The true nature of our experience.

[southflorida]

I am very aware of this at pretty much all times, but especially if I were to experience fear.
Using this knowledge, I manage to stay away from fear. If fear overcomes me fysicly, I will recognise this too, wich helps me overcome fysical fear as well.

But the oposite of scare (fear) would be 'care', I believe.
In order to be a good human, It's necessary to care. (> Survival of the conscience)
Even though I manage to deal with most of my fears fairly well, the urge to 'care' means I would need to understand, maybe even sympathise with' other ppls possible fears as well, even though I don't experience these 'fears' myself in the first place. Hence, I will have to adjust my behaviour in accordence.

I'm talking about your own, personal, and direct fear, not what other people you live with or know - fear.

...but, obviously their fear has the same structure, and knowing this structure you can...with care...maybe help them to see that their fears are not based in reality.

...this can be done really gently, choosing the right words, but to simply watch how people live in fear, and not help them out, if you know how to, is not very caring...imho.

Caring is caring. Being a loving human being means you are fearless, because, as you correctly said, caring (love) is the opposite of fear.

A person paralyzed by fear can't be truly loving, since he is completely focused on himself and NOT on the other human being.

F ? FFF ??? FU FU FU FUUUUUUUUuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuu ... And not grow weed anylonger?... I Donno man. Ma ego keeps telling me that it's just sooo right a thing to do for the right-now yanno. lol

You don't need fear to grow and not get caught. That is why you have intelligence, and can take all the possible steps to make it as safe as possible.

But, the reality is this: if you grow, and it is illegal where you are, circumstances can occur where you will get caught.

fear will not help you in any way to avoid a circumstance that is NOT under your control.

so, no matter what, fear is an unnecessary manipulation of the experience that is occuring, and is basically an imposition on reality.

In my reality it is yeh, But not in my family's reality.
I can't force my 'fear free reality' unto others who are not aware of this mindset. (wife, children)
(in my book of 'trying to be a good human', I am not allowed to force too much of myself upon others without their consent.)

you can actually only experience your own fear, you can't experience the fear of other people, there is simply no way of doing this.

all you can do is believe and assume that they are afraid of something, but in reality you can't know for sure.

but, either way, I don't really see what the fears of other people in your life have to do with what we're talking about in here.

My family members, relatives, friends, and people I personally know all "seem" to have fears...so what?

Where I can help them and point out that their fears are not rooted in reality...I do that...if they don't care to know about this...I leave them alone with their fears.

every "individual" consciousness has its own path, its own way of evolving, why get in the way?

If others are living a 'lie', then I will need to respect them for living these lies in order not to become oppressive towards these others myself.
If others are oppressive to me because of their lie's, I will do as I please and not acknowledge their lies having merit. (> hence I grow weed)
I need living a lie in order to keep others safe. If I'd life without fear, I would not have a reason to take care, do wreckless things, and end up in prison or lose the house my family lives in.

...I agree, if others want to live within a lie, within an illusion, then you shouldn't be oppressive.

...but, the fact that you are growing weed, is not lying.

You are simply doing something that your government has "invented" laws against. These laws are made-up by stupid human beings, they are not true in any way.

If you live your life without fear, you could clearly see how to be caring/loving and would not do wreckless things.

...instead of being hypnotized by your fears, you would focus on what is actually occuring in your experience, instead of focusing on concepts in your thinking.

I could not be to sure of that. I think it's not so much a matter of lying or beeing honest to oneself (I'd be aware either way^^), I believe it's more about trying to do what's right.


...true...you are aware either way

Been practising that already for a while... Untill other peoples reality kicks in... ^^ lol.

it is actually not about practicing, but being present in your experience, here and now, and no matter what other people do, it is still "your" direct-experience.

...this now-experience never ends, or goes anywhere, even when you are caught in your thoughts.

...just like the sun is still shining when the clouds cover it up

 

[southflorida]

WHAT causes a person to actually LIVE? HOW is it "we" "exist"?

