Canna Boost V Molasses - side by side comparison.

[hilbie]

i flushed a recent plant with blackstrap molasses and the erb taste like total f king shit. i wont be useing it again. overated in my opinon, but i bought it a long time ago for health for myself so im not out any money.

 

[*mistress*]

flush plants w/ water only, 5-14 days before harvest... may have different results...

enjoy your garden!

 

[mriko]

i flushed a recent plant with blackstrap molasses and the erb taste like total f king shit.

Indeed ! Molasse is to be used during the flowering stage but, as mistress said, use only water for flushing !

Irie !

 

[Owl Mirror]

i bought it a long time ago

I wonder if the product became spoiled due to TIME ?
Sugars break down with time, even in a sealed bottle.
How old was this black strap ?
Again, flushing with it does no good, except when it is the very last drops applied at the end of the flush cycle.

 

[Hazy Lady]

i flushed a recent plant with blackstrap molasses and the erb taste like total f king shit. i wont be useing it again. overated in my opinon, but i bought it a long time ago for health for myself so im not out any money.

I am afraid the group are correct hilbie, I think those who use it at the 'flushing' stage stop all nutes, feed molasses for a week and then a week or more just water, that way she gets a boost of sugar she can use up during the just water stage, sorry you hated it but never make a decision on one trial alone.
Yours may well have been spoiled as Owl says above, thanks for popping in

@ Owl, Hiya buddy, funny I think at the start of flush, you think maybe the very end. I have been reading how long plants live for after cutting and the processes that continue, I can see perhaps one feed just before harvest could have an effect, it would need an amount small enough to be used up fully or prolonging the drying so the plant carries on working longer and uses it up before actual death. More food for thought

 

[indifferent]

@ Indif', Thank-you for these posts, I really appreciate you taking the time, your total NPK looks ideal, assuming it all blends you really shouldn't need any Booster like you said.
I was looking at comfrey a week or two ago, as you say it has a lots of N, still could be good as early bloom food though, a kick start if you like?
Please don't say Kays has gone bust! up in the Lake district? I have been waiting about 6 weeks for an order, I thought it was the post dispute and check cashing slowing it up. Thats a shame, she did good stuff, good prices. I better check my account!
I do use Maxi crop seaweed but I had ordered some of Kays, oh bum!, Still Maxi isn't too expensive, just you get about a gallon extra from Kays, DID i should say. many thanks indiferent

Sadly yes, Kays have gone bust, and only earlier this year they had taken on new staff as they couldn't keep up with the volume of orders, really sad and I have no idea what happened. I hope you get sorted mate. I shall post some links to other places with good products at good prices.

Maxicrop is good stuff but I always feel it is a little too expensive. The Vitax brand is good and Wilkos sell it in the spring and summer seasons, pretty cheap.

Comfrey is awesome, just stop using it when you get to the point in flower where you want to cut out N. I guarantee your plants will like Comfrey, apart from the high levels of potash it has loads of other good stuff in it, do a google for comfrey and you will find a huge volume of info about it's use.

Some places to get good stuff cheap:

This is a similar horticultural suppliers to Kays, they have very good prices, cheapest wormcasts I've ever seen, only 3.90 for 40 litres!

http://horticulture.taylorschoice.co.uk/products/103035_wormcasts_soil_conditioner_40ltr.php

70 litres of soil conditioner, perfect for re-using soils, 4.89 is an incredible price, I would mix old soil with this and wormcasts:

http://horticulture.taylorschoice.co.uk/products/104001_just_naturally_soil_conditioner_70ltr.php

Instead of Biobizz or BioCanna or Plagron organic nutes which are all overpriced, try this Westand Nutri, for 2.48 a litre, it's a quarter the price and works just as good, it's 2-1-4 so ideal for veg:

http://horticulture.taylorschoice.co.uk/products/129083s_nutri_feed_plant_-_westland_1ltr.php

The Tomato version of Westland Nutri is a great choice for early to mid flower:

http://horticulture.taylorschoice.co.uk/products/129129s_nutri_feed_tomato_-_westland_1ltr.php

