Between Sun and Moon HPS/LED comparison grow.

[hazy]

One other thing. a single plant comparison is biased against HPS,

blah blah

Bet you didn't bother to read the thread eh, DF? This wasn't a single plant comparison. What, you think i ran a grow with one plant under a light? The space was packed bro.
What I don't get is that the HPS won the 'which makes it bigger' test and you still want to say that somehow the test was biased against the HPS? Does it piss you off that the LED made good buds? Do you think that the HPS should win by a bigger margin?
Look bud, I'm sorry you bought a crappy led light once and didn't get the monster buds you hoped for, but this is not the thread for you to do your analyzing in. This thread is for me to show the progress and show the actual results of as fair of a test as I could come up with. Sorry if I could only get 3 pairs of plants. How many do you think I should have run? As many as I can fit in? But what pot size should I use? Damn!?​

And the cost diff = blah blah

Conclusion: Gram per watt contests are great for spec sheets and not much else.


blah blah

Sounds like that's all you did.

Sorry for the tone of this post DF, but the "One other thing..." comment had a tone too.
this one too~​

I had/have no intention to threadjack, but I've grown tired of some very biased and one-sided comparisons for the purposes of marketing.

How is this grow biased? I ain't marketing shit. I'm trying to grow three equal pairs of plants under two different lights to show how they do. Don't even bother to post any more analysis. Start your own thread if you wish to do that. This is a flame free zone brother.​

 

[hazy]

I think the test DF would like to see would be one where you take whatever area will hold the maximum number of plants that a 400 can cover. idk? 3x3? 4x4? 5x5?

His point is that if you grow the max number that you can with an HID and put that up against the LED. He figures that way the increased footprint of the 400 would show up the LED in a big way.

Whatever.

My point is that you can't always use your 400 in the biggest most optimal space to maximize output from that light. Sometimes the space you have is the space you have.

While I'm not marketing, DF seems to be anti-marketing. Here's an idea. Darth Fader, don't buy one if you don't like them. Come back around to visit, we'll toke a bowl of that Shack grown under the LED.
Debated whether to say this, but since you got my goat like that, the bud grown under the LED got me higher than this strain ever has before*. I'd been smoking GAK and Sugar Shack(grown in a different room), and Golden Cindy all day. Expected just a bland, "oh boy, let's smoke another bowl" boring late night bowl, but instead I loaded a nug up and three hits later I was blazed. SS is stony weed anyway, but this cut right through everything else that I'd been toking. Same thing the next morning.(always the best time for testing new smoke imo.) I don't know if that'll be true of the others. We'll see after they get chopped and dried.

*Disclaimer: This is merely anecdotal and is not to be taken as hazy saying that LED's make stonier weed. More testing needs to be done to verify that it wasn't simply psychosomatic desire on the part of hazy to will the LED bud to be more stony..

​

 

[hazy]

As far as venting in an LED only cab, the main advantage I see, though I'm slow at these things, is not having to exhaust to the outdoors. You could blow right out of a cab or tent into the room. Doing this would keep you from blowing out all that AC cooled air from inside your house. Think about how much cooled air blows out of a 4" duct with a Vortex going. Now there's less wattage to power the light and no AC cooled air being blown out of the house at 177 cubic feet per minute. or whatever. And you don't have to cut a hole in the wall. For folks living in places where the police can point their temp guns ?whatever you call those aim and read temps from a distance things? at your house vents, this would keep you from having to worry about that. Doing this would keep the neg pressure that you need to keep unfiltered air from escaping the tent. Instead of trying to just recirculate inside the cab like in a sealed room. You wouldn't need CO2 because you'd be pulling in fresh air from inside the house. You house air has enough, and exchanges enough when doors are opened. i think.
​

 

[Hashy1]

Hey Hazy. If people want to hear about the quality and highs and taste from each light. I will volunteer to do a blind test. you can give me a bud from each side of the same strain and i will write you up a report for both and say what one i think is better. Then you can tell us what bud came from what light. that should tell us what light makes the better buds. Just a thought. let me know.

I know my opinion don't count for much but for me I don't really care what is going to give you more buds. I care about what gives you the best buds.

 

[grumblez]

Hazy, I love the disclaimer man....you are a good guy and it shows through.

Hashy1, I like the idea...Hazy we are jumping in the Grumblezmobile and will be right over...

