Gender dysphoria and the trans movement.

[Porky82]

I just posted an article above. Also, let’s talk about the basics of hormones. I asked you a question and you ignored it. Are hormone blockers safe for kids ?

Probably not physically but the mental health outcomes probably outweighs the physical problems.
If your worried about blockers which are just chemicals maybe you should have a look at what we eat, wash with, spray on ourselves package food with or the air we breath. All packed full of chemicals that are very bad for us and the environment.

 

[eastcoastjoe]

I think you're full of shit.
I think you care about playing an agitating role in this moral panic.
I don't think you're sincere.
What urgency drives you? What is the scope of the problem, as you see it?
How many examples of the scenarios you imagine actually exist?

You are entitled to your opinion. With the way people attack each other in this section, I won’t speak about why it matters to me so much in detail.

The scenarios I am describing are going to happen with many kids receiving hormone blockers. Why would we be giving children hormone blockers that completely suppress LH, which causes interruptions in the entire hormonal pathway?

When a kid enters puberty, the body is just beginning to mature. Why would we want to suppress estrogen when bones are developing ? Why would we give kids TRT on top of that when we know it can enlarge organs. Cause heart problems? Not to mention the compounding of mental health issues by disrupting these hormones? It’s baffling that you guys don’t read about this stuff but post all these links like you’re scientific experts

 

[eastcoastjoe]

New Study Shows Transgender People Who Receive Gender-Affirming Surgery are Significantly Less Likely to Experience Psychological Distress or Suicidal Ideation - Fenway Health

BOSTON, April 28, 2021—A new study published today in JAMA Surgery found that gender-affirming surgery is associated with improved mental health outcomes

fenwayhealth.org

https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamanetworkopen/fullarticle/2789423

The samples are small because it's a very small proportion of the population that actually wants to transition but all of them are saying the same thing.
Better mental health outcomes for kids who are transgender.

You didn’t read the link I posted did you ?

 

[eastcoastjoe]

Probably not physically but the mental health outcomes probably outweighs the physical problems.
If your worried about blockers which are just chemicals maybe you should have a look at what we eat, wash with, spray on ourselves package food with or the air we breath. All packed full of chemicals that are very bad for us and the environment.

With all due respect, the residual amount of endocrine disrupting Chemicals in our food supply isn’t even comparable to shutting down the pituitary gland from making LH.

Again, read the link I posted. That was from the largest gender clinic in the world.

 

[Porky82]

I just posted an article above. Also, let’s talk about the basics of hormones. I asked you a question and you ignored it. Are hormone blockers safe for kids ?

Anyway do you think a kid just wakes up and says i want to be another gender and they head of to the doctor and leave with hormone blockers.
No they need multiple psychological evaluations from multiple health professionals.
It takes years to even start treatment most of the time.
You really don't know much about the subject do you!

 

[eastcoastjoe]

New Study Shows Transgender People Who Receive Gender-Affirming Surgery are Significantly Less Likely to Experience Psychological Distress or Suicidal Ideation - Fenway Health

BOSTON, April 28, 2021—A new study published today in JAMA Surgery found that gender-affirming surgery is associated with improved mental health outcomes

fenwayhealth.org

https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamanetworkopen/fullarticle/2789423

The samples are small because it's a very small proportion of the population that actually wants to transition but all of them are saying the same thing.
Better mental health outcomes for kids who are transgender.

If what you’re saying is true about such a minority of people wanting to transition, why is this ideology being taught in schools when it’s based off of a lie ? What is the agenda here ?

 

[eastcoastjoe]

Anyway do you think a kid just wakes up and says i want to be another gender and they head of to the doctor and leave with hormone blockers.
No they need multiple psychological evaluations from multiple health professionals.
It takes years to even start treatment most of the time.
You really don't know much about the subject do you!

