F
Fields~of~Green
Thanks for the detailed post disciple makes more sense to me now
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a ppk for a 6 plant limit
- Thread starter delta9nxs
- Start date
Just to make sure we are on the same page. These are to seperate gallons of stock solution. Not one gallon.
Also I need to mention that in this ratio the calcium nitrate is higher than what delta uses. This is because I use potassium nitrate in my mix and bring the PH down with phosphoric acid. Thus adding P and K with these two to bring my NPK back.
Once again I have a gallon jug of calcium nitrate and a seperate gallon jug of jack's .
D
disciple
Last edited:
It last about a month before I use it up. I mix one and let it set till I use the other one. So I have two gallons of each. One of which is being used up. I find that the jacks will take a while to totally dissolve so that is why I have two on hand.
Here's a quickie. Don't judge me.
This interpretation features the 3.5 Gal lower bucket with the 7 Gal upper feed tub.
This interpretation features the 3.5 Gal lower bucket with the 7 Gal upper feed tub.
Sorry Disciple,
Looking back at what i wrote, i can see how it can be read that i had it all i one container, but this is NOT the case.
What i meant was i mixed the concentrate for 100 gallons and stored in a 2 gallon container, i did one for Jacks and one for Calcnit.
Both are in their separate 2 gal containers and i then pour those into a 55gal drum til i reach the desired PPM of each.
Never had issues with either dissolving, i fill each container 1/2 way with HOT water and they dissolve almost instantly!
Never mentioned anything of color spectrum nor that they were a Buddies LEDs, this company liked my flowers and was nice enough to let me test 4 panels equal to 1kw so i can do a side by side against my Gavitas.
Growing under these lights revealed that they produced a Mag deficiency, thus requiring the necessary retrofit.
hope i explained it better this time.
Snook
Still Learning
Yup! Worthless, the bunch of us
worthmore!
Snook
Still Learning
I must say first, the nutes should be mixed in a separate container until desired PPMs and then added to the Volume (stock) rez keeping it as full as necessary.
This whole scenario is much more easily understood via a picture and I am not capable, FlowerFarmers redition of that picture (thanks FF), although rudimentary, is accurate.. a couple arrow heads to confirm the flow of nutrient solution and it is dead on.
old school ppk, had the control rez (float valve) and pulse rez (pump for top watering) in separate containers in series: volume feeds control which is connected to pulse rez by tubing at the bottom of each pulse and control rez. additionally, each PPK bottom rez (where the wick resides) is also connected to the pulse rez bottom to bottom by tubing.
volume rez feeds: control rez (float valve), control rez feeds the pulse rez (used for top feeding) via a tube connection at the bottom of both the PPK rez and the pulse rez.
the pulse rez receiving nutrients from both the control rez (with only fresh 600 ppm nutrients) and the nutes that were top fed and collected in the bottom PPK rez which will have a higher PPM ratio after draining thru the media in the top PPK pot.
Recently, D9 has combined the control rez and pulse rez into one container. I can not get that combined container to work for me and am going back to 'old school', 4 rez, process.
if I knew how to do diagrams, I'd do it but again, I'm not capable.
standard naming conventions for each PPK component would help understand the PPK process. we each call those components something different, muddying the understanding of the process from member to member.. potato / patato , tomato / tomoto
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Ok here is my PPK breakdown
First a bit of general Knowledge. PPK is at it's core a wick fed Hydro system. The plants are fed via a wick of whatever medium you are growing in. Some acceptable mediums for this method are Coco, Turface, Vermiculite mixtures, etc. I use Coco (GH CocoTek) straight up, no pearlite or anything. The plants are potted in the container of your choice (sized by the size plants you want to grow) with a 1 1/2" plumbing tailpiece coming out of the bottom.
This image has been resized. Click this bar to view the full image. The original image is sized 1024x768 and weights 115KB.
My pots are MT38 Treepots from Stuewe & Sons. They are 3"x3"x8", hold 1 Liter of coco and come with a hole in the bottom that is sized perfectly to accept a 1 1/2"dia plumbing tailpiece. The tailpiece has a flange on the top. "Amazing Plumbing Goop" is applied to the bottom of the flange to adhere the 2 pieces together.