 

[one Q]

I think the test DF would like to see would be one where you take whatever area will hold the maximum number of plants that a 400 can cover. idk? 3x3? 4x4? 5x5?

His point is that if you grow the max number that you can with an HID and put that up against the LED. He figures that way the increased footprint of the 400 would show up the LED in a big way.

this is true, the coverage a 400w has can not be had by the current LEDgirls lighs. BUT...
HOW MANY SMALL GROWERS STUFF THEIR AREAS WITH HID LIGHTS?
I see some DR60s with 400s in them, If they replaced the 400 with LED205 they, according to this thread, could get damn near what they get with the 400s with 1/2 the watts and smaller fans and all that jazz. Ppl over do lights all the time and not MAX out the hid foot print.

Hazy; good to note that the LEDs give you *higher* results.

 

[VerdantGreen]

....
Debated whether to say this, but since you got my goat like that, the bud grown under the LED got me higher than this strain ever has before*. I'd been smoking GAK and Sugar Shack(grown in a different room), and Golden Cindy all day. Expected just a bland, "oh boy, let's smoke another bowl" boring late night bowl, but instead I loaded a nug up and three hits later I was blazed. SS is stony weed anyway, but this cut right through everything else that I'd been toking. Same thing the next morning.(always the best time for testing new smoke imo.) I don't know if that'll be true of the others. We'll see after they get chopped and dried.

*Disclaimer: This is merely anecdotal and is not to be taken as hazy saying that LED's make stonier weed. More testing needs to be done to verify that it wasn't simply psychosomatic desire on the part of hazy to will the LED bud to be more stony..

​

hey hazy - im glad you said it - ive been the same about claiming that LED buds were stronger, especially as i only grew one strain so far under my 63w LED. but i pretty much thought the same. my MMG cut is potent weed anyway - but i thought that it was even more potent when grown under LED than it was under HPS.
it had that lung expansive feeling i only tend to get when smoking hash.

i'll be interested to hear what you think of the others

great test hazy

VG

 

[VerdantGreen]

34.2/29.1 = 1.175

HPS produced 17.5% more weight.
... but at what cost?

And the cost diff = about $200 for HPS vs $700 for LED?
or $700/29.1g = $24.05/g cost for LED
vs $200/34.2g = $5.85/g cost for HPS

.......

you're really comparing the cost of a light that will last 10 years against the yield of one plant in one grow?

that is nonsense.

i guess you'll stick to the CMH for you second grow then

 

[Darth Fader]

How is this grow biased? I ain't marketing shit. I'm trying to grow three equal pairs of plants under two different lights to show how they do. Don't even bother to post any more analysis. Start your own thread if you wish to do that. This is a flame free zone brother.​

Whoa!
Hazy, you misunderstand, I'm not being critical of your grow AT ALL. Didn't mean to imply that your grow was biased/unfair in any way. When I said I was tired of biased & unfair comparisons I was referring to you-know-who's cost comparison or gram/watt posts. They are B.S. I guess that's my fault for not making that clear, so this is my mea culpa.

Sorry if my post(s) rubbed you the wrong way. Probably shouldn't have posted here in retrospect but was just looking for some discussion of ideas. Either way I guess that's a threadjack, so again, apologies. I've never bought an LED & have no reason to be pissed either way. I may start a thread outside of the "Vendor forum" (any thread inside will be *edited* or deleted) for a civil discussion on the economics of LED vs HPS vs CFL. I'm neither a fan-boy or a hater, just really interested in exploring further understanding.

peace bro

 

[LEDGirl]

LEDGirl - Would you care to comment on the status of a vertical LED unit? I would love to get my paws on one of them.

It should be available in as little as 3 weeks for purchasing. Our first units are currently being manufactured. The price will be right around $1500 shipped, and you'll get 504 vertical watts.

 

[LEDGirl]

Wow ,, the comparison between wattage and yield has really put it in perspective .... very interesting results .....Ha how much would it be to convert my 4000 watt room to 4000 watts of LED .... ?? do you accept HPS returns for a led discount ??? ,,, HA HA !! i wont hold my breath ...

