Transitioning away from the illegal grower mindset?

[Cadfael]

I would like to point out:

If you want to share with your friends that you are growing is one thing. When, how much and how long are all different questions.

You could share that you have a closet shed with two plant at a friends house in the country that you just started up.

 

[Avinash.miles]

The OP and I were having this conversation a few weeks ago at the TetraHydro Club and that's the perfect example of a relaxed farmers market setting with lots of weed for sale in the open with no guns, crime, or hassles from the cops.

yet
no guns, crime, hassles or cops..... yet
and it's been legal in MA for what, a couple months?

instead of shitting on advice (even if it may be somewhat over-blown) you might want to heed it and just play it safe

 

[Chunkypigs]

yet
no guns, crime, hassles or cops..... yet
and it's been legal in MA for what, a couple months?

instead of shitting on advice (even if it may be somewhat over-blown) you might want to heed it and just play it safe

The TetraHydro Club fought in court for almost three years to get permitted after being shut down...

I have gotten lots of great advice that I take from IC but when it is to avoid all Mass Hydro shops because there are three guys with guns who DAILY home invasion anyone who shops at them I'm gonna shit on that one, again and again...

I also heard that when you buy blunt wraps at the 7/11 in legal states the cashier sends her boyfriend to follow you home on a scooter and take your dime bag.

It's the overblown here I have a problem with, it's not a big problem I just like to poke fun at it when it pops up.

I'm going to live my life on the assumption that when a crook needs easy money he's gonna take an expensive car from a female pumping gas not hang out at hydro shops and plot home invasions on strangers who are potentially better armed.

But that's just me.
And I have been jacked at gunpoint in the past, over thirty years ago when I sold white powder to support my habit.
My cousin took a shotgun blast to the belly and barely lived to tell about it.

I quit the powder and stopped dealing, he did three bids and ODed in his 40's.

 

[OldSSSCGuy]

I have gotten lots of great advice that I take from IC but when it is to avoid all Mass Hydro shops because there are three guys with guns who DAILY home invasion anyone who shops at them I'm gonna shit on that one, again and again...

Please do. I worked at a MA grow shop for over 10 years and never heard of ONE rip off like that. Total LEO bullshit.

 

[Avinash.miles]

i believe when you say it's overblown... chunkypigs, for sure i get that; and thanks for clearing up the situation on the ground in the most recent legalized state, and first encounter with legalization on the east coast (outside of DC which doesn't fucking count imo)
but
imo it's better to air on the side of caution always.
organized crime / violent criminals will see cannabis ops of all sizes (med/rec, commercial/personal) as low hanging fruit, and unfortunately they are often correct - don't be a sucker (not YOU specifically CP, but everyone in newly legalized areas)
once again, if it aint a problem, better add "yet" to that statement, because it's new in MA, right? and it is in fact a problem in colorado even for large commercial ops.
an armed guard was killed in a dispensary robbery last year in colorado..... it happens
and co is nothing compared to east or west coast, really very safe and laid back in comparison
i've always said about the scene in colorado "don't let them thugs on the east coast how we do in colorado" and "jeez dem boys in the south would run game on us hippys & happy pot farmers if they knew how chill we keep it in co"
never had a gun in my face in colorado, never been ripped (knock on wood)
not saying it's soft out here in the giant square but.... it's not the east coast lets just say that
there are no real ghettos in co, no neighborhoods so bad peeps don't want to go, no housing projects with only one entrance and exit, like i was so accustomed to seeing in the south....

my point should have been that the "black market" mindset is actually valuable and imo getting RID of it would be a shame and a waste, like throwing out good knowledge or unlearning a trade.
instead of transitioning away from the illegal mindset just build on it, but recognize that ALL experience you have with this plant can be valuable experience when applied and learned from.

god i envy the farmers market vibes... wish we could have something like that in CO, but it's never materialized in a real way for whatever reason. sounds so cool, and if there was one out i would probably attend, but would also mind my p's & q's and always CYA

just sayin'
stay safe

 

[Chunkypigs]

i believe when you say it's overblown... chunkypigs, for sure i get that; and thanks for clearing up the situation on the ground in the most recent legalized state, and first encounter with legalization on the east coast (outside of DC which doesn't fucking count imo)
but
imo it's better to air on the side of caution always.
organized crime / violent criminals will see cannabis ops of all sizes (med/rec, commercial/personal) as low hanging fruit, and unfortunately they are often correct - don't be a sucker (not YOU specifically CP, but everyone in newly legalized areas)
once again, if it aint a problem, better add "yet" to that statement, because it's new in MA, right? and it is in fact a problem in colorado even for large commercial ops.
an armed guard was killed in a dispensary robbery last year in colorado..... it happens
and co is nothing compared to east or west coast, really very safe and laid back in comparison
i've always said about the scene in colorado "don't let them thugs on the east coast how we do in colorado" and "jeez dem boys in the south would run game on us hippys & happy pot farmers if they knew how chill we keep it in co"
never had a gun in my face in colorado, never been ripped (knock on wood)
not saying it's soft out here in the giant square but.... it's not the east coast lets just say that
there are no real ghettos in co, no neighborhoods so bad peeps don't want to go, no housing projects with only one entrance and exit, like i was so accustomed to seeing in the south....

my point should have been that the "black market" mindset is actually valuable and imo getting RID of it would be a shame and a waste, like throwing out good knowledge or unlearning a trade.
instead of transitioning away from the illegal mindset just build on it, but recognize that ALL experience you have with this plant can be valuable experience when applied and learned from.

god i envy the farmers market vibes... wish we could have something like that in CO, but it's never materialized in a real way for whatever reason. sounds so cool, and if there was one out i would probably attend, but would also mind my p's & q's and always CYA

just sayin'
stay safe

Gotcha!

It's just that I've seen and lived the worst part of the black market in the past and the medical transitioning to recreational vibe out here is relaxed and really cool.

I've seen a commercial grower in NY get hooked on oxy and lose everything but he didn't rob me he put his life back together and works a straight job now and has kids.

There are bad greedy people everywhere but mostly I've met cool people in the weed biz and I've purchased in twenty different countries and many states med and street.

If people don't get out and connect now I think they might end up in the cold if the market here ends up looking like WA and rec weed is dirt cheap and you can't earn a living off your old black market customers who develope a taste for low price dank super concentrates or that 99% ultra refined whatever.

The medical market here is full of sick people who get ripped at the dispensaries and love connecting with growers one on one and paying a fair price for meds.
Really sick people from states like jersey, and NY where there are no flowers allowed and even CT where the dispensaries are also bunk are driving a few hours to RI to cop and some who go all the way to Maine where there's supposed to be better CBD meds.

If you have high quality clone only gear I think you could clean house because everyone here is running seed selections and many are kinda generic smelling.
The east coast MMJ market supply is way better than last time I was here but it's not west coast yet, soon though and it's a big market filled with sick people that can't garden.

Personally I think if you are near here and grow high quality you should try it.
I think there are way more of us out here than anyone knows, I've already had a few people from the mag come meet me fthat never even posted in my thread and we're off my radar here.

Lots of people glad to get out of the closet and smoke and talk shit.

high Times cup in RI this summer should open lots of eyes, get you a weed card by then even if it's a fake, they don't look close at them and they accept all states cards in RI.

There will be thousands of new legal growers this year all around me and I want to get the best quality genetics in their hands and help them crop twelve monsters if they are Adult and an unlimited quantity if they got that Mass weed card.

 

[rives]

it's way too late in life to change tactics for me, and I see no reason to even want to. I've been doing this since well before Operation Green Merchant, and while levels of enforcement come and go, it's still illegal at the most worrisome level.

Keep your head down.

 

[KONY]

Gotcha!

It's just that I've seen and lived the worst part of the black market in the past and the medical transitioning to recreational vibe out here is relaxed and really cool.

I've seen a commercial grower in NY get hooked on oxy and lose everything but he didn't rob me he put his life back together and works a straight job now and has kids.

There are bad greedy people everywhere but mostly I've met cool people in the weed biz and I've purchased in twenty different countries and many states med and street.

If people don't get out and connect now I think they might end up in the cold if the market here ends up looking like WA and rec weed is dirt cheap and you can't earn a living off your old black market customers who develope a taste for low price dank super concentrates or that 99% ultra refined whatever.

The medical market here is full of sick people who get ripped at the dispensaries and love connecting with growers one on one and paying a fair price for meds.
Really sick people from states like jersey, and NY where there are no flowers allowed and even CT where the dispensaries are also bunk are driving a few hours to RI to cop and some who go all the way to Maine where there's supposed to be better CBD meds.

If you have high quality clone only gear I think you could clean house because everyone here is running seed selections and many are kinda generic smelling.
The east coast MMJ market supply is way better than last time I was here but it's not west coast yet, soon though and it's a big market filled with sick people that can't garden.

Personally I think if you are near here and grow high quality you should try it.
I think there are way more of us out here than anyone knows, I've already had a few people from the mag come meet me fthat never even posted in my thread and we're off my radar here.

