No Big Bang? Quantum equation predicts universe has no beginning

[resinryder]

Say it ain't so!!?? The promoter of evolutionary theory was a child fuck'n pedophile atheist with an agenda? Lol
Not the first time hearing that.

 

[genedigger]

it wasnt just him that liked the little boys.it was quite popular in the 1800s in upperclass america and europe.its funny how many ideas and how much technology is still used from all the pedophliles from that era.check out the men who promoted fossil fuels.same era as darwin same sick perverted fucks.it is sad that our world is based on many of the ideas from this period in history.oh yeah and some of the treejumpers rippers from then promoted some whack ideas on medicine,like vaccines and morphine for the masses.real smart folks we look up to as a culture.

 

[Midwest sticky]

Looks like, fill in your choice of ****berry, is back again

Yep.

 

[mr.brunch]

Yea , Darwin AND half the Catholic church.

 

[Mad Lab]

Say it ain't so!!?? The promoter of evolutionary theory was a child fuck'n pedophile atheist with an agenda? Lol
Not the first time hearing that.

no way? i thought religious nuts were the only ones who liked little boys and started unncessary wars. LOL.



setting theists aside. many scientists that are secular still are split on darwins theories. as much as school teach the opposite.

im not opposed to most of his theories, but people need to understand scientific 'facts' are not FACTS. although im down with it ether way, evolution or not.


Im super into science but this thread topic is just imagination, like religion and philosophy. Without observational testing these mathematical equation are nothing more than educated guesses that will never likely be tested.

Still awesome to converse about.

 

[Mad Lab]

Not trying to argue Mad Lab, but the Greek mythologies have historical backgrounds too. They found a city mentioned in one of the myths, which does not mean the myths are true.

From what I have read it is quite certain that Jesus did exist. The parts about him doing miracles and rising from the dead is the uncertain aspect at least for me.

Yes, there is likely much truth wrapped into the greeks and their religion during those times. And scholars of history examine those histories as well to connect dots.

Thank you for your honesty about Jesus. This is something that is a better debate: not did Jesus exist, but was he what he says (or they said) he was.

I respect atheists and agnostics with this attitude. No respect for Retro's I know it for sure attitude.

 

[mr.brunch]

Med lab you are spot on there.
A theory with nothing to back it up is exactly that- just a theory. And as they say round my way, most of em ain't worth a wank.
Also agree that this is an awesome thread, love it.

 

[420somewhere]

Dr. Jones was my biology teacher in High School...

Dr. Jones was my biology teacher in High School...

He was a Mormon and taught me all about Evolution.

I thought that was odd at the time.

Now I am just glad I had him as a teacher

Peace

 

[RetroGrow]

You dont think intelligent man possibly recorded family tree history during the beginning of human evolution to intelligence?

First of all, that "sentence" doesn't even make sense. No telling what you are attempting to say there. It's gibberish. During the "beginning" of human evolution, early man didn't even write. Early man was half ape. Writing wasn't even in the equation yet.

HISTORY IS STORIES bro, not observational ANYTHING so stop saying you can disprove the Bible, you cant.

Early "history" was stories, which is why it is so totally unreliable. However, "modern" history is documented in film and photos, which is not to say that it still isn't open to argument/interpretation, but it's infinitely more reliable than your stories, mythologies, and superstitions. It most definitely IS observational, and recorded for all to see. We record history daily, something the ancients were incapable of. In regards to your statement about "disproving the bible", well what can I say other than it's laughable? As laughable as your statement that I can't disprove god. The burden of proof is on you. You can't disprove a fantasy. Yes, there was a bible. Were it's contents reliable or factual? Absolutely NOT! Was there a man named Abraham? Possibly, but he definitely did not live 900 years. These are stories and mythologies, mixed in with the superstitions of the day. Absolutely fake, and not meant to be taken literally. The bible stories and gods are pure fiction, appealing to the unfathomable ignorance of the times. The god of the bible is no more reliable than any of the other thousands upon thousands of gods that man has created to suit his needs.
Since you are pretending to be discussing science, perhaps you should take a look at what some eminent scientists say about the non-existence of god:

Showing God Does Not Exist
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/victor-stenger/showing-god-does-not-exis_b_3757729.html

Stephen Hawking Declares That Science Can Prove God Does Not Exist

http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/stephen-ha...ence-god-by-offering-scientific-proof-1467528

A snippet from the article, since I know you are not really going to read these articles, as you are not really ready for or seeking the truth:
"The renowned astrophysicist gave an interview to Spanish newspaper El Mundo in which he explained his firm belief that the universe was the work of scientifically explainable phenomena and not of a supreme being, reports CNET.

