where did god come from?

[VenerableHippie]

Were definitely in agreement on some things anyway,

Thanks for that. I say yammering because it seems to me that our individual efforts and experiences are puny, almost useless. Of course what we've got is all we've got and we have to make do with it.

I broadly agree with you re what is god.

Time though is human. We, that is, you and I can find that out if we take ecstasy or lsd or probably even enough dope. Under the influence of those chemicals time may stretch or shorten or cease to exist until the effects of the chemicals wear off.

Time is the result of our thinking. The result of our thinking that there must be a start and an ending to things. Of course when we say, go for a walk, there is a beginning and an end to the walk and there is the experience of the duration of the walk. But if during the walk we had stopped our internal dialogue and were experiencing each moment completely, wholly ... instead of thinking or expecting the next moment ... then we would not experience Time passing.

We would be experiencing the world as a child experiences the world. I think you will recall those endless days of summer when you were young. My understanding of this lack of awareness of time is that it is the result of enjoying each moment rather than worrying about the future, or one's debts, or one's health, or even ... whether or not there is a god.

(I 've been reading Marcus Aurelius. I 'm sure he has said something about this subject. I 'll copy a quote here when I find one.)

 

[gizmo666]

so thanks everyone for your inputs
tho we are stretching away a bit from the question
anyways this is a reply from a minister on the question
and as usual imo no answer

"Thank you for your question–and I hope you will always want to know more about God. God loves you and wants to help you and be your friend every day of your life.

God had no beginning (just as He will have no end); He has always existed, and He always will. (That’s why He had no father or mother.) I know that’s hard for us to understand, because everything we see around us had a beginning. Even the universe–the stars, the galaxies, even the atoms you can’t see that make up everything in the world–all had a beginning. But God had no beginning. The Bible says, “The Lord is the everlasting God, the Creator of the ends of the earth” (Isaiah 40:28).

And God also never changes or grows old. Have you ever noticed how everything around you changes? People and animals change and grow old; trees grow up and die; even rocks eventually weather and disintegrate. But God never changes; as the Bible says, “I the Lord do not change” (Malachi 3:6). This is one reason why you can depend on Him, because He’ll never change His mind or go back on His promises.

But the most important truth I can tell you about God is that He loves you, and He wants you to know Him and be His friend. How do I know this? I know it because God sent his only son, Jesus Christ, into the world to show us his love. And right now Jesus wants to come into your life and make you part of His family forever. Ask Him to come into your heart today–and He will."

dam even two seperate verses of the bible have him(him as he is always refered to in the bible)as coming from two different places Temen and sinai
its seems i ask i think the unanswerable question

 

[Chi13]

gizmo666, I think you are trying to find answers to this in the wrong place. You are referring to a book(s) written by many different human authors, about something called God. Not only that, but these books were written long ago, and have interpreted and reinterpreted by many, each time in a different cultural setting. Some of the writings were likely written hundreds of years after events that they discuss.

I think that this thread has taken a much more interesting turn, whilst still being somewhat on track.

I don't believe in God, the human invention. I do think, though, that there are some vast mysteries about our existence, that can be explored through meditation, philosophy, and some religious texts. I am a prove it to me type of person, however I have also had what I believe was, in hindsight, for want of a better word, a mystical experience. It has taken 40 years to fully recognise it as such, and led me on a path of exploring some of the things that Venerable has touched on, such as meditation, silence, and reading certain texts. My prove it to me side thinks that these mysteries are not necessarily incompatible with science either.

 

[gizmo666]

gizmo666, I think you are trying to find answers to this in the wrong place. You are referring to a book(s) written by many different human authors, about something called God. Not only that, but these books were written long ago, and have interpreted and reinterpreted by many, each time in a different cultural setting. Some of the writings were likely written hundreds of years after events that they discuss.

I think that this thread has taken a much more interesting turn, whilst still being somewhat on track.

I don't believe in God, the human invention. I do think, though, that there are some vast mysteries about our existence, that can be explored through meditation, philosophy, and some religious texts. I am a prove it to me type of person, however I have also had what I believe was, in hindsight, for want of a better word, a mystical experience. It has taken 40 years to fully recognise it as such, and led me on a path of exploring some of the things that Venerable has touched on, such as meditation, silence, and reading certain texts. My prove it to me side thinks that these mysteries are not necessarily incompatible with science either.

yep i think i'm pretty much in the same thought
just another of those deep stoner thoughts
tho i admire other folks perseptions of religