My Perpetual Ebb & Flow Cabinets

[imnotcrazy]

Mibri: Yeah the seeds were in my possession for @ 2 years or so in the fridge. I'll leave them in the towels for @ 3weeks or so. Got two sprouts now so can't be that bad. Older seeds sometimes just take longer to get going. I purchased this pack of JH from Dr. Chronic, won't use him any more though. All the new stock has/will come from SBay/SBoutique as the last order from Chronic was lacking in the stealth shipping dept, and I've heard the same from others. And yes, fresh trim goes in a bag into the freezer then to Bags w/ice & water.

-VT-: Still no rep left for yoooooouuuuuuu lol

 

[imnotcrazy]

Look at what else I found, If he don't know what he's talking about who does???:

Lucas
ImPatient Cannabist
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 59 Lucas has disabled reputation



> so can a fella get some specific opinions on botanicare's supplemental additives like silica blast, sweet organic carbohydrate, liquid karma, and blast off?

I personally recommend AGAINST all additives until you are able to grow good medicine with a simple recipe. For example, 15ml/gal Pure Blend Pro plus 5ml per gal Cal Mag. If that mix does not work for you, there is something wrong with your system environment. Additives do nothing to correct for bad environment.

You cant imagine how many people with too warm water, go for hydroguard. Or how many people with spotted leaves from using too little nutrient, decide to buy Liquid Karma.

Sweet btw, is a Magnesium supplement. So is Cal Mag. Pure Blend Pro below EC 1.5 is guaranteed to cause numerous nutrient deficiencies, that can be fixed by using a stronger mix. Additives are just a way to make the mix stronger.

I know someone who claims they use Canna, but they use it at half of mfg recommended dosage. To solve all the problems caused by this weak nute mix, they add Kaching, Sweet, Rhyzotonic, and a bunch of other P and K boosters. They end up with nutrient overdoses of P and deficiencies of Mg and K, because they grow by "feel" and have no idea what they are actually feeding.

I agree completely that buds grown with GH nutes at proper dosage, do not need flushing.

Flushing is for folks who play around guessing at what to feed, and then have to wash it all out cause they have no idea whats going on with the plants nutrient levels.

just my opinion
Lucas


Found here (Post#55 ):
http://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=13384&page=4&pp=15

 

[Mibri]

Hehe - definately a nice post. Yes - he must know. Hmm sounds reasonable. I haven't tried to combare flushed with unflushed yet but Lucas's statement makes sence. They plants grown directly in mother earth don't get flushed either do they?

 

[Guest]

flushing is for people who play guessing games...pure opinion on lucas part and bs if im at 1000 ppms and i dont flush im screwed my shit wont even stay lit in a joint...sure it will smoke with black ash...i dont guess anything..i know whithout a flush or atleast ppms dropped below 500 for the last week your shit is not as good as it can be..end of story

Look at what else I found, If he don't know what he's talking about who does???:

Lucas
ImPatient Cannabist
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 59 Lucas has disabled reputation



> so can a fella get some specific opinions on botanicare's supplemental additives like silica blast, sweet organic carbohydrate, liquid karma, and blast off?

I personally recommend AGAINST all additives until you are able to grow good medicine with a simple recipe. For example, 15ml/gal Pure Blend Pro plus 5ml per gal Cal Mag. If that mix does not work for you, there is something wrong with your system environment. Additives do nothing to correct for bad environment.

You cant imagine how many people with too warm water, go for hydroguard. Or how many people with spotted leaves from using too little nutrient, decide to buy Liquid Karma.

Sweet btw, is a Magnesium supplement. So is Cal Mag. Pure Blend Pro below EC 1.5 is guaranteed to cause numerous nutrient deficiencies, that can be fixed by using a stronger mix. Additives are just a way to make the mix stronger.

I know someone who claims they use Canna, but they use it at half of mfg recommended dosage. To solve all the problems caused by this weak nute mix, they add Kaching, Sweet, Rhyzotonic, and a bunch of other P and K boosters. They end up with nutrient overdoses of P and deficiencies of Mg and K, because they grow by "feel" and have no idea what they are actually feeding.

