91'chemdog

[mack 10]

~ Nice,
Check this lady, she sneaked into the sunshine.

 

[shishkaboy]

~ Nice,
Check this lady, she sneaked into the sunshine.[URL=https://www.icmag.com/ic/picture.php?albumid=50249&pictureid=1409975&thumb=1]View Image[/url] [URL=https://www.icmag.com/ic/picture.php?albumid=50249&pictureid=1410893&thumb=1]View Image[/url]

She looks like a tree compared to my little 2 gallon pots, that's the clone only sour D?
I gotta pop beans, non med state. But I am going to Co for 4/20, So I will be strain hunting while there.
Maybe I can find a chem

 

[mack 10]

No its the '91. Looks similar eh?

 

[shishkaboy]

No offense Lambs-Bread, but that is an awful lot of assumptions in that post. Probably cause more problems than solutions posting all that. Might wanna edit to prevent newb's from making some crazy assumptions, none of which are based in fact.

There is absolutely no evidence to support TK, Shiva Shanti, Garlic Bud, and Chem91 are even related at all in the history of Sour Diesel. Original Chem 91 is bagseed from Norcal/Oregon Border dank herb. Nothing more, nothing less. Please don't assume that they have anything to do with each other without strong evidence.

There is not any evidence that TK has anything to do with chem lines, or whether it, or the original "OG" cut came first. Chicken or the egg, no way to know. TK didn't show up online until 2006, years after OG cuts seeds and hybrids had been sold by the thousands.. OG Kush had been passed around as a clone, s1 seeds, and hybrids for 5 years at that point when it first hit the internet in 2001 with Orgnkid. There were several growers online from Florida in the early 2000's. Most of them got cuts of the OG from Orgnkid, and no one ever made any comments about a local strain being the same. No one online had ever mentioned Triangle Kush from what I remember until Big Ricky and Krome came online..

I have no Idea where you got TK is made of Lemon Thai x Hindu Kush x PTK.. PTK wasn't even a strain back then, because TomHill made that in recent years. The Lemon Thai Hindu Kush backstory is from this asshole John and his old cohort in business, Kailua Kid. And their asshat "brothel brothers" seed company. They completely fabricated the John from Grass Valley, Lemon Thai x Kush, back story and it is complete and utter bullshit. I knew John personally and first hand saw him concoct that story. Please Stop perpetuating it in any fashion.

SO TO CLARIFY, ACCORDING TO NEW INFORMATION FROM AJ, although some other CHEM guys like JJ think it may have been a different cross...

Chem 91 = Bagseed from Norcal/Oregon around 1991. Popped by "Chemdog"

Sour Diesel = Chem 91 x Mid 90's Sensi SuperSkunk Hermi.

Sensi Super Skunk purchased by Weasel in Amsterdam, Chem Clone from "Chemdog" crew. Mass Superskunk aka Virginia Superskunk was not in the Garden that Weasel scored the Sour Diesel seed from.

The only other plants in the room in which the seed that created Sour Diesel was found were: NL#5, Sensi Superskunk, and Hawaiian Indica. So, technically, any of those could have been the father, but according to AJ and Weasel, based on smell/taste/growth/plant, the Sensi Superskunk was the most likely culprit for pollen.

IMHO, TK and the OG Kush lines have zero to do with any of this. Please stop.

May I see the garlic? Got some loud ass garlic/onion/beef/deer meat smelling shit over here and its creeping me out. Its worse than my sour.
pheno 7

pheno 3

 

[Nspecta]

There is not any evidence that TK has anything to do with chem lines, or whether it, or the original "OG" cut came first. Chicken or the egg, no way to know. TK didn't show up online until 2006, years after OG cuts seeds and hybrids had been sold by the thousands.. OG Kush had been passed around as a clone, s1 seeds, and hybrids for 5 years at that point when it first hit the internet in 2001 with Orgnkid. There were several growers online from Florida in the early 2000's. Most of them got cuts of the OG from Orgnkid, and no one ever made any comments about a local strain being the same. No one online had ever mentioned Triangle Kush from what I remember until Big Ricky and Krome came online.

Hey Doc...a couple corrections for posterity's sake...Blue Dog first posted pics of Triangle Kush, which he called at the time Emerald Triangle Kush, on OverGrow in 2004. Also, and much more relevant...a google search of Florida Triangle Kush made back in 2004/05 revealed quite a bit of online banter about TK or Triangle Kush...all from Florida cats round the Orlando area, dating back to the late 90's. Just because a few Florida locals weren't privy to the fact TK was going around in their back yard doesn't mean it wasn't there.

