Teaming with Microbes: The Organic Gardener's Guide to the Soil Food Web

There was an idea in the compost tea brewing forum about starting a book club type thread for certain books, Teaming with Microbes being one of them. I have read a few books here & there but not many on the topic of gardening. I read a lot of threads from multiple sites that pertain to a certain parts of my grow. Over the past few months I have been able to become more serious & really spend time researching and studying gardening as a whole. There are a couple books that I have been meaning to read from front to back but always find myself thumbing through every book I have reading certain pages or paragraphs randomly. I know this is a great place to begin expanding my knowledge of the soil food web.

Whoever would like to join in the read can. Go ahead share your thoughts, opinions, questions or ideas with the class! Go to your local book store and pick it up, or just order it online. There are a few sponsors on this site that sell the book as well. I will be reading the revised edition. Hopefully a few of the people that have read this book numerous times will join in the discussion. If this was a sub forum we could break it up into chapters making it easy for people to participate and read at their own pace


Teaming with Microbes: The Organic Gardener's Guide to the Soil Food Web
By: Jeff Lowenfels & Wayne Lewis
Foreword by Elaine Ingham

::SUMMARY:: "blurb"
Smart gardeners know that soil is anything but an inert substance. Healthy soil is teeming with life — not just earthworms and insects, but a staggering multitude of bacteria, fungi, and other microorganisms. When we use chemical fertilizers, we injure the microbial life that sustains healthy plants, and thus become increasingly dependent on an arsenal of artificial substances, many of them toxic to humans as well as other forms of life. But there is an alternative to this vicious circle: to garden in a way that strengthens, rather than destroys, the soil food web — the complex world of soil-dwelling organisms whose interactions create a nurturing environment for plants. By eschewing jargon and overly technical language, the authors make the benefits of cultivating the soil food web available to a wide audience, from devotees of organic gardening techniques to weekend gardeners who simply want to grow healthy, vigorous plants without resorting to chemicals.
The revised edition updates the original text and includes two completely new chapters on mycorrhizae (beneficial associations fungi form with green-leaved plants) and archaea ( single-celled organisms once thought to be allied to bacteria).



Please try to reference anything pulled directly from the book.... 1. Its respectful to the author.... 2. It makes things much easier when discussing.

you should start a thread for each chapter, maybe ask for a book club sub-forum where you can do it.

amazing book and the one i've loaned more than any other. It explains after every section what the gardener needs to know about whatever topic was just discussed.

teaming with microbes

teaming with microbes

Junebugjoe,

I'm so glad you started this thread. This book is a MUST READ for all organic growers. I devoured this book in no time. I was blinded by the light soo many times when reading this book. It was a real BINGO moment for me when I was done with the book. All of you should read it. You will not regret it.

One of the issues I had in the book was about making compost. Those Alaskan dudes did not want to use animal manure in their compost piles. They stated page 119, why take the risk when you don't know what kind of antibiotics and other drugs were used to feed the animals?"

I can understand not wanting the antibiotics etc.., I refuse them as well. We have piles of factory farm shit all over here, soo tempting, but one must strong and smart to reject the bad shit.

So why did the authors not go into "organic farm" manure. Raising chickens, cows, worms, etc.. makes so much sence if you can do it. The amount of N in animal manure and animal byproduct, is alot greater than in "green manure".

I just felt that they could have explained alittle better the fact that we should be promoting organics a little more. At least when it comes to animal manure. They did a great job in general promoting organics. The entire book itself revolves around the idea of keeping it organic. They also point out how chem ferts destroy, destroy destroy, in many ways.

grow microbes,

HG

Fungi-Bacteria ratio

Fungi-Bacteria ratio

The topic of fungi-Bacteria ratio is of great interest to me. It is my understanding that to have the "ideal" PH for your plant, you need to know what your plants ideal PH is and create a F-B ratio that matches.

For example, lets say you are trying to grow a annual plant that has an ideal PH of around 6.5-6.8. From what this book says you need to have a slighty fungi dominated environment. I assume this can be done in your soil by adding compost that is made from woody debris, tree leaves etc..along with green plant material. Anyone have experience with making Fungi dom compost? I have never tested for PH in my finished compost. I assumed it was at 7 when done. If adding say, 5 gal of fungi dom compost to your 50 gal of soil, is that going to add enough to bring overall soil ph down?

