The true nature of our experience.

[dank.frank]

This is absolutely retarded. NEVER once have I ever protested the "now" aspect of anything - I've conceded to accept that - and even stated that "now" only exists what is technically a nano-second - and that by the time we actually PERCEIVE anything...it is already, technically the past - which you said is a correct observation - so.... we may exist in the now - By the time we have a thought of any sort - "now" has already come and gone and changed....

But I know - time - doesn't exist - it is only a forced structure of society that we choose to enslave ourselves too... circle jerk, circle jerk, circle jerk.

YOU can't even explain what consciousness IS - or HOW we are able to exist. YOU said that "we" whoever that is, has no idea what the mind is. How can ANYONE that has NO ability to receive any sort of data or interpret it - be the pure essence of consciousness - ROFL...

So, your idea of a perfect state of being - is to be physically unable to do, think, feel, see, hear - anything. Your perfect state of being...is to essentially be NOTHING.

WOW. Have fun with that. I really am done here....this time...really.

Until you start posting grow threads, I have nothing left to say to you. Enjoy living in the past...errrr...the nano-second you consider to be the "present"...

Honestly...biggest waste of TIME EVER...I could have put a book on tape on repeat and gained just as much insight - you have no understanding of your own - you only have the words of another person that you happen to agree with...just like all the rest of us.





dank.Frank

 

[devilgoob]

The purpose of life defines itself.

I type in English, to be understood by others, with computers, that have English.

The purpose of the word, is to describe other words. These are states of being of things represented in each of the states of beings of the things the words describe, wherein a state of being, AM, IS, ARE, WAS, WERE, all forms of 'be' and describing being in the future and the past, but also present.

So words are just to express what is, or what will be, but never themselves. All words are meanings of each other and therefore inherently meaningless without describing existence or consciousness. As we all know, we are made from cheese, rocks, hamburgers, eggs and water. Before they interacted with other cells working together, the chemicals worked together, and before that, the electrons formed a system with protons and neutrons, and all those are made up of that.


Those things are conscious, yet, at so low of an order, we would like to think not. But they are.

Words communicate things, much like an animal's utterances, or a lizard's posture, or even a toad swelling up to look bigger. Even a worm struggling or a cell's attack or self-death signal.

So everything that is expressed consciously, is just another word, just a lower form of it.

The moment any of it existed or didn't, still measured up to us being here now. So if no time existed, no anything, in a way, we existed, but in the future.

Something had always been living or moving or interacting. A rock can be chipped, sort of like a physical memory. It can interact, and it has structure. Trees aren't decision makers, but DO turn toward the sun. We might think it's just clockwork, and that the plant isn't thinking, but the same can be said about us - negative and positive things motivate us to not do something, or do it. We really don't have a choice, but for some reason I know we create our reality, somewhat.

Me and my girlfriend were talking, and I told her I was having Deju Vu. After telling her that, we continued on our conversation and she ended up asking STILL the same questions as in my Deja Vu "dream." Me knowing it was happening, didn't effect the outcome and her asking the same questions.

Anything that is physical, is consciousness, because it begins a self-interacting pattern. The more the pattern interacts with itself, the more it becomes aware of itself, which is part of it's environment.

Anything, that forms a pattern, based on the pattern of things existing around it, forms itself to think AKA perform function to repeat said function. To propagate the most stable pattern, and build upon it. Something we do naturally. If the pattern is unstable - it collapses -destruction being the form of creation.

 

[southflorida]

This is absolutely retarded. NEVER once have I ever protested the "now" aspect of anything - I've conceded to accept that - and even stated that "now" only exists what is technically a nano-second - and that by the time we actually PERCEIVE anything...it is already, technically the past - which you said is a correct observation - so.... we may exist in the now - By the time we have a thought of any sort - "now" has already come and gone and changed....

dank.Frank...a nano-second is still time, now is now, it is what always and only now, for now there is nothing but now.

now is what IS (always and only!!!)

the primary reality...is where now exists

in the the secondary reality, where time is only a thought, there are nano-seconds and seconds, minutes, hours, days, years, etc...etc...etc.

but, what you're not grasping (at least that's how it seems to me, based on your posts, and your frustration in relation to this topic) is that the primary reality, consciousness/awareness/aware presence doesn't disappear when the secondary reality is occuring in our perceptions.

Just like the screen (consciousness/primary reality) doesn't disappear when the movie (perception/secondary reality) is being projected on it.

The screen "seems" as-if it becomes the movie, but in reality, the screen is always and only the screen, unchanging, constant.

What changes is the movie being projected on the screen.

If you stop being hypnotized by your thoughts and look clearly at your experience you will see that what you are perceiving in your experience is very much like that movie on the screen.

and Consciousness is like that movie screen

the movie screen can show any image on itself, because it is exactly NOTHING.

But I know - time - doesn't exist - it is only a forced structure of society that we choose to enslave ourselves too... circle jerk, circle jerk, circle jerk.

In our direct-experience there is only NOW.

This is an undisputed fact, and anyone that doesn't grasp it is simply hypnotized by their mind, since the mind needs time to survive.

The mind, just like the body, is nothing but a thought, a concept, a perception that is secondary in nature, and not true in and of itself.

YOU can't even explain what consciousness IS - or HOW we are able to exist. YOU said that "we" whoever that is, has no idea what the mind is. How can ANYONE that has NO ability to receive any sort of data or interpret it - be the pure essence of consciousness - ROFL...

Consciousness/awareness/aware presence/what IS - are NOT concepts, they are what we really "are."

What is - IS, that's as far as words can explain it, and even that is saying too much.

You want to grasp with a secondary tool (mind) what Consciousness IS...??? remember consciousness is primary, it is - what actually is - now.

That's like the bacteria in your stomach wanting to grasp what you are as a human being, or what you are thinking

...don't you think that's sort of.....impossible?

So, your idea of a perfect state of being - is to be physically unable to do, think, feel, see, hear - anything. Your perfect state of being...is to essentially be NOTHING.

that's not my idea, or an idea at all...Consciousness/awareness is nothing, infinitely nothing and absolutely everything - at once.

not a thing for the mind to understand for sure...but that is what you are experiencing right now.

you are, after all, that Consciousness/awareness also...even if your mind tells you otherwise

WOW. Have fun with that. I really am done here....this time...really.

Until you start posting grow threads, I have nothing left to say to you. Enjoy living in the past...errrr...the nano-second you consider to be the "present"...

Honestly...biggest waste of TIME EVER...I could have put a book on tape on repeat and gained just as much insight - you have no understanding of your own - you only have the words of another person that you happen to agree with...just like all the rest of us.

The mind is a terrible thing....waste it

 

[trichrider]

what is time?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?annota...&feature=iv&src_vid=y_leHGTm55Y&v=4a-o5-EYzTY

and...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?annota...&feature=iv&src_vid=j-u1aaltiq4&v=vrqmMoI0wks

 

[Easy7]

Some brain circuits are faster or slower than others. So some aspects of the viewing of the "now" are actually percieved more as "then".

Who can say what the true nature of our experience is? I guess everyone can, anyone that observes any aspect at all. All opinions are valuable because we care mostly what others observe, this is more real and truth than what we intend.

I suppose that there are two perpectives to admire. The perspective of survival and the post life spiritual dying aspect. I care for both because they serve me well. Surviving can be rude, we do cruel things to stay on top. Having a spirit can help us be more sensative and live in ways that are more than surviving, but flourishing.

I think it's important to balance surviving with spitualism. There can be an imbalance of the two. PSTD is like having too much of the past, overcompensating spiritualism for survivalism. I have developed a belief that the spirit can be a toy. Self hypnosis tools, a hypnotic imagery that takes us away from our surviving. In this aspect we don't really have to exist, but having a body changes the body while we experience these not having body experiences. Seems why there are cerimonies, so we can drop surviving and be in a safe place while exploring what is beyond. But the truth is we must contain dualism, unless you just want to be dead.

 

[southflorida]

Some brain circuits are faster or slower than others. So some aspects of the viewing of the "now" are actually percieved more as "then".

we are making a distinction in this thread between primary reality and secondary reality.

all perception occurs in the secondary reality, at least the "stuff" we perceive is secondary, and not what is actually there.

just like with a movie on the screen.

the movie is secondary, the screen primary

the movie starts, changes, and ends

the screen is what always is

the screen is there before the movie starts, is there during the movie, and there when the movie ends

the movie is just an illusion (secondary)

the screen is real (primary)

Who can say what the true nature of our experience is? I guess everyone can, anyone that observes any aspect at all. All opinions are valuable because we care mostly what others observe, this is more real and truth than what we intend.

anyone that can put their thoughts aside, stop being hypnotized by their mind, and actually directly experience their experience

I suppose that there are two perspectives to admire. The perspective of survival and the post life spiritual dying aspect. I care for both because they serve me well. Surviving can be rude, we do cruel things to stay on top. Having a spirit can help us be more sensitive and live in ways that are more than surviving, but flourishing.

this is a good point, making a distinction between survival and spiritual, except the part about dying, we don't really remember being born, how can we be sure we will actually die?

maybe the spiritual part simply always exists now, similar to the screen in the analogy above

while the body/mind end similar to the movie?