====================
Consciousness is aware. It is aware AS this experience, that you and everyone and everything else is currently having.
====================

Think about it: isn't the only truth that you are 100% sure of is....."that"......you exist?

You may not be sure "what" you are, but you are sure "that" you are...right?

...i mean, when we get right down to it...you are "conscious"?

...you don't have to think it or feel it, consciousness/awareness is an inherent element of you "being."

So, the question actually becomes...what is consciousness?

If consciousness is a fundamental, original, and authentic experience itself...then you can clearly see that we exist and live as "the" experience that consciousness is having.

...and that's why it is always NOW, and never anything but NOW

Everything that exists in this now-experience is simply a "distinction" inside of consciousness, and consciousness is aware "as" every distinction, and "of" every distinction.

Alive or dead, is nothing more than a distinction inside of consciousness.

That's why Consciousness doesn't care about the killing of sentient beings. It matters about as much as killing does in a movie.

None of this is actually occuring, it is more or less a projection being projected onto a movie screen, and consciousness is the screen, the projector, the projection, and the one watching the movie.

...i know this shit sounds kind of woo-woo, but as the Chinese said a long time ago: paradox and confusion guard the truth.

...of course the self-mind says all this is bull-shit, but if one puts the mind (and its BS thinking) aside...and clearly observes his "experience" all this becomes crystal-clear quite fast!

 

[southflorida]

"nature of our experience" Be Happy and in No way Detrimental to ANYONE
to achieve this.

these are excellent principles to live by

 

[Dope time]

NOT ALLOWED to Rep or Rate the post(s). ICMag P

Limitations can be Blags!

..C'mon CalCrutchlow. Brumbrum

[MotoGp].

 

[southflorida]

And anyone that doesn't think fear can be DIRECTLY experienced in the present / now - has NEVER had the police at their door while in a medical state obeying and having followed every single nuance of the law to an extent that is consider "radical" by others...

You can live without any notion of future altercations - as there is zero anticipation of any such difficulty that would arise from doing something that otherwise is illegal. Having never been arrested, there is no past thoughts or experience to contribute to the self generation of fear.

However...trust me - when they show up and knock your door - THAT is real, instant fear - in that EXACT present moment - that for NO LOGICAL reason should exists.

do notice that the fear only exists in the form of a scenario in a "possible" future.

...for example that they will break down the door and shoot you, the dog, or a family member, etc

...or ending up in jail, and dropping the soap

...in the actual experience that is occuring there is NO fear.

...and plus, fear is completely self-generated by the mind, it doesn't exist in any circumstance outside the mind.

...to clearly see this, one has to pay attention to what is occuring in one's experience and be honest with himself.

Now, if you want to define past / present / future straight down into the notion of nano-seconds, as that is precisely how fast our minds think / process / become aware - well, that in and of itself, while being TECHNICALLY correct - is just a bit asinine.

That would say that the "now" technically exists with in such a small window we are NOT even capable of processing our "experience" until it is over - meaning we ALWAYS live in the PAST - and NEVER the ACTUAL present...because the present is too quickly ever fleeting.

this post above shows how you are focusing on time, believing/assuming that it "really" exists.

...my main point is that there is "no" such thing as time in reality

...time is a conceptual invention of the mind

...experience is always and only now.

...in our experience there is no time, there is only now, and always now.

Fear is a natural, built in, innate tool developed to increase the ability to SURVIVE. Fear produces adrenaline...by design, FEAR keeps us "alive"...NOT the other way around.

It's called mutha fuggin' spidey sense bro - and if you don't have it...you're gonna get ate up.

fear is really a conceptual "activity" occuring inside the mind.

it has a crystal-clear structure:

1. the unwillingness to experience something we consider to be unwanted/painful.

