Living organic soil from start through recycling

[Seandawg]

Seadawg, cheap or not most of these books are so packed with information they're worth having a physical copy on hand. "Teeming with microbes" is another common suggestion. I like Rodale's book on composting as well.

I like to read pretty much anything that'll make my grow better. And have read quite a bit already. Most that i have read i was lucky enough to get free. But some i had no choice but to pay. If its worth it i dont mind. But some books like "vermiculture technology" are more expensive than some of my grow equipment lol.

I actually have both of those two that you've suggested. And you're right those two are packed with solid information and are beneficial beyond initial assumption.

Thank you greatly
SD

 

[IncredibowlBoss]

My new iPhone 5 is arriving tomorrow. I just verified the FedEx tracking number.

A new toy! Yay!

I have a spare iPhone microscope - hit me with a PM if you'd like it

 

[IncredibowlBoss]

I like to read pretty much anything that'll make my grow better. And have read quite a bit already. Most that i have read i was lucky enough to get free. But some i had no choice but to pay. If its worth it i dont mind. But some books like "vermiculture technology" are more expensive than some of my grow equipment lol.

I actually have both of those two that you've suggested. And you're right those two are packed with solid information and are beneficial beyond initial assumption.

Thank you greatly
SD

Botany for Gardeners(!)

And for some open-minded reading time: primary plant perception by Cleve Backster

 

[MrSterling]

Botany for Gardeners is great! I knew I was forgetting a title. I'm picking up a couple other books Eliot Coleman suggested. I'll let you guys know when I finish.

 

[Seandawg]

Yeah, i got that one too. It was also pretty cool to use the book to size up some slides i had for my scope. Thanks for the suggestions guys! I like having confirmation that im on the right track and in good company.

Mahalo
SD

 

[b_all_in]

Store bought compost

Store bought compost

After reading this entire thread (and what a truly incredible wealth of information it is) I'm learning that building soil with quality humus is one of the keys to organic growing and recycling soil. I have access to quality homemade EWC but it seems that I can only source bagged compost from a nursery or True Value. One brand is G & B (at True Value Hardware) the other, from the nursery, I cant remember the name (maybe Black Earth or something). Am I wasting my time with these products? A humble thank you in advance.

 

[shmalphy]

After reading this entire thread (and what a truly incredible wealth of information it is) I'm learning that building soil with quality humus is one of the keys to organic growing and recycling soil. I have access to quality homemade EWC but it seems that I can only source bagged compost from a nursery or True Value. One brand is G & B (at True Value Hardware) the other, from the nursery, I cant remember the name (maybe Black Earth or something). Am I wasting my time with these products? A humble thank you in advance.

I would stick with the homemade EWC... If you need more, you could always run those products through the worm bin and it would improve them and bulk up your casting supply at the same time. I would turn to craigslist/freecycle for compost before I bought anything like that, but that is just me.

But, seriously, why not just start a compost pile? What do you do with your kitchen and yard waste?

 

[b_all_in]

Just started composting this summer and I just got worms started this week. Im pretty pumped to check out some of my final product. Ive just been adding kitchen scraps and cardboard to a few 5gal buckets with holes drilled in them. Now that fall is here i plan on gathering some aspen leaves and adding those as well. Ive got a couple buckets of pretty rotted stuff it looks like. From what Ive read on these threads, it sounds like I should feed this stuff to my worms. Any suggestions?

 

[b_all_in]

Sorry I guess I didnt answer the question. I didnt start a pile because of bears and coons and stuff. I grow veggies on my 2nd story deck. Thats where i have my bins. Semi-locally there is a worm guy and he is where I get the EWC and now my worms.

 

[+Vibes]

hey guys i'm just into the 50's, page wise, can ya'll slow down for a day or two while i play catchup?

 

[shmalphy]

I screened my homemade castings for the first time last night. I used a really fine screen I got from a friend, it looks like 10 mesh or so. It was a hand me down from his grandfather. I was amazed at the quality, they are jet black, friable castings. They are enriched with bokashi, bio char, lacto b, BIM, stone dust and well rotted manure (goat, rabbit, horse, and chicken). I have a horizontal flow through bin, my bedding was a mix of leaves, compost, and used potting soil, and I fed them all of my food scraps, and coffee grounds. The stuff I sifted out looks like it can be used as a potting soil, it is very coarse and has humus rich chunks. The fine stuff will be used in teas. I got 5 gallons of soil and 18 gallons of fine castings. I couldn't believe that not a spec of food was left. Seems like the bokashi gets everything going fast, so all the food breaks down quickly and they eat it right up.

 

[b_all_in]

shmalphy-

I just read a thread on Bokashi. Pretty cool stuff there. Do you make your own? If so what do compost and what do you bokashi? And do you run all of through the worm bin before it goes in your soil? Sorry for so many questions, this stuff fascinates me.

 

[HUGE]

Tag

 

[VortexPower420]

Hey folks, So I have been Reading through the thread and what great information. I still have a lot to go but I have questions. First I would Like to give some good horticulture/gardening books. Most of these have change how I thought about gardening, soil and the world.
Secret life of Plants -Christopher Bird All about the magic of plant life and how they are sentient beings.
Secrets of the soil- Christopher Bird A follow up but all about soil/compost/Biodynimics/nymphs and faeries
A Biodynamic Farm - Hugh Lovel His story on becoming a biodynamic farmer the preps and energy organization
Eco-Farm Acres Primer- Charles Walters a in and out primer on farming and soil health, I reference this book quite often as he breaks down each Cation and their role as well as all the soil tilith and pH.
Also I feel everyone in this forum should receive Acres magazine.
I feel it is a invaluable resource for all people with the urge to produce the highest quality produce (herb or other) possible, plus you get to keep informed about our failing food supply and what we might be able to do to change it. That being said, now to my question.
I unable to make my own castings or compost at this time, so I use the highest quality possible sources, which i know is not always the most active but better then nothing. In a article in Acres mag someone was talking about Humic substances, how they act in the soil and their make up. Now from my understanding humic compounds are what make soil soil. They are the compounds that can hold on to large amounts of nutrientsand give soil its structure. This is the main pourpous of adding casting or compost as well as to add life and a small amount of available nutrients and more locked up in the bodies of microbes. According to the article Compost and castings have good amounts of humic compounds but they are not as complex as they could be (Humic compounds are still to be completely defined, every time they try and figure the humic-chains they realize they are different according to they environment). In the article they talk about the most complex, active humics are made by the relationship of plants and AM Myco Fungi. It has been discovered plants can put back into the soil up to 70 % of the sugars it makes. it does this to feed the proper microbes to mineralize nutrients for the plant and to make Humic compounds and sequester carbon. Carbon is the key to everything.
Now my question... So if I had Highly active soil with a proper Cation exchange ratio and good nutrient levels wouldn't compost become obsolete. If you ran into a problem with a nuitrient def. couldn't you just use some mineral supplement to fix the problem, and then at the end of the cropping cycle do a proper soil test and then add the required minerals back in? My thought process on this is large scale organic farms. Alot of them are converting from Chem Agriculture, their farms with no organic matter and completely dead from years of chemical assault. Few have the ability to compost at such high rates. Insted they set up a couple year plan to reestablish soil life and organic matter (HUmics). They start with mineralization, cover crops, biological inocoulants and AM Fungi.If properly done you can go from .5% OM Rock like dirt to 5% OM Black gold in 2 years. I know in a potted indoor environment things are different, but that just means you can get to where you want to be quickly.
I do understand the extreme value of well made compost don't get me wrong just wondering how you intelligent people feel about my thoughts.
Thanks for hearing my rambles Keep up the ggod fight everyone!!
timbuktu

 

[shmalphy]

I think that even if your soil is perfect, you would still need something to amend it with after a few runs "recycling" if you are only doing one type of plant in it (monoculture) as most cannabis growers are doing. Composting (including vermi) is the most effective way to return organic matter to the soil.

Obviously, in a perfect world, cannabis would be grown on a farm as part of a crop rotation program with other plants, including cover crops and green manures, but that is not feasible, for me at this point it isn't anyways, but the only reason for that is bureaucratic bullshit.

 

[VortexPower420]

I think that even if your soil is perfect, you would still need something to amend it with after a few runs "recycling" if you are only doing one type of plant in it (monoculture) as most cannabis growers are doing. Composting (including vermi) is the most effective way to return organic matter to the soil.

