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G
Guest
My 2 cents that is an n def and these plants may take longer
I believe in accepting what is normal and natural in flowering cannabis plants,
rather than calling it a nute def. The def guide needs to reflect this factually imho.
Excerpted from the book Marijuana Botany
An Advanced Study: The Propagation and Breeding of Distinctive Cannabis
by Robert Connell Clarke
"Elongation growth of the main floral stem ceases at
this stage, and floral clusters gain most of their size through
the addition of more calyxes along the secondary stems
until they cover the primary stem tips in an overlapping
spiral. Small reduced mono-leaflet and tri-leaflet leaves
subtend each pair of calyxes emerging from secondary
stems within the floral clusters. These subtending leaves
are correctly referred to as bracts. Outer leaves begin to
wilt and turn yellow as the pistillate plant reaches its repro-
ductive peak. In the primordial calyxes the pistils have
turned brown; however, all but the oldest of the flowers
are fertile and the floral clusters are white with many pairs
of ripe pistils." - Robert Connell Clarke
rather than calling it a nute def. The def guide needs to reflect this factually imho.
Excerpted from the book Marijuana Botany
An Advanced Study: The Propagation and Breeding of Distinctive Cannabis
by Robert Connell Clarke
"Elongation growth of the main floral stem ceases at
this stage, and floral clusters gain most of their size through
the addition of more calyxes along the secondary stems
until they cover the primary stem tips in an overlapping
spiral. Small reduced mono-leaflet and tri-leaflet leaves
subtend each pair of calyxes emerging from secondary
stems within the floral clusters. These subtending leaves
are correctly referred to as bracts. Outer leaves begin to
wilt and turn yellow as the pistillate plant reaches its repro-
ductive peak. In the primordial calyxes the pistils have
turned brown; however, all but the oldest of the flowers
are fertile and the floral clusters are white with many pairs
of ripe pistils." - Robert Connell Clarke
Levitikuz said:
then why do you keep quoting 10k and calling his info wrong
I totally agree with 10k here and what he has said so far
I also know he has ton's of experience in sick plant and how to spot symtoms
as he handled the OG FAQ's for years
yellowing that late into flowering is a natural part of the grow cycle
10k said:
In the growfawqs it states that flushing for 2 weeks should be done for chemical ferts and a week for organics...... It's in the growfaqs; just repeating what it says in there.
As for my post, here is the answers to your questions; yes this is very very common to new growers freaking out; but by the way the plant looks it still has some time before harvest I always fed my plants nitrogen up untill the 2 week mark and my yeilds were better when I used a little nitrogen. That is coming from my experience, I did this with the 9 strains that I grew out and always did the same.
They do not need no where near the amount in flower than veg but I still add like 1/2 teaspoon per gallon of grow ferts with my bloom ferts. So reason why I told the guy to use nitrogen is because that plant still has a little more time before it is done and ready to harvest; why starve the plant of nitrogen if it still has at least a few more weeks to go... I know for fact that plant has more than 2 weeks to go before harvest..... those buds look like it's only been in flowering for about a month
Since this I did not know there was a strain that could be harvest in 4 weeks;
if so then it does not need nitrogen; but since there is no strain that you can harvest in just 4 weeks which proves it still has time to flower; why starve it of nitrogen for the next 4 weeks? The yellowing will only get worse if he does not use a little nitrogen. I am not saying you are wrong 10k, nor am I trying to be mean I am just explaining why I said what I did per your request as to why I said what I did.REmember; not everyone will agree on what we say; it's all up to how the grower likes to grow his plants and the way they see if this is normal or not normal.