2. the mental projection of this unwanted/painful scenario

3. and a possibility of a future where this scenario will/might occur

4. the emotional charge felt in the body once the first three elements are imagined by you in your imagination (mind)

...this last part, the emotional charge is what most people think fear IS, and don't notice or ignore the first three that they are generating using their OWN IMAGINATION !!!

...if you take away any of the first three elements, fear will be simply impossible to experience

...meaning that you not only will not experience fear, you will not be able to experience it.

try it out...imagine anything you fear and:

1. become completely willing to experience it (dropping the soap for example )

2. don't project the unwanted/painful scenario in the first place

3. become aware of the "impossibility" of a future

...since future is an impossibility, that shouldn't be that hard

If one genuinely does this in the experience, NO-FEAR will be generated...period...point...blank!

 

[Dope time]

Mr Seminar

 

[southflorida]

The fact that our true self (consciousness, present awareness) is present and aware is beyond doubt.

However, to this simple knowing of our own being we normally add many attributes. In this thread we should proceed very slowly, referring only to our direct and intimate knowledge of our true self, adding attributes, if any, that truly come from experience—that is, from our self’s own experience of itself—rather than from any belief.

The first attribute we usually add to our self, to the simple knowing of our own being, is the belief that it resides in, is made of and is limited to the body and mind. We consider that our self resides inside the body and mind and that everyone and everything else resides outside.

This is the primary belief that is responsible for the fundamental presumption that underpins our entire culture, that experience is divided into two parts—a separate, inside subject, the self that knows, feels or perceives, and a separate, outside object, other or world that is known, felt or perceived.

This essential belief that "I, aware presence" am synonymous with and limited to the body, and therefore share its characteristics, is responsible for the veiling or forgetting of our true identity of aware presence.

The simple knowing of our own being is not actually veiled or forgotten as a result of this belief any more than a screen is veiled by the appearance of an image that appears on it, but it seems to be. This illusion, although it never actually happens, is tremendously powerful and profoundly conditions the way we think, feel, act and relate.

 

[HempKat]

If as you like to believe, that we can't experience anything directly because everything we experience needs to be processed by our senses and then interpreted by our brain. Then it is impossible to live in the here and now because everything our brain interprets was experienced in the past (albeit just fractions of a second in the past). Since you feel past and future is just programming of our "sick society" then everything is just programming of our sick society because we are never able to live in the "now" due to the limitations of our perceptions.

Which makes for quite the paradox since obviously we do exist somewhere.

 

[southflorida]

If as you like to believe, that we can't experience anything directly because everything we experience needs to be processed by our senses and then interpreted by our brain. Then it is impossible to live in the here and now because everything our brain interprets was experienced in the past (albeit just fractions of a second in the past). Since you feel past and future is just programming of our "sick society" then everything is just programming of our sick society because we are never able to live in the "now" due to the limitations of our perceptions.

Which makes for quite the paradox since obviously we do exist somewhere.

This is an accurate observation, one which dank.Frank also made in a previous post and I forgot to comment on.

Consciousness that is aware is primary.

Our perceptions are secondary.

The experience occuring "now" is what IS.

Our "interpretations" of this experience is what IS-NOT.

Our mind interprets what is occuring, and provides us with an emotional charge, letting us know how to react to any circumstance that occurs in our experience.

It is important to make a distinction between a state of present awareness and perception using our senses.

These are two different things, the first always exists now, and only now.

The second, really doesn't exist at all, it is simply an illusion, just like a movie is an illusion on the movie screen.

The movie screen is consciousness that is present awareness...this now-experiencing occuring now.

The movie is the perception of our body, our mind, and the outside world.

When the movie ends, the movie screen remains.

When the movie is playing, the movie screen remains.

The movie screen is primary, the movie is a secondary event.

Same with consciousness/awareness.

Consciousness/awareness is primary.

Body, mind, outside world are simply activities of the mind, they are secondary, and couldn't exist without consciousness/awareness.

Just like a movie wouldn't exist if it was projected into space without a screen.

 

[offthehook]

do notice that the fear only exists in the form of a scenario in a "possible" future.

...for example that they will break down the door and shoot you, the dog, or a family member, etc

...or ending up in jail, and dropping the soap

...in the actual experience that is occuring there is NO fear.

...and plus, fear is completely self-generated by the mind, it doesn't exist in any circumstance outside the mind.

...to clearly see this, one has to pay attention to what is occuring in one's experience and be honest with himself.



this post above shows how you are focusing on time, believing/assuming that it "really" exists.

...my main point is that there is "no" such thing as time in reality

...time is a conceptual invention of the mind

...experience is always and only now.

...in our experience there is no time, there is only now, and always now.



fear is really a conceptual "activity" occuring inside the mind.

it has a crystal-clear structure:

1. the unwillingness to experience something we consider to be unwanted/painful.

2. the mental projection of this unwanted/painful scenario

3. and a possibility of a future where this scenario will/might occur

4. the emotional charge felt in the body once the first three elements are imagined by you in your imagination (mind)

...this last part, the emotional charge is what most people think fear IS, and don't notice or ignore the first three that they are generating using their OWN IMAGINATION !!!

...if you take away any of the first three elements, fear will be simply impossible to experience

...meaning that you not only will not experience fear, you will not be able to experience it.

try it out...imagine anything you fear and:

1. become completely willing to experience it (dropping the soap for example

)

2. don't project the unwanted/painful scenario in the first place

3. become aware of the "impossibility" of a future

...since future is an impossibility, that shouldn't be that hard

If one genuinely does this in the experience, NO-FEAR will be generated...period...point...blank!

yeh that's true.
I once was informed the cops were comming for my plants, but I anyways left one grow unit undemolished for them to find.
I was willing to face all future scenario's in disregard of consequence.
No fear was beeing felt by me when finally they walked in.
Up till this day, I still don't 'fear' that way.
Using your outlay, It's actually real easy to train oneself to remain fearless with cops 'n bully's n' shit.
Nowadays, cops are checking me out rather often so meanwhile I learned to outsmart them.
I don't experience fear, but it's rather stressfull always, and ma wife claims our kids and her selves having fear because of them. (including the aftermath incomplications at school.)

But if my child were about to become hit by a truck, I d'sure feel fear, but prolly on a different level.
Cops and their BS are not real to me somehow. My kids and their destiny somehow is.

 

[HempKat]

This is an accurate observation, one which dank.Frank also made in a previous post and I forgot to comment on.

Consciousness that is aware is primary.

Our perceptions are secondary.

The experience occuring "now" is what IS.

Our "interpretations" of this experience is what IS-NOT.

Our mind interprets what is occuring, and provides us with an emotional charge, letting us know how to react to any circumstance that occurs in our experience.

It is important to make a distinction between a state of present awareness and perception using our senses.

These are two different things, the first always exists now, and only now.

The second, really doesn't exist at all, it is simply an illusion, just like a movie is an illusion on the movie screen.

The movie screen is consciousness that is present awareness...this now-experiencing occuring now.

The movie is the perception of our body, our mind, and the outside world.

When the movie ends, the movie screen remains.

When the movie is playing, the movie screen remains.

The movie screen is primary, the movie is a secondary event.

Same with consciousness/awareness.

Consciousness/awareness is primary.

Body, mind, outside world are simply activities of the mind, they are secondary, and couldn't exist without consciousness/awareness.

Just like a movie wouldn't exist if it was projected into space without a screen.

Not entirely true, not the way you paint it. Our interpretations might be off from the primary based on learned preconceived notions but it's rarely if ever so off as to not even closely resemble the primary. For the majority of us this "secondary" is pretty much the same as the "primary" so it's not like there is any valid reason to try and force yourself to see something differently then you already do unless maybe you're so unhappy with your life as to be bordering on suicidal?

