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Best thing I EVER added to my res...

S

SeaMaiden

So, I went to Wally World yesterday with the intention of buying a simple sponge filter. Well, guess what. They don't sell them at my local! ONLY power filters, either the in-tank or hang-on-tank types. I use trash cans and need that inlet to be able to reach far, far deeper than they allowed, so what did I do?

I made my own ghetto mechanical/biological filter. I got an air bar and wrapped it in air filter material, plugged it into the air pump, and dropped it into the can. When I go downstairs this morning I'll see if it's had any effect on the hair algae-laden soup that can of rain water has become.

Friend, Uaru are one of my favorite Central American cichlids. Say it with me. OOO-ah-ROO. OOO-ah-ROO!

I thought fluidized bed filters were long gone because of the problems of overflowing and such.
 
cravin morehead

cravin morehead

Active member
Veteran
nice work sea maiden!! as long as there is enough surface area to colonize for your trash can, should work great.
in my bio-bucket res, i keep the replacement bio-wheels (2) floating in my res. they roll around under the waterfall getting a nice blend of water and oxygen.
i used to keep central and south american cichlids. my favorites were Geo hechilai (sp?) pretty rare. beautiful rainbow tassle off the tips of their fins. similar to geo surnamsasis but has a pronounced line diagonal through the eyes.

cm
 
F

FRIENDinDEED

A FRIEND WITH WEED IS A . . .
Veteran
SeaMaiden said:
So, I went to Wally World yesterday with the intention of buying a simple sponge filter. Well, guess what. They don't sell them at my local! ONLY power filters, either the in-tank or hang-on-tank types. I use trash cans and need that inlet to be able to reach far, far deeper than they allowed, so what did I do?

I made my own ghetto mechanical/biological filter. I got an air bar and wrapped it in air filter material, plugged it into the air pump, and dropped it into the can. When I go downstairs this morning I'll see if it's had any effect on the hair algae-laden soup that can of rain water has become.

Friend, Uaru are one of my favorite Central American cichlids. Say it with me. OOO-ah-ROO. OOO-ah-ROO!

I thought fluidized bed filters were long gone because of the problems of overflowing and such.
Click to expand...

I could see fluidized filters being a problem if you've got some manner of immensely powerful pump, but outside of that I don't see them overflowing things.

I actually saw a tank that had me wondering about starting my own back up again, guy had the pump plumbed on the outside of the tank itself. you could see the two holes (one top, one bottom)
of the side wall of the tank, I thought it was a pretty cool/clean setup.

and yeah I said it " OOO-ah-ROO" a couple of times actually. so do any one of those DIY filters look like a good bet to you? any one of them look better than the other? outside of buying your own, would you run one of them?
 
S

SeaMaiden

Friend, my last experience with a fluidized bed filter was in a commercial set-up (see below), several hundred tanks adding up to several or tens of thousands of gallons of saltwater. ALL the fish were wild-caught, so killing off that many animals removed from an ecosystem bothered me deeply. Warehouse fishroom scenario, so you've got tanks on warehouse shelving going from the floor to about 6' up, 3-4 levels of fish tanks.

Did you know you can walk on fish tanks? You've got to step on the edge, and NEVER allow any lateral movement (pretty easy, really). Just don't slip.

Yeah, the simpler filters that are easiest to clean seem the better options. Use what costs the least in money and time until you get a feel for it, that's my advice.
cravin morehead said:
nice work sea maiden!! as long as there is enough surface area to colonize for your trash can, should work great.
in my bio-bucket res, i keep the replacement bio-wheels (2) floating in my res. they roll around under the waterfall getting a nice blend of water and oxygen.
i used to keep central and south american cichlids. my favorites were Geo hechilai (sp?) pretty rare. beautiful rainbow tassle off the tips of their fins. similar to geo surnamsasis but has a pronounced line diagonal through the eyes.

cm
Click to expand...

I admit, I do appreciate the Earthmovers, while not spectacular as a family, they do have their own sublime beauty.

The material is fairly open, but it was big enough to wrap the bubble bar. It's EXTREMELY ghetto, I probably could have done better building my own trickle filter, but Wm didn't even have powerheads, and I am NOT going to Petco, am NOT giving Brian DeVine my money. No fucking way, no fucking HOW. Long story, but I'll tell you this much--if Petco is the place where pets go, it's to die.
 
cravin morehead

cravin morehead

Active member
Veteran
i worked in the aquarium trade over 20 years ago. i support local fish keeping stores around here. i hate the petco's and petsmarts.
 
cravin morehead

cravin morehead

Active member
Veteran
sorry, sea maiden, i don't. maybe 20 years or so ago. hahaha! but i hate them for my own reasons. i watched them come into towns and just wipe out all the mom and pop good knowledgeable fish shops. good luck trying to find someone that knows anything about keeping fish in there. let alone dogs, cats, and such...
 
