The growing large plants, outdoors, thread...

[FatherEarth]

I know bacteria and spores are destroyed by h202 even at low strength.

GIven the time it takes to multiply bacteria(hours) that doesnt seem to be of much concern.

Mycelium and fungal fruit bodies are not destroyed by h202 alone and will survive.

High temperatures cancel out h202 @ approx 130F the h202 releases its extra oxgen molecule and becomes h20...

Interesting stuff about the calcium peroxide, Ill look into it... thanks.


Respectfully,



FE

 

[NorCalDreaming]

I know bacteria and spores are destroyed by h202 even at low strength.

I'm going to do more research on the subject in general and see what I can find online from credible sources. Found a paper titled Survival of Subsurface Microorganisms Exposed to UV Radiation and Hydrogen Peroxide I'll go through for starters. Excessive use could be a problem as at the least you'll be oxidizing organic matter.

I'm guessing the concentration used would be pretty low. I now remember looking into this and rainwater, especially during thunderstorms, and the measurable amounts of H2O2.

Found this...

It is this hydrogen peroxide in rainwater that makes it so much more effective than tap water when given to plants. With the increased levels of atmospheric pollution, however, greater amounts of H202 react with air-borne toxins and never reach the ground. To compensate for this, many farmers have been increasing crop yields by spraying them with diluted hydrogen peroxide (5 to 16 ounces of 35% mixed with 20 gallons of water per acre).

Tom never finished that conversation and wish he had.

 

[ares420]

my large plants :]

Ak47xshamankaxBHPT x (mexican sativa x guerilla gold) and happy brother x manitoba medicine

 

[ares420]

 

[ares420]

 

[NorCalDreaming]

The Full Circle Compost cover crop mix contains buckwheat, bersee clover, winter rye, fodder radish, triticale, walking oats, yam hill wheat and Austrian winter pea.

 

[Backyard Farmer]

all those things sound like they'll work great, what kind of soil temps do they need to see before they'll come up and what kind of innoculant do they need, if any/

 

[NorCalDreaming]

all those things sound like they'll work great, what kind of soil temps do they need to see before they'll come up and what kind of innoculant do they need, if any/

I have no idea regarding temps and doubt any innoculant is needed.

 

[Hash Man]

I have no idea regarding temps and doubt any innoculant is needed.

Not sure if anything there is supposed to be fixing nitrogen. If so, a nitrogen fixing innoculant should be used. My winter cover crops all have to be innoculated so they will suck nitrogen out of the air.

 

[NorCalDreaming]

Not sure if anything there is supposed to be fixing nitrogen. If so, a nitrogen fixing innoculant should be used. My winter cover crops all have to be innoculated so they will suck nitrogen out of the air.

So without the innoculant your cover crops don't fix N? I assume you're using some type of azobacter? What's your program? If its just the innoculant you use then doesn't matter what the green that's growing right?

 

[Hash Man]

I get my cover crop at peaceful vally and they sell an innoculant with it. From what i have read , you have to innoculate the seeds with a nitogen fixing bacteria before you plant them. The mix i use has lots of legumes in it and i have always done that because it says in the instructions that the beans wont be able to fix N without it.

 

[NorCalDreaming]

It was azotobacter and not azobacter I was thinking about.

 

[Hash Man]

Not sure what spores but its called n-dure. Here is a link to a pdf about cover crop innoculants.

http://www.groworganic.com/seeds/cover-crop/inoculants.html

 

[NorCalDreaming]

Thx for that link.

Rhizobacteria exist naturally in the soil, but not in sufficient amounts to maximize nitrogen fixation

Reminds me of when I was working on my Sea-Crop project. I got some info from John Kempf regarding a popcorn farmer he worked with. Over the course of 3 years the farmers yields went up as his N inputs went down. Thought it was mainly through supporting healthy soil microlife through certain techniques promoting N fixation through the growin season and not necessarily through off season cover crops. Will have to clarify that next time I talk to him. I had a 3 year chart of that farmers yields and stuff on my website yet that info is long gone.

I vaguely remember talking to someone about an algae culture for soil that's not available in the US full strength which promotes N fixation. Don't think that's what John was doing though.

 

[milkyjoe]

Along with legume cover crops and innoculants this is the product Kempf uses to fix N....http://www.tainio.com/userfiles/file/BioGenesis_I.pdf. It contains azotobacter and pseudomonas fluorecens which will both fix N from the atmosphere. Whey protein is used to feed the bacteria and diatomaceous earth is used to provide something for them to establish on.