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Levitikuz
Member
here we go again? lol!! somone NEW always has to attack me...its ****ing amazing!! WAY TO GO OLD PINK!!! YOU ARE THE MAN!!!
god damn all over a ****ing plant that OBVIOUSLY needs some food!!!!! WOWO!!! ****ing shit...and if you scroll back through this thread you will see i was quoted first and flamed apon...but the funny thing is, i was told i was wrong .... but then 10k agreed with me that it needs food, so OLDPINK, you actually agree with me too =]
K
khaleel
thanks for the spirited debate guys. i'm learning a lot just reading the different arguments. 
levit: i've seen your posts before and you've always been cool with me, so thanks for sticking to your guns and saying what you believe to be right.
when i checked my ppm measurements for bloom fert, i saw i was giving them a very light solution. probably about half of what they should get. so i am going to up the bloom nutes, per 10k, and see if that slows down the yellowing. however, if chem burn occurs, then i'll know its not the amount of nutes but a lack of nitrogen, and they'll get a small amount of grow fert.
keep the peace everyone
levit: i've seen your posts before and you've always been cool with me, so thanks for sticking to your guns and saying what you believe to be right.
when i checked my ppm measurements for bloom fert, i saw i was giving them a very light solution. probably about half of what they should get. so i am going to up the bloom nutes, per 10k, and see if that slows down the yellowing. however, if chem burn occurs, then i'll know its not the amount of nutes but a lack of nitrogen, and they'll get a small amount of grow fert.
keep the peace everyone
tokinsmokin
Active member
This is a hard one, I understand where they are both coming from, but I'd have to sway towards mynamestitch's conclusion. Those buds look to me around 27-30 days in flower. Thats just not normal to see them turn yellow that early in flowering. Some plants might need more nitrogen than your ferts have depending on the strain. This strain looks like it needs more nitrogen in flower. You will see the plant begin to yellow usually a lot later in life not around the halfway mark. Where I think 10k may be right is that maybe that strain could be more prone to yellowing so early. I wouldn't discredit either one of them for their responses.
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What you're seeing there is far more serious than simply a nitrogen deficiency caused by the natural progression of flowering.
I see N, Ca, and S deficiency on those lower leaves and petioles.
Your watering regime is quite likely to blame- it does not sound to me like you are giving your soil ample time to dry out between feedings, and I can't get a good look at the soil in those bags but I'll bet it's on the sodden side.
Do you know what your runoff soil pH is?
I'm going to take a stab at this one and say that you are out of pH range, and that combined with excessively wet medium is making your plants unable to uptake the food you are providing to them.
You're too early in flower to be seeing THAT much yellow, and the fact that your petioles are going red at the same time tells me it's not the normal end-of-flower N def.
I'd consider adding drainiage to, by poking more holes in the sides of, your grow bags to help improve drainage and aeration of the root zone.
I see N, Ca, and S deficiency on those lower leaves and petioles.
Your watering regime is quite likely to blame- it does not sound to me like you are giving your soil ample time to dry out between feedings, and I can't get a good look at the soil in those bags but I'll bet it's on the sodden side.
Do you know what your runoff soil pH is?
I'm going to take a stab at this one and say that you are out of pH range, and that combined with excessively wet medium is making your plants unable to uptake the food you are providing to them.
You're too early in flower to be seeing THAT much yellow, and the fact that your petioles are going red at the same time tells me it's not the normal end-of-flower N def.
I'd consider adding drainiage to, by poking more holes in the sides of, your grow bags to help improve drainage and aeration of the root zone.
K
khaleel
stinkyattic: i am watering every day. and the drainage in those bags suck i'm sure. i'll try that out, can't hurt a thing and will probably help.
no more daily waterings. anyway here's what the buds look like. super ice on the right, chrystal on the left. (this particular chrystal plant is a week behind the super ice, regarding bloom). i couldn't get the one with the worst yellowing to focus, but the bud looks about like the one on the right, just not as big.
no more daily waterings. anyway here's what the buds look like. super ice on the right, chrystal on the left. (this particular chrystal plant is a week behind the super ice, regarding bloom). i couldn't get the one with the worst yellowing to focus, but the bud looks about like the one on the right, just not as big.
Yeah the purple petioles are visible in those pics too. Fabulous looking buds though. Get your drainage sorted quick! And I like that you're using a blue backdrop for photos! Makes things SO much easier to see!
I grew Chrystal once about a year and a half ago, but I'm not sure what you're getting at- these symptoms are far from strain-specific.