4kW would run $12,500 shipped. I'm sorry there are no trade-ins for HID lol, but Craigslist is great for that

While LED is certainly much more expensive to purchase vs (4) 1000W HID's in this case, many people don't analyze the true advantage: run the same wattage LED as you do HID and get double the yield and possibly more! This grow is a great example when you consider that the 205W draws about 190W, 10W of which goes to the fans. The HID draws roughly 440W, so there is almost a 60% actual power draw difference between the two lights.

For people running dispensaries or co-ops, double the yield while reducing operating costs is definitely a selling point. Let's say your average 4kW co-op is yielding 3200g per cycle, or about 7lbs of meds. They're paying to cool those HID's with A/C and ventilation fans (although A/C would also be needed with 4kW of LED), and the bulbs need replacing once a year. The value of 7lbs if distributed to patients (cause we only support legal growing) is roughly $45,000 in CA (at $400/oz). If that same co-op invested $12,500 from that harvest in LED lighting, their next yield would be closer to 14lbs or $90,000 with no bulb replacements and less cooling cost. Then they get that yield again cycle after cycle, making LED a much more cost-effective choice for those kinds of individuals.

 

[Che]

I'd like to see a medical grow box with LED on 5 sides and a single site hydro bucket.. grow a nice little medical tree

 

[kro]

Interesting, thanks.

 

[hazy]

Sour Diesel and Chem4 chopping now.

just looking for some discussion of ideas.

No problem man. I guess I took it wrong, so that's water under the bridge. I do welcome rational civil discussion of the economics of these lights. I don't want to discuss past grows by others and their failings. I would ask that when there's disagreement that nobody gets pissed at each other.

Only thing is there's threads around here that are many many pages of analyzing and flaming and whining and bitching and well, you've seen em.

I just don't want this thread cluttered up with too much of that stuff.

Anyway. that Sugar Shack's gone, so let's light up some of this Golden Cindy. MMM, mmmm. I hope nuggetshiner never lets the mom and dad go of this darling.
​

------------​

Hey Hazy. If people want to hear about the quality and highs and taste from each light. I will volunteer to do a blind test. you can give me a bud from each side of the same strain and i will write you up a report for both and say what one i think is better. Then you can tell us what bud came from what light. that should tell us what light makes the better buds. Just a thought. let me know.

I know my opinion don't count for much but for me I don't really care what is going to give you more buds. I care about what gives you the best buds.

I think that's a great idea Hashy1. Your opinion matters to me.

Don't you love it when a man puts his personal needs aside, and takes time to volunteer to help the community. Ask what a man can do for his country, and Hashy1 steps up. Your service is appreciated.

I'll give you samples of the Sour Diesel and the Chem4 from buds grown under each light. I'll mark them A and B, but you won't know which it is hehe. I'll grind the bud so you can't tell by the look or density. Chopping as I type so about a week for some dry and just starting to cure samples.




_____________________

OK, here's a few Sour Diesel pics. There's lots more in the album. I'll post more later.

Sour Diesel


hps/led

hps


led

​

​

 

[WizeWizo]

Certainly much nicer coloring under the LED side! Beautiful job Hazy!

 

[guest5703]

Great test hazy, seems like you really found a winner, the led buds do look pretty though! Peace


Oh thats right, the Rush song I've been listening to while I look at your thread, awesome!

 

[LEDGirl]

Can't wait to see the gram per watt #'s at the end Hazy. Should be interesting.

 

[hazy]

More Sour Diesel pics

hps/led

hps/led

hps/led

led

hps/led

hps/led

hps/led

hps/led



​

 

[Frozenguy]

Hazy.. What an awesome grow.. Great comparison. I'm loving the results. Have you seen the coloring from the LED side before, when you flowered this cut out under HID? Beautiful looking nugs, cant wait to read a smoke report.

 

[hazy]

Hazy..Have you seen the coloring from the LED side before, when you flowered this cut out under HID?

The last time I ran this Sour Diesel under a 1K it purpled up like my PK. But it's not its normal thing.

Well, everything's chopped and hanging. As FG and others noted the Sd under the LED had lots of color. The C4 also had more character, really more color, well maybe more color, but more gnarly nuggety buds.​

Chem4






hps/led


hps/led


hps/led


hps/led

all these are of the LED c4.






Which ones for next time?



I bet you guys want some final chopped bud shots, yes?


Sour Diesel
hps/led



Chem4
hps/led


There you go folks this one's wrapped up. I'll post dry numbers in a few days. Also give a smoke report and any general comments.



​