Lots of people glad to get out of the closet and smoke and talk shit.

high Times cup in RI this summer should open lots of eyes, get you a weed card by then even if it's a fake, they don't look close at them and they accept all states cards in RI.

There will be thousands of new legal growers this year all around me and I want to get the best quality genetics in their hands and help them crop twelve monsters if they are Adult and an unlimited quantity if they got that Mass weed card.

Bingo, the only people really making any money in legal markets now are retail sales. I mean sure people growing for the black and grey market can make some money, but its peanuts compared to those legal sales. The average customer would much rather pay a premium for a small amount of good quality weed once or twice a week, then buy black market wholesale for a great price once a month from some guy at a gas station parking lot.

I've realized after thinking about this more, that the only way to go forward with my plan safely is to have the grow at a separate location. Which has been an idea for a bit and I will continue looking for the right place.

 

[III%]

It's the same old shit.....it's risk vs reward. How much reward are you looking for and how much risk are you willing to take.

This can mean many things, risking theives, risking LEO intervention, or risking financial ruin when a large crop gets infested by bugs.

There isn't any one answer to this question, it is personal as everyone has a different idea of how it should go about.

Some of the wealtheist people I know are big time gamblers, they have taken in a lot of cash in their day but they have also had some tremendous losses.

Most people only brag about the success few want to brag about their mistakes.

 

[mojave green]

I always operate as if it was illegal! Old habits. Now that it's legal, Hydro stores in Cali wanna be all, "hey bro, what strains you running?" Fuck off! Last year you woulda thrown me out for mentioning weed!
Ima grumpy old duck!

But I love growing WEED!
Personal nirvana!

 

[KONY]

I always operate as if it was illegal! Old habits. Now that it's legal, Hydro stores in Cali wanna be all, "hey bro, what strains you running?" Fuck off! Last year you woulda thrown me out for mentioning weed!
Ima grumpy old duck!

But I love growing WEED!
Personal nirvana!

Things like this make me believe I am living in an alternative universe. I have been puffing out back of the local hydro store for 7 years here now.

Many had medical back then, but many did not, the store doesnt care and has never had any problems (as a result of puffing out back). Granted we are in the middle of nowhere. Nearest stop light to this store is probably 20 miles away.

 

[EastCoast710]

Bingo, the only people really making any money in legal markets now are retail sales. I mean sure people growing for the black and grey market can make some money, but its peanuts compared to those legal sales. The average customer would much rather pay a premium for a small amount of good quality weed once or twice a week, then buy black market wholesale for a great price once a month from some guy at a gas station parking lot.

I've realized after thinking about this more, that the only way to go forward with my plan safely is to have the grow at a separate location. Which has been an idea for a bit and I will continue looking for the right place.

ya.. and great weed is always wanted in mass.. the shortage of top shelf quality nugs is here.. so there is always a market for top top top shelf shit.. especially if its been flushed properly and smokes great too..

 

[KONY]

ya.. and great weed is always wanted in mass.. the shortage of top shelf quality nugs is here.. so there is always a market for top top top shelf shit.. especially if its been flushed properly and smokes great too..

No ones buying great weed in large amounts in legal areas unless they are taking it elsewhere. The days of selling like this are limited. Its not going to stop overnight, or even next year, but it's limited.

 

[III%]

I get ppl begging me for high grades. There is so much bullshit mediocre bud out there, but there is still ppl that want the really good shit.

Any news I see on the legal states like CO anytime they show the recreational weed either for sale or growing it looks like straight up crap.

There is always been 2 schools of thought, sell a large volume of cheap mediocre weed, or sell smaller amounts of really good shit at a premium price. If the home grower has survived Canadian beasters and mexican mids how can it not survive the new state sanctioned weed cartels?

 

[Avinash.miles]

the only people really making any money in legal markets now are retail sales.

innacurate,
more people have 8-12$ an hour jobs in legal markets, but the owners are the ones making the real coin and there aren't as many of those as you would think - yes they are making hella coin - BUT they aren't the ONLY ones doing it, i assure you
also.... wana know who makes money in legal markets?
associated dealers...
like... who got richer than gold miners during the rush? dudes selling picks and shovels and sluice boxes and GEAR like boots and buckets

so (imo) to say retail sales are the ONLY money worth mentioning in legal markets is pretty inaccurate - still loads of money in the black market (so im told by peeps doing it big)
still loads of dough in associated products (think growstores and fertilizer dealers, soil yards, greenhouse builders)
in legal markets the upswing of money is spread out among EVERYONE, people (private & industry) buy more lumber to buildout more rooms, they buy more glass jars to store more weed, they buy more trim machines, they buy MORE - stores they buy from hire more employees (8-12$ probably).

