The growing large plants, outdoors, thread...

[FatherEarth]

Yes OB, Biodynamic farming is whats up.

Do you have a biodynamic calendar? I do alot of my work with the cycles of the moon. Planting, cloning, harvesting, all done in accordance with the proper cycle, I dont miss one. Some say its hogwash, like using crystals and charging water for plants... try it and you decide... Its the other level after you get everything else in order...

 

[FatherEarth]

And one more thing, a degree or a piece of paper from some college, does not make you a good farmer or even a farmer at all.. Experience and a love/ respect relationship with nature will bring you closer to that definition than those papers ever will...

 

[jackpot7]

FE sent u a pm Jah blessed

 

[Dr. Purpur]

Growing large plants outdoors

Growing large plants outdoors

After harvesting my earliest plant, I processed a few lower colas with dry ice through the Bubbleman Kief Tumbler. It rained fresh kief. Got a half zip from a handful of buds. Light amber clean kief.

Its a great way to check out your resins before the plants are even dry. It smokes great, like fine hash.

 

[OrganicBuds]

Yes OB, Biodynamic farming is whats up.

Do you have a biodynamic calendar? I do alot of my work with the cycles of the moon. Planting, cloning, harvesting, all done in accordance with the proper cycle, I dont miss one. Some say its hogwash, like using crystals and charging water for plants... try it and you decide... Its the other level after you get everything else in order...

Biodynamic calendar huh? Google has many examples, you have one you recommend? Thanks, love this stuff.

 

[stickyicky009]

god bless this mess ... and give us all good health , good f.a.m & good friends ... a big crop would be nice too ..

 

[FatherEarth]

here are some recommended from our favorite magazine.
Lunar Guides
http://www.acresusa.com/books/thumbnail.asp?catid=8&pcid=2

I grabbed 2013 moon sign book, not so great but maybe its the format as I got the ebook version. That said, Kobo books is utter garbage. Dont buy an ebook if you have to use kobo.

Biodynamics
http://www.acresusa.com/books/thumbnail.asp?catid=7&pcid=2


I have some links for free calendars that are very good and get specific about planting with the zodiac as well.. Ill have to find them....

 

[FatherEarth]

Pupur,

Id love to see some snaps of some hash made from fresh buds and dry ice...
I would imgaine the flavor is off the hook!..

 

[mapinguari]

(l to r) Monkey Haze f4, U2, (Blue Dream x Monkey Haze) f2, ditto, C99 x Monkey Haze

So far, Cindy's Monkey has a pretty good lead, frostin' and stackin'. Some of these ladies are going to have me looking at the NWS site a lot come late October and early November.

Wishing you all sweet sap.

 

[DungeonMaster]

all this knowledge that is jumping off right now is really getting me thinking about next year's game plan already.

1. gonna redo the soil mix a bit.
2. i will try to stake the plants down and train them to flatten and spread out some like the DR.P has going.
3. then get in touch with the lunar cycles.

at peace with the earth for sure.

 

[Carlos Danger]

For the record, harvest moon is just a term that applies to autumn full moons. The origin of the term has nothing to do with harvesting being better under a full moon, and everything to do with Autumn. It turns out you also don't have better luck shooting under a Hunter's Moon.

Edit: FE and I have disagreed on Biodynamics before but I feel the need to say something. It's defenders have a convenient out of discrediting skeptics as being closed-minded or such and painting themselves as some sort of spiritual guide to the Earth. There's a lot that works in Biodynamics, and it's the stuff regular science backs up. The rest is fluff and it's proponents don't see it for what it is, an esoteric belief system from the 19th century. There were tons of nutty rich guys like Rudolf Steiner in the late 1800s coming up with quasi-religious mystical world views. It's like hopping on one leg every time you spray with neem and then sooner or later concluding it was the hopping on one leg that kept the bugs away.

Seriously, don't just write me off as skeptical or that I have a closed mind, look at the stuff Biodynamics advocates. I can use ksil for silica, or I can get cow horn silica ground up with crystals, stuffed with manure into another cow horn and then bury it for winter. Then you should spray it "when the Moon and Saturn are in opposition" make sure you consult Rudolf Steiner's instructions on the direction you should stir, and for what proper time. Also make sure it's a cow horn and not a deer horn, because biodynamics says they each collect different forms of cosmic energy. I wish I was making stuff like this up, "the soil has the tendency to be full of growth energies, which energies are absorbed into the dung through the receptive nature of the horn". What is shoving manure in a horn and burying until it's compost anything but a strange form of composting?