Oh Gawd, not this again lol j/k
Oh Gawd, not this again lol j/k
I think it is normal fer some of the bottom fan leaves ta turn yellow as flowering progresses,but too many,too early at once is a sure sign of N dif.To better evaluate the situation ya need ta look at the rest of the plant,how green is it,and how fast is -it- turning yellow.Once a plant is done stretching you could give it all the N ya want,it's not gonna stretch more.The hormones that are tellin it ta stretch stop after a couple of weeks in flower.Btw it would be wise ta give em more K during the stretch cuz that's what their useing more of at that point,K builds stem an stalk.It is important that they also have plenty of N and P at that point too.Giving a plant N past the stretch isn't gonna hurt anything as long as the P out weighs the N.Imo not given more N when they yellow too fast in flower only holds it back.By given it more bloom nutes will only cause the plant ta use up more of it's stored N,makin it yellow out before it's time,there by cuttin back on yeild that was potentionaly there.I've done it many times.They always finish right on time too.Has any of ya used Age Old Organics Bloom? NPK *5*-10-5 wonderfull stuff,keeps em green clear up to the end.When it comes ta the flush each plant is gonna be a lil different.What's important is that ya catch the end of the transpiration phase.This way the plant is still pullin alot of water though the plant,helpin the plant rid it self of extra nutes.If ya wait too long and the transpiration phase is over there is a chance all of the nutes won't be flushed,cuz the plant matabolism has about stopped.On a 8 week strain this happens a about 6 1/2 ta 7 weeks as a rule of thumb (again,a hormone thing).Yul know cuz the plant stops needin water.Best ta have em flushed before this happens.This has been my experience fer many years.Too each their own tho.Best of luck.Take care...BC
Oh Gawd, not this again lol j/k
I think it is normal fer some of the bottom fan leaves ta turn yellow as flowering progresses,but too many,too early at once is a sure sign of N dif.To better evaluate the situation ya need ta look at the rest of the plant,how green is it,and how fast is -it- turning yellow.Once a plant is done stretching you could give it all the N ya want,it's not gonna stretch more.The hormones that are tellin it ta stretch stop after a couple of weeks in flower.Btw it would be wise ta give em more K during the stretch cuz that's what their useing more of at that point,K builds stem an stalk.It is important that they also have plenty of N and P at that point too.Giving a plant N past the stretch isn't gonna hurt anything as long as the P out weighs the N.Imo not given more N when they yellow too fast in flower only holds it back.By given it more bloom nutes will only cause the plant ta use up more of it's stored N,makin it yellow out before it's time,there by cuttin back on yeild that was potentionaly there.I've done it many times.They always finish right on time too.Has any of ya used Age Old Organics Bloom? NPK *5*-10-5 wonderfull stuff,keeps em green clear up to the end.When it comes ta the flush each plant is gonna be a lil different.What's important is that ya catch the end of the transpiration phase.This way the plant is still pullin alot of water though the plant,helpin the plant rid it self of extra nutes.If ya wait too long and the transpiration phase is over there is a chance all of the nutes won't be flushed,cuz the plant matabolism has about stopped.On a 8 week strain this happens a about 6 1/2 ta 7 weeks as a rule of thumb (again,a hormone thing).Yul know cuz the plant stops needin water.Best ta have em flushed before this happens.This has been my experience fer many years.Too each their own tho.Best of luck.Take care...BC
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Sorry about the topic deviation khaleel, but I need to address this here and now with stitch.
MyNameStitch....
Here we go again... I don't know why it always has to be like pulling teeth on every time (of several corrections to date) I've asked you to correct things in your nute def compilation paper. This particular one was pointed out to you a long long time ago. Whats up ?
This is a picture you have in the def guide, of a small plant in very late flowering, which YOU labeled as an N deficiency. This is very misleading info to say the least.
you said...
"(Picture 2 is a Nitrogen Deficiency in late Flowering)(Thanks to BillyBob for the Picture)"
to THAT I'll now say again...
Your nute def compilation paper really needs to speak of whats totally normal (and to be expected) in flowering instead of making new growers think they have some kind of a problem worth worrying about.
AND...
Robert C. Clarke writes, in chapter four of mj botany.
first sentance of the first paragraph under the section labeled:
"Late Floral Stage
By this stage plants are well past the main reproductive phase and their health has begun to decline. Many of the larger leaves have dropped off, and some of the small inner leaves begin to change color."
nuff said stitch ?