S

SeaMaiden

It's really better to not get me started on that one! If most folks knew what I know, they wouldn't want them to have their money, either.
 
F

FRIENDinDEED

A FRIEND WITH WEED IS A . . .
Veteran
QUESTION FOR THE PANEL . . .

QUESTION FOR THE PANEL . . .

watching all of the videos im learning about the ability of the beneficial bacteria to break down ammonia into nitrates and then into nitrites (if I remember it all correctly)

my question comes from this train of thought: if the filters that are being used in fishtanks are there to collect and use the beneficial aspects that "fish" provide in that environment, then what manner of bacteria can be expected to collect in the bio filter of cannabis plants in hydro?

OR

is the filtration more about the water than the plants that are in it?

the varying sources say that there is a spike in ammonia levels when/after the fish are fed, so what would be my concerns (besides) pH with using a bio filter? im guessing not many since its all biological.

the thought even crossed my mind, with seeing the floating bio mediums, to maybe put some dry organic nutrients in the bottles so that the air would agitate the nute granules and release the nutes slowly into the water but I know that, that is something I am going to have to research a lil more about.

just incase the panel cant answer the Q's can I be pointed in the direction of someone that could, should I just go over to the bio bucket thread and pick at those guys?

I know that there is a lot of experience on the thread so what are your thoughts
 
K

Keep goin

Member
Game Theory said:
Keep goin Quick question...

Im looking for something thatll keep my res clean & benefit the root mass.
After reading through this thread Im considering purchasing the filter you speak of.

Is this the one your using:

http://www.tetra-fish.com/sites/tetrafish/catalog/detail.aspx?id=4217
Click to expand...

Yes...enjoy! This thread has taken some very technical and interesting turns...given the vast knowledge of some of the "fish tank" pros chiming in. But yeah, just drop one of those in and go. Works like a charm.

KG
 
S

SeaMaiden

FRIENDinDEED said:
watching all of the videos im learning about the ability of the beneficial bacteria to break down ammonia into nitrates and then into nitrites (if I remember it all correctly)
Click to expand...
You've got it a little switched. NH4 --> NO2 (nitrITE) --> NO3 (nitrATE)

Believe it or not, the anaerobes are beneficial, too. They take that NO3 and further break it down into its constituent components of oxygen and nitrogen.
FRIENDinDEED said:
my question comes from this train of thought: if the filters that are being used in fishtanks are there to collect and use the beneficial aspects that "fish" provide in that environment, then what manner of bacteria can be expected to collect in the bio filter of cannabis plants in hydro?

OR

is the filtration more about the water than the plants that are in it?

the varying sources say that there is a spike in ammonia levels when/after the fish are fed, so what would be my concerns (besides) pH with using a bio filter? im guessing not many since its all biological.
Click to expand...
I'm not sure what it is you're asking.

In aquariums, fish shit, and that shit (and leftover food) becomes NH4, a toxic form of ammonia. That must be oxidized, eaten if you will, in the two steps I show above by different species of bacteria. The filters are homes for the bacteria. An undergravel filter is a biological filter; i.e. its best use is when it is well colonized by bacteria that can convert/oxidize the wastes generated by the biological load. In some tanks, plants are used to help take up these nutrients. In other tanks, the water column is loaded up with nutrients to grow plants, but they still require biological filtration for any fish kept in the system.

Those spikes, first NH4, then NO2, and finally NO3 are how one knows that they've got an active, well populated filter, and it's usually called "cycling." If someone's started up a new tank and they've got problems, first question fishkeepers will ask is, "Has it finished the cycle?" When they ask that, they want to know, have all the toxic forms of N been converted to the least toxic form of NO3.

I hope this is answering your question, I'm not really sure.
FRIENDinDEED said:
the thought even crossed my mind, with seeing the floating bio mediums, to maybe put some dry organic nutrients in the bottles so that the air would agitate the nute granules and release the nutes slowly into the water but I know that, that is something I am going to have to research a lil more about.

just incase the panel cant answer the Q's can I be pointed in the direction of someone that could, should I just go over to the bio bucket thread and pick at those guys?