 

[ThaDocta]

Also, just because a couple random people on the internet claim to be smoking some "Triangle Kush" back then, but we have no evidence that what they were smoking is what we are growing, doesn't make it true either. There is no "evidence" that can be gleamed from that tidbit of "coincidence"..

As a reminder, people have been smoking "Albert Walker" in Socal since 2007. We both know that cut ain't real, but those people will swear up and down thats what they were smoking. Their descriptions are even spot on in terms of the smoke. But it's not the same, and it's not relevant to authenticity, unless you can confirm what it WAS to those people, and what it IS we are growing now, are exactly the same. No one has yet been able to confirm that from FLA.

No offense, but I think your dates are a little off. 2004 was only 1 year after I started up after school. Don't ever remember ETK stories until way after that. Definitely never saw it online until after I had the Cat Piss, which was late 04/05.. And I was pretty on it with TK information, or I doubt I woulda been the first outsider to get it direct.

I know you really want it to be true its from the Emerald Triangle Nspecta , but lets be a little less biased and only tie strings with knots we know will hold.

 

[LAMBS-BREAD]

BR said in 2007 that he just got more infos about the TK. This mean prior to that date, him meeting with the breeder, he didn't knew much about it. this could explian the name change too... But the Hoopa story and He claiming he's having the cut since 1992, is a bit confusing. Also the cut could be older than the name or not...

 

[DoubleTripleOG]

A little off topic here......but is the original 91' cut hard to get? Do quite a few dispo's in Cali/Colorado have it? Or do you have to be in someone's circle. I ask because I frequently see guys talking about legit chem4 and legit og's in dispo's.

I have had the 91' on my "wishlist" for a good 5 years now. If It's as easy as somebody grabbing a cut from a dispo, I would make the 3 day drive just for cuts. My commitment runs that deep.

 

[subrob]

Hey doc...the cut in socal that was known as Albert walker has been known as dago walker since the day you confirmed for us it wasn't Albert...and we will swear its not Albert walker...but I get the point you are making...it only takes one link in the chain to misinform every following link...and it doesn't have to be on purpose...

 

[Kalyx]

A little off topic here......but is the original 91' cut hard to get? Do quite a few dispo's in Cali/Colorado have it? Or do you have to be in someone's circle. I ask because I frequently see guys talking about legit chem4 and legit og's in dispo's.

I have had the 91' on my "wishlist" for a good 5 years now. If It's as easy as somebody grabbing a cut from a dispo, I would make the 3 day drive just for cuts. My commitment runs that deep.

She is my all time favorite and has been on my wish list for a very long time as well. I highly doubt you would find the legit Chem 91 SkunkVa cut from a dispensary in cali/colo.

Its always possible you could find the legit one but she is a tightly held girl for sure. I know there are very few breeders that actually have the legit cut of her, or that at least make some crosses with her.

I know lots of breeders claim or think they have the legit Chem 91 when they don't. Im sure the same holds true on the dispensary front.

-Kalyx

 

[Cannavore]

i sure as shit hope no dispensary has the 91

 

[Solum]

wow nice

 

[luxcultivars]

Science/dna will never be able to prove lineage if the mother and father are both gone, period. Gone as in no plant material, no stems, no flowers, or a living plant (no viable dna). Nobody has a clue what is in chemdog and nobody ever will. Just glad it's here!!

wut

DNA analysis of Chemdog will definitely determine what is in it. I have a sample of a cut of Chem '91 in the lab right now being sequenced. I'll be taking in Chem4OG and ChemD next week.

With an extensive heritage map being created of landrace, existing and old-school strains these questions can indeed be answered. They are actually being answered right now. If Chemdog has portions of it's DNA from any already-sequenced strains anywhere in the world, that will show up in the Chemdog sequencing. You don't know that its parents are gone now, either. Regardless, they aren't necessary to determine general lineage.

Personally I can't wait to have these lineage questions answered factually via DNA analysis rather than via wild speculation and hearsay. I get so tired of hearing "I have the original chem '91!" or "this is the real OG Kush!", as if they can be sure of that. 'True authenticity' will eventually be agreed upon via group consensus when we start matching up our DNA sequences.

We will eventually all be able to have certified 'real-deal' strains. It's new technology but it is advancing quickly, and as I said thousands of landraces and old-school strains have already been sequenced. Within a year we will have an online reference to start referring to when determining strain origins.

 

[MrBelvedere]

wut

DNA analysis of Chemdog will definitely determine what is in it. I have a sample of a cut of Chem '91 in the lab right now being sequenced. I'll be taking in Chem4OG and ChemD next week.