I agree completely that buds grown with GH nutes at proper dosage, do not need flushing.

Flushing is for folks who play around guessing at what to feed, and then have to wash it all out cause they have no idea whats going on with the plants nutrient levels.

just my opinion
Lucas


Found here (Post#55 ):
http://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=13384&page=4&pp=15

 

[imnotcrazy]

Mibri: No they don't, all you "flush" out of the soil if you do is anything converted to a "mobile" element in the soil by beneficial bacteria etc from what I take from the "organic vs. chemweed" thread. And I don't mean mobile as in Macro nutes being mobile in the plant. I've seen a chart somewhere, maybe in the Mel Frank Grower's Guide I have, that shows a nute's availability in soil versus distance from the root. Some nutes/elements are just more mobile. A flush in soil I would think is like diluting the nute strength in your hydro rez more-so than removing the nutes from the soil. That was one of the reasons/arguments Oscar Meyer, Varaan and joecrowe gave for reducing nute levels rather than a complete flush. Besides, according to Jorge Cervantes, a light dosing of nutes is better for flushing as it is easier for water w/some nutes to dilute existing nutes in your medium. Say anywhere from 300-800ppm depending on how high the plant was taking nutes in full bloom I'd suppose...

 

[Mibri]

Yes, that definately sounds good to me. I think for my flushing im gonna go with about the 500 ppms. I just think it sounds fair, that the plant has potential to grow a bit denser the last couple of weeks if it has a bit of nutes to work with.

 

[imnotcrazy]

*As long asyou give them less than they need*, they'll begin to use stored nutes. In fact, the B pheno of the Blue Mystic I have started to show SEVERE N deficiency, among other things, when the Lucas Formula I previously ran was dropped to @ 1200ppm (if you wanted to go perpetual, you have the obvious advantage of multiple trays and resivours, so you could run two diff flower nute strengths and have a better "happy medium" to work with(much like Oscar Meyer did and I plan to do again, still have to find 2-3 trays that will fit in the existing shelf space).,by dividing up:

Onset of flower/Light feeding strains on one lower strength tray, possibly with more N to help with newer clones during stretch Just would have to stop application of extra N or move girls ready for harvest to 3rd tray with flush strength nutes/plain water/flushing solution depending on if you had room for it and what you chose to finish them off with before harvest. Still not as optimal as having single pots for each girl, but gaiusmarius did it with Coco, a finicky White Widow and a heavier feeding strain, Sour Diesel V3 and Omega Diesel if my memory serves me right. But it definatly is easier to do something like that in a medium that holds alot of water for a long period of time such as RW slab or Coco because if you flood once a day you could have lower nute strength in the rez and after drain/drip cycle is finished, dunk the cube have second rez for manual app/on timer to drip just before higher ppm runoff. This would bump up the nute strength in the rez faster when the tray flooded again unless you run flood/drip to waste system. Which could help with topoff/addback of rez if the nute profiles for each strain weren't completly different then you have to perform rez changes more often in a recirc system.



For example, DJ Short's Blueberry is known to be a finicky strain and might be ran @ 800-1000ppm full bloom (so you may want to use strength of flush based on full bloom strength rather than have a set figure) depending on meter conv factor, meter calibration point and Nutrient Brand used as they are all close, but not exactly the same when you look at the guarenteed analysis paperwork on each brand of nute..

Being that the PBP is a "Pseudo Organic", I'm thinking I'll have to worry about buildup even less, besides once it's in the jars for a month or so the buds are fine. The biggest improvement comes after the first week or two. But a SLOW dry,7-10days, is even more important IMO. And even if you didn't have a tray to "flush", you could always take the higher feeding flowering strains and put them on the lower strength table and they probably wouldn't have enough nutes to sustain themselves and would get an equivalent flush as they consumed the fan leaves, etc.