These Earthworks organics are good products and much cheaper than the canna-targeted brands, this liquid Fulvic/humic is extracted from Leonardite, same as GHE Diamond Nectar or AN Grandma Enggy's and is less than half the price at 3.91 for half a litre:

http://www.garden-supply.co.uk/product_info.php?cPath=8_18&products_id=47

They also sell a granulated version of the fulvic/humic, which is the only non-liquid fulvic/humic product I have seen in the UK, I am gonna use this as part of my soilmixes along with wormcasts, fulvic derived from leonardite is great stuff, 3.91 for 450g is again, dirt cheap:

http://www.garden-supply.co.uk/product_info.php?cPath=8_12&products_id=48

The Earthworks organic plant food looks like good stuff for veg too, it's 12-12-6 so good strong stuff and has loads of goodies added, 3.91 for half a litre is dirt cheap as it has a very low application rate due to it's high NPK:

http://www.garden-supply.co.uk/product_info.php?cPath=8_12&products_id=46

This healthfood place has some interesting products of use to us organic growers, 125g of Alfalfa powder for 2.99, this would be great for making a foliar spray, contains triacontanol and a load of aminos, vitamins and other goodies:

http://www.naturallygreen.co.uk/alfalfa-powder-125g-p-166.html

They also sell kelp powder, 125g for 1.99, will make a good liquid seaweed methinks, especially for use in flower as it has a fair bit of potash, also has decent amounts of cal and mag, so ideal for coco based mediums. I think it could also make a good soil amendment, although seaweed meal is probably better for adding to soil. For 1.99, it's certainly worth experimenting with.

http://www.naturallygreen.co.uk/kelp-powder-125g-p-79.html

Hope those products are interesting to folks, I firmly believe we should all try to avoid using canna-targeted brands as much as possible as they just rip us off, and the same things are available for much less if you only take the time to look.

 

[indifferent]

As well as Molasses, unrefined sugar cane juice is great stuff, it has riboflavin and that increases plant's health and resistance to various problems. Asda sell solidified unrefined sugar cane juice in the form of Jaggery Goor, it's really cheap and a single packet will last ages, 61p for 500g, there is no cheaper source of this stuff, check out bonecarver_og's Panela thread for a load of great info about the benefits of unrefined sugar cane juice:

http://groceries.asda.com/asda-esto...e=Products&headerVersion=v1&_requestid=169881

For cheap molasses, check out your local animal feed supplier, it's sold as horse feed, I have one locally to me and I get my molasses in 5 litre jugs, this place sells it online - 6.99 for 5 litres, and that is enough to last years!

http://www.farmway.co.uk/equine-2/e...27/natural-animal-molasses-supplement-197.htm

Neem is awesome stuff, not only does the oil make a superb pest spray, but neem pwder is a great fertiliser, it's something like 3-1-3 and really does discourage bugs in the soil, it's dirt cheap too, if you have an Indian/Pakistani store near you, they will sell it, it's used for all sorts of stuff, you can buy a 100g box intended for hair treatment for a quid:

http://www.spicesofindia.co.uk/acatalog/Hesh-Neem-Leaves-Powder.html

My next grow is going to be using Neem powder, Kelp powder, Jaggery Goor, Molasses, Alfalfa powder, in addition to the stuff I'm already using, the Alfalfa Kelp and Neem I will also use as a foliar spray. I'll be using homemade Comfrey too.

Sorry if I went a bit off-topic here but I spend a lot of time looking for cheap but effective stuff to use in my grows and I figured there were a few people who will also be interested in this info.

I'll post the info I gathered about other common wild plants that make superb ferts if folks are interested, as an example, Dock leaves are full of P and K and Dandelions, Yarrow and Bracken are also very useful. You can make a really effective flowering nute from Comfrey, Dock and Dandelions, add some Molasses and Kelp and you really don't need anything else to produce great buds.

 

[Hazy Lady]

Hey indifferent, That is very sad news indeed about Kays, happened very quickly!.
Thank-you for all these links, good to get some idea what we have in UK stores.
Don't ever worry about going off topic ( not that you did anyway) if its grow related its good, if you think it may be useful feel free to post anything you like
I didn't know Neem had so many uses, very useful posts. Again, many thanks.

 

[Hazy Lady]

Thank-you Canna, you shouldn't have....oh wait, you didn't!.

Thank-you Canna, you shouldn't have....oh wait, you didn't!.

I wrote to Canna, for a change, I wanted stockists for single nutrients in the city, half way through, I mentioned the side by side, asked didn't they want to send a sample or two of Canna nutes to be used on my next test?, I said with 12,000+ views in 6 weeks Canna may well end up selling the odd extra bottle, I think they prefer I do these at my own expense, but want a look anyway?, bloody cheek, I am going to use Cannas email today, to ask other more forward thinking nutrient companies to donate to my next tests. I will let you know what they say.

CANNA support:
Monday, 26 October, 2009 11:05:01
From:
"[email protected]" <[email protected]>
Add
To: XXXXXXXXXXX
Dear XXXXXXX

Thank you very much for your message! Nice to hear you are testing CANNA products. Tried to have a look but was not able to find the website. Can you please send a link where I can see the test?

We do not have any samples of our products. Please have a look at our website for authorised dealers. You can fill in your postcode and find the nearest dealer(s) and call them if they sell the Ca and Mag.

Al the best with the test! Looking forword to see the tests!

Keep on growing! < advice

CANNA support

I will however, follow that advice,

 

[indifferent]

Cheers man, glad the info is of interest.

In the past Canna have been quite good at handing out samples, or so people have told me at least.

If you need Cal and Mag, and don't feel like splashing out on the expensive Canna bottles of them, you can go for Epsom Salts for the Mag and wither Calcium or Calcified Seaweed for the Cal. A 900 or 1000g box is less than a fiver and you can buy em just about anywhere that sells garden stuff.

Here are the boxes of Cal and Mag I use, a box will last you several years as you only need a very small bit of the powder.

 

[Hazy Lady]

Praise where praise is due

Praise where praise is due

Speaking of other nutrient companies, I am very pleased with the Alg-A-Mic from BioBizz, I picked it up when I looked for a Ca supplement a while back.
I am sure many know it but for those who don't.
It is made of liquid seaweed and algae extracts, it has more of a seaside smell than Maxi-crop seaweed.
It is not actually a Ca supplement, it has an NPK of 0.1-0.1-0.1 with Ca 0.2 and Mag 0.1, they say it is a 'tonic' a 'vitality booster' when needed, and that you can also use throughout the whole grow, added to your usual nutrients. root or leaf feeding, all good.

I have been feeding my SSH plants that got hurt, after 2 weeks of the Alg-A-Mic (AAM) they're growing nicely and they are starting to pre-flower now , I am surprised I assumed they would be late since they were so delayed, not so, they are just over 6 weeks old and showing both sexes so seems normal.
I could not pull them out to photo but you can see how they have recovered in this pic below.

 

[Hazy Lady]

Cheers man, glad the info is of interest.

In the past Canna have been quite good at handing out samples, or so people have told me at least.

If you need Cal and Mag, and don't feel like splashing out on the expensive Canna bottles of them, you can go for Epsom Salts for the Mag and wither Calcium or Calcified Seaweed for the Cal. A 900 or 1000g box is less than a fiver and you can buy em just about anywhere that sells garden stuff.

Here are the boxes of Cal and Mag I use, a box will last you several years as you only need a very small bit of the powder.

Cheers Man!, I was going to register as a man, I didn't think women growers are taken seriously : ( not that I think anyone takes me too seriously ) but this place was a revelation, I understand why most lady growers on line are on ICMag

The links are most welcome, your box of Chempaq, that is what I tried to buy in my local garden centre, I have seen boxes of Chempaq Calcium, it may have N in but nothing more, they denied it existed?, asked far too many questions, and wanted to know exactly what I needed it for, do you know, I got to thinking, is it one of the fertilisers that terrorists use to make bombs, actually DONT answer! but that is what I was thinking. It really was odd, I bit angry when I know someone is not being straight, this one was bent double! Thanks again indi'