Ima try it out next summer...but with plenty of Ferti Nitro on hand just in case things go sideways (a direction I am well familiar with)

I plan to simply use a legume and winter rye as a cover crop

 

[Tiami]

hello fellow growers. soil help needed.

this is the situation. weather seems to getting worse, almost no rain during summers. last year there wasn't any significant rain from end of may to beggining of september. there's no water suply near and I'm limited to visiting my spots. I need to carry all the water for my plants. on top of that the soil is pure sand. nice deep sand, which plants love but it's thirsty.

what I learned from last year. less is more. at least for me. I plan to have five or six plants, last year I had ten. can't handle more. I dug 6'x6'x1,5' holes but I figured it doesn't make sense having huge holes if you can't water them properly. I watered aprox every five days with 30 liters per plant and still plants weren't happy during really hot days. also I think I'll be using less soil amandmends but maybe in bigger quantities. unfortunatly I'm not in position to buy fancy stuff and would like to keep it simple for security reasons. also I believe sand is exellant medium for plants to grow it just lacks water/nutrient holding ability. shouldn't be a problem to improve it in a small patch.

my idea is to make container in soil. lay down the plastic into the hole, sides also. this way the water won't drain away. I have water crystals and I'm not sure how to use them. my idea is they might catch the excess water at the bottom and release it when soil gets dry. also I'd like roots to grow deep so the bottom half of the hole/container might benefit with crystals.

I'll be adding some peat, pelleted manure and bone meal. I know I could use better stuff but that's what I got. as I said smaller holes 3,5'x3,5'x1,5' which is a bit more than 100 gallon, still a big hole imo. I hope such hole/container with more organic matter than last year and maybe some water crystals should better deal with drought if receiving some 10-15 gallons of water per week. I almost forgot to mention there's always a chance for some summer storm to surprise.

starting seeds a bit later might also help I guess. last year I germinated mid march I believe

what ya think. feel free to comment. thanks.

Golden Tiger from last year. amazing drought resitance and amazing plant.

 

[Cep]

Tiami,

I would reconsider the plastic in your holes unless its perforated. If you do get a freak storm with a bunch of rain and the enclosed hole goes anaerobic you could lose the plants. The polymer crystals work for some guerrilla growers. For larger grows it can get expensive though.

Increasing the organic matter in your mix will also improve drought tolerance, as will a micorrhizal inoculant. These fungi expand the root system of your plants and increase water and Phosphorus availability. If you do use an inoculant I wouldn't use chemical fertilizers: the salt damages the fungi and in high nutrient conditions the plant has little use for the symbiosis.

 

[NorCalDreaming]

on top of that the soil is pure sand. nice deep sand, which plants love but it's thirsty.

You may want to look at adding some HumaCarb from Advancing Eco Agriculture with each watering. This is regardless of adding additional organic matter to your holes. The humin fraction of HumaCarb will really help in your situation especially over time. It's inexpensive and a little goes a long way. Hard to over do it.

 

[Tiami]

I would reconsider the plastic in your holes unless its perforated. If you do get a freak storm with a bunch of rain and the enclosed hole goes anaerobic you could lose the plants. The polymer crystals work for some guerrilla growers. For larger grows it can get expensive though.

Increasing the organic matter in your mix will also improve drought tolerance, as will a micorrhizal inoculant. These fungi expand the root system of your plants and increase water and Phosphorus availability. If you do use an inoculant I wouldn't use chemical fertilizers: the salt damages the fungi and in high nutrient conditions the plant has little use for the symbiosis

thanks for response. good point about making drain holes at the bottom of holes. especially if water crystals will be used. wouldn't be cool to loose plants in september when occasunal rains start. as for micorrhiza fungi I've heard mixed reactions. I think even Tom mentioned his doubts in this thread. would appriciate some thoughts about micorrhiza.

You may want to look at adding some HumaCarb from Advancing Eco Agriculture with each watering. This is regardless of adding additional organic matter to your holes. The humin fraction of HumaCarb will really help in your situation especially over time. It's inexpensive and a little goes a long way. Hard to over do it.

thanks for reminding me about this. appriciate.

 

[NorCalDreaming]

thanks for reminding me about this. appriciate.

Just want to clarify it's not a silver bullet for your problem. From what I understand it's benefits will accumulate over time regrading building soil in a situation like yours.