 

[Easy7]

I know we don't die, the entirety of who we are is energy flowing through nuerons...which goes on. I find folie e duex to be interesting. It seems it is a power that runs deep, when we synch we can see eachother more. It's a mind control, something that society uses everyday. Being psychotic is the animal experience. It's natural survivalism. Something that I always wanted more of the soul in. I find life on earth has to much of the bad things. People are traumatized so we can't really develope spiritually. A war of freedom exists, this is what is happening. Until science validates the true nature of our spirit, we are doomed to be subjected to old and powerful beliefs.

 

[Dope time]

I Repped your post But this aint about "Mans" Science. (words...)
lol
Mans Science Does Not Explain.Stuff

 

[southflorida]

I know we don't die, the entirety of who we are is energy flowing through nuerons...which goes on. I find folie e duex to be interesting. It seems it is a power that runs deep, when we synch we can see eachother more. It's a mind control, something that society uses everyday. Being psychotic is the animal experience. It's natural survivalism. Something that I always wanted more of the soul in. I find life on earth has to much of the bad things. People are traumatized so we can't really develop spiritually. A war of freedom exists, this is what is happening. Until science validates the true nature of our spirit, we are doomed to be subjected to old and powerful beliefs.

You are 100% right about survival. In this secondary reality, survival is all we are ever doing, and nothing exists outside of it...at least in our perceptions.

The only reason perception exists and evolves is for survival.

But, in relation to humans, we have taken the "social-survival" to a level that is just freakin-absurd...lol

...humans are so hypnotized by "social-survival" that physical survival has taken a back seat...lol

...people killing themselves because of how they appear socially

...mothers giving birth to many children so they can die in "holy" wars

...etc...etc...etc

================

...look at me I have more bling-bling

...and i got bigger trichomes

...and so on!

 

[Dope time]

No i Meant the other way!

Lack of Understanding makes Aggresion [in Many Cases]..yes yes. BUT that was Pretty simple []
lol ok

 

[southflorida]

what makes our body/mind ours?

if we clearly look into our experience we will see that it's thought that makes our body/mind ours.

fundamentally the body/mind is simply a body/mind, it is not actually "ours"

folks hypnotized by cultural programming rarely, if ever notice this in their awareness.

the biggest conspiracy against humanity is the cultural programming that convinces us that we are fundamentally a body/mind that perceives the outside world.

this false assumption keeps the masses effectively dumbed down

 

[Sat X RB]

southflorida, what is your authority to speak to us saying the things you do? in my eyes you have no authority. you too seem 'hypnotised' by your conditioning.

 

[southflorida]

southflorida, what is your authority to speak to us saying the things you do? in my eyes you have no authority. you too seem 'hypnotised' by your conditioning.

who said anything about authority?

why does one have to have authority to post what one experiences in one's experience????...lol

if something is true, what's the difference where the truth originates?

 

[HempKat]

so if they put me in a straight jacket and i just stayed positive about the whole experience would my balls itch or not?

It depends, did you shower or at least put on some Gold Bond before they put you in a straight jacket?

 

[Weird]

be here now

 

[Weird]

imho the true nature of our existence is to reach the top of this chart but hey to each his own

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ten_spiritual_realms

 

[HempKat]

Your assumption is that you know what the primary reality is.

And if I'm right, you think that the primary reality is the "objective" world outside of us, and the secondary world is the "subjective" point of view we each have of the "objective" world.

But, this is not what I'm pointing at, and from my current point of view, the objective and subjective realities are both secondary processes and activities of our minds. They are the movie on the movie screen. The movie screen being an analogy to the primary and the movie to the secondary, of course.

What I'm actually trying to say is that the primary reality is not-known, and actually can't be known through our organs of perception.

Why?

Because perception is a secondary process.

The "primary" data that is interpreted and converted into the "secondary" reality - through our organs of perception working in co-operation with our mind - is really not-known.

The reason the "primary" reality is not-known is because it can't be known.

Primary reality is what IS.

And, what IS - can only be directly experienced.

We are directly experiencing the primary reality NOW, and always and only NOW.

In fact, we ARE this primary reality itself.

While the secondary reality is occuring inside of us, not outside of us, as many folks believe.

You see, in reality, we are not a body/mind perceiving an outside world.

We are consciousness that is aware of our body, mind, and the outside world.

The only thing that makes our body and mind "ours" is a thought that they are ours...nothing else.

Without this thought, that I am my body and mind, the body and mind are simply a body and a mind, they are not "someone's" body and mind.



The body that most people consider to be objective and physical is simply a perception, an interpretation of data that is not-known.

