Occupy Wall Street: Not on major media but worth watching!

[SpasticGramps]

is this a quote from one of chavez's speeches from '99?

Sounds like it right. My solution to all this would be end the fed, end the wars, less government, and dismantle the welfare state over time. Empower the individual and bring back the importance of relying on family and self instead of big brother.

That doesn't mean that I don't see the enemy. Communism, Fascism, This-ism, That-ism. All centrally planned system eventually lead to the destruction of the middle and productive classes via the misallocation of capital found in command economies. Wealth and power becomes concentrated in the hands of a few sickos. Chavez is a great example.

Unfortunately most revolutions end with a worse system replacing a bad system. I'm not saying that this isn't going to be the case here. I'm hoping it won't and I think economic conditions will eventually shape the movement differently that what we are seeing now.

 

[dagnabit]

Many of the people who ended up with adjustable rate mortgages would have also qualified for normal fixed rate 30yr mortgages but were not informed of that option because the banks incentivised arms by providing bigger bonuses for them.

i was offered an arm back in '98...

they did not say a word about a fixed!!!

somehow i managed to end up with a 15 year fixed.

must have been those majic words i said. "i dont want an adjustable rate i want a fixed rate".

if you signed an arm..
it's your fault you signed an arm..







ows is already ended.
it's the tea party.

 

[zor]

if you signed an arm..
it's your fault you signed an arm.

Indeed, the old saying, 'buyer beware' applies here to the adjustables taht were being pimped during the boom.

I lived in an area during the boom where there was a mortgage broker shop every other block trying to pimp the adjustables. Why? Because the buyers of that debt, e.g. investment banks, wanted the higher yield of the adjustables and would pay more for them.

The end result was a ridiculous baloon of non productive shiesters getting paid out the ass from these debt bundles. These are the same bundles that GS would sell to foreign investors as AAA debt. The level of con went as high as the fed with Greenspan even pimping these adjustables.

Those of us lucky enough to be in a position where we knew enough about interest rates and 'nothing in life is free' got of easy in some sense. HOwever, there is a whole nation of zombie sheeple, that buy the official story, just like they are trained to do. Knowing this, the big con was on, and they were the suckers.

They WERE preyed upon, even if it WAS there responsibility. The conmen preyed upon and created an environment for the con. The public should've known better, but with the dumbing down of society, and nothing being taught in public education about financing, we were all ripe for the taking.

 

[Anti]

$300,000 will buy a lot of long underwear, mittens (better than gloves for keeping hands warm and being able to manipulate things with your hands), snow parkas and down-filled sleeping bags. Could probably get them all silk-screened, too for cheap, since you're buying in bulk.

 

[greenmatter]

i was offered an arm back in '98...

they did not say a word about a fixed!!!

somehow i managed to end up with a 15 year fixed.

must have been those majic words i said. "i dont want an adjustable rate i want a fixed rate".

if you signed an arm..
it's your fault you signed an arm..
..........................................................

same story for me in 2000 ...... my mortgage broker is actually a friend of mine and was trying to talk me into an ARM. when i insisted on a fixed rate he had to work a little harder to get it done but it worked out just fine.

maybe it is just me but i usually know what i want when i go shopping and i very rarely get talked into something that i don't need. when a salesman is trying to talk me into something i know whatever it is usually is better for him than it is for me, even if that salesman means me no harm ......... looking at it like that keeps me out of a shit load of trouble, and it always has.

i am not the kind of person who laughs while other people are bleeding, but i am the kind of person who really wonders how the fuck people can listen to someone who says "sure man! of corse you can have your cake and eat it too" ...... and not recognize the FACT that if you can't afford it you cant afford it!!! no matter what you WANT to hear the rules of mathematics apply to you, and if you are dealing with a bank you are crazy to think they have your best interests in mind.

 

[dagnabit]

$300,000 will buy a lot of long underwear, mittens (better than gloves for keeping hands warm and being able to manipulate things with your hands), snow parkas and down-filled sleeping bags. Could probably get them all silk-screened, too for cheap, since you're buying in bulk.

do you think considering the disorganized nature and the reports of theft already it will be used that efficiently?

if the fundraising continues at this level what steps do you think they should take towards incorporation(if they have not already)?

 

[SpasticGramps]

Anti points out a good point. The biggest threat to OWS right now is the cold weather.

