Sparkless blades, in conjunction with a totally enclosed fan cooled motor with NEMA 7, Div I electrical, would be considered explosion proof.
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Mk III Terpenator
- Thread starter Gray Wolf
- Start date
Sparkless blades, in conjunction with a totally enclosed fan cooled motor with NEMA 7, Div I electrical, would be considered explosion proof.
GratefulOne
Member
Study the amount of air flow you need. Those blowers Boghart is selling are WAY too small to move the amounts of air needed for NFPA standards or indoor use. Check out NFPA 33 for lots of info on air flow to prevent fires and explosions. You can read NFPA standard for free if you register: http://www.nfpa.org/codes-and-standards/document-information-pages?mode=code&code=33
Off the top of my head: you need 100-150 cubic feet per min of air flow. The flow should be controlled to form a laminar flow. The area design should prevent dead space that don't flow air and trap vapors.
For example a spray bench 3x3x4 needs a 18" blower a small open face booth 6x6x7 needs a 24" blower. The Boghart thing is 8" and not even a good 8". The design fills most of the flow space with the motor. The design is terrible for achieving real air flow. Typically explosion proof blowers have the motor located outside the flow path for increased air flow and safety by getting the motor outside the flammable path.
A plenum helps (and is required for spray booths) to create the laminar flow. This causes the air to flow evenly through all elevations of the spray booth.
Check the air flow under load for the blowers and compare to real spray booth blowers. Also the Bogharts are based on a Chinese design that is famous for overstating air flows. In addition that design is not well suited for handling pressurized flows. I doubt you can even find an under load rating for the Boghart blower.
Honestly I feel people are going to get into serious trouble if they think a blower that size will ventilate an indoor operation properly. You need a staggering amount of air before you even start talking about make up air. Look up make up air flow before adding ANY ventilation to an indoor set up. This is an area where the real numbers based on engineering standards would shock you. You would never guess it would require so much air to be safe indoors.
Yes I am.
So I don't need to have my recovery tank under vacuum? The temperature differentials is enough to suck out the vapor in the collection pot once the solvent boils off?
So I only run 5# through the column then just dump that? Terpp said I should use as much solvent as I run actively. So inject 5 lbs, soak then dump then inject another 5# to get any leftovers.
So dump valve is open throughout the whole process?
Also a bit confused on vapor assisting, to my knowledge if I run passively, I have to top feed instead of flooding the column like the mk3 was designed for so I moved the injection tee to the top instead of the bottom of the material column. What I'm failing to understand is vapor assist. To my knowledge this is how vapor assist supposed to work.
One HVAC tank in warm water with a bit of butane (~1lb) hooked up to a second HVAC via vapor valve which is sitting in dry ice which is also hooked up to the inject valve on the top of the CLS via liquid valve. What I don't understand is that are we supposed to have the amount of distilled solvent in the second HVAC sitting in dry ice and all vapor assist is, is just using the 1lb of butane in the first hvac to push all the distilled solvent in the second HVAC to run through the system? or are we supposed to inject solvent by holding a HVAC higher than the top of the Mk3 and then use vapor assist after?
One HVAC tank in warm water with a bit of butane (~1lb) hooked up to a second HVAC via vapor valve which is sitting in dry ice which is also hooked up to the inject valve on the top of the CLS via liquid valve. What I don't understand is that are we supposed to have the amount of distilled solvent in the second HVAC sitting in dry ice and all vapor assist is, is just using the 1lb of butane in the first hvac to push all the distilled solvent in the second HVAC to run through the system? or are we supposed to inject solvent by holding a HVAC higher than the top of the Mk3 and then use vapor assist after?
How long should it typically take to recover 10lbs of butane from the collection pot? Im using a TR21 with mt69 in ice bath with recovery tank in ice bath. The collection pot is in 100 degree water bath. Its taking about 1.5 hours for each flush recovery cycle. I Suspect my recovery pump may be failing...