Another idea for maintaining 6.8 PH is to mulch with fungi loving mulch. TWmicrobes suggests leaves, partialy composted wood chips etc.. for mulch. 2-3 inches deep. They say that the hyphae of the fungi grow laterialy in a single cell chain that grabs nutes from as the hyphae reach. Wow that is supper cool. Now I am into fungi for the second time in my life.

Seems to me that since the hyphae of the fungi can reach so far to grab nutes and the fact that the cell structure is so fragile, one would NOT want to disrupt the mulch at all. Any thoughts?

I always have added nutes via top dressing into the top layer of soil by my plants. I now realize that I was killing fungi hyphae strands.

So get this. Here is another idea I'm working on. It involves total organic outdoor , homemade smart pot set above ground, lots of good soil, microbes, sun and leaves.

The idea is to grow lots of lateral roots to the outside of the smart pot. Once the roots are at the outside of the pot, inoculate side of container with fungi microbs, then burm up leaf litter and fungi loving material all around the smart pot for the hyphae to spread into. I speculate that if you could get the fungi hyphae started outside of the pot and connected to the roots of your plant they would collect nutes, minerial from outside the normal gathering area greatly increasing growth.

Please tell me if I'm crazy.

HG

mad librettist said:

you should start a thread for each chapter, maybe ask for a book club sub-forum where you can do it.

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Yea i was hoping the same thing. I believe there are a lot of good books we could discuss if there was a sub forum for a book club. Closest thing to a book club I have been in is trying to get the girls in college to come read to me

We are not just creating a discussion for the moment. We will be leaving a resource in the form of chapter by chapter discussions and questions valuable to the authors and the readers. This is the true meaning of education.

herbal gerbil said:

Junebugjoe,

I'm so glad you started this thread. This book is a MUST READ for all organic growers. I devoured this book in no time. I was blinded by the light soo many times when reading this book. It was a real BINGO moment for me when I was done with the book. All of you should read it. You will not regret it.

HG

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Thanks Im sure everyone will get a lot of the read... including myself

Chapter 1. Page 1. for me today.

so what did you guys think about chapter 1?

One of my favorite excerpts (Ch. 1 IIRC):

At the center of any viable soil food web are plants. Plants control the food web for their own benefit, an amazing fact that is too little understood and surely not appreciated by gardeners who are constantly interfering with Nature's system. Studies indicate that individual plants can control the numbers and the different kinds of fungi and bacteria attracted to the rhizosphere by the exudates they produce. During different times of the growing season, populations of the rhizosphere bacteria and fungi wax and wane, depending on the nutrient needs of the plant and the exudates it produces.

Soil bacteria and fungi are like small bags of fertilizer, retaining in their bodies nitrogen and other nutrients they gain from root exudates and other organic matter (such as those sloughed-off root-tip cells). Carrying on the analogy, soil protozoa and nematodes act as "fertilizer spreaders" by releasing the nutrients locked up in the bacteria and fungi "fertilizer bags." The nematodes and protozoa in the soil come along and eat the bacteria and fungi in the rhizosphere. They digest what they need to survive and excrete excess carbon and other nutrients as waste.

Left to their own devices, then, plants produce exudates that attract fungi and bacteria (and, ultimately, nematodes and protozoa); their survival depends on the interplay between these microbes. It is a completely natural system, the very same one that has fueled plants since they evolved. Soil life provides these nutrients needed for plant life, and plants initiate and fuel the cycle by producing exudates.

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I thought I understood growing organically, but the above was one of those "Aha!" moments when it all came together on a higher level.

sweet dude!

mad librettist said:

so what did you guys think about chapter 1?

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I've been reading this book for about a month now, taking my time as to better absorb what the book has to offer. I've completed part 1 and am stalling to read part 2 as there seems to be more information than in the first (debatable.) I'll say one thing, GREAT BOOK so far! Hope you all don't mind if I join

Chapter one set the stage for the book just fine. It had me primed and ready for more. The author stated at some point that the science is "dry", I didn't think so. Chapter 1 was dry but the rest of the book so far has been great!