 

[Mibri]

That sounds about right. Very thorough. Yes the high consuming strains could probably do that.
I'll be rebuilding my flowerroom sometime to make space for an extra tray with low levels of ferts in it for mild flushing. That would also be a good buffer place if growing perpetual

 

[imnotcrazy]

Well, on the suggestion of another PBP/E&F user (mr.wags) I dropped my nute strength to @ half of the 2600ppm setting from earlier in the week. Drained half of rez and topped off with plain water to set @ 1800ppm and 5.9-6.0PH. I kept the other half of the rez I drained because I went and bought 2 16" x 22" rubbermaids for dual strenghth flower nutes and a 7.5" x 16" tray for low strength nutes/flushing (but it wound up being just a little too big to fit with the other two, so I have to go searching for something more like the 6" x 22-24" I was originally looking for). Need to get a few more F&D fittings from the hydro store and another pump or two tomorrow to complete this upgrade, Then I'll have double the nute capacity in the flower cabby so I'll more than likely won't need to adjust the rez's as often . Still trying to get a cam for pics, Hydro store is by my family's house, so I'll have to pester my sis for her 20D or her 5MP pocket cam at the least, want to get timeline photos and keep this thread fairly up to date. Figures that I can't get pics till the roomies go to bed and when they are going away for the weekend they grab up my camera

 

[imnotcrazy]

Well, on the suggestion of another PBP/E&F user (mr.wags) I dropped my nute strength to @ half of the 2600ppm setting from earlier in the week. Drained half of rez and topped off with plain water to set @ 1800ppm and 5.9-6.0PH. I kept the other half of the rez I drained because I went and bought 2 16" x 22" rubbermaids for dual strenghth flower nutes and a 7.5" x 16" tray for low strength nutes/flushing (but it wound up being just a little too big to fit with the other two, so I have to go searching for something more like the 6" x 22-24" I was originally looking for). Need to get a few more F&D fittings from the hydro store and another pump or two tomorrow to complete this upgrade, Then I'll have double the nute capacity in the flower cabby so I'll more than likely won't need to adjust the rez's as often . Still trying to get a cam for pics, Hydro store is by my family's house, so I'll have to pester my sis for her 20D or her 5MP pocket cam at the least, want to get timeline photos and keep this thread fairly up to date. Figures that I can't get pics till the roomies go to bed and when they are going away for the weekend they grab up my camera

 

[cocogrow]

Damn dude props you got a great setup and are producing some dank congrats!

 

[Mr GreenJeans]

Hiya imnotcrazy
You are a man with a plan, and a good one! Looking forward to your next update

 

[imnotcrazy]

Shit, MrGJ, I still have to make the new carbon filter before things get smelly with the newer strains I'll be running

 

[OhioPlayer]

i like smaller grows like this , not huge "dealer" grows.

 

[imnotcrazy]

Pulls @ 1-4ounces per week strain dependent. Will only get better with upgrades...

 

[Mibri]

Hehe sounds good, bro.(not the part with the camera, but i guess then we can really see some improvement in it all, when u get it back)
I bought some cat trays at a pet shop some time. Don't know if you could get it the size u need. Sometimes in delicatesse shops, they have different size black hard plastic trays for the catering food. Maybe u could smoke a couple of good joints, get really hungry, and just order in, hehe. Can't wait to see all of those new strains growing. Sorry i can't participate too much in the talk of nutes. Just don't have the meters, and just know a little bit of what the different terms are - no experience at all.

 

[imnotcrazy]

Well, as far as nutes, I'm not comfortable per say either, I just know the deficiencies that show up with certain strains if you don't suppliment (usually N in veg/early flower and P/K in mid/late flower need to be addressed Ca and Mg uptake may change during flower). But I'm rambling ro try and figure out the new PBP lineup. Talked to mr. wags and was told the mix was WAY hot and after 2 more days the girls showed it. I figure maybe if I can read my thoughts on the screen and have some suggestions along the way it has to help speed my learning curve

 

[Mibri]

Hehe, you're right. Doh, so u flushed the girls after that burn? Hope they'll be fine. Yes, i'm learning a lot here too.. It's very nice with a forum like this. Much better than reading books.

 

[imnotcrazy]

They didn't burn reall all that bad so I dropped the mix to @ 800ppm of PBP total ppm 1800 but Sweet and Liquid Karma are most of that

 

[Mibri]

That's nice. I really get in a bad mood when the plants aren't well. Hopefully they'll be better from now on. I guess in some grows i'll be able to keep'em completely happy.