Hellavated
Member
You could try lowering your tempetures to create a pressure difference to increase recovery time ? I know Bizzybee runs all passive and shreds butane vapor
NorPene Solutions
Member
The small 1/4" size of your mt69 may be slowing down the process. You might want to look at switching up and building an IC69 heat exchanger.
Hellavated
Member
Its done using negative pressures. A recovery tank in cold/vacuum'd has a negative pressure in comparison to a collection pot sitting on a heat pad, which heats the butane making the vapors cause pressure.
Ditch the Mt69 for a 3/8" X 50' stainless jockey box coil (IC-69).
Could I buy it off the shelf or do I have to source parts and assemble? I was reading the IC 69 thread and found the link for the 20' 3/8 coil with 1/4 flare fittings. Is 20' not long enough?
http://www.amazon.com/HomeBrewStuff-Stainless-Steel-Tubing-Coil/dp/B00420V094
Just add compression fittings.
hobb3s93
Member
any suggestions as to where one would find a better product? im willing to spend more to get it done right. i need one to exhaust a 10x10 room then one for pulling air out the larger work space...
GratefulOne
Member
It sounds like you are trying to do it right. I suggest creating a smaller high danger area and shape the air flow into that area. Basically the same set up as a spray booth. Check out NFPA 33 for air flow numbers.
If you want to get the whole 10x10 room and an additional area I suggest hiring a professional who does industrial air flow plans. Just 2-3 hours with them would teach you a ton. You end up needing a balanced system with exhaust and make up air blowers all running if you need to do more than a small area.
hobb3s93
Member
well my contractor is a close friend and also certified hvac but not sure if he has much experience in setting up explosion proof or lab type set ups.
i just found canarm explosion proof fans online, not sure if uve heard of them?
i can pick up an 18in explosion proof fan rated at 3200cfm for around 800.
the small room will be used to exhaust freshly ran material and freshly made slabs. obviously im gna have to figure out how not to have a bunch of material flying around and going in slabs but thats another issue hahaah.
we also want a circulating/ exhausting type fan to clear the larger workspace of any small amounts of gas produced by possible leaks or venting off after runs.
are there wall mount circulating explosion proof that are around 500? im gna keep searching online aswell obviusly
GratefulOne
Member
This is an area of an industrial hygiene expert. I can give you some basics but you will learn more than enough to make hiring someone for a half day worth it.
Typically you try to set up smooth air flow without any dead spaces. You pump in the make up air at the front end. You pull a bit more exhaust so the building stays negative pressure. In my old plant we would pump in new fresh air where we needed to clear areas. Using local fans just stirs air and causes the laminar air flow to break up.
It is really hard to give specific advice without knowing the space details.
IMO the best source for cheap explosion proof blowers is used spray booth blowers.
hobb3s93
Member
thanx man i really appreciate the advice. my buddy had planned for the space to be in negative pressure. with all other fans pushing twords vent room. ill ask him more about your advice next time i see him.
i ended up buying the bogart for temporary vetilation while we wait on our larger unit to get made and shipped.
we're going with a 16'' mushroom type exhaust i can pick one up for 1k but takes a month to get here. also once i looked around online a bit it seemed like 450 for an 8in explosion proof fan with ducting was actually a decent deal. i dont expect it to be able to handle the room well but i need something temporary .once that larger fan shows up we'll just use the bogart for ventialtion directly next to the systems.
im gna look into used spray booths now.
thanx again
GratefulOne
Member
Watch the exhaust path. NFPA standards require the exhaust to push the flammables far enough above the building to dilute to levels that prevent fire.
Check out the Denver Fire Dept regs for cls. They are the only group I have seen write specific rules with regards to fire issues. They are worth the read. Not the details of NFPA but still useful. The best standards imo and what most fire marshals go by are the NFPA.
Check out the Denver Fire Dept regs for cls. They are the only group I have seen write specific rules with regards to fire issues. They are worth the read. Not the details of NFPA but still useful. The best standards imo and what most fire marshals go by are the NFPA.