"Before we understand science, it is natural to believe that God created the universe. But now science offers a more convincing explanation," Hawking said.

When El Mundo questioned him about the suggestion in his 1988 book A Brief History Of Time that a unifying theory of science would help mankind "know the mind of God", Hawking explained:

"What I meant by 'We would know the mind of God' is, we would know everything that God would know, if there were a God. Which there isn't. I'm an atheist.
"In my opinion, there is no aspect of reality beyond the reach of the human mind."

God Is Imaginary

http://godisimaginary.com/
They give 50 proofs of the non-existence of god.
Here is one that is pretty simple to understand:
" Let's say that you were to create a far-flung news network, and you somehow had the capacity to observe all of the inexplicable tragedy that occurs on Earth each day:

all of the murders,
all of the car wrecks
all of the rapes
all of the mutilations
all of the torture
all the miscarriages and stillbirths
all of the disease
all of the starvation
all of the destruction
all of the terrorism

Let's say you had a news feed that delivered this all to you in real time.

Just ten minutes with this news feed would be unbearable. Thousands of tragic, heartwrenching events would impinge themselves upon you every minute. It would make you vomit over and over and over again until you passed out in exhaustion and despair.

In other words, the amount of gut-wrenching, anguished tragedy in our world is unspeakable.

Meanwhile, there is a housewife in Pasadena who firmly believes that God answered her prayer this morning to remove the mustard stain from her favorite blouse. She prayed to God to help with the stain, and after she washed it the stain was gone. Praise Jesus! There are tens of millions of people in the United States who firmly believe that God is personally helping them each day with their trivial prayers like this. They believe that they have a personal relationship with God, that God hears their prayers each day, and that God has time to reach down and remove the mustard molecules one by one. They believe it with all of their hearts.

It makes you wonder: If God has the time and the will to answer these trivial prayers, then why does he have no time for the millions of other massively serious problems that arise on earth every day?

Simply look at the world we live in. All around us we have murderers, rapists, robbers, child molesters, terrorists, etc... How do they do their deeds? If God is all-knowing and God answers prayers, then we have to believe that:

God watches them as they murder, rape, molest and terrorize other people millions of times a day, but he does nothing to stop them.
God watches the victims as they are being murdered, raped, molested and terrorized, but he does nothing to help them.
God completely ignores the prayers of the planet to eliminate murder, rape, child molestation and terrorism and allows these atrocities to continue unabated.

According to the Standard Model of God, God is an omniscient, all-powerful, all-loving being who answers prayers. Imagine God sitting on his magnificent throne in heaven looking down upon Earth, seeing every detail. God speaks:

"Look at all of those praying people getting tortured in that death camp. Excellent! I won't do anything to stop that. And look at that little girl down there being raped and murdered. Perfect! She is praying like mad, and so is her mother, but I won't do anything to stop that. And there are three terrorists preparing to blow up a church and kill 1,500 people who are saying the Lord's Prayer to me right now. Outstanding! I won't do anything to stop that. How wonderful it is that 1,000 prayerful people will die of starvation today in Ethiopia. I love it! I won't do anything to stop that. Oh… and there's little Suzy Jankins praying that I remove that pimple from her nose for her big date with Chad tomorrow. Let me go help Suzy right now…"

There is no evidence to support any of the claims made in the Bible concerning the existence of a god. Any ‘evidence’ proposed by theists to support the Bible’s various historical and supernatural claims is non-existent at best, manufactured at worst.

"The Bible is not self-authenticating; it is simply one of many religious texts. Like those other texts, it itself constitutes no evidence for the existence of a god. Its florid prose and fanciful content do not legitimise it nor distinguish it from other ancient works of literature.