 

[bonecarver_OG]

As well as Molasses, unrefined sugar cane juice is great stuff, it has riboflavin and that increases plant's health and resistance to various problems. Asda sell solidified unrefined sugar cane juice in the form of Jaggery Goor, it's really cheap and a single packet will last ages, 61p for 500g, there is no cheaper source of this stuff, check out bonecarver_og's Panela thread for a load of great info about the benefits of unrefined sugar cane juice:

http://groceries.asda.com/asda-esto...e=Products&headerVersion=v1&_requestid=169881

For cheap molasses, check out your local animal feed supplier, it's sold as horse feed, I have one locally to me and I get my molasses in 5 litre jugs, this place sells it online - 6.99 for 5 litres, and that is enough to last years!

http://www.farmway.co.uk/equine-2/e...27/natural-animal-molasses-supplement-197.htm

Neem is awesome stuff, not only does the oil make a superb pest spray, but neem pwder is a great fertiliser, it's something like 3-1-3 and really does discourage bugs in the soil, it's dirt cheap too, if you have an Indian/Pakistani store near you, they will sell it, it's used for all sorts of stuff, you can buy a 100g box intended for hair treatment for a quid:

http://www.spicesofindia.co.uk/acatalog/Hesh-Neem-Leaves-Powder.html

My next grow is going to be using Neem powder, Kelp powder, Jaggery Goor, Molasses, Alfalfa powder, in addition to the stuff I'm already using, the Alfalfa Kelp and Neem I will also use as a foliar spray. I'll be using homemade Comfrey too.

Sorry if I went a bit off-topic here but I spend a lot of time looking for cheap but effective stuff to use in my grows and I figured there were a few people who will also be interested in this info.

I'll post the info I gathered about other common wild plants that make superb ferts if folks are interested, as an example, Dock leaves are full of P and K and Dandelions, Yarrow and Bracken are also very useful. You can make a really effective flowering nute from Comfrey, Dock and Dandelions, add some Molasses and Kelp and you really don't need anything else to produce great buds.

Jaggery Goor is indian version of PANELA.

the reason i use panela is because a friend of mine who is a nute manifacturer uses it in his flowering boosters.

peace

 

[bonecarver_OG]

Cheers Man!, I was going to register as a man, I didn't think women growers are taken seriously : ( not that I think anyone takes me too seriously ) but this place was a revelation, I understand why most lady growers on line are on ICMag

of course we do the results speak for them self. what we all look at is the nugs we dont care much about who wear skirts or pants.

one of the MOST popular persons on this site was , mrs MEDJOOL - a great female grower/mother. we all remember her with a lot of love and we miss her

 

[indifferent]

Sorry for the slip of the tongue hazy lady, I, for one am not sexist at all, I don't personally know any lady growers, but I have had many delightful and informative discourses with lady growers on various forums.

Thanks for the tip about Alg-a-mic, never used it myself as I figured it was just Biobizz's version of a seaweed extract and I have been using Kay's seaweed extract for years with great results.

My local garden centres are never nosy at all, and I grow loads of other house plants - bonsai, cactus, succulents, so I can always BS if they ask any questions, not that they ever have.

I wouldn't be surprised if Kay's suspected I was a weed grower as I used to order things like 20 coco bricks along with loads of liquid nutes, drip line, pots, etc. lol

Hi bonecarver, I realise jaggery is the same as panela, I first saw the jaggery when looking for molasses and other sugary stuffs in Asda one day, I got a tip from a Dr of Horticulture to use Agave Nectar rather than molasses but still haven't tried the Agave as it's 4-5x the price of molasses and molasses works so well.

So now I use jaggery and molasses side-by-side, seems to work well. bonecarver, got any more tips for things we should be looking for to buy cheap that are used in flowering booster products? I'm sure many of them are molasses, kelp, triacontanol and aminos, and I add all of those already, but I'm always keen to try new things!