I know that there is a lot of experience on the thread so what are your thoughts
Click to expand...
That's where I'd hit cravin.
 
cravin morehead

cravin morehead

Active member
Veteran
i'm sorry friend, i'm a little confused by your question. can you try to ask it a different way? its Saturday morning, and i don't have alot of time today. taking the dogs hiking and got to roto till and amend the veggie garden today. i'll check back as soon as i can.

cm
 
cyat

cyat

Well-known member
Veteran
friendindeed

no need to even think about that stuff unless your doin aquaponics
 
G

Gruetoo

Member
The answer is...... The same. As our plants live they have positive uptake cycles, and negitive Output Cycles. We all are aware of the need for plants to consume. Anything that consumes also has excrement of some sort. While the ammonina and other levels will be quite low, they will still be there. It will come from natural sluffing off unwanted and dieing matter. The biomass that will be collecting in your filtration of your plants will be different than in a fish tank. When you use a EWC or anything else that add good bacteria (Canna comes to mind) this bacteria will collect on the substrate you provide to help keep the water free of flocksum and what not.

I hope I understood what you were asking. Again just my 2 cents.

Gruetoo :plant grow:
 
K

Keep goin

Member
highonmt said:
Seems like you are just adding another "net pot" in effect. Just dripping the water through a colonized net pot of lava rock would do the same thing NO? Just like others have said ..biobuckets. seems like you are adding complexity with little benefit. Not hating mind you it is a cool idea just seems redundant.
HM
Click to expand...


Um, NO... you're adding an active filtration system. Cleaning the "tank" as well as adding beneficial bacteria. Not just dripping water through lava rock.

I ran bio buckets...the original point of this thread was to illustrate something which gains the benefit of clean, bio active water without all the bullshit of bio buckets...

ie: specific system requirements...height of waterfall, amount of water flow, etc.
Use of specific media...bio buckets need to be run with lava rocks ONLY ideally, NO hydroton!! Well news flash, a lot of people run hydroton.

The idea here is that ANYONE running ANY type of hydro could possibly benefit. Don't need to run lava rocks...running hydroton? That's fine, drop a filter in...
Running Ebb & Flow, fine drop a filter in...
Running NFT/ Top Feed, drop a filter in...
Aero Cloner not performing, drop filter in...

Adding complexity??? How F'n complex IS it!?! Put a filter in and plug it in.
You can say you're "not hating"...but come on, say something positive...or nothing at all.
The idea is only redundant IF you run bio buckets. Which I would imagine a lot of people DON'T...I know I don't!!

Just trying to help people out...I don't mind the technical discussion that has ensued, but this negative, non helpful crap that you posted pissed me off...(obviously) Rant over.

If you like the idea try it, if you don't...or find it redundant to your system, then don't.

Good Luck all,
KG
 
S

SeaMaiden

If I may, hopefully without getting anyone worked up, I'd like to say that I think highonmt has a point. The biggest difference that I can see is efficacy here, and that's where I can see the powered filter being superior to what is basically a trickle filter (as he's described it/as I understand it). Aquarists already know that we get different results and efficacy of different filtration methods and types depending on how that water is moved; i.e. any kind of pressure (canister filter, the H.O.T. filter) where water is forced to some degree or another to go THROUGH the filter media, vs allowing it to go where it may.

I mean to say that what he's describing is indeed basically a type of biological filter. Just that I can see it being ineffective with specific regard to particulate/mechanical filtration, and inefficient with regard to the biological filtration.

I've got to get the camera away from my husband so I can take pix of the dirty-ass rain water I rigged up the ghetto air curtain filter in. Last night there was much greater clarity and I didn't have to add anything to get all the debris to flocculate.
 
gmanwho

gmanwho

Well-known member
Veteran
quick bio filter i added to my ebb & gro system. Bucket hangs under return line in my rez. (requires no extra power, an i had all the ingredients) I also put a mix of ewc an mycorhizae in a mesh bag an place it on top of the lava rock. not i the picture.

1 gall bucket with holes drilled,small nylon filter mesh on lower level over holes,then hydroton, then lava rock. pic shows no tea bag, but its now in there.

picture.php



only rinse, no disinfect. when time to clean, dump it in the utility sink, rinse, reassemble . 2 mins an done every run!!

picture.php



b-safe
 
S

SeaMaiden

That should work. If you point the powerhead upward and cause turbulence, then you'll get the gas exchange (CO2-O2) happening.
 
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