Lets take the body image, in a movie you can use stunt doubles, specific camera angles, special lighting techniques and even video editing to make a person look better then they do, thinner, younger, healthier etc. In the world the secondary lives in you can't just simply change the way you perceive things and magically make those things change. You can't just will yourself to be better, you still got to put in the hard work to get there. All you can do perception wise is change how you feel. Like instead of being sad because your body doesn't look as fit as someone who devotes their lives to fitness you can tell yourself to be proud that you keep your body in better shape then a majority of your peers. Or if you have some health issue that limits you then you can just accept that there is something beyond your control and not be angry at yourself for it.

In doing that though you're not really changing your perceptions or the "secondary" only what emotional charges if any you attach to various perceptions.

The problem I have is with the way you present your case it's almost as if everyone has this really distorted perception of what is real, programmed into them against their will or even knowledge and if they could just look at things differently somehow they would be different and more real. I disagree, I don't see our senses as being some barrier that somehow blocks us from knowing things truly or directly but rather it's something that just is and only works into the discussion as a technicality that "yes because of how our bodies work our ethereal mind or soul if you prefer is insulated from direct physical contact with reality". It's like being in a car, when you travel down a road in a car you don't have contact with the road but you still travel the same road as if you walk and you'll still get to the same destinations along the road whether you walk or drive. The fact that the car prevents your body from directly touching the road, doesn't mean the car travels a different road then the one you would walk on.

 

[dank.frank]

In doing that though you're not really changing your perceptions or the "secondary" only what emotional charges if any you attach to various perceptions.

EXACTLY. How you THINK about something does NOT physically change what is - it only changes how you relate to it. BINGO. Been saying that 1,000 different ways and feel like I've been banging my head into a wall trying to get that point across. Bravo!!

The problem I have is with the way you present your case it's almost as if everyone has this really distorted perception of what is real, programmed into them against their will or even knowledge and if they could just look at things differently somehow they would be different and more real.

Again - this is exactly what I meant in regards to how he speaks as if he is more enlightened than the rest of us - even though he has never come out and said as much directly, he portrays such by default in the way he states our "inability to understand" as if our disagreeing with him is some sort of mental deficiency...which like I've said - I fully get it - I just don't agree.

...I don't see our senses as being some barrier that somehow blocks us from knowing things truly or directly...It's like being in a car, when you travel down a road in a car you don't have contact with the road but you still travel the same road as if you walk and you'll still get to the same destinations along the road whether you walk or drive. The fact that the car prevents your body from directly touching the road, doesn't mean the car travels a different road then the one you would walk on.

Excellent analogy. Well done.

It is only because of our senses that we have ANY awareness of this world around us in the first place - at least in the sense of being able to form any thoughts about it.

A blind, deaf, mute paraplegic with no sensations - STILL lives and STILL breaths and STILL exists - although such person would have no means through which to interpret the world around them - does this mean they are incapable of present reality awareness? Does this mean their consciousness is any less than? How is their ability to live in the "now" possible when they have no means through which to interpret what is currently / actually happening...

It is for these reasons, I see such theories of thought to be wholly incomplete - simply because they never address what makes us LIVE...what gives us the ability to exist / be - the ACTUAL nature of consciousness - the FORCE behind it...IS NEVER addressed. This way of thinking is limited by - what we experience and how we chose to interpret said experiences. It is NOT some great final statement about life - it is merely a psychological way of thinking about things - IT DOES NOT change what really is...not at all.



dank.Frank

 

[Eighths-n-Aces]

so if they put me in a straight jacket and i just stayed positive about the whole experience would my balls itch or not?

 

[dank.frank]

I love how rather than address the points I make - or answer the questions / participate in the conversation, someone just hits the dislike button...hahahaha.

I've gotten more dislikes in the past few days than I have in 5 YEARS - I sure do wish my little troll under the stairs would just reveal themselves and bring forward whatever issue they had with me to light...hahaha...