 

[Hazy Lady]

of course we do the results speak for them self. what we all look at is the nugs we dont care much about who wear skirts or pants.

one of the MOST popular persons on this site was , mrs MEDJOOL - a great female grower/mother. we all remember her with a lot of love and we miss her

Hi bones' Yes, I have read lots of Mrs Medjools posts, I am not surprised she was so loved. A sad loss to her family and MJ community.

Sorry for the slip of the tongue hazy lady, I, for one am not sexist at all, I don't personally know any lady growers, but I have had many delightful and informative discourses with lady growers on various forums.

Thanks for the tip about Alg-a-mic, never used it myself as I figured it was just Biobizz's version of a seaweed extract and I have been using Kay's seaweed extract for years with great results.

I'm sure your not sexist indi', never thought it for a second.

AAM (Alg-A-Mic) is quite different, I imagine with the many benefits of liquid seaweed, having the extra Ca and Mag is a handy addition, I am keen to see how it works as a foliar feed for a Ca or Mag deficit, I would imagine it is softer on the plant than say a potentially harsh Dolomite Lime or Epsom Salt?

Having a small amount of N,P & K means you need not add any to the spray, I prefer single products in mine as it could be sat around in the bottle a while, mixed products seem to have only a limited use life, and clog your spray!.

Yesterday a member was asking could you have a real organic hydro set-up, AAM could be very useful in this respect too?

I wonder if the product became spoiled due to TIME ?
Sugars break down with time, even in a sealed bottle.
How old was this black strap ?
Again, flushing with it does no good, except when it is the very last drops applied at the end of the flush cycle.

Going back to this, from what i can find the average shelf life, stored in a pantry, cupboard etc, not refrigerated, is around 2 years

Thanks fellas

 

[Strangely]

Nice snap there Hazy, the one where you couldn't remove them.

Still time for a shock that could change your opinion!

Always, I'm still slowly getting all my stuff together from cab to nute choice etc and never rule things out. I think what I'd like is a good 2 part nute, not too bothered about cost but need to be able to get it in the UK, any ideas people? A natural (and erm cheap) 'booster' like Panela if I can find it in UK, or Molasses. And a spray I make myself and modify over the years as I learn. For the spray I'm thinking mainly Trialalalalatinol at the mo. Too many bottles will scare the Mrs into thinking I'm making crack or something.

For a little extra guidance on the 2 part suggestions if it helps, I'm planning on a Mistress inspired wick method with a few BoneCarver modifications in terms of ditching the small reservoir in the top tub for more root space etc as I'm limiting myself space wise more than Mistress. Again to appease the Mrs! What was my point... oh yeah so the 2 part will be reused in terms of it's run-off. So I'll run it alot lighter but it'll need to like / be ok with being used like this. Not even sure if that matters really! Thanks in advance all!

Last thing, Some + rep heading Hazy's way. Doing a top job Man!

 

[Hazy Lady]

Where are day 56 pics ?

Where are day 56 pics ?

Nice snap there Hazy, the one where you couldn't remove them.


Always, I'm still slowly getting all my stuff together from cab to nute choice etc and never rule things out. I think what I'd like is a good 2 part nute, not too bothered about cost but need to be able to get it in the UK, any ideas people? A natural (and erm cheap) 'booster' like Panela if I can find it in UK, or Molasses. And a spray I make myself and modify over the years as I learn. For the spray I'm thinking mainly Trialalalalatinol at the mo. Too many bottles will scare the Mrs into thinking I'm making crack or something.

For a little extra guidance on the 2 part suggestions if it helps, I'm planning on a Mistress inspired wick method with a few BoneCarver modifications in terms of ditching the small reservoir in the top tub for more root space etc as I'm limiting myself space wise more than Mistress. Again to appease the Mrs! What was my point... oh yeah so the 2 part will be reused in terms of it's run-off. So I'll run it alot lighter but it'll need to like / be ok with being used like this. Not even sure if that matters really! Thanks in advance all!

Last thing, Some + rep heading Hazy's way. Doing a top job Man!

Thank-you Sister You're very kind.

Well I did say it Strangely, turns out since Canna wont supply me with free nutes, purely coincidental of course!, but since then I discovered I had all my work jumbled up and got the order wrong, tut tut! It seems Molasses is king and Boost is not worth a salt! heehee, how tempted was I too pull something along those lines!