 

[dagnabit]

maybe it is just me but i usually know what i want when i go shopping and i very rarely get talked into something that i don't need. when a salesman is trying to talk me into something i know whatever it is usually is better for him than it is for me, even if that salesman means me no harm ......... looking at it like that keeps me out of a shit load of trouble, and it always has.

i am not the kind of person who laughs while other people are bleeding, but i am the kind of person who really wonders how the fuck people can listen to someone who says "sure man! of corse you can have your cake and eat it too" ...... and not recognize the FACT that if you can't afford it you cant afford it!!! no matter what you WANT to hear the rules of mathematics apply to you, and if you are dealing with a bank you are crazy to think they have your best interests in mind.

all that!!!!

just said much more betterer than i does

 

[bombadil.360]

They WERE preyed upon, even if it WAS there responsibility. The conmen preyed upon and created an environment for the con. The public should've known better, but with the dumbing down of society, and nothing being taught in public education about financing, we were all ripe for the taking.

the dumbing down of education is not some conspiracy; students do not want to learn shit; they just want to watch reality tv and become famous stars over-night and be loved and be rich just because they think they deserve it and are cooler and smarter than everyone else, without the need to study anything or make any effort whatsoever.

people dumb-down themselves out of their own free-will.

shit, just now in the room I'm in, there's a discussion on which boarders surround us and no one really knows lol... except for me of course

 

[dagnabit]

iv'e been thinking lately...

there is expansion and contraction right?
boom/bust in ever widening circles..

in the micro it's things like the housing bubble prices boom,sales boom,pigs get fat and hogs get butchered.
then the bust, prices plummet,sales down foreclosures up...

back out and look larger we see larger booms...
followed by their busts.
all through history.


the industrial revolution begat flaming rivers and extinction of entire species.

the dark ages were really just a macro contraction. of the enlightened age of the roman empire.

this latest is the global digital revolution's burst.

we come out ahead each time(relatively)

where will this lead?

 

[zor]

iv'e been thinking lately...

there is expansion and contraction right?
boom/bust in ever widening circles..

in the micro it's things like the housing bubble prices boom,sales boom,pigs get fat and hogs get butchered.
then the bust, prices plummet,sales down foreclosures up...

back out and look larger we see larger booms...
followed by their busts.
all through history.


the industrial revolution begat flaming rivers and extinction of entire species.

the dark ages were really just a macro contraction.

this latest is the global digital revolution's burst.

we come out ahead each time(relatively)

where will this lead?

there is a book called the 4th turning that actually examines what you just spoke of. I'd highly recommend it.

Also, within the macro cycles, there is actually instances throughout history where the human race stepped backr hundreds of years. The steeper the climb up, the worse the fall can be. Steep enough to the upside also increases the chances of the fall hitting new low points. I don't think it is a given that civilization slowly continues to advance though i do hope it will.

 

[dagnabit]

there is a book called the 4th turning that actually examines what you just spoke of. I'd highly recommend it.

ill check it
thanks

damn headband bubble gets me all thinky!

 

[Sgt.Stedenko]

The rainy cold weather here over the last 2 days has sent all the OWS doofus hipsters back home to recharge their iphones in their mom's basements and make some more anti-semitic posters.

What a bunch of poesuer pussies.

 

[zor]

idk man, I've seen a ton of good done by people with a ton of money.

and yes, as you say, money can corrupt people, and it does in many ways... but not always...

but if we go your logic, if the so-called 99% of people protesting because they want more money=power, this will mean the more corrupted people there will be.

lol

anyway, I have already lived through one bullshit revolution, the so-called uprising of the "people", and it was simply the uprising of the idiots without a clue and whose only demand was that they wanted to receive all sorts of benefit without having to put in any work. does the name hugo chavez rings a bell?

the only real "revolution" is to make things happen on your own; and for that you need to work a lot, maintain inspiration and grow a big pair of balls; 'cause the rest is just more of the same old bullshit.

In your view, should the advocates of civil rights in the 60s have just kinda shut up and 'made things happen on there own' since it was more bs revolution? how bout the protestors of the vietnam war?

hello,
when it comes to people being in a bad financial position due to their own bad financial choices, yes, it is their fault; accumulating debt out of your own free-will because you want to bite more than you can chew, is your own fault; not the goverment's, not the fault of some evil rich guy plotting against you; this much is a fact.

So in your view, people living in impoverished 3rd world countries, could be living large with a fat bank account if only they didnt make such bad choices? its defintaely not the corrupt govt's fault in places like sierra leone etc? Am i getting it right?

Some of us who have busted our ass to get where we are in life, realize that despite all teh work and good choices, we are LUCKY to even be in a position to take advantage of what the world has offered.