Can't say I've ever been trolled before - it's a new experience...I feel...special?

But I really do wonder how present reality awareness applies to the situation I presented above - where a person is unable to actually interact with what have been defined as secondary experiences through out this discussion...I'm really not being sarcastic - I'm taking the conversation seriously...not everyone has to agree for it to be a good conversation / thread.

What if this thread was followed by 50 people simply saying "yep....I agree" - how boring would THAT be?!?!!!



dank.Frank

 

[southflorida]

Not entirely true, not the way you paint it. Our interpretations might be off from the primary based on learned preconceived notions but it's rarely if ever so off as to not even closely resemble the primary. For the majority of us this "secondary" is pretty much the same as the "primary" so it's not like there is any valid reason to try and force yourself to see something differently then you already do unless maybe you're so unhappy with your life as to be bordering on suicidal?

Your assumption is that you know what the primary reality is.

And if I'm right, you think that the primary reality is the "objective" world outside of us, and the secondary world is the "subjective" point of view we each have of the "objective" world.

But, this is not what I'm pointing at, and from my current point of view, the objective and subjective realities are both secondary processes and activities of our minds. They are the movie on the movie screen. The movie screen being an analogy to the primary and the movie to the secondary, of course.

What I'm actually trying to say is that the primary reality is not-known, and actually can't be known through our organs of perception.

Why?

Because perception is a secondary process.

The "primary" data that is interpreted and converted into the "secondary" reality - through our organs of perception working in co-operation with our mind - is really not-known.

The reason the "primary" reality is not-known is because it can't be known.

Primary reality is what IS.

And, what IS - can only be directly experienced.

We are directly experiencing the primary reality NOW, and always and only NOW.

In fact, we ARE this primary reality itself.

While the secondary reality is occuring inside of us, not outside of us, as many folks believe.

You see, in reality, we are not a body/mind perceiving an outside world.

We are consciousness that is aware of our body, mind, and the outside world.

The only thing that makes our body and mind "ours" is a thought that they are ours...nothing else.

Without this thought, that I am my body and mind, the body and mind are simply a body and a mind, they are not "someone's" body and mind.

Lets take the body image, in a movie you can use stunt doubles, specific camera angles, special lighting techniques and even video editing to make a person look better then they do, thinner, younger, healthier etc. In the world the secondary lives in you can't just simply change the way you perceive things and magically make those things change. You can't just will yourself to be better, you still got to put in the hard work to get there. All you can do perception wise is change how you feel. Like instead of being sad because your body doesn't look as fit as someone who devotes their lives to fitness you can tell yourself to be proud that you keep your body in better shape then a majority of your peers. Or if you have some health issue that limits you then you can just accept that there is something beyond your control and not be angry at yourself for it.

In doing that though you're not really changing your perceptions or the "secondary" only what emotional charges if any you attach to various perceptions.

The body that most people consider to be objective and physical is simply a perception, an interpretation of data that is not-known.

There is no such thing as bodies, minds, or outside world.

All that we perceive is very similar to how a movie is projected onto a screen and we sit in the movie theater, hypnotized for two hours "believing and assuming" that what is being projected on the screen is real.

Otherwise we wouldn't spend so much money to go to the movies.

I mean, most folks don't go to the movies and keep telling themselves and others that it's just a movie, none of this is real, etc.

Exceptions do happen, for example when some scary or gross stuff occurs on the screen. But, the majority of the time we look at the movie in a theater as if it is real for those two hours.

This is what is occuring in our lives as well, except obviously it is much more real, and all our organs of perceptions are working and making us believe that my body and mind and the outside world that I'm perceiving is real.

....but, it's not.

It's a movie being played by consciousness inside of consciousness.

And consciousness is the screen, the projector, the movie, and the viewer of the movie. This part is a paradox for the mind, but not for consciousness.

