Alec Baldwin to be charged with involuntary manslaughter over “Rust” death

[mean mr.mustard]

what is the arm's. respon in new mexico??? do you know?? if so please enlighten me...

I don't think that the job requirements change from state to state...

But the idea that someone is in charge of locking up the guns seems like they have the primary responsibility for them.

If a three year old got ahold of a gun and shot someone with it I think everyone would be blaming the parents...

It's probably a bit different for a grown man but the principle is what I was talking about.

 

[NewbOldster]

shit that sucks... baldy is one of them 'special-people'..... if he was driving and killed someone, he'd blame it on the car..

Why not? It's not like people kill people. It's the tool used that does the killing, not the hand wielding it.

 

[Cuddles]

Naw...it didn't suck. She was truly a violent psycho. 8. Long. Miserable. Years. ended for me!

GOOD FOR YOU!!!

 

[mean mr.mustard]

Why not? It's not like people kill people. It's the tool used that does the killing, not the hand wielding it.

So-called "dram laws" include the bartender who is responsible for monitoring and over-serving in the case of DUI arrest here.

Why on Earth would the legislation be in place, I wonder?

PS I hope you aren't thinking that my position is anywhere near such that Mr. Baldwin is innocent. I'm simply including the possibility of others being culpable as well.

 

[NewbOldster]

I don't think that the job requirements change from state to state...

But the idea that someone is in charge of locking up the guns seems like they have the primary responsibility for them.

If a three year old got ahold of a gun and shot someone with it I think everyone would be blaming the parents...

It's probably a bit different for a grown man but the principle is what I was talking about.

A three year old has no business unsupervised with a firearm, and I agree fully with the prosecution of those responsible for that child at that time when such a horror happens, which is FAR TOO OFTEN.

But Alec Baldwin is a grown adult man who makes movies, often involving guns and stuff. The entire operation was his responsibility, and if his crew is irresponsible, that's also on him, though they might have some individual culpability. I don't know. A ship is only as tight and tidy as its Captain keeps it, and he shouldn't need a babysitter to do his job.

I'll never be convinced that a grown adult individual wielding a firearm that discharges (which I might add, was carelessly pointed at other people) is not responsible for that action. Especially not someone who has invested a good part of his life into making money off the very tool utilized in his productions.

That he can't even man up and say "I screwed up" when he obviously did, and that he's been scrambling to avoid responsibility places him at the bottom rung of humanity in my eyes.

I'm just a simple man, but I own up when I F up. You're right. It's different for a grown man. He ain't one.

Am I too harsh?

 

[NewbOldster]

So-called "dram laws" include the bartender who is responsible for monitoring and over-serving in the case of DUI arrest here.

Why on Earth would the legislation be in place, I wonder?

PS I hope you aren't thinking that my position is anywhere near such that Mr. Baldwin is innocent. I'm simply including the possibility of others being culpable as well.

I'm enjoying the convo, dude. Thank you.

 

[NewbOldster]

So-called "dram laws" include the bartender who is responsible for monitoring and over-serving in the case of DUI arrest here.

Why on Earth would the legislation be in place, I wonder?

PS I hope you aren't thinking that my position is anywhere near such that Mr. Baldwin is innocent. I'm simply including the possibility of others being culpable as well.

I don't know much about dram shop laws, but my tendency is to assign responsibility to the individual who allows himself to *go to a bar *get drunk *drive home and kill someone.

Sloppy, falling down drunk is one thing; call a cab or a cop, but where do you draw the line when, say, you have multiple bartenders and the over-legal drunk is not exhibiting a drunken state, but then he drives home and kills someone? Nobody forced him to go drinking.

 

[xtsho]

Who points a real gun at someone and pulls the trigger without checking for themselves to see if it's loaded?

I don't care if there was someone that was supposed to check the gun before me. There is absolutely no way I would ever point and pull at a person without checking for myself. It's stupid, irresponsible, and in this case deadly.

Baldwin has always been a big anti-gun advocate yet here he is making a movie involving guns and he himself shoots and kills someone with a gun.

His behavior afterwards has been selfish and his only concern has been himself. He sucks.

 

[NewbOldster]

Who points a real gun at someone and pulls the trigger without checking for themselves to see if it's loaded?

I don't care if there was someone that was supposed to check the gun before me. There is absolutely no way I would ever point and pull at a person without checking for myself. It's stupid, irresponsible, and in this case deadly.

Baldwin has always been a big anti-gun advocate yet here he is making a movie involving guns and he himself shoots and kills someone with a gun.

His behavior afterwards has been selfish and his only concern has been himself. He sucks.

Agreed. And well put.

 

[mean mr.mustard]

My understanding was that the gun was supposed to have a blank inserted to fire at the camera.

It's looking like a squib load or an actual live round was the issue, so the primer and brass of a blank would be there instead of an empty chamber and, as such, wouldn't be easily distinguished from a live round.

Such a seriously dangerous shot should have had no person behind the camera in my opinion.

 

[Tynehead Tom]

It was apparently a sloppily run group; the man in charge of it killed someone, and now he wants to blame anyone other than himself. It was not intentional, I don't believe. He just won't own up to his mistake.