 

[bombadil.360]

In your view, should the advocates of civil rights in the 60s have just kinda shut up and 'made things happen on there own' since it was more bs revolution? how bout the protestors of the vietnam war?

you confuse two different things; civil rights with economic progress.

there's always ways to make one's economic situation better; it just takes a lot of hard work for most of us.

and btw, I never said they should shut-up, in fact, I played with the idea of what if the protesters got together to produce valuable commodities? become the competition of the system they want to change; too much work? it is better to wear che guevara t-shirts while drinking beer on the street I guess.

 

[Sgt.Stedenko]

They WERE preyed upon, even if it WAS there responsibility. The conmen preyed upon and created an environment for the con. The public should've known better, but with the dumbing down of society, and nothing being taught in public education about financing, we were all ripe for the taking.

You're preyed upon every time you turn on your TV and get accosted by big pharma commercials telling you you need to be using their product to have a harder dick or less anal leakage.

I never took any biology or medical classes in college, but I have enough common sense to see through the smoke screen.

I guess personal responsibility is not a common trait among the ows crowd.

My guess is the $100/month saving these suckers with ARMs enjoyed was wasted on an iphone contract or a couple of HDTVs and a high def cable package.

Boo-fricking-hoo.

 

[Hash Zeppelin]

What we really need is another actual CIVIL RIGHTS movement. That is what these kids want. They are just confused by dumb ass Liberal Professors, that don't live in the real world, they live in the world of Academic Idealism.

 

[bombadil.360]

So in your view, people living in impoverished 3rd world countries, could be living large with a fat bank account if only they didnt make such bad choices? its defintaely not the corrupt govt's fault in places like sierra leone etc? Am i getting it right?

Some of us who have busted our ass to get where we are in life, realize that despite all teh work and good choices, we are LUCKY to even be in a position to take advantage of what the world has offered.

you do not realize I'm from a third-world country, born and raised,and have lived through a so-called "revolution", don't ya? and I have way better insight into the idyosyncrasy of third world countries than you do.

so yes, in thrid world countries most people do not like to work, even though we have an excess of natural resources, we simply do not like to work. why? who knows, just the way it is.
our collective choices have placed us where we are today. we are the corrupt goverment, not some alien entity hidden away in some office controlling everyone's choices. sheesh, get real.

 

[zor]

you confuse two different things; civil rights with economic progress.

To some people, the economic situation is a rights issue. The right not to be taxed unjustly to pay for banker's losses.

there's always ways to make one's economic situation better; it just takes a lot of hard work for most of us.

For the most part i would agree with you. However, this is not always the case, nor do i think its relevant.

You assume the protestors just don't wanna work to better there situation. Its a Complete straw man that is anlagous of a protestor saying something stupid like 'all rich people have made me poor'. I'm sure there are idiots that think this way. But in no way does that invalidate the civil unrest we are seeing.

and btw, I never said they should shut-up, in fact, I played with the idea of what if the protesters got together to produce valuable commodities? become the competition of the system they want to change; too much work? it is better to wear che guevara t-shirts while drinking beer on the street I guess.

Ok, how bout i start a company, get access to the fed discount window, and use that to play the markets? I can't because, i'm not afforded the priveledge of discount money dow. No matter how much i work, i will never be in the circle of the privedged that get to both loan money to the fed (aka print money/tax the people), and borrow cheap money to gamble with. What you say SHOULD be true. but it is not. And this is one thing you have in common with them. The desire for a free market system as opposed to the financial oligarchy we have now.

I admire your ideals and values but i don't think the actual world lives up to it, as unfortunate as that is.
\

 

[zor]

you do not realize I'm from a third-world country, born and raised,and have lived through a so-called "revolution", don't ya?

You are still lucky to have what u have even though you've worked hard to get it and even though others choose not to. Furthermore, yvou are no more an expert of third world economies or revolutions in general despite your experience.

so yes, in thrid world countries most people do not like to work, even though we have an excess of natural resources, we simply do not like to work. why? who knows, just the way it is.

So the corrrupt govt's have nothing to do with the standard of living in such countries. Its just the lazy people. Quite a bold claim which is backed up with more reiteration of the claim. Circular reasining.

our collective choices have placed us where we are today. we are the corrupt goverment, not some alien entity hidden away in some office controlling everyone's choices. sheesh, get real.

So when someone is born into sierra leone, it is there choice to live in povertd y, and they should just work harder right?

You're assumptions are very clear along with your position, but your explanations are quite lacking. So you get real.