It is ONE, and to pull this off, it has to use this structure, where it seems "as-if" there are separate elements all over, but if one simply pays attention to the direct-experience occuring NOW, instead of being hypnotized by thoughts, one will see that all there ever is, is experiencing.

No one has ever experienced anything but this experience that is occuring NOW, and always and only NOW.

And this is a FACT.

Arguing with this fact is really absurd, but for some unknown reason to me, the human species loves to argue with it.

And, so far, the only thing that it leads to is suffering and struggle.

And, of course a lot of cruel shit that we humans do to each other.

Like wars, rape, murder, torture, etc..etc...etc

The problem I have is with the way you present your case it's almost as if everyone has this really distorted perception of what is real, programmed into them against their will or even knowledge and if they could just look at things differently somehow they would be different and more real. I disagree, I don't see our senses as being some barrier that somehow blocks us from knowing things truly or directly but rather it's something that just is and only works into the discussion as a technicality that "yes because of how our bodies work our ethereal mind or soul if you prefer is insulated from direct physical contact with reality". It's like being in a car, when you travel down a road in a car you don't have contact with the road but you still travel the same road as if you walk and you'll still get to the same destinations along the road whether you walk or drive. The fact that the car prevents your body from directly touching the road, doesn't mean the car travels a different road then the one you would walk on.

It's not about looking at things differently.

It is about the truth.

The truth of who we really ARE.

If we are conscious and aware of our body/mind, then we simply can't be that fundamentally, we can only be that "thing" that is aware and conscious.

In other words, consciousness/aware presence/awareness.

If one puts aside thoughts and focuses on what is actually occuring in one's direct-experience, then he will clearly see that the experience occuring NOW is the only thing that has ever been actually real.

And what this experience really IS - is not-known.

 

[southflorida]

yeh that's true.
I once was informed the cops were comming for my plants, but I anyways left one grow unit undemolished for them to find.
I was willing to face all future scenario's in disregard of consequence.
No fear was beeing felt by me when finally they walked in.
Up till this day, I still don't 'fear' that way.
Using your outlay, It's actually real easy to train oneself to remain fearless with cops 'n bully's n' shit.
Nowadays, cops are checking me out rather often so meanwhile I learned to outsmart them.
I don't experience fear, but it's rather stressfull always, and ma wife claims our kids and her selves having fear because of them. (including the aftermath incomplications at school.)

But if my child were about to become hit by a truck, I d'sure feel fear, but prolly on a different level.
Cops and their BS are not real to me somehow. My kids and their destiny somehow is.

it doesn't matter what one fears, the structure of fear remains the same.

you simply have more thoughts attached to your identity as a husband and a father than as a marijuana grower...imho

social survival is a serious thing for us humans, and surviving as a family man I'm sure has a lot of importance attached to it - in your case that is.

some folks don't give a shit about their family and might be scared in relation to getting caught growing marijuana on the level that you fear some kinds of circumstances occuring in relation to your wife and kids.

...fundamentally it is all conceptual anyways, we as humans don't really pay attention to that, we are hypnotized by our mind and the thoughts and emotions it creates on a moment-to-moment basis as it tries to help us survive as the "self" that we believe and assume that we are.

 

[southflorida]

I love how rather than address the points I make - or answer the questions / participate in the conversation, someone just hits the dislike button...hahahaha.

I've gotten more dislikes in the past few days than I have in 5 YEARS - I sure do wish my little troll under the stairs would just reveal themselves and bring forward whatever issue they had with me to light...hahaha...

Can't say I've ever been trolled before - it's a new experience...I feel...special?

But I really do wonder how present reality awareness applies to the situation I presented above - where a person is unable to actually interact with what have been defined as secondary experiences through out this discussion...I'm really not being sarcastic - I'm taking the conversation seriously...not everyone has to agree for it to be a good conversation / thread.