In all seriousness though, there really has been an improvement that changes things somewhat, although Boost is still in part responsible for this latest one.

I am having camera trouble I am working on it and one way or the other will have this weeks pics up shortly.

I will explain what has happened for now - and show you the pics later on. At the end of last week the B's (Boost) were the most advanced, had a richer more complex smell, the calyx themselves were more advanced etc. The D's (Boost & Molasses) were very close behind showing similar progress, the A's & C's (None & Molasses respectively) were without doubt behind in terms of development, I was not sure by how much, time wise.
As things progressed this week I was able to say there is a 3 or 4 day difference in actual growth*.
The growth was not the only way I was able to compare them, as I
discovered on checking the trichome's with my magnifier.
I could plainly see that the B's & D's had started to cloud up whilst the A's & C's now at a similar stage for me to judge have not got close to getting cloudy. I can say with a little confidence now that the Boost plants are 3 or 4 days in front growth wise, and can add at least the same in terms of the maturity of the trichomes, by today the trichomes on the A's & C's have now started to go cloudy albeit at the slower rate.
So I am saying if things continued on the same track, that using Boost you may be able to take around a week off a 10 week plant.

BUT! It is not quite as cut and dried as that. The way the plants have been positioned the last 3 days has allowed me to keep an eye on the trichome's on the A's & C's while I was watching for advances so I could draw my conclusions, I could just see the B plants for comparisons (with a magnifier) but the D's have been just out of my reach.
I have not been inspecting them for the D's over this period, when I did get to see them, while doing this weeks pics earlier, I was astounded. If I was not certain it isn't so, I would swear someone is messing around!.
The mum of this plant whilst being pretty frosty doesn't really have a lot of trichs on the leaves around the bud like you see on a lot of nice plants.
Like this below. note this is NOT one of mine, just for an example

The cuttings had been starting to look just like mum this week and so the last thing I would expect to see is a bunch of leaves caked in trichs, but that's what I see.
On 2 plant's, the D's, I see the biggest and I might add fastest changes, like the pic above all the buds on these 2 plants are caked!, I did a double take and was thinking they must be very milky now, not just cloudy, and the milkyness is making them shine white.
It is nothing of the sort, this is an incredible covering of trichomes on all bud leaves and the small leaves that surround the buds. The smell is incredible, there is so much frost you need not get your nose even close to be overpowered.
I always used both Boost and Molasses for previous grows as I explained at the start of the thread but I was strting to think I would be able to cut something out, if it was to finish as things stood this week I would think I would be fine without Molasses, now of course today it is starting to look like a mixture of both has the greatest effect.
You can judge for yourself later, I am now recharging my batteries so need an hour or so.
I am sure you will agree with me though.

* You can read in more detail a few post back.

 

[buddin_904]

ohhh please do post!

 

[Hazy Lady]

Wont be too long.

Wont be too long.

ohhh please do post!

Hi buddin Of course I will dear, I am waiting for my daughter to get home to help me, she is far better at this, I keep trying to upload and it says no connection to my camera, I put the flash card into my PC and it doesn't recognise it?.
If I can't manage I will re-take them with another camera that seems fine?, I really hope I don't need to though!.

While you are waiting you can listen to something I came across last week, the song 'You don't know me!' that Ray Charles had success with, lovely song, I found a guy on youtube doing a cover, it makes me smile every time I listen, not laughing at the guy I promise though it IS comical, I really like how happy he is singing this song, you can make your minds up yourselves but I think he is marvelous. check out Little Dragons version HERE
One way or the other the pics will be up before my lights go out later on, thanks for waiting.

EDIT! Guys, I have sorted my problem, my flashcard is dead!, it means I lost my pic's, I re-did some with another camera but I am very unhappy with the result,( not being precious, they are BAD) far better I just get a new flash card and do them again at lights on, I am sorry, I am also shattered so I am off to my box of feathers for a snooze, I will post them asap I do them later today, again sorry to anyone waiting, things happen.