There is a screen affixed in the bottom of the tailpiece to hold the medium and the roots in the pot and out of the reservoir. This is a key part of the PPK. It keeps the roots out of the reservoir allowing the coco to act as a buffer. The tailpiece is loosely packed with the same medium the plant is in. This sits in the Control Reservoir, wicking moisture and nutrients up into the pot to feed the plant. The moisture profile of the coco is controlled by the water level in the control reservoir. If it is too wet (plants show signs of over watering) then you lower the water level. If the top layer of medium dries out then raise the water level. By doing this (adjusting the air gap between the bottom of the pots(not the tailpiece) and the top of the water) you are controlling the level of the perched water table. I'm not going into detail here all you really need to know is what I put here. If you want to know more it is discussed extensively in the Passive Plant Killer thread just do a search for perched water table or PWT.
This image has been resized. Click this bar to view the full image. The original image is sized 862x550.
An Overview of the system as I have adapted for multiple sites in a small space. Simple and effective.
This image has been resized. Click this bar to view the full image. The original image is sized 1024x768.
The Control Reservoir. Cover has 36 sites in a 3"x3" grid 4 rows x 9. It could be any size and have any number of sites. 4 for a multi strain scrog, 144 in a 4'x4'x6" reservoir, it is easily adapted. If I run into issues at my current density (16psf) I can easily make a new cover with less sites. The control res is constructed of plywood coated with a 24 hour epoxy to waterproof it. Simple and easy to make.
This image has been resized. Click this bar to view the full image. The original image is sized 1024x768.
Inside of the control reservoir. It is 6" deep. My tailpieces are also 6" long. The cover is ~1/2" thick so this leaves a small gap between the bottom of the tailpiece and the bottom of the res. Also you see the white float valve. This is connected to the Bulk reservoir that keeps this thing fed. It is adjustable, and is set to maintain a 3" air gap between the bottom of the pots and the top of the water.
In the back right corner is the pump for the saturation pulses. There is a hose (not shown) that goes to a manifold that distributes the water to a line for each pot. I will be pulse feeding to the point of saturation every 2 hours. This will serve a few main purposes. Left alone in the PPK evaporation is greatest in the top layer of the coco. The pulse keeps the salt levels (ec) in the coco and the reservoir balanced. Applying a large enough pulse of water will also provide a thorough exchange of gases throughout the medium (similar to ebb & flow). I will show more of how my pulse feed system is set up in a later post as I have a few issues to work out still.
This image has been resized. Click this bar to view the full image. The original image is sized 1024x768.
Bulk Res is a standard 18 Gal Rubbermaid Tote. I used a brass fitting to connect the line to the res. The thin piece of wood adds a bit of thickness and made it easier to waterproof. Used kinda like a washer. I think that with 10 gallons of nutes it will keep the PPK fed when fully stocked with 36 clones for 10-14 days. That is as long as I could possibly stay away without interrupting the perpetual cycle.
I use Jacks nutrients from J.R. Peters. I use the Jacks Hydro and the Calc-Nit. I mix 2 tsp of Jacks and 1 1/2 tsp of Calc-Nit per gallon of water. Per the instructions for each this should mix the 2 at a ratio of roughly 1:0.66 and end up with a solution of roughly 660PPM (EC 1.2). I don't have an TDS meter or a PH pen yet. This seems to be stable and all of my plants are healthy so I will roll with this until chance is necessary. Easy and CHEAP. 25lb for $35.
This is the PPK in a nutshell. I hope this clears up questions, but this is how I adapted the designs of Delta9nxs, Oldone, ImaginaryFriend and other soldiers in the PPK army to a Micro SOG.
Why did I do this? I felt the perpetual SOG is the best way to maximize a small space to grow in. As I am just growing for personal meds I do not want to devote a large space, plus due to my legal status in the state I currently live I would like to have a bit of stealth to avoid LEO. I also get bored smoking one strain all of the time. This eliminated a SCROG, the other preferred method of cabinet cultivation. I think if I can keep the environment stable and get the strains dialed to my space I can exceed 1 GPW every 9 weeks. 400 grams from 400 watts of CFL in ~2.5 sq' of space.
This PPK and the cabinet itself are V 1.0 of my setup. I am working out the kinks of my designs and methods. I plan on using a slightly larger, and more secure metal cabinet with electronic locks and stuff. It will house a flower chamber (slightly larger than my current one), a veg/clone chamber, a drying chamber, and a utility area. All reservoirs, pumps, fans, filters, etc will be housed within the cabinet. I want it to be a completely self contained unit that I can just run an extension cord and a water line to. The cabinets are like $600 so I want to get my design right and proven before I start purchasing and fabrication.
As always feel free to comment, question etc freely
Ok here is my PPK breakdown
First a bit of general Knowledge. PPK is at it's core a wick fed Hydro system. The plants are fed via a wick of whatever medium you are growing in. Some acceptable mediums for this method are Coco, Turface, Vermiculite mixtures, etc. I use Coco (GH CocoTek) straight up, no pearlite or anything. The plants are potted in the container of your choice (sized by the size plants you want to grow) with a 1 1/2" plumbing tailpiece coming out of the bottom.
This image has been resized. Click this bar to view the full image. The original image is sized 1024x768 and weights 115KB.
My pots are MT38 Treepots from Stuewe & Sons. They are 3"x3"x8", hold 1 Liter of coco and come with a hole in the bottom that is sized perfectly to accept a 1 1/2"dia plumbing tailpiece. The tailpiece has a flange on the top. "Amazing Plumbing Goop" is applied to the bottom of the flange to adhere the 2 pieces together.
There is a screen affixed in the bottom of the tailpiece to hold the medium and the roots in the pot and out of the reservoir. This is a key part of the PPK. It keeps the roots out of the reservoir allowing the coco to act as a buffer. The tailpiece is loosely packed with the same medium the plant is in. This sits in the Control Reservoir, wicking moisture and nutrients up into the pot to feed the plant. The moisture profile of the coco is controlled by the water level in the control reservoir. If it is too wet (plants show signs of over watering) then you lower the water level. If the top layer of medium dries out then raise the water level. By doing this (adjusting the air gap between the bottom of the pots(not the tailpiece) and the top of the water) you are controlling the level of the perched water table. I'm not going into detail here all you really need to know is what I put here. If you want to know more it is discussed extensively in the Passive Plant Killer thread just do a search for perched water table or PWT.
This image has been resized. Click this bar to view the full image. The original image is sized 862x550.
An Overview of the system as I have adapted for multiple sites in a small space. Simple and effective.
This image has been resized. Click this bar to view the full image. The original image is sized 1024x768.
The Control Reservoir. Cover has 36 sites in a 3"x3" grid 4 rows x 9. It could be any size and have any number of sites. 4 for a multi strain scrog, 144 in a 4'x4'x6" reservoir, it is easily adapted. If I run into issues at my current density (16psf) I can easily make a new cover with less sites. The control res is constructed of plywood coated with a 24 hour epoxy to waterproof it. Simple and easy to make.
This image has been resized. Click this bar to view the full image. The original image is sized 1024x768.
Inside of the control reservoir. It is 6" deep. My tailpieces are also 6" long. The cover is ~1/2" thick so this leaves a small gap between the bottom of the tailpiece and the bottom of the res. Also you see the white float valve. This is connected to the Bulk reservoir that keeps this thing fed. It is adjustable, and is set to maintain a 3" air gap between the bottom of the pots and the top of the water.
In the back right corner is the pump for the saturation pulses. There is a hose (not shown) that goes to a manifold that distributes the water to a line for each pot. I will be pulse feeding to the point of saturation every 2 hours. This will serve a few main purposes. Left alone in the PPK evaporation is greatest in the top layer of the coco. The pulse keeps the salt levels (ec) in the coco and the reservoir balanced. Applying a large enough pulse of water will also provide a thorough exchange of gases throughout the medium (similar to ebb & flow). I will show more of how my pulse feed system is set up in a later post as I have a few issues to work out still.
This image has been resized. Click this bar to view the full image. The original image is sized 1024x768.
Bulk Res is a standard 18 Gal Rubbermaid Tote. I used a brass fitting to connect the line to the res. The thin piece of wood adds a bit of thickness and made it easier to waterproof. Used kinda like a washer. I think that with 10 gallons of nutes it will keep the PPK fed when fully stocked with 36 clones for 10-14 days. That is as long as I could possibly stay away without interrupting the perpetual cycle.
I use Jacks nutrients from J.R. Peters. I use the Jacks Hydro and the Calc-Nit. I mix 2 tsp of Jacks and 1 1/2 tsp of Calc-Nit per gallon of water. Per the instructions for each this should mix the 2 at a ratio of roughly 1:0.66 and end up with a solution of roughly 660PPM (EC 1.2). I don't have an TDS meter or a PH pen yet. This seems to be stable and all of my plants are healthy so I will roll with this until chance is necessary. Easy and CHEAP. 25lb for $35.
This is the PPK in a nutshell. I hope this clears up questions, but this is how I adapted the designs of Delta9nxs, Oldone, ImaginaryFriend and other soldiers in the PPK army to a Micro SOG.
Why did I do this? I felt the perpetual SOG is the best way to maximize a small space to grow in. As I am just growing for personal meds I do not want to devote a large space, plus due to my legal status in the state I currently live I would like to have a bit of stealth to avoid LEO. I also get bored smoking one strain all of the time. This eliminated a SCROG, the other preferred method of cabinet cultivation. I think if I can keep the environment stable and get the strains dialed to my space I can exceed 1 GPW every 9 weeks. 400 grams from 400 watts of CFL in ~2.5 sq' of space.
This PPK and the cabinet itself are V 1.0 of my setup. I am working out the kinks of my designs and methods. I plan on using a slightly larger, and more secure metal cabinet with electronic locks and stuff. It will house a flower chamber (slightly larger than my current one), a veg/clone chamber, a drying chamber, and a utility area. All reservoirs, pumps, fans, filters, etc will be housed within the cabinet. I want it to be a completely self contained unit that I can just run an extension cord and a water line to. The cabinets are like $600 so I want to get my design right and proven before I start purchasing and fabrication.
As always feel free to comment, question etc freely
https://www.icmag.com/ic/showpost.php?p=5459828&postcount=84
Link to the post in my original thread. Hope it helps. Lacking a box around the float valve cause I never ends up hooking up the pump lol
Link to the post in my original thread. Hope it helps. Lacking a box around the float valve cause I never ends up hooking up the pump lol
O
Oti$
I know I'm a day late, but I wanted to express how thankful I am for all the ppk knowledge d9, the ppk godfather, and all the other ppkers have dropped over the years. It really toom me quite a bit longer to wrap my head around the design with all the upgrades and design changes. However, once it clicked and everything became clear, it was simple and it really is a set and forget system. Thanks everyone and have a good weekend
F
Fields~of~Green
amazing info! thank you! i haven't bought any other brand of nutes since oct 2010.
i checked a friends ppk grow last night that was was first loaded about a month ago and is still in veg.
it read 820 ppm at .5 and 5.9 ph.
extremely stable nutes.
thanks, as i answer this i see FF's drawing and that is about as good as it gets. mine wouldn't look that good. so if you can make something based on that it might help folks.
good to hear from you!
i think i may have repped you twice but if so it's cool because this is the best short description i have read.
i hope you don't mind if i steal it, with credits of course!
thank you!
thank you for your input! and pics! epoxy is some cool shit!
I know I'm a day late, but I wanted to express how thankful I am for all the ppk knowledge d9, the ppk godfather, and all the other ppkers have dropped over the years. It really toom me quite a bit longer to wrap my head around the design with all the upgrades and design changes. However, once it clicked and everything became clear, it was simple and it really is a set and forget system. Thanks everyone and have a good weekend
hey, so you have re-upped under a similar handle also! thank you for the support as we try to bring this out into the public eye a little more!
since the first one, the only real changes have been in plumbing.
later
I think I got the idea to run them from your old thread.
I just want to mention again so people know it. This is not what the PPK uses. It is high in the calcium nitrate portion. I run that part higher because I use potassium silicate, drip clean and phosphoric acid. All of which add more PK from the NPK ratio. So I need a little more N.
Because the calcium is higher you need to watch for magnesium deficiencies with this mix. I find the Chem d strains run short at first flowering. It usually shows up at the beginning of flower and clears itself up quickly.
Once again this is not recommended for the PPK. I believe your PH will float some and he silica will settle out of solution. I use it for hand watering.
Sorry Delta9 for walking all over your thread.
yep, that's it except maybe for a few directional arrows to depict the two way flow between the pump res and plant res.
thank you!
and thanks for helping take out the trash on the other thread!
it's cool, i appreciate your input, this is how we learn.
