Philips 315w CDM Elite (CMH)

[Hammerhead]

There is no published data I can find on Ushio DE LEC/CMH fixtures/bulbs. LEC is the same as CMH. I thought LEC was a sunlight supply name?. If they sale commercial 1kw LEC lights getting replacement bulbs should be easy. I cant find a single img anywhere. All of there published data is on 315w T12 only. Ushio bulbs are no different than any other good CMH bulb. I wouldn't be surprised if they all sourced them for the same company.

 

[oti$]

Thanks for dropping the knowledge hammer, the input is helpful and appreciated

 

[beefalo bill]

There are commercial Ushio DE 1000W LEC. They look a lot like a HPS. No, I don't know how, but the construction coordinator at a commercial grow being built here said they get them from Germany. I cannot find any information online but I have seen the pallets of boxes. I wasn't comfortable taking pictures of them with that guy around, but will check back periodically to inspect their progress.
Currently, the underground electric supply is going in and is intriguing.

https://www.ushio.com/product/hilux-gro-super-metal-halide-double-ended/
Second link after a google search. Doesn't specifically say it's "CMH", but does refer to it having a color temp similar to daylight, and that it's manufactured in Germany.

 

[Hammerhead]

Its not CMH. That's there MH bulb. Very different than CMH. You can tell by looking at the ARC tube its MH. If you look at the spec sheet it says CMH bulbs only available in 315w.


Ushio America introduces a new DE (double-ended) Metal Halide lamp

 

[Dirt Bag]

Hortilux also makes a 600w CMH they tout as ceramic hps. Looks promising.

 

[Avenger]

lol,

If you cant tell the difference between high pressure SODIUM(HPS) and ceramic METAL HALIDE(CMH) I guess we can't expect you to tell the difference between QUARTZ and CERAMIC arc tubes.


hps lamps have ALWAYS had ceramic arc tubes

 

[Dirt Bag]

lol,

If you cant tell the difference between high pressure SODIUM(HPS) and ceramic METAL HALIDE(CMH) I guess we can't expect you to tell the difference between QUARTZ and CERAMIC arc tubes.


hps lamps have ALWAYS had ceramic arc tubes

By "you", do you mean me, or Hortilux? And who is "we"? You got a mouse in your pocket?

 

[p0opstlnksal0t]

has anyone taken a look at the Nanolux 1000w maxpar bulbs? looks like 2x 500w diodes.

3K

4K

 

[Avenger]

By "you", do you mean me, or Hortilux? And who is "we"? You got a mouse in your pocket?

Yes, I was speaking of you Dirt Bag.

As Hammerhead pointed out the USHIO AMH-1000W/AGRO double ended 1000 watt metal halide is a regular Quartz metal halide, not Ceramic metal halide(CMH/LEC). I assume this is the lamp your employer has pallets of.

The Hortilux 600 watt Ceramic HPS is not a CMH. Can you show me where Hortilux call it a CMH? ....all HPS arc tubes are made of ceramic, always have been. TPCA


There, they're with their marketing language, riding the coattail of Philips.

 

[Dirt Bag]

1) not my employer
2) I didn't post the MH info
3) I said that I couldn't find any information
4) I saw them.
5) Hortilux Ceramic HPS is a marketing scheme and uses CMH technology. You can argue, post negative crap, or go flex in the mirror. I honestly don't give a shit, and frankly, no one else does either.

 

[HorseBadoritiz]

https://eyehortilux.com/ceramic-hps-lamp-ballast-kit/

 

[rives]

1) not my employer

5) Hortilux Ceramic HPS is a marketing scheme and uses CMH technology.

Actually, the reverse is true - CMH uses HPS technology. As stated above, HPS lamps have used ceramic forever.

 

[led05]

Actually, the reverse is true - CMH uses HPS technology. As stated above, HPS lamps have used ceramic forever.

fwiw, I was the first I believe to mention the new Ushio 1000w MH bulb and always referred to it as MH, why, because it clearly is..

The point was that both MH and CMH operate under very high pressures vs say HPS and thus shouldn't be run in an open fixture unless designed to, most by far aren't designed to be... Which is really how all this got started, clear false advertising by certain small less than reputable light MFG's.... aka resellers of Chinese junk (GC for example) vs true light manufacturers that have been making light-bulbs (every conceivable kind not just cashing in on the growing sheep in cannabis) since almost as long as Edison first invented them

 

[Hammerhead]

fwiw, I was the first I believe to mention the new Ushio 1000w MH bulb and always referred to it as MH, why, because it clearly is..

