best case scenario, but it is better than any other option at this time... I am definately not for big corporations making meds and kicking out the little guy, but again, its better than people going to jail for "our" plant.... This bill sucks, but, I would vote "yes" and hope for something better soon...

I certainly see both sides of the coin....I agree with the "NO" voters and the "YES" voters....but lets forward this movement, whatever way we can......

I also admit I do not know all about this bill, as Im not a California resident..... Hope it all works out for y'all.....

Good luck, the rest of the country and the World is watching..and the rest of the non-mmj states need you guys to vote the right way on this....Its so important, not only for Cali, but America and the World.....Dont fuck up.

VOTE YES!

 

[Hydrosun]

How can indignation from NON CALIFORNIANS be so strong? How can what the CA voters do change the universe? Why are better bills on the ballot on other states?

If ANYTHING is better than the current PROHIBITION why isn't there a vote on the issue in your locality?

I for one hope the people in CA do what they want and realize that this bill has nothing to do with MJs future or the MJ culture.

 

[JackTheGrower]

It's the Sneaky sneak if I am correct that has the hairs on the back of my neck standing up.

Imagine a honest medical person is denied a garden area because Prop 19 states the property owner can say no to all Cannabis including medical gardens.

I am trying to find out if Prop 19 takes gardening away from patients with an actual law on the books where we had none before.

Anyone know for sure?

 

[Hydrosun]

There was a neat thread that discussed this language:

IRRESPECTIVE of any state law localities MAY REGULATE.

If that clause is in Prop 19 and Prop 19 passes than it is a majority vote and has the EFFECT of overturning Kelly and now plant limits and county regs are fine

 

[humboldtsbest]

The state of affairs in California is very simple.

We as a people have voted to fight back against the DEA (Drug Enforcement Administration).

We have voted to protect MEDICAL users of marijuana. We said they are too sick, suffering, in pain, disabled, to be caught up in this DEA drug war BULLSHIT.

Now it is our chance to protect RECREATIONAL users of marijuana. We just want to have a good time. We don't need no DEA drug war BULLSHIT.

All you commercial growers who don't want to pay a tax for a permit to play in the big leagues, guess what? You still have to deal with DEA drug war BULLSHIT.

Your proposition to grow freely and abundantly will come later. Maybe 2012, maybe 2020. I don't know when your ship will sail, but get off of our ship.

THIS IS THE LEGALIZATION FOR RECREATIONAL USE ship. ALL COMMERCIAL GROWERS AND PROFITEERS, please jump ship.

I'm sorry to repeat myself, but the questions why don't we wait for another bill is just getting old.

Why didn't we wait for a better bill when 215 was being passed? Why didn't we hold out then to wait for "everyone" and not just those with a medical need.

LMFAO.... Ur funny.. For real. The professor of Internet Warrior 101.. LOL. What ship? Seriously!!!!!!!! What the fuck are u talking about. Do u really not have anything better to do than to sit on this thing and reply to peoples opinions to express ur own in bully type stance? Ur fighting the cause right bro? Well get off the internet. And forums like these that want to "Discuss", not bang heads about the possibilty that California might just make a little more history in the Marijuana world. Its not a war on this site. But I bet u do nothing to really and I stress REALLY put in work for what u so strongly believe in. Well at least apparently believe in seeing all your great posts. Trying to tell people they should have sources or there word is not relative.. U r not relative. U are exactly the type of person neither side wants on there team.. A waste of internet space.. LOL..

 

[JackTheGrower]

There was a neat thread that discussed this language:

IRRESPECTIVE of any state law localities MAY REGULATE.

If that clause is in Prop 19 and Prop 19 passes than it is a majority vote and has the EFFECT of overturning Kelly and now plant limits and county regs are fine

That what I am afraid of.

That coupled with Property owners rights to say no and there will be a new assault on medical people.

The question is will the Courts see Prop 215 language separate from Prop 19 language?

If I am understanding the basics Prop 215 grants rights and Prop 19 grants privilege revocable by legislature at any time without the vote of the people.
I am trying to finalize my position on Prop 19.

I only have 68 days left to decide.