Yes their compost is almost always amazing, etc, because they do the basics right. You don't need any of the actual biodynamic mumbo jumbo, all you need is good gardening practices.

Skeptic is a four letter word to biodynamic proponents. Too many times discussions with its proponents start with them assuming a spiritual world view is superior, and end with their discrediting the criticisms of biodynamics as some sort of spiritual failing on the part of the critic for not being in tune with the earth like they are.

 

[Madjag]

Science for Soil Health

Science for Soil Health

Carlos D. - A excellent, concise criticism with points that apply to many other agro views such as Rodale, permaculture, organic, and no-till practices.

It's the soil. You grow soil, not plants. Great soil grows healthy plants just as great nutrition grows healthy human bodies.

Here's an excerpt from The Ideal Soil by Michael Astera, a man who has studied, and mastered the essence, of Reams, Albrecht et al and has written what I think is the best summary of what is needed for the ideal soil:

"The worldwide Organic agriculture movement and its various offshoots offer simplistic solutions, mostly one simplistic solution: add more organic matter to the soil. While a step in the right direction if the soil is low in humus, this does little to address nutritional deficiencies, especially mineral deficiencies. Yet it is fiercely defended and proclaimed to be the one answer for everyone everywhere. Is it? No. While essential, soil biology and organic matter are only a part of what makes a healthy soil and nutrient dense crops. Nature is not simple, and simplistic one-size-fits-all answers are not going to solve the nutritional and environmental crises we face.

Those who follow the Biodynamic school are to be commended for their deep appreciation of Nature and for having preserved much traditional knowledge and brought it into the present. They have an understanding of energy that goes far beyond simple electrical current flow, but by not fully understanding the minerals in their soil, they limit their potential.

Permaculture works fine in many instances, but is mostly an approach to stabilizing the existing soil, preventing erosion. Under a permaculture system the nutrients that are in the soil are largely retained; what is taken away is supposedly replaced with a fresh layer of organic matter. If every bit of the crop that was taken away was somehow brought back and replaced, the soil nutrient content would still only be what it was to start with, which in the case of most agricultural soils is far from ideal.

The various fans and promoters of soil biology, from earthworms to fungus, as the "holy grail" of sustainable agriculture, tell us that a bio-active soil will break down toxic residues, increase humus, and the beneficial soil organisms will make minerals and nutrients available to the plant. The question that is not asked is what if the needed minerals are not to be found in the soil?

The one truly mineral-oriented school of "mainstream" alternative agriculture is what I call the Glacial Rock Dust school, based on the famous book Remineralize the Earth, whose authors argued that the retreat of the glaciers at the end of the last ice age was the last time our soils had a fresh dose of minerals. Their solution was to add freshly ground rock powder to the soil as the source of those missing minerals, but there is little understanding of the actual role of minerals, and no conception of the amounts or balance of minerals needed. An average everyday soil with a cation exchange capacity of 10 requires around 3,000 lbs of Calcium in exchangeable form per acre, and 50 or so pounds of Zinc. Is that in the rock dust or not? Does the soil need the minerals in that particular rock dust at all? Freshly ground rock dust is a great soil amendment, but it can't be counted on to correct a mineral imbalance or deficiency."

http://www.soilminerals.com/TIS_Ch1.htm

 

[mapinguari]

I don't care what methods you use if your plants are large and healthy, and I don't care how fanatical or irrational you are.

And I don't care how nice your rap is. If you don't grow large and healthy plants, it doesn't matter.

Ten million times I prefer people saying "here's my result and here's how I got it" to folks pontificating about what would, could, and should work best.

Anyone got pudding? Let's see it!

 

[GreenHands13]

I don't care what methods you use if your plants are large and healthy, and I don't care how fanatical or irrational you are.

And I don't care how nice your rap is. If you don't grow large and healthy plants, it doesn't matter.