The point was that both MH and CMH operate under very high pressures vs say HPS and thus shouldn't be run in an open fixture unless designed to, most by far aren't designed to be... Which is really how all this got started, clear false advertising by certain small less than reputable light MFG's.... aka resellers of Chinese junk (GC for example) vs true light manufacturers that have been making light-bulbs (every conceivable kind not just cashing in on the growing sheep in cannabis) since almost as long as Edison first invented them

I've been using GC bulbs/Fixtures since I switched from Sunlight Supply years ago. I used Phillips 315w bulbs in that hood. I still have a bunch of Phillips 315w bulbs. I see no difference between GC vs Phillips. That's why I no longer buy Phillips. I never hold back when I use equipment that turns out to be junk. If GC bulbs where junk I would post that. Since switching all bulbs over nothing but outstanding results. Results drive sales. If they didnt perform they would have no sales and be out of business a long time ago. Who in the right mind would use bulbs that don't perform as advertised. This is common sense shit. Everyone I know that is using there bulbs loves them. FYI GC doesn't make bulbs. They buy bulbs from a manufacturing company in china. They do all there testing in house. Adjust any specs that are needed. That in no way means there junk. Anyone that post an opinion on something without ever using it has no place posting any opinion. I'm pretty sure everyone can see what your doing. Its pretty obvious. Any CMH bulb would perform better than that Ushio MH bulb.

 

[gh0stm0de]

I notice that some participants of this thread make broad generalizations and state them as fact. So far I chose to ignore these comments as I dont perceive debating them to be constructive toward the nature of the thread. However, there are a lot of very strong and very unsupported statements going unchecked, and I feel this could mislead someone wandering into the thread without background knowledge of the subject matter.

Why would you knock GC quality just because their products are imported from China? The vast majority of the indoor grow products are manufactured in China. It is extremely naive to imply that the only quality lights come from few select manufacturers that exclusively develop their own products and happen to be located outside of China. As has been suggested, even some of the larger more reputable names import their products from China with their OEM branding.

There is no doubt about quality, GC is distributing good quality lamps. I don't have experience with their ballasts, but since you are going to speak this way about someone's product, please do elaborate.

Why is it that you perceive GC bulbs to be junk? You are certainly entitled to your opinion... Lord knows I dont have any affiliation with GC, but please support this statement with your experiences.

 

[rives]

I notice that some participants of this thread make broad generalizations and state them as fact. So far I chose to ignore these comments as I dont perceive debating them to be constructive toward the nature of the thread. However, there are a lot of very strong and very unsupported statements going unchecked, and I feel this could mislead someone wandering into the thread without background knowledge of the subject matter.

Why would you knock GC quality just because their products are imported from China? The vast majority of the indoor grow products are manufactured in China. It is extremely naive to imply that the only quality lights come from few select manufacturers that exclusively develop their own products and happen to be located outside of China. As has been suggested, even some of the larger more reputable names import their products from China with their OEM branding.

There is no doubt about quality, GC is distributing good quality lamps. I don't have experience with their ballasts, but since you are going to speak this way about someone's product, please do elaborate.

Why is it that you perceive GC bulbs to be junk? You are certainly entitled to your opinion... Lord knows I dont have any affiliation with GC, but please support this statement with your experiences.

There are certainly SOME good products that come out of China, most of which are coming out of facilities that are built and run by Western companies who are enforcing strict quality control standards. I haven't used GC lamps and have no plan to, simply because they are a knock-off of what I KNOW to be a quality lamp. I'm glad that they work well for Hammerhead, you, and whoever else, but I've spent decades in industrial maintenance and have been stung by Chinese products more often than I can count. They will freely lie about the provenance and testing of their products, provide you with testing certifications that are ginned up on someone's laptop, and documentation and support is typically nonexistent. Then there are the "minor" issues with them stealing intellectual property, dumping product, the trade imbalance, etc....

On the other hand, I have used Philips products for the aforementioned several decades. They have very, very rarely failed to perform to expectations, have good product support, and you can bank on their testing. It is true industrial-quality gear, and it's not unusual to see their ballasts run for 20+ years.

A quick look at the Grower's House site shows that a GC 4200k 315 is selling for $78.24, and a Philips 942 315 is selling for $69.72. Why would I want to pay a 12% premium for a lamp that may or may not perform as well as the original?

 

[Hammerhead]

I put both bulbs to the test a long time ago. You can bet I wouldn't be using GC if they didn't perform at least as well as the Phillips bulbs did. Most people won't except opinions when they have never used products there claiming to be inferior. I have no doubts GC 315w bulbs are as good as Phillips 315w bulbs are. That's what my garden is telling me. If any can get Phillips bulbs cheaper that's never a bad thing. I don't pay retail for GC products.

 

[led05]

There are certainly SOME good products that come out of China, most of which are coming out of facilities that are built and run by Western companies who are enforcing strict quality control standards. I haven't used GC lamps and have no plan to, simply because they are a knock-off of what I KNOW to be a quality lamp. I'm glad that they work well for Hammerhead, you, and whoever else, but I've spent decades in industrial maintenance and have been stung by Chinese products more often than I can count. They will freely lie about the provenance and testing of their products, provide you with testing certifications that are ginned up on someone's laptop, and documentation and support is typically nonexistent. Then there are the "minor" issues with them stealing intellectual property, dumping product, the trade imbalance, etc....

On the other hand, I have used Philips products for the aforementioned several decades. They have very, very rarely failed to perform to expectations, have good product support, and you can bank on their testing. It is true industrial-quality gear, and it's not unusual to see their ballasts run for 20+ years.

A quick look at the Grower's House site shows that a GC 4200k 315 is selling for $78.24, and a Philips 942 315 is selling for $69.72. Why would I want to pay a 12% premium for a lamp that may or may not perform as well as the original?

the problem is many westerners just can't grasp this is how they do business in (ASPAC), it's ingrained in the culture, understood and as Rives says, if you want control you have boots on the ground, lots of them....bribing is part of the culture too, big time...... They do this kind of stuff even for aircraft parts, fun times.....

All different levels of aptitude in here, good chatting, some just have their heads in sand.
.....

 

[led05]

I've been using GC bulbs/Fixtures since I switched from Sunlight Supply years ago. I used Phillips 315w bulbs in that hood. I still have a bunch of Phillips 315w bulbs. I see no difference between GC vs Phillips. That's why I no longer buy Phillips. I never hold back when I use equipment that turns out to be junk. If GC bulbs where junk I would post that. Since switching all bulbs over nothing but outstanding results. Results drive sales. If they didnt perform they would have no sales and be out of business a long time ago. Who in the right mind would use bulbs that don't perform as advertised. This is common sense shit. Everyone I know that is using there bulbs loves them. FYI GC doesn't make bulbs. They buy bulbs from a manufacturing company in china. They do all there testing in house. Adjust any specs that are needed. That in no way means there junk. Anyone that post an opinion on something without ever using it has no place posting any opinion. I'm pretty sure everyone can see what your doing. Its pretty obvious. Any CMH bulb would perform better than that Ushio MH bulb.

Do you actually read what anyone else writes or just keep on adding to that post count - see above in bold and the post this replied too, man, you just keep on stumbling all over yourself here?

In the post you quoted mine from with your above one, my exact words are below.... I've yet to post any opinions in this thread, only facts linking to documents supporting them, ones anyone on earth could find, aside from you for whatever reason. My intitial post to you was calling attention to GC's blatant false advertising on every single one of their spec sheets and I was playing dumb acting as if open fixture is ok, of course it isn't like they claim it is.. Stop holding this company up, they are simply skimming off from Chinese junk and re-selling, no QC, everyone knows this.

From my post you quoted.....
"[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]aka resellers of Chinese junk (GC for example) vs true light manufacturers"[/FONT]
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[/FONT][FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]
[/FONT][FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Buddy, you are WAY too hedged into Growers Choice for whatever reason it may be.... [/FONT]

[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]
[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]
[/FONT]

 

[led05]

Quick Recap


1) Hammerhead claims the literature I linked is only at Growers house yet I linked direct to Growers Choice website, made this point clear, hamemrhead keep acting like not there


2) Hammerhead claims to visit GC website regularly, says for certain there's no such literature such as I mention there, knows this website like back of his hand, been there multiple times past couple days etc etc..., the spec sheets I'm sharing are dated, not there or fake, I'm lying, nope, wrong again....


3) I post a clear way to find the link on Growers Choice website (one anyone else could find in 10 seconds already), miraculously you are then able to find the spec sheet on GC website, hallelujah


4) You then claim the spec sheets say nothing about the bulbs being open rated. Total BS, it says plain as day on EVERY one of their CMH spec sheets open/enclosed - false advertising, funny how it always benefits sales when company does that, you know make a "mistake" in their favor, one that expands the target audience i.e. open or closed


5) Finally you see it's on the sheet after I again make it clear as day, you concede this but then go on again to say how you've been right, GC is the shit - bla bla bla


6) again above, even while quoting my post you tell me things in your post I said in mine, acting as if I don't know what I just typed, classic....


After #2 above you lost all credibility with me, by number six I'd bet most in here if they actually take the time to read thru the past few pages and verify this, even after the edits you've made. I don't expect them to nor care but you sir are a trip....

Thanks for the laughs, I needed a good 5 min break, back to it...... Light up at your own risk
......