Please fix it asap MNS.
Let me know when you're ready and I'll unlock it for you.
MyNameStitch....
Here we go again... I don't know why it always has to be like pulling teeth on every time (of several corrections to date) I've asked you to correct things in your nute def compilation paper. This particular one was pointed out to you a long long time ago. Whats up ?
This is a picture you have in the def guide, of a small plant in very late flowering, which YOU labeled as an N deficiency. This is very misleading info to say the least.
you said...
"(Picture 2 is a Nitrogen Deficiency in late Flowering)(Thanks to BillyBob for the Picture)"
to THAT I'll now say again...
Your nute def compilation paper really needs to speak of whats totally normal (and to be expected) in flowering instead of making new growers think they have some kind of a problem worth worrying about.
AND...
Robert C. Clarke writes, in chapter four of mj botany.
first sentance of the first paragraph under the section labeled:
"Late Floral Stage
By this stage plants are well past the main reproductive phase and their health has begun to decline. Many of the larger leaves have dropped off, and some of the small inner leaves begin to change color."
nuff said stitch ?
Please fix it asap MNS.
Let me know when you're ready and I'll unlock it for you.
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K
khaleel
10K: aside from the nitrogen, what do you think about the drainage issue? do you think that could have just sped up the natural yellowing? there was some pretty nasty pooled water in the trays... 
(on that note, i just read your sig thread on "lifting the pot" - instead of watering this morning i lifted to see if they needed it and they are still way heavy... thanks for the technique)
(on that note, i just read your sig thread on "lifting the pot" - instead of watering this morning i lifted to see if they needed it and they are still way heavy... thanks for the technique)
G
Guest
khaleel said:
chrystal is a 60 day strain, under a 1k, so under flouros, id give them a wee more time, mega yielder. one,lime
damn Good call on the overwatering stinkyattic, that very well could be it in a nutshell.
Khaleel,
when did you switch from veg nutes to flowering nutes as compared to when you flipped the light cycle ?
If you did both at the same time it would also contribute to some early yellowing. It's standard practice to make the switch over about two weeks after the lights are flipped.
But now at 30 days in on a 60 day strain I am still am not seeing anything to be overly alarmed about in those pictures. You've got the watering method changed now and I trust you wont be letting the bags sit in pools anymore. After the bags lighten up, give em a low dose flush and then bump up the "bloom nutes" strengths like I suggested. I'm sure you'll see buds a pleanty bursting forth in the next few weeks.
Red petoiles pffff...no sweat, if it's not a strain specific trait it will go away when they're eating the bloom nutes at the strength they'll be asking for as they continue plumping up. Don't let em get too light when doing the lift the pot method btw.
ps... yea its a fluorescent sog style grow too... so you can expect to see branching happening reaching up towards the canopy level, and a lack of light down below as the canopy fills in up top. Be sure to add some airflow (a very mild breeze, but not too much) under the canopy as that happens too. Pffffffft
Khaleel,
when did you switch from veg nutes to flowering nutes as compared to when you flipped the light cycle ?
If you did both at the same time it would also contribute to some early yellowing. It's standard practice to make the switch over about two weeks after the lights are flipped.
But now at 30 days in on a 60 day strain I am still am not seeing anything to be overly alarmed about in those pictures. You've got the watering method changed now and I trust you wont be letting the bags sit in pools anymore. After the bags lighten up, give em a low dose flush and then bump up the "bloom nutes" strengths like I suggested. I'm sure you'll see buds a pleanty bursting forth in the next few weeks.
Red petoiles pffff...no sweat, if it's not a strain specific trait it will go away when they're eating the bloom nutes at the strength they'll be asking for as they continue plumping up. Don't let em get too light when doing the lift the pot method btw.
ps... yea its a fluorescent sog style grow too... so you can expect to see branching happening reaching up towards the canopy level, and a lack of light down below as the canopy fills in up top. Be sure to add some airflow (a very mild breeze, but not too much) under the canopy as that happens too. Pffffffft
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