 

[JackTheGrower]

We might get an answer here.

http://www.opposingviews.com/i/tossed-salad-dragonfly-de-la-luz-on-marijuana-laws#piece_tabs

 

[erbium]

You really think the owner of the property shouldn't have a say if people grow there? Do you own any property? Ever had renters?

They can tell you no pets too. Nobody not on the lease allowed to stay is another.

Buy your own property and don't worry about it. If not, work for it like other people have done.

I can not believe people think the owners shouldn't have a say on what happens in their rentals.

 

[ClosetAdvocate]

How can what the CA voters do change the universe? Why are better bills on the ballot on other states?

It cannot change the universe, but it can show the powers that be (i.e. Democratic and Republican state party leaders) that Marijuana legalization/decrim is no longer a shoot yourself in the foot topic to be avoided at all costs.

It sends a message not only to party leaders but to voters that people are ready for change (and are not happy with the status quo).

Today is a new day. Much of the aging population that so adamantly supported marijuana prohibition are dying off or being replaced by a newer generation (Gen X, Y, Me, and the children of the baby boomers-the former hippies), so the new generation is replacing them and they aren't afraid of marijuana but they do have genuine concerns of government jailing and killing people for growing or smoking a plant.

At my last job (had to leave to go back to school), literally everyone I worked with supported marijuana legalization and/or decriminalization including the boss who is about as American as apple pie (military service, former rancher/cowboy, hunter, small business owner/entrepreneur, you name it).

I don't see this as a weird coincidence. More and more people are ready to draw the line that whether or not they agree with (or like people "getting high") they don't feel that it should be a punishable offense. I don't think people should drink in excess or commit adultery or view pornography, but I also don't feel that the government should punish such things.

These are the distinctions that are becoming more prevalent.

It is not inevitable that Marijuana will become legal in the United States (we could fall as a society before that happens), but if Proposition 19 fails in November it'll be much harder to get it on the ballot in CA and other states in the future. "If something like that can't even pass in California, it certainly won't pass in Idaho" will be the thinking.

Is it just coincidence that no state had medical marijuana laws until after Prop 215 passed in California?

 

[BiG H3rB Tr3E]

How can indignation from NON CALIFORNIANS be so strong? How can what the CA voters do change the universe? Why are better bills on the ballot on other states?

If ANYTHING is better than the current PROHIBITION why isn't there a vote on the issue in your locality?

I for one hope the people in CA do what they want and realize that this bill has nothing to do with MJs future or the MJ culture.

Just like 215 had nothing to do with the starting a wave of medical marijuana legislation in other states....?

 

[BiG H3rB Tr3E]

There was a neat thread that discussed this language:

IRRESPECTIVE of any state law localities MAY REGULATE.

If that clause is in Prop 19 and Prop 19 passes than it is a majority vote and has the EFFECT of overturning Kelly and now plant limits and county regs are fine

8. Ensure that if a city decides it does want to tax and regulate the buying and selling of cannabis (to and from adults only), that a strictly controlled legal system is implemented to oversee and regulate cultivation, distribution, and sales, and that the city will have control over how and how much cannabis can be bought and sold, except as permitted under Health and Safety Sections 11362.5 and 11362.7 through 11362.9.

Thats the difference. You anti's can only post speculation. While I can back up my claims with facts and language straight from the proposition.

I cant even imagine how many times ive posted and reposted and reposted this everytime one of you anti19 people bring it up. Do you just not read, or choose its easier to ignore what I post and hope that your fear mongering speculation will fool someone who hasnt read into 19....?

 

[Billy Burroughs]

I am a SoCal resident, registered voter, Vet and MMJ patient. I fallow the leader of leaders for the end of prohibition by Decriminalization and that man was/is Jack Herer who did not support Prop 19. He had seen it for what it is... taxation and nothing more.

The proof... Mr. Richard Lee's facility which will crank out a mega 60 pounds a day.

I am for the Decriminaliztion of our beloved plant and not the enslavement of it through taxation.