The Bible is historically inaccurate,factually incorrect, inconsistent and contradictory. It was artificially constructed by a group of men in antiquity and is poorly translated, heavily altered and selectively interpreted. Entire sections of the text have been redacted over time."
https://whynogod.wordpress.com/

Proof that there is no god
http://articles.exchristian.net/2002/05/proof-that-there-is-no-god.php

Argue That god Does Not Exist
http://www.wikihow.com/Argue-That-God-Does-Not-Exist

Anyway, I don't really expect to read about or accept anything logical or scientific when it comes to god, because you're mind is made up, and you have been brain washed, but I ask that you refrain from calling anything you have posted as science, as nothing could be further from the truth. I won't bludgeon you with any more science, as you are comfortable with superstition. If only you spent more time reading books other than the bible, you might learn something.

Before closing, I will leave you with one more snippet from Bertrand Russell:
Russell's teapot, sometimes called the celestial teapot or cosmic teapot, is an analogy first coined by the philosopher Bertrand Russell (1872–1970) to illustrate that the philosophic burden of proof lies upon a person making scientifically unfalsifiable claims rather than shifting the burden of proof to others, specifically in the case of religion. Russell wrote that if he claims that a teapot orbits the Sun somewhere in space between the Earth and Mars, it is nonsensical for him to expect others to believe him on the grounds that they cannot prove him wrong. Russell's teapot is still referred to in discussions concerning the existence of God.
Many orthodox people speak as though it were the business of sceptics to disprove received dogmas rather than of dogmatists to prove them. This is, of course, a mistake. If I were to suggest that between the Earth and Mars there is a china teapot revolving about the sun in an elliptical orbit, nobody would be able to disprove my assertion provided I were careful to add that the teapot is too small to be revealed even by our most powerful telescopes. But if I were to go on to say that, since my assertion cannot be disproved, it is intolerable presumption on the part of human reason to doubt it, I should rightly be thought to be talking nonsense. If, however, the existence of such a teapot were affirmed in ancient books, taught as the sacred truth every Sunday, and instilled into the minds of children at school, hesitation to believe in its existence would become a mark of eccentricity and entitle the doubter to the attentions of the psychiatrist in an enlightened age or of the Inquisitor in an earlier time.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russell's_teapot

 

[waveguide]

they say a little knowledge is dangerous...

amazing how many people put their trust in science ("knowledge") who have no familiarity with epistemology. lots of what we term "religions", you get look within, all is illusion. in the west, we get a symbol of corporal punishment and "inarguable" truth by heirarchal reference (or do you have your own subatomic microscope handy). now i ask you...

do you know where you are? welcome to the jungle it's going to bring you to your NIs.

 

[Mad Lab]

[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]First of all, that "sentence" doesn't even make sense. No telling what you are attempting to say there. It's gibberish. During the "beginning" of human evolution, early man didn't even write. Early man was half ape. Writing wasn't even in the equation yet.[/FONT]

You need to start using statements that start as such:
it's likely that...;
it's possible that...,
based on what so and so published about this, we can determine...



Honestly Retro, I will make a short comment on your rant about God not being good and allowing so many tragedies, then I will stop responding to your MIDDLE SCHOOL intellect.

God made an opposing force to good. Because if everything was good, it wouldnt be good. You need the opposition of good to make it what it is. If you want good things to happen, bad things must be possible. Your rant was childplay and most of the atheists contributing to this thread are above your comments.

Please bring to the table some serious points if you wish to converse with people who may actually have something you apparently dont, and thats a degree in some sort of science, of which i have.

To say i wont look at something scientific is humorous at best, I cant say for sure, but based on what you've said in this thread, I'm just betting I'm more of a scientist than you'll ever be.

Your comments indicate to me your upset with God, which is sometimes funny with SOME atheists. Your wasting so much time arguing about something that you dont believe even exists. Im not arguing with the fact 99.9% of religion is not true, because its truly impossible for them all to be, thats something we can say. But just because you can dismiss almost all religions doesnt mean one cant be the truth. Thats why going through theologies and dissecting them is good for everyone, especially the atheist who wants to feel more secure in his belief system choice. But you havent done that.

Youo have no idea how many theologies and philosophies i went through before everything pointed to Jesus.

You havent even contributed to the quantum equation this thread is about, you just seem to want to disprove God to me.

Im not here preaching to you, just telling you you dont have all the answers, and a true scientist would know that. Your choice to not believe in a God is your right and I'm not here to change that. But dont tell me I disregard science, because I obviously regard it much more than you.

I will still pray for you my friend. No pun intended.