What if this thread was followed by 50 people simply saying "yep....I agree" - how boring would THAT be?!?!!!



dank.Frank

this is a tough topic for most folks to talk about since it is about the true nature of who we really are.

and who we really are is NOT what culture has programmed us to believe.

but why really care if someone doesn't support your posts or doesn't want to communicate with you in this forum...the reality is that they will do what they will do...anyway.

and the chances that they will come out and say it that it was them are slim, to say the least.

 

[trichrider]

A blind, deaf, mute paraplegic with no sensations - STILL lives and STILL breaths and STILL exists - although such person would have no means through which to interpret the world around them - does this mean they are incapable of present reality awareness? Does this mean their consciousness is any less than? How is their ability to live in the "now" possible when they have no means through which to interpret what is currently / actually happening...dank.Frank

no it do not.
without perception of past or future this person must live in the moment (NOW) without experiencing the secondary.

consciousness may be amplified in this case particular to the person, because they have no other contamination (senses).

...and forgive me this but, how is it less than if there be no measurement?

existence does not depend on whether you believe it to or not, your concept of existence relies solely on the ability to deceive oneself that we are apex/epitome of life...

arrogance is the fools master.

 

[Dope time]

You dudes like talkin well typing..

Fingers doin ok lol
Where ya heads at right . Got a Comfy Chair to sit on.. Lol

 

[southflorida]

EXACTLY. How you THINK about something does NOT physically change what is - it only changes how you relate to it. BINGO. Been saying that 1,000 different ways and feel like I've been banging my head into a wall trying to get that point across. Bravo!!

you are confusing the primary with secondary.

a physical object is secondary, it is a perception...it is NOT primary.

your thought about this secondary object is still in the domain of the secondary reality.

but, this is not what is really important.

What IS important and what one should grasp to clearly see the truth is that all you ever experience is the experiencing occuring always and only NOW.

This is something you and a few other folks posting in this thread for some reason have NOT really grasped yet....even though you keep saying you get it

Again - this is exactly what I meant in regards to how he speaks as if he is more enlightened than the rest of us - even though he has never come out and said as much directly, he portrays such by default in the way he states our "inability to understand" as if our disagreeing with him is some sort of mental deficiency...which like I've said - I fully get it - I just don't agree.

you haven't grasped the truth of the now-experience being all that IS.

and the post below points at the fact that you haven't grasped it.

It is only because of our senses that we have ANY awareness of this world around us in the first place - at least in the sense of being able to form any thoughts about it.

our sense organs are secondary processes, the first and primary thing is consciousness/awareness.

awareness is what IS...it doesn't change, it is what this now-experience is...it is it's true nature.

you're focusing on your thoughts while completely ignoring your direct experience of this experience occuring now, and only now.

awareness doesn't disappear, it doesn't come and go, it is what always is.

the only thing that comes and goes is what is NOT real, what is temporary.

bodies, thoughts, emotions, etc

A blind, deaf, mute paraplegic with no sensations - STILL lives and STILL breaths and STILL exists - although such person would have no means through which to interpret the world around them - does this mean they are incapable of present reality awareness? Does this mean their consciousness is any less than? How is their ability to live in the "now" possible when they have no means through which to interpret what is currently / actually happening...

as trichrider pointed out...this being would have no choice but to exist now, and be pure consciousness

It is for these reasons, I see such theories of thought to be wholly incomplete - simply because they never address what makes us LIVE...what gives us the ability to exist / be - the ACTUAL nature of consciousness - the FORCE behind it...IS NEVER addressed. This way of thinking is limited by - what we experience and how we chose to interpret said experiences. It is NOT some great final statement about life - it is merely a psychological way of thinking about things - IT DOES NOT change what really is...not at all.

for you...because you're focusing on your thoughts and not on your actual direct experience without thoughts.

as soon as you stop being hypnotized by your mind you will clearly see that you have always and only existed NOW in this one experience that is occuring NOW, and only, and always NOW.

You can't think your way into enlightenment.

Enlightenment is simply knowing you ARE this now-experience...itself