Can the genetics be saved from plant with fusarium/pythium/stem canker?

[Loc Dog]

4 clone orders in a row, all with stem canker. 12 clones total and everyone had it. First 2 on verge of death, other 2 just showing day of delivery.

Is there any chance of topping a plant that is showing stem canker or mold at base of stem, and getting a clean clone??

Most articles just say burn it and clean everything. Have also seen that they reside in the root system, and that the damage on top will look like root rot since the top is being starved to death.

I know HLVD the only chance is tissue culture using tiny piece of top, and that it is throughout plant.

Are there any products or procedures that can be done to the cutting before inserting into rockwool? I tried 1 part hydrogen peroxide to 5 parts water and soaked overnight.

Also wonder if UVC could help exposed for 10 - 15 minutes. Warning - UVC will burn your eyes from even slight exposure. It kills pretty much everything.

 

[William76]

Yea,u can cut above the canker and root the top,but only if uv no other choice,76

 

[Cloneman]

I think its time to start growing from seed mate

 

[William76]

Forsure!,I used to run a lot of clone onlys but nowadays there's so many diseases I try to stick to seeds now.76

 

[Loc Dog]

Unfortunately seeds can get HLVD. Fusarium, and Pythium. An HLVD male or female making seeds, 30% chance of seeds passing it. Hate wasting time on seeds. Like wasting 5 months to find out losing lottery ticket. Even if winning genetics, over or under feeding and can turn out like crap. I had a few lousy runs of GG4 from being lazy and not checking runoff.

 

[Ca++]

I start seeds 5 days before I take my cuts, and they are equals about 5 weeks later.
I can start them as late as 3 days before, or as early as a week before. However 5 days is just right. Enabling seedlings to join the cuttings through veg and flower, as equals.


If a breeders stock is 30% bad, as suggested. Then a breeding pair has a 40% chance of involving bad stock. Then if we have a 30% transfer rate to the seeds, we are somewhere around the 10-15% chance of bad seed.

Cuttings are done batch at scale, and I image many of the mums which are fine, provide bad cutting by the end of their journey. 30% of the plants are bad, and that number is not being reduced through the use of sharing kit. That 30% is going up. If they are not cleaning properly, then it's going up a lot.

It's just an odds game. In the worst west coast setting, 85% of the seeds will be alright.



Can anyone else address the issue of how far cuts are ahead of seeds, in their systems. My cuts are generally in seed tray (40 cell) for 3 weeks, before the cell can't hold a days water. I'm in no rush, but its a fair gauge of their advancement speed. Ideally 10 days follow in 15 cell, then a week in 1L pots has them neck and neck.

 

[Creeperpark]

In my opinion, there are too many good seeds around to grow without using anything that may be defective. Why use anything but the best for gardens? Most good reliable seedbanks have a 99% success rate. On the other hand, seedbanks with less than a 99% success rate are last on my list to buy from.

 

[Loc Dog]

I start seeds 5 days before I take my cuts, and they are equals about 5 weeks later.
I can start them as late as 3 days before, or as early as a week before. However 5 days is just right. Enabling seedlings to join the cuttings through veg and flower, as equals.


If a breeders stock is 30% bad, as suggested. Then a breeding pair has a 40% chance of involving bad stock. Then if we have a 30% transfer rate to the seeds, we are somewhere around the 10-15% chance of bad seed.

Cuttings are done batch at scale, and I image many of the mums which are fine, provide bad cutting by the end of their journey. 30% of the plants are bad, and that number is not being reduced through the use of sharing kit. That 30% is going up. If they are not cleaning properly, then it's going up a lot.

It's just an odds game. In the worst west coast setting, 85% of the seeds will be alright.



Can anyone else address the issue of how far cuts are ahead of seeds, in their systems. My cuts are generally in seed tray (40 cell) for 3 weeks, before the cell can't hold a days water. I'm in no rush, but its a fair gauge of their advancement speed. Ideally 10 days follow in 15 cell, then a week in 1L pots has them neck and neck.

Regarding mold and bacteria I was thinking last night, If their mothers were kept below 70F and 55% humidity, they may produce clones without dying. If kept at 80F and 65% or higher humidity mothers would die. One of the recent infected clone sellers said they soak trays of clones. All they need is one infected clone, or mold/bacteria introduced into the system otherwise, they are all exposed and any cracked roots are entry for infection. Aeroponic cloners would be same problem.

I am going to try some seeds in fridge for 6 years, but to me like spending 5 months on losing lottery ticket. I should go back to mycology for the pleasure of growing and getting results. Have had no pleasure of growing, just dread of spider mites then mold for over a year..

 

[Loc Dog]

Interesting article about various diseases.

Emerging diseases of Cannabis sativa and sustainable management

Cultivation of cannabis plants (Cannabis sativa L., marijuana) has taken place worldwide for centuries. In Canada, legalization of cannabis in October 2018 for the medicinal and recreational markets has spurned interest in large‐scale growing. ...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

 

[englishrick]

Fungal Infections Following Boston Type 1 Keratoprosthesis Implantation: Literature Review and In Vitro Antifungal Activity of Hypochlorous Acid - PMC

To review the current literature describing cases of fungal keratitis and endophthalmitis following Boston Keratoprosthesis (KPro) implantation, and characterize the antifungal activity of 0.01% hypochlorous acid against medically relevant fungi. A ...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

In our study, hypochlorous acid, 0.01%, effectively eliminated all molds (including Fusarium and Aspergillus) and yeasts (Candida spp.) tested, with fungicidal activity observed in as little as 15 seconds.


I'm not sure where this idea that fusarium is untreatable came from,,I'm finding science papers that say different,,,I'm wondering if the woman from tumi would say I'm wrong,,wtf do I know anyway

It's also possible that the discolouration on the bottom of the stem is from applications of h202,,,I could show you something that seems exactly the same but it's from h2o2 applications

Don't freak out,,,read and grow better, teach the so called teachers

 

[chronosync]

I was reading earlier on here and someone mentioned using Actinovate on cuts to save an infected plant

as far as i know its biological and has a systemic action

best of luck to you - I wouldnt give up on seeds. Have you grown any Ace gear? Tony Greens gear has never let me down. I wont say keepers in every plant but by my standards Id call it as a workable keeper in every pack, Tony green got glue and sour bubble locked in tight with his RIL and Gorilla Bubble lines

 

[eastcoastjoe]

Regarding mold and bacteria I was thinking last night, If their mothers were kept below 70F and 55% humidity, they may produce clones without dying. If kept at 80F and 65% or higher humidity mothers would die. One of the recent infected clone sellers said they soak trays of clones. All they need is one infected clone, or mold/bacteria introduced into the system otherwise, they are all exposed and any cracked roots are entry for infection. Aeroponic cloners would be same problem.

I am going to try some seeds in fridge for 6 years, but to me like spending 5 months on losing lottery ticket. I should go back to mycology for the pleasure of growing and getting results. Have had no pleasure of growing, just dread of spider mites then mold for over a year..

Below 70 degrees is a horrible temperature for growing plants. 80 and 65 will definitely not kill plants either. It’s almost optimal

 

[mean mr.mustard]

Unfortunately seeds can get HLVD. Fusarium, and Pythium. An HLVD male or female making seeds, 30% chance of seeds passing it. Hate wasting time on seeds. Like wasting 5 months to find out losing lottery ticket. Even if winning genetics, over or under feeding and can turn out like crap. I had a few lousy runs of GG4 from being lazy and not checking runoff.

I would suggest that you sterilize/break your grow (even if it is just section to section) down and clean it top to bottom restarting with clean seeds.

I admit most of the reason is that you make sure you are sure it was the clones' vector that caused contamination.... but you also have a chance at moving forward safely and that's a great portion of my concern as well.

I think it's worth the investigation.

PM me if you can't find clean beans.

 

[Loc Dog]

I was reading earlier on here and someone mentioned using Actinovate on cuts to save an infected plant

as far as i know its biological and has a systemic action

best of luck to you - I wouldnt give up on seeds. Have you grown any Ace gear? Tony Greens gear has never let me down. I wont say keepers in every plant but by my standards Id call it as a workable keeper in every pack, Tony green got glue and sour bubble locked in tight with his RIL and Gorilla Bubble lines

Seeds I have are from around 2017 from attitude. In a fascist state so very little room to grow and no outdoors. With price of seeds, and have horrible luck with them, might just have to spend more than I have had in income in years, and get a few from pig tails. Wish they had deals on buying a few, especially since shipping is included and does not cost much more to ship 3 or 4 than 1.

Still kicking myself. Had GG4 real and clean, but after 8 years wanted to try some new strains then lost everything from bens nursery spider mites.

 

[Loc Dog]

I would suggest that you sterilize/break your grow (even if it is just section to section) down and clean it top to bottom restarting with clean seeds.

I admit most of the reason is that you make sure you are sure it was the clones' vector that caused contamination.... but you also have a chance at moving forward safely and that's a great portion of my concern as well.

I think it's worth the investigation.

PM me if you can't find clean beans.

Would hope the attitude name brand seeds from 2017 would be clean. Problem is stealth shipping from UK so re-packaged and not marked well. Lost list of who made what.

 

[mean mr.mustard]

Below 70 degrees is a horrible temperature for growing plants. 80 and 65 will definitely not kill plants either. It’s almost optimal

Horrible? No.... but still not optimal according to the science.

68 is fine and horrible doesn't have a place in the description of a plant's behavior at the temperature.

By the way, 65 is below 70.

I recall 50 to 90 being suggested parameters for growth during outdoor days.

 

[Loc Dog]

Below 70 degrees is a horrible temperature for growing plants. 80 and 65 will definitely not kill plants either. It’s almost optimal

That temperature would stop mold growth. Some large grower said they keep flowering at 68 to retain the most terpenes. Do not know if it is true.

 

[goingrey]

Regarding mold and bacteria I was thinking last night, If their mothers were kept below 70F and 55% humidity, they may produce clones without dying. If kept at 80F and 65% or higher humidity mothers would die. One of the recent infected clone sellers said they soak trays of clones. All they need is one infected clone, or mold/bacteria introduced into the system otherwise, they are all exposed and any cracked roots are entry for infection. Aeroponic cloners would be same problem.

I am going to try some seeds in fridge for 6 years, but to me like spending 5 months on losing lottery ticket. I should go back to mycology for the pleasure of growing and getting results. Have had no pleasure of growing, just dread of spider mites then mold for over a year..

Lotteries have smaller prizes than the grand one as well. Even if you don't get something quite on par with the top kept around cuts, buds from those seeds might still turn out to be pretty good, and for damn sure better than nothing.

 

[Ca++]

I don't take 5 months to do seeds. I can be putting in the 3rd crop by then. Which isn't a calculation, it's a rate I have achieved through consecutive years. In 5 months I have flowered them twice, and judged if any are getting a third run. Two runs is my standard selection period. So while I agree 5 months is needed to make any sort of informed decision, it's also very rare that something gets kicked out at 14 weeks (just one run) and has not happened since some semi-auto's were being sold as photos, meaning the stock was truly defective.

There is a story we hear, of feminised seed being inferiour. I think most of that idea, comes from the fact it's harder to produce, and people don't buy as many.
If you do normal seeds, then odds on, that half your room will be cut out and put in the bin. Leaving half the number of females you would of had, had you of done feminised seed. From a selection point of view, having twice as many girls to choose from, brings benefits I find more tangible, than the debate over pollen from reversed girls being inferiour.
Perhaps there is some testing I have missed, but the info I gather from consumers, says their is no difference.

 

[Cloneman]

I've been growing seeds for over 30 years to get my keepers and create mothers. Fast forward to 3 years ago on my 70th birthday when I'd had enough of looking after them, so started on all fem seeds. I converted to LED for veg and flowering and haven't looked back. I start seeds five weeks before flowering, pinch out at the third node to bush up. I start seeds five weeks before the current flowering plants are ready, so it's crop, cleanup, pot up then put the new run in the tent and off to the races,so a constant seamless process.
Over the last couple of years I've tried bulk seeds as well and I've got to say they are brilliant.
Fresh soil for five week seedlings and then recycled soil for the up pot. Don't use much power either.
Veg - two 3 x 18w LED at 24 hours equals 108w
Flower - 3 x 300w LED at
12/12 2 weeks 50%
2 weeks 75%
3 weeks 100%
11/13 2 week 100%
11/13 1 week 50%
so roughly 650 - 700w total for the complete run, this is the last one mainly MAC with 1 freebee at the front with a few more right at the back. Total cost of seed about £50...
I could still enjoy my hobby even being older.
Just for information purposes only....seeds are pretty good actually.

50 days

65 days