Ten million times I prefer people saying "here's my result and here's how I got it" to folks pontificating about what would, could, and should work best.

Anyone got pudding? Let's see it!

Great way to put it. The cannabis plant is so strong and diverse not one living soul on this planet knows exactly what each strain wants in its soil.

 

[Madjag]

Here Puddin"

Here Puddin"

And this is guerrilla growing without the luxury of backhoes, enzyme mixes, water tanks for soil drenches, and manicuring machines when done.

The guy in the photo is 6'7"; his reach is 9'; the girls are 12-14'...

Now that we can improve on that native soil biology a bit, thanks to the many in this thread, the 10 lb+ queens should be a reasonable target.

 

[warthog]

Awesome man! love me a good guerilla grow.. way more fun too!

 

[Bud-Boy]

do you go through and de leaf the shaders?

live leaves, not yellowers

i dont mean cleaning the insides, im referring to outer leves

regularly?

or like skirting...
do you go in and clear in batches?
if you do,
at what stage do you tend to really open up the flowers?

 

[Bud-Boy]

 

[DungeonMaster]

i think we are all in agreement with that madjag. for the most part from lurking on this board for 2 years, and primarily this thread, i have found that most people posting on here all of the same mind. everyone is taking bits and pieces from each of these "schools" in order to do what they feel is best for the plant. which is what it really comes down to. what is best for the plant and its environment should ultimately yield the best product. i would not say we are all preaching to the choir here because everyone is coming with new and interesting views and new people like myself show up for advice from time to time to take or leave the information that is given.

not to touch a trolling and sore subject, but it seems what mr. seahawk was trying to put out, in a not so eloquent way, was something that people have been indirectly talking about throughout a lot of this thread. i do see his message deep in the harshness of it all, and take it to heart that has farmers we are also caretakers of the earth. a boon that we should use good practices, but from this thread i feel that most people are already on that page.

i hope my 2 cents here have not bored everyone. but seeing as i feel more of a bystander and less of a contributor on this thread i though i would chime in a bit. having trolls on the thread from time to time helps remind us that there are others out there frustrated, need more education, or have something on their mind they need to express. its part of any group discussion that goes on. with that being said, i would like to return you to your regularly schedule grow.

DM

 

[Madjag]

De-Leaf Technique

De-Leaf Technique

do you go through and de leaf the shaders?

live leaves, not yellowers

i dont mean cleaning the insides, im referring to outer leves

regularly?

or like skirting...
do you go in and clear in batches?
if you do,
at what stage do you tend to really open up the flowers?

Bud-Boy,

Not sure if you asked me directly or if you were "speaking" to someone else on the thread. Anyway, here's my $2...hahaha.

No de-leafing was done on the plants in the photo of the 14 foot girls. On that gurrilla grow I was only around on weekends and let nature do its thing. Now that I have practiced a bit, I do things differently.

Now I do practice defoliation faithfully with great results. I'm more about having high-quality, tight, solid buds. I also remove the lower branches to half way up the plant height well before flowering, during middle to late veg, so that each plant's energies are focused on the production of many fat buds on the remaining branches. All larf is rubbed off and only substantial buds are left, perhaps only the last 50% of a branch's lenght out to the tip of the cola.

At onset of flowering I take maybe 20% of large leaves, green or yellow doesn't matter. I open up the flowers to daylight further in on each branch. I take more after another week, and so on until a month before flowering all the buds are filling out nicely. Again, any larf or tiny buds are removed along the way during this period. I often use them for testing the smoke. I totally denude just before cutting in order to lessen the work and also to avoid handling the dried buds any more than necessary. At manicure time it's quicker, less trichome loss, and superior bag appeal.

Whether defoliation and exposing the flowering sites to more sunlight improves the potency remains to be tested scientifically. I can say, from my experience, it improves weight and yield.

A hidden bonus is that in a guerrilla grow, or backyard or farm grow, if totally exposed to all weather, when you get a downpour, far fewer branches break from the weight of all those wet leaves, be it rainwater weight or just that they catch wind easier when full and wet. Can't get hortinova or wire way out on the remote sites so easily. In the past we used a sisal, natural-colored rope network, like a Tic-Tac-Toe design, to support the heavy leaners.

What do you other guys think?