Obviously, in a perfect world, cannabis would be grown on a farm as part of a crop rotation program with other plants, including cover crops and green manures, but that is not feasible, for me at this point it isn't anyways, but the only reason for that is bureaucratic bullshit.

I agree that you need to re amend for you are taking some minerals out with the plant and that momo cropping is not a soil buliding pratice. At the same time Cannabis\hemp is known for not being a soil draining crop, but a good soil building crop in rotation.
I know Idealy you should always have a cover crop as well.
I was just posing a situation based on information I have read different places and trying to make a solid theory. If it is true that all plants(or microbes for that matter)can convert N from the air into soil N and with the help of AM Fungi make highly stable complex forms of Hummus. Then whouldn't we just be required to make sure all minerals are present in correct amounts, without the necessity of consantly adding worm castings. I kinda feel the same way about AACT. I know it is great stuff loaded with active microbes, but if you have healthy soil to begin with arent you just wasting your time. microbes will eat what the have and go dormant if they are not needed, Right? I understand the disease suppressing aspect of AACT and to use it to revitalize unhealthy soil, but as a weekly or monthly addition I wonder if it is necessary the same way I feel constant addition of castings or compost to healthy well amended soil is running circles. This is all just what I have running in my head, I could be very wrong or just on my own side of the street but I thank all for listening and also for any input.
Timbuktu

 

[Budwhyser]

SO about a month ago I made a soil mixture with what I am hoping has adequate humic content (mainly cow poo and ewc). I transplanted a few plants in it a few days ago and now I'm seeing small sprouts popping in each pot. Is this normal?

Also, would it be beneficial to alfalfa foilar spray cuttings prior to them taking root?

 

[VortexPower420]

So I stared reading through this thread heavily and DAMN there is great knowledge in here. So many of my questions have been answered, and i still have 100 pages to go. can't wait to see what i find. I have been playing around with making my own soil and re using it for over a year now. Its nice to know i am going in the right direction. Its funny how things will coincide with each other, info on here and other books and articles I have been reading. it's like puzzle pieces. Awesome stuff. I wish i jumped no this band wagon earlier, it was just going to fast for me at the time.Thank you all who contributed and will contribute and thank you to you handful of people with years of knowledge on me, im glad i found the best to sound off of. I read some of these posts and its nice to know im not the only one who feels this is the only way to make this sacred herb be all it can be.
sorry for my stoned rambles Damn ChemD...
Timbuktu

 

[ClackamasCootz]

SO about a month ago I made a soil mixture with what I am hoping has adequate humic content (mainly cow poo and ewc). I transplanted a few plants in it a few days ago and now I'm seeing small sprouts popping in each pot. Is this normal?

I've never used any horse or cow manure that did not result in a large number of unintended plants (weeds) in our gardens. It's said that the main reasons for composting manure is to kill pathogens (a worthy goal) and to kill the seeds which it does up to a point.

But it doesn't kill all of them. Raw or even aged manure would have lots and lots of viable seeds that will come to your party.

Also, would it be beneficial to alfalfa foilar spray cuttings prior to them taking root?

I couldn't think of any as a foliar spray. Far better would be to use an alfalfa tea to drench your rooting medium since I assume you're looking for a couple of specific Auxin and the other 'rooting hormone' - correct?

CC

 

[shmalphy]

I find alfalfa is an amazing foliar spray. It darkens the leaves and gives the plant an overall appearance of vigor. I find that cuts taken while the foliage is darker don't fade and yellow as much during rooting, and also resist pest attacks better, so foliar spray the mom before taking cuttings. If the leaves look thin, pale or at all deficient I will use the alfalfa foliar as a quick pick me up, it's been one of the best things I have ever found since I started growing. Looking around my growroom, that is all I use now, with the EWC and rock dust.

I am starting 4 plants today in flower. I will only use EWC tea to water, they got barley a few days ago, and I will foliar aloe on fridays and alfalfa on mon/tues until they are in full bloom, with some botanical teas/neem as needed to control mites. All 4 are in 5 gallon root pouches with earthworm laden living soil and a "lasagna" mulch. I will post some pics as they progress.