@ foescan - I found the segment you highlighted to be rather interesting myself. I didn't really understand what was behind the workings of the soil and that level. Yeah, that excerpt brought it together for me. It had me wondering how all of this would work indoors if at all. I realize I would have to import some of those protozoa etc. if I really wanted them.

I came down with my own bacteria/fungi the last week... Being sick is not fun but i did have time to read a few chapters...

Ch.1 Really sets itself up for the reader to follow the rest of the book by explaining what the soil food web is all about... Basically explaining that good soil is full of life. In addition to all living organisms we can see there are also millions of microbes that are naked to the human eye. The -icides they use to spray on their gardens would not only damage the pest but also kill off any good living organisms & microbes. I found it really interesting when they explained the use of chemicals in your garden. It makes you really think how our every day gardeners are seduced into the top shelf garden bombs that just make you keep coming back for more and more... I for one from this first chapter have a different outlook already

I love to know that plants are in control. When you think about the idea of a living plant that has survived millions of years it makes sense that there is a whole new who eats who world underneath the soil. Plants do not need us to help them defend anything if we would just supply them with the natural food to eat and defend those things themselves.

I am pretty new to the technical world of cultivation and gardening so one thing i enjoy doing is highlighting key points in the chapters to go back and read them again, including "ahhh ok i see now" moments and definitions. The writers do like to use terminology over and over and over so its pretty hard not to understand what they are talking about.

One thing i would like to bring up is the Root exudates in the form of carbohydrates. I once had someone tell me to water my plants with carbonated water because it was co2 to the roots... If the roots already produce natural carbohydrates off the roots that feed the microbes would this be pointless, or does it some way help? When adding compost tea with high microbial life maybe the plant would like a little extra co2. But then again when thinking of the soil food web I would think its a big cycle... If you add more microbes to the soil the plant will flourish and create more exudates therefore going back to being pointless...

I realize I would have to import some of those protozoa etc. if I really wanted them.

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There are protozoa in good compost/vermicompost. There are usually protozoa in Canadian Sphagnum peat moss

One thing i would like to bring up is the Root exudates in the form of carbohydrates. I once had someone tell me to water my plants with carbonated water because it was co2 to the roots... If the roots already produce natural carbohydrates off the roots that feed the microbes would this be pointless, or does it some way help? When adding compost tea with high microbial life maybe the plant would like a little extra co2. But then again when thinking of the soil food web I would think its a big cycle... If you add more microbes to the soil the plant will flourish and create more exudates therefore going back to being pointless...

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I'm a little confused by this as CO2 is not the same as carbohydrates. One is a gas the other is a molecular food source.

Microbeman said:

There are protozoa in good compost/vermicompost. There are usually protozoa in Canadian Sphagnum peat moss

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They are the bane of carnivorous plant growers as their poop kills the plant. You start with peat, add tapwater, and you get N. WTF?!?

Microbeman said:

I'm a little confused by this as CO2 is not the same as carbohydrates. One is a gas the other is a molecular food source.

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yea two different things for sure... figured that out after posting and researching. always had that question on my mind but i guess everyone has their ways. not all of them are right

Microbeman said:

There are protozoa in good compost/vermicompost. There are usually protozoa in Canadian Sphagnum peat moss



I'm a little confused by this as CO2 is not the same as carbohydrates. One is a gas the other is a molecular food source.

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I think this is a myth from the High Times days. I have heard it before.

V

vonforne said:

I think this is a myth from the High Times days. I have heard it before.

V

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I'm sorry, I'm confused. Were you speaking about the protozoa or the Co2 debacle?

the Co2 debacle?

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The protozoa is spot on. The C02 is a myth.

V

vonforne said:

The protozoa is spot on. The C02 is a myth.

V

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Aha, thanks

CO2 in soda water has a very low pH something like 4 so I doubt anyone who suggested that it be introduced to a plant actually did this. Sounds like someone getting baked one night and having an idea. Most likely smoking Indica. If they were smoking some good Sativa they might have better ideas?