I do not knock Mr. Lee for what he is doing... just do not feed me a line of bull. Just tell it like it is.

and if this isnt the truth i dont know what is i wish the residents of nevada and it's medical patients such as myself get on board as a whole and really try to tackle the huge problems this states law has in it but classic to las vegas and it's facade for the past 8 years people have done what vegas does and just sat around trying to figure out how to SCAM THE LAW not fix it myself born and raised in eugene oregon been here 3 years a patient for almost 2 and you can believe that for 2 years now i've tried everything i could to try to point these people in the right direction but the select few that have so far figured out the loop hole or scam or at least the one that metros not hip to yet are the same ones running the meet up groups passing out this vital information hmmm seems one sided to me these groups want to keep people in the dark for every patient they egt carded they charge them almost as much as the state does and almost as much as the doctor so instead of two people collecting 200 dollar fees now they've got it on lock with the doctors that they all get a piece of the pie for a patient to obtain a card ie. my fiance just had to renew i renewed 6 months ago mine cost 75 bucks hers cost 150 this is fees to the doctor and the Dr himself told me that hey these cannabis patient help clubs are charging 150 bucks a visit so why the fuck cant i these idiots have no kinda college they're just a fucking parasite period

 

[vta]

We might get an answer here.

http://www.opposingviews.com/i/tossed-salad-dragonfly-de-la-luz-on-marijuana-laws#piece_tabs

That is the best thing you have posted, yet.

I like the ending comment.

Miss de la Luz, you are welcome on my show anytime you like to discuss why you think I should remain a criminal. Just email me at stash ‘at’ norml.org and we’ll set up an interview time. I will be fair and respectful, but I will be as tough with you as I am with any prohibitionist who wants to keep my pot smoking a criminal act.

 

[pushlimits]

I hope for legalization before I leave this earth. It would be wonderful to not worry about going to prison for the most important plant we have on earth.. but after all the controversy over the present bill I can't vote for it with a clear conscience.. its not what we have waited all these years for! Just because it has been labeled "legalization" doesn't make it so and it sounds more like "industrialization" than "legalization." We need to vote NO this time around and work for a better bill... its been too long coming to settle for less than complete and total and REAL legalization.
We're farmers and we shouldn't be treated or regulated differently than any other farmer.
PLEASE VOTE NO ON "LEGALIZATION" IN NOV!

I totally agree in some respects but I also believe people are missing the bigger picture. If you vote no and this doesn't pass, who's to say we will ever have this opportunity again?

It's kind of like saying Vote NO on Prop 215 all those years ago because it's not good enough. Really? because this is what it sounds like.(correct me if I'm wrong) if everyone had this mentality with 215, -mark my words- we would've never made it this far.

Is a 5x5 canopy really that bad, or maybe we would all prefer an 8x10 cell instead. please don't misconstrued my message, I don't wish to offend anyone. Please realize I say we in all of my statements, because we need to unify, not divide.

Social change is a process, it never happens over night. if people (especially us) say NO to ANY form of legalization (regardless of it's ridiculous stipulations, and yes I think they are very dumb) it sends the wrong message to the world- period.

Let's take what we can get ladies and gentleman, and help BEGIN to end this madness . Heaven knows we have a long way to go from here, let's not make it any longer. I beg you.

 

[Gypsy Nirvana]

I'm kinda excited about seeing this Prop19 pass (that's if it does ofcourse)....

Does anyone see that we may suddenly have thousands of new growers joining our ranks who are perhaps fearful of growing now and may well take up the hobby when it becomes legal to grow for recreational use?

....a 5 x 5 area under 1000 watts of HPS/MH....should yeild the novice grower a minimum of 0.5 a gramm per watt......maybe even 1 gram per watt....per harvest....and even if they are not into perpetual harvests but have 4 harvests a year..(say a 3 month cycle from seed/clone, veg and then thru flowering), thats a minimum of 2 kilos or around 4 and a half pounds per year of 'erb......or 72 ounces per year.....for the average cannabis consumer 1.38 ounces of 'erb a week is plenty for personal use......and if the grower is real good, it could be double that amount......enough to supply themselves and another person or two.....

Quite a few members here have perfected growing in such an area as a 5x5 and have outstanding yeilds way above what I have stated above......