 

[Mad Lab]

amazing how many people put their trust in science ("knowledge") who have no familiarity with epistemology.

exactly.

it is as "foolish" as putting your trust into a religion without knowing it's philosophy and context.

 

[genedigger]

in another few hundred years our world and culture could be gone,an you can be damn sure that all our info thats recorded electronicly will be real hard for some future generation to read.make fun of the ancients all you want they were writing shit down on stones and clay and we can still read it today.in 700 years after are world goes to shit some future human is gonna come along look at a mangled thumbdrive and not know what it is. hey retro grow do you believe in satan if you agree with all the bad shit dawkins talked about?if you study the bible you would find out that there is a epic battle going on in heaven between good and evil.the good has chased the evil to earth and the evil is angry for its time is short.this must mean that things are gonna be hunky dory on planet earth.wrong!this is why the world is wrought with evil.the bible clearly states satan is fucking with humans to piss god off and god and jesus have chased him and his demons to earth to wage war.i wonder how many folks on here have even looked at a bible nevermind read one.

 

[mr.brunch]

Earth and humanity is not the centre of all things.
Anyone who thinks it is is dreaming. Face it we are no more important than a bug on a window.... And when the sun expands and swallows us we will all be done.
And the universe will continue. Based on the op, it will carry on forever.

 

[Mad Lab]

I doubt earth and humanity are the center of all things. But perhaps intelligent lifeforms are truly the creators intent for the intricacy of the universe. As genesis says, God loved all creatures, but his favorite was mankind, for he was made in Gods image. Meaning we also had a choice to do good things and bad things, unlike the rest of the creatures on this earth, who only have primal instincts to enslave them. So when intelligent lifeforms who have the privilege of freewill, choose to be unselfish as opposed to a more primitive survival default reaction, which would be selfish, i think its somewhat a miracle. Some would say miracle of social evolution, which I wouldnt neccessarily disagree.

The universe will exist after we are gone. And their will likely be another lifeform that reaches our level of intelligence elsewhere in the future, as there likely has been in the past. And likely in another universe or galaxy 'presently'.

A good question would be: Are other intelligent life forms likely to be governed by the same laws that apply to us, and would they likely come to the same fate? Even if they didnt evolve from primates and evolved from a species that lacked aggressive genes/traits, would the gained knowledge and freewill over time result in a similar human experience? Unable to succumb to the thirst for power and control regardless of how passive the species that evolved was? Assuming macro evolution is true of course.

As a theist I believe God as omnipotent as he would be, if he was at all, he would be doing much more than one thing with one race. It would likely be an unfathomable number of intelligent life forms out there with the same freewill and experience.

 

[mr.brunch]

Earth and humanity is not the centre of all things.
Anyone who thinks it is is dreaming. Face it we are no more important than a bug on a window.... And when the sun expands and swallows us we will all be done.
And the universe will continue. Based on the op, it will carry on forever.

 

[Pinnate]

Youo[sic] have no idea how many theologies and philosophies i went through before everything pointed to Jesus.

WTF! Do I invoke Poe's Law, or what?

You say you're a scientist, MadLab ─ well gee, I'm a fucking giraffe!

 

[bombadil.360]

lol no wonder why Hawkings is only referenced in pop culture, or why his books are not required reading in any institution of higher learning. On the other hand, Einstein and Godel are, which is quite revealing.

The first tries to tackle a metaphysical issue using empiricism (can you say Categorical Error!) While the latter two use empiricism only in relation to the physics of the perceivable universe.

Waveguide, I love that saying: a little knowledge is dangerous indeed!

Peace

 

[genedigger]

if religion is all wrong and evolution is right and humans are not being influenced to do evil by any external force and the only reality is right here and now ,then evolution is producing a race of pure evil.if this is what we evolved to as a human species then were fucked. we are evolving into killing machines.everything we do as a culture[worldwide]is based on taking the life away from something else.think of how many folks will die because we want our laidback lifestyle.you dont have to go to war to kill shit.another thing maybe you should all start obeying the government more because the folks who make it to office have evolved more than the rest of us.its not, is evolution the answer to where we came from its how will this philosophy change the human mind and so far ive only seen it sow seeds of discord.

 

[Pinnate]

if religion is all wrong and evolution is right and humans are not being influenced to do evil by any external force and the only reality is right here and now ,then evolution is producing a race of pure evil.

Indeed, how comforting it is to know that the fault is not in ourselves?