It doesn’t take years. It’s not immediate but not years. that is besides the point. The point is, we are allowing irreversible damage to be done to kids who can’t fully understand the consequences to the decision.
You tell me I don’t know about the subject but you haven’t said a word about anything im saying specifically about blocking hormones. You don’t understand it fully do you ? I think if you did, you would change your position some

 

[eastcoastjoe]

“no way of knowing whether, rather than buying time to make a decision, puberty blockers may disrupt that decision-making process” and disrupt brain development “which could have significant impact on the ability to make complex risk-laden decisions, as well as possible longer-term neuropsychological consequences.”

https://segm.org/UK_shuts-down-worlds-biggest-gender-clinic-for-kids

 

[eastcoastjoe]

“First, there is insufficient evidence to justify the general clinical use of puberty suppression or cross-sex hormone use in youth experiencing gender dysphoria. Second, a treatment regimen that focuses exclusively on gender dysphoria, ignoring co-occurring mental health conditions, will not provide optimal care for young people.”

World's Largest Pediatric Gender Clinic Shut Down Due To Poor Evidence, Risk of Harm and Operational Failures

The UK’s National Health Service will close the world’s largest pediatric gender clinic, the Gender Identity Development Service in London (GIDS) often known as the Tavistock, after the NHS Trust which houses it. An independent review condemned the clinic as “not a safe or viable long-term...

segm.org

 

[GenghisKush]

You are entitled to your opinion. With the way people attack each other in this section, I won’t speak about why it matters to me so much in detail.

The scenarios I am describing are going to happen with many kids receiving hormone blockers. Why would we be giving children hormone blockers that completely suppress LH, which causes interruptions in the entire hormonal pathway?

When a kid enters puberty, the body is just beginning to mature. Why would we want to suppress estrogen when bones are developing ? Why would we give kids TRT on top of that when we know it can enlarge organs. Cause heart problems? Not to mention the compounding of mental health issues by disrupting these hormones? It’s baffling that you guys don’t read about this stuff but post all these links like you’re scientific experts

wait, you don't know answers to any of those questions?

it's a basic question: how many people are we talking about? what is the scope of the problem, as you see it?

this isn't a question requiring expertise so much as bare minimum scientific literacy.

are you telling me you never worked through the piano tuner problem, joe?

 

[eastcoastjoe]

I think you're full of shit.
I think you care about playing an agitating role in this moral panic.
I don't think you're sincere.
What urgency drives you? What is the scope of the problem, as you see it?
How many examples of the scenarios you imagine actually exist?

wait, you don't know answers to any of those questions?

it's a basic question: how many people are we talking about? what is the scope of the problem, as you see it?

this isn't a question requiring expertise so much as bare minimum scientific literacy.

are you telling me you never worked through the piano tuner problem, joe?

To me it looks like you’re insulting me because you disagree with me. After that I didn’t feel the need to answer your questions but I’ll play ball.

The urgency that drives me is this is a bad thing for the youth of this world. It’s illogical and harmful. It’s really that simple. I don’t want to live in a world where we are affirming lies for our children. That is shameful.

The scope of the problem is we are allowing minors to make life altering, irreversible changes to their body without considering their long term health. if that isn’t negligent and abusive, I don’t know what is.

I see many examples of this. It’s everywhere I look. Sadly, this will become more apparent as time goes on. You ever watch an interview of any of these kids who grew up and regret the decision? It’s heartbreaking. Imagine if that was your son ?

 

[eastcoastjoe]

wait, you don't know answers to any of those questions?

Now I have a question. Do you think hormone blockers are safe for children? If so, please explain why ?

 

[Porky82]

It doesn’t take years. It’s not immediate but not years. that is besides the point. The point is, we are allowing irreversible damage to be done to kids who can’t fully understand the consequences to the decision.
You tell me I don’t know about the subject but you haven’t said a word about anything im saying specifically about blocking hormones. You don’t understand it fully do you ? I think if you did, you would change your position some

It's not easy at all. As this says they are not permanent and they need to continue treatment as adults.

Puberty Blockers

Puberty Blockers This page is not meant to be a substitute for professional medical advice. If you are interested in going on puberty blockers yourself or helping a young person with hormone therapy, please consult with a licensed medical expert. Dr. Mosser of the Gender Confirmation Center is...

www.genderconfirmation.com

 

[Porky82]

“First, there is insufficient evidence to justify the general clinical use of puberty suppression or cross-sex hormone use in youth experiencing gender dysphoria. Second, a treatment regimen that focuses exclusively on gender dysphoria, ignoring co-occurring mental health conditions, will not provide optimal care for young people.”

World's Largest Pediatric Gender Clinic Shut Down Due To Poor Evidence, Risk of Harm and Operational Failures

The UK’s National Health Service will close the world’s largest pediatric gender clinic, the Gender Identity Development Service in London (GIDS) often known as the Tavistock, after the NHS Trust which houses it. An independent review condemned the clinic as “not a safe or viable long-term...

segm.org

Did you actually read this?
Because they are actually moving it a hospital setting and making it safer.
Probably a good thing.

 

[Porky82]

It doesn’t take years. It’s not immediate but not years. that is besides the point. The point is, we are allowing irreversible damage to be done to kids who can’t fully understand the consequences to the decision.
You tell me I don’t know about the subject but you haven’t said a word about anything im saying specifically about blocking hormones. You don’t understand it fully do you ? I think if you did, you would change your position some

Can you provide a % of people who have had hormone blockers that regret the decision??
Not your "I know of people that regret it" typical answers.
I'll bet it's very low compared to the people that are happy with their decision to take them.

 

[eastcoastjoe]

It's not easy at all. As this says they are not permanent and they need to continue treatment as adults.

Puberty Blockers

Puberty Blockers This page is not meant to be a substitute for professional medical advice. If you are interested in going on puberty blockers yourself or helping a young person with hormone therapy, please consult with a licensed medical expert. Dr. Mosser of the Gender Confirmation Center is...

www.genderconfirmation.com

That is false. Let’s use bodybuilders as an example. You heard about the use testosterone shrinking your balls right ?

That’s because using testosterone for an extended length of time shuts down the hormonal pathways because your body recognizes it as a bio identical hormone and thinks your body has enough.

Guess what happens ? Over time, your pituitary gland stops making LH and FSH which is what stimulates your testicles to make leydig cells. Eventually your testicles atrophy because they aren’t working and if that is done for long enough, you may never recover endogenous production.

These sex hormones are responsible for so many more critical body functions than we may realize. So again, why is this necessary for children to treat a condition that is supposed to be a social construct, that is based off of a lie ?

 

[eastcoastjoe]

Did you actually read this?
Because they are actually moving it a hospital setting and making it safer.
Probably a good thing.

Oh yeah I read it. I’m guessing you didnt
see the part about changing the approach of treatment due to insufficient evidence and lack of safety ?

 

[eastcoastjoe]

Can you provide a % of people who have had hormone blockers that regret the decision??
Not your "I know of people that regret it" typical answers.
I'll bet it's very low compared to the people that are happy with their decision to take them.

No I can’t. Just like you can’t provide a % for the opposite. What science can provide though is clear proof of the damage these drugs can do to anyone who uses them, and those side effects are well documented and understood by the medical community.

We are still getting pretty far away from the simple fact that no matter what a person does to their body, boys are boys and girls are girls. This is all stemming from an illogical fallacy that some of us refuse to accept as fact.

 

[Porky82]

That is false.

Its not faulse it fact.

So again, why is this necessary for children to treat a condition that is supposed to be a social construct, that is based off of a lie ?

And here it is you don't believe transgender is a mental condition you think these kids are just doing it because they have seen it on TV, the internet or heard it from others.
Yeah they just doing it because it's the latest fad!
I told you know nothing about this subject.

 

[Porky82]

No I can’t. Just like you can’t provide a % for the opposite. What science can provide though is clear proof of the damage these drugs can do to anyone who uses them, and those side effects are well documented and understood by the medical community.

We are still getting pretty far away from the simple fact that no matter what a person does to their body, boys are boys and girls are girls. This is all stemming from an illogical fallacy that some of us refuse to accept as fact.

Yes I can and I did. Small samples but compared to the nothing you can produce it's far more valid!