There is no such thing as bodies, minds, or outside world.

All that we perceive is very similar to how a movie is projected onto a screen and we sit in the movie theater, hypnotized for two hours "believing and assuming" that what is being projected on the screen is real.

Otherwise we wouldn't spend so much money to go to the movies.

I mean, most folks don't go to the movies and keep telling themselves and others that it's just a movie, none of this is real, etc.

Exceptions do happen, for example when some scary or gross stuff occurs on the screen. But, the majority of the time we look at the movie in a theater as if it is real for those two hours.

This is what is occuring in our lives as well, except obviously it is much more real, and all our organs of perceptions are working and making us believe that my body and mind and the outside world that I'm perceiving is real.

....but, it's not.

It's a movie being played by consciousness inside of consciousness.

And consciousness is the screen, the projector, the movie, and the viewer of the movie. This part is a paradox for the mind, but not for consciousness.

It is ONE, and to pull this off, it has to use this structure, where it seems "as-if" there are separate elements all over, but if one simply pays attention to the direct-experience occuring NOW, instead of being hypnotized by thoughts, one will see that all there ever is, is experiencing.

No one has ever experienced anything but this experience that is occuring NOW, and always and only NOW.

And this is a FACT.

Arguing with this fact is really absurd, but for some unknown reason to me, the human species loves to argue with it.

And, so far, the only thing that it leads to is suffering and struggle.

And, of course a lot of cruel shit that we humans do to each other.

Like wars, rape, murder, torture, etc..etc...etc



It's not about looking at things differently.

It is about the truth.

The truth of who we really ARE.

If we are conscious and aware of our body/mind, then we simply can't be that fundamentally, we can only be that "thing" that is aware and conscious.

In other words, consciousness/aware presence/awareness.

If one puts aside thoughts and focuses on what is actually occuring in one's direct-experience, then he will clearly see that the experience occuring NOW is the only thing that has ever been actually real.

And what this experience really IS - is not-known.

Actually it's not about truth at all, it's about your opinion and that because you think your opinion makes so much sense to you, you've decided it is the truth for everyone.

One big basis for your argument is that you've labeled reality as the Primary and an individual's experience of it thru their senses as Secondary. You then conclude from those labels that the primary can never be known directly simply because our senses are what you call a secondary process. Which sounds logical because something that is considered secondary can never be primary. Like fire and smoke. Fire is the primary because it has to come first in order for the secondary of smoke to occur. Smoke can never be the primary because it requires the primary of fire to make it happen.

I've said it time and again in these discussions with you in your various threads. You keep making blanket statements about people based on your opinions and frankly, your opinions are way off the mark for most people. Like this little gem:

All that we perceive is very similar to how a movie is projected onto a screen and we sit in the movie theater, hypnotized for two hours "believing and assuming" that what is being projected on the screen is real.

Otherwise we wouldn't spend so much money to go to the movies.

I mean, most folks don't go to the movies and keep telling themselves and others that it's just a movie, none of this is real, etc.

Hardly anyone goes to the movies and sits there and says "this stuff is real" We go to the movies to escape reality for a while not because we believe it is reality, we call this entertainment. The only people that sit in a movie and believe or assume that what is being projected on the screen is real are really stupid people or people with cognitive issues that interfere with rational thought.

You are correct that most folks don't go to the movies and keep telling themselves "it's just a movie, none of this is real" the reason they don't is because they already know this though, so they don't have to keep preventing themselves from accidentally thinking it's real.

 

[HempKat]

anyone that can put their thoughts aside, stop being hypnotized by their mind, and actually directly experience their experience

This is impossible because to put your thoughts aside and stop being hypnotized by the mind would require the thought to do so which comes from the mind and by your definition is therefore secondary and not real.

 

[HempKat]

who said anything about authority?

why does one have to have authority to post what one experiences in one's experience????...lol

if something is true, what's the difference where the truth originates?

Authority is what establishes what is truth and what isn't. What he is asking is what besides your own personal opinion establishes that what you are saying about reality is the Truth? Just because you believe it to be truth doesn't make it truth.

 

[offthehook]

Authority is what establishes what is truth and what isn't.

It only considers what authority's establish as 'truth'.

Stating this beeing 'fact' on a Canna forum somehow got my gear grinding.

"Just because you believe it to be truth doesn't make it truth".

Because authority's establishing/believing it beeing truth also doesn't make it realy more truth as my own.

Oh, and I do buy some of Southflorida's conclusions, wich does make me a bit of an authority of my own too. (since accepting authority seems beeing a bit of a numbers game and we're now already with 2 ppl)
lol