I get ppl begging me for high grades. There is so much bullshit mediocre bud out there, but there is still ppl that want the really good shit.

Any news I see on the legal states like CO anytime they show the recreational weed either for sale or growing it looks like straight up crap.

There is always been 2 schools of thought, sell a large volume of cheap mediocre weed, or sell smaller amounts of really good shit at a premium price. If the home grower has survived Canadian beasters and mexican mids how can it not survive the new state sanctioned weed cartels?

there is good weed out there on the industry side, it's hard to find but its out there
i have a close friend running a legal med/rec op in denver, he just advertised 250 lbs of flower at 50 per lb (wholesale price from dispensary to dispensary) i've smoked a few strains from his shop and nove of it was "straight up crap", not as good as our organic homegrown, but good enough not to be bad

 

[Treetroit City]

there is good weed out there on the industry side, it's hard to find but its out there
i have a close friend running a legal med/rec op in denver, he just advertised 250 lbs of flower at 50 per lb (wholesale price from dispensary to dispensary) i've smoked a few strains from his shop and nove of it was "straight up crap", not as good as our organic homegrown, but good enough not to be bad

$50 a pound?
Let's face it if someone is selling flower for $50 a lb you don't want that flower. Something is up with that flower.

 

[III%]

Do you guys see the silver lining?

The rule book is being written, hold tight to your price and the price will stay high.

It's a commodity, when the suppliers start under cutting eachother the price will sink and keep sinking. Luckily huge grow ops have huge overhead, they can only go so low before they have to cut corners.

One thing that can be said about the black market is we unknowingly worked together without even trying or knowing.

Products of similar quality always went for a similar price. Price your shit accordingly, work hard, work smart, good luck and remember it will be a survival of the fittest.

 

[420somewhere]

Yeah, I want some of that..

Yeah, I want some of that..

$50 a pound?
Let's face it if someone is selling flower for $50 a lb you don't want that flower. Something is up with that flower.

I'll go for $50 a lb sounds like the good old days, $45 a pound on the American side.

 

[Avinash.miles]

$50 a pound?
Let's face it if someone is selling flower for $50 a lb you don't want that flower. Something is up with that flower.

maybe so, BUT it's lab tested for residuals and potency, so it ain't tainted or the state wouldn't allow it to be sold or leave premise

it's just how people are trying to shut down the game, they are growing enough to justify it apparently.

in the same way i heard of cbd processing labs selling CBD isolate SUPER cheap (cents per gram) back to farmers to shut down any other labs trying to do the same thing
it's a tactic - and doesn't necessarily reflect the quality of the product

 

[DocTim420]

Cannabis is NOT a homogeneous commodity that can be compared across the board. Sorta like wine, what is the difference between a $5 bottle of wine and one that teeters $500? Both are "liquid assets".

IMO, those same reasons/rationale that explain the differences between two bottles of wine ($5 vs $500) are the same for cannabis ($50 vs $_000 per pound). It is simply consumer expectations and their preferences--you know, the same thing that makes some herb to be "so-so" and some herb to be "whooa!".

Ask a California wine consumer which wine they prefer and most likely you will hear the same 3 wines: Cabernet Sauvignon, Chardonnay and Pinot Noir.

Ask a California winemaker what is their "go to wine"...and it seldom will it be the same "top 3". Rather their preference usually bends to obscure heavier "tooth stainer" wines such as California's Petite Sirah"--something that most consumers are not crazy for. Hmmm, how can this be?

Ask a California cannabis consumer which herb they prefer and will their preference mirror that of California cannabis growers? I doubt it. Same...same.

That said...IMO, each cannabis grower needs to define their market (just like wineries did decades ago) some cater to the "low end" market (Two-Buck-Chuck from Trader Joes), others to the "high end" (primarily distributed via club members on an allocation basis...never sold at stores), and the balance (majority) compete for the same shelf space in retail stores (aka commercial). You know...that 80/20 thing.

If the stuff you grow is "commercial" quality...then don't whine about it, embrace it. If the stuff you grow is "whooa!" quality...then don't price it as "commercial'. If the stuff you grow is "two-buck-chuck" quality...then you need to understand why, and fix it.

In otherwords, if you grow the same strain and quality that everyone else is growing--then you are stuck in the "middle market"...aka "commersh". Hard to differentiate mediocre from other mediocre weed.

The admission to the "high-end" herb club requires a few basic things: excellent genetics, advanced cultivation knowledge with years of experience...and a pair of balls made of steel (as the pathway is loaded with landmines and price grinders).