With an extensive heritage map being created of landrace, existing and old-school strains these questions can indeed be answered. They are actually being answered right now. If Chemdog has portions of it's DNA from any already-sequenced strains anywhere in the world, that will show up in the Chemdog sequencing. You don't know that its parents are gone now, either. Regardless, they aren't necessary to determine general lineage.

Personally I can't wait to have these lineage questions answered factually via DNA analysis rather than via wild speculation and hearsay. I get so tired of hearing "I have the original chem '91!" or "this is the real OG Kush!", as if they can be sure of that. 'True authenticity' will eventually be agreed upon via group consensus when we start matching up our DNA sequences.

We will eventually all be able to have certified 'real-deal' strains. It's new technology but it is advancing quickly, and as I said thousands of landraces and old-school strains have already been sequenced. Within a year we will have an online reference to start referring to when determining strain origins.

Yes agreed the point is if the parents dna is gone there is no way to show absolute proof of parentage. As more elderly relatives are submitted for sequencing then the general lineage will become more accurate. It will be a truly great thing when strains can be truly verified and matched easily.

 

[genedigger]

if you know what the dna sequence is on chem91 then dont you just have to keep testing other strains you come across that you know are older than chem91 and see if any of the dna is the same?theres plenty of named known strains that were well established before 1991.is it possible that the dna from chem might match?

 

[MrBelvedere]

if you know what the dna sequence is on chem91 then dont you just have to keep testing other strains you come across that you know are older than chem91 and see if any of the dna is the same?theres plenty of named known strains that were well established before 1991.is it possible that the dna from chem might match?

One thing to think about is that for the general lineage to be accurate it has to take into account things like location and time. For example let's say that a 100 thai samples are submitted for sequencing and the people submitting them swear on the bible the dna is from Thailand. So they get labelled Thai in the sequencer. Then 10 samples from Laos are submitted, and it turns out to match 80 of the Thai samples. Then 20 Chinese samples come in and match 3 Laos samples. And so on. Then it is realized a few of the people who swore on the bible the samples were from Thailand were misinformed and the sample really was grown in Laos and exported thru Thailand and thus a mislabel. Or maybe they are right, nobody knows for sure. So the lineage is really about how strains migrated around the world, and when they migrated. As old tombs are discovered and samples are found buried from tens, hundreds, or thousands of years ago then the lineage evolves and starts to tell a more accurate story.

 

[luxcultivars]

One thing to think about is that for the general lineage to be accurate it has to take into account things like location and time. For example let's say that a 100 thai samples are submitted for sequencing and the people submitting them swear on the bible the dna is from Thailand. So they get labelled Thai in the sequencer. Then 10 samples from Laos are submitted, and it turns out to match 80 of the Thai samples. Then 20 Chinese samples come in and match 3 Laos samples. And so on. Then it is realized a few of the people who swore on the bible the samples were from Thailand were misinformed and the sample really was grown in Laos and exported thru Thailand and thus a mislabel. Or maybe they are right, nobody knows for sure. So the lineage is really about how strains migrated around the world, and when they migrated. As old tombs are discovered and samples are found buried from tens, hundreds, or thousands of years ago then the lineage evolves and starts to tell a more accurate story.

Agreed. This will be a bit of a challenge. The project I'm referring to is international and has people collecting strains from locations around the world, but some will have migrated there at some point and this will confuse the data a bit. In the end patterns will likely emerge that indicate which ones truly originated from certain regions and which ones just traveled there.

It is a huge project and will take years. Hopefully the first run of tests will give us some basic ideas about lineage of some of today's mystery strains like Chem '91. I'll report back here when I have the data. The testing itself doesn't take long but parsing the data does. Should have results by June.

 

[stix~]

aaaaahh ye old DNA testing talk ... what a breeze of freash air lol ... stay tuned aparrently the mistery will be solved in june rofl

 

[luxcultivars]

aaaaahh ye old DNA testing talk ... what a breeze of freash air lol ... stay tuned aparrently the mistery will be solved in june rofl

Sorry, brother: I don't speak snarky-passive-aggressive. Care to have a grown-up conversation minus the dancing icons? What's your point? Is bro-science currently answering all your lineage questions better than DNA analysis will...?

I get that anti-science sentiment is popular these days, but clearly all we have at this point regarding strain origins is hearsay, which amounts to pretty much nothing. That plenty for you is it? 'Cause personally I can't wait for science to wash away all of the bullshit bro-science that dominates these forums.

 

[acridlab]

What is bro science?