Only question I have is what will the industry do to prevent this from happening again?

Halayna Hutchins did not deserve to die. Alec Baldwin was holding the gun when it discharged. Lots of broken there, but the first step in correcting a problem is recognizing there is one.

I believe the second step should be accounting for errors and addressing them. Alec Baldwin needs to account for his lack of professionalism in running such a sloppy outfit, and his obviously disastrous mishandling of a firearm needs to be addressed as well.

I've been a strong 2A advocate all my life, and I'll die as one, but I'd beat even my best friend right into the ground* if he was to act recklessly with a firearm in my presence. That is simply intolerable behavior.

* (well...used to be I could do it! I'm old now! lol Still, I'd be all up in his face, fact)

Somewhere out there are the original details that broke about the case. I posted this already but it bears repeating. During a break in filming, Baldwin and others engaged in target shooting with live ammunition, apparently with firearms that were also used on set.
This is where Baldwin is fully responsible as the boss. Those firearms designated for the production should not have been handled by anyone but the armorer..... full stop.
The armorer is also responsible for not exercising proper control over said firearms while on or off the set.
Those firearms should not have been accessible to anyone for any purpose other than the scenes they were to be used in.
Next and here is where I find BOTH individuals at fault , Baldwin for irresponsible and wreckless regard for the protocols of having firearms on set but also for allowing live ammunition on set. The armorer is at fault for not securing the firearms in a manner that would have barred access to them to anyone but the armorer. This next bit is where the armorer shares equal blame...... that firearm should have been inspected and prepared for that scene by the armorer in which case is would have been proven unsafe. That didn;t happen obviously so did Baldwin deny the amorer that inspection or what happened there?
Details need to be fleshed out but an innocent women lost her life and another individual bears the physical and emotional scars but fortunately was only wounded. In my opinion the amorer and baldwin share equal blame for the discharge of live ammunition on set. Bladwin deserves more "punishment" than the armorer though because he was the man in charge. The armorer should be banned from working with firearms forever.

 

[xtsho]

My understanding was that the gun was supposed to have a blank inserted to fire at the camera.

It's looking like a squib load or an actual live round was the issue, so the primer and brass of a blank would be there instead of an empty chamber and, as such, wouldn't be easily distinguished from a live round.

Such a seriously dangerous shot should have had no person behind the camera in my opinion.

I've only ever used live rounds and have always just assumed that there would be some type of marking to distinguish them from blanks.

 

[mean mr.mustard]

I don't know much about dram shop laws, but my tendency is to assign responsibility to the individual who allows himself to *go to a bar *get drunk *drive home and kill someone.

Sloppy, falling down drunk is one thing; call a cab or a cop, but where do you draw the line when, say, you have multiple bartenders and the over-legal drunk is not exhibiting a drunken state, but then he drives home and kills someone? Nobody forced him to go drinking.

Considering there's more moving parts in the shooting scenario, I could put it as: the possibility exists that the drunk guy didn't plan on drinking alcohol and thought he had a non alcoholic beverage... supplied by a person trusted to know the difference.

He certainly drank it in the case of the shooting... but did he intentionally drink and drive or did someone else load a live round?

 

[mean mr.mustard]

I've only ever used live rounds and have always just assumed that there would be some type of marking to distinguish them from blanks.

I usually use fingernail polish on tips and primers if I need to differentiate when I am loading.

 

[NewbOldster]

‘Totally preventable and shocking’: props masters talk on-set shootings

After the accidental death of Halyna Hutchins on the set of Rust, professionals discuss gun safety in Hollywood

www.theguardian.com

 

[NewbOldster]

Considering there's more moving parts in the shooting scenario, I could put it as: the possibility exists that the drunk guy didn't plan on drinking alcohol and thought he had a non alcoholic beverage... supplied by a person trusted to know the difference.

He certainly drank it in the case of the shooting... but did he intentionally drink and drive or did someone else load a live round?

I'm completely responsible for myself. I don't need anyone to determine the difference for me between alcoholic and non-alcoholic beverages. But again...I'm an adult.

"Intentionally"? Perhaps not. But thoughtlessly and carelessly, yes indeed. His responsibility.

 

[mean mr.mustard]

I'm completely responsible for myself. I don't need anyone to determine the difference for me between alcoholic and non-alcoholic beverages. But again...I'm an adult.

"Intentionally"? Perhaps not. But thoughtlessly and carelessly, yes indeed. His responsibility.

"Solely"?

 

[mean mr.mustard]

‘Totally preventable and shocking’: props masters talk on-set shootings

After the accidental death of Halyna Hutchins on the set of Rust, professionals discuss gun safety in Hollywood

www.theguardian.com

Everything you do is preventable by not doing it.

Is Ms. Hutchins responsible for being shot because she chose to get behind a camera knowing someone was going to fire a gun at her?

 

[NewbOldster]

Everything you do is preventable by not doing it.

Is Ms. Hutchins responsible for being shot because she chose to get behind a camera knowing someone was going to fire a gun at her?

I'm pretty sure she did NOT know someone was going to shoot a gun at her. Of course she has no responsibility.

 

[NewbOldster]

"Solely"?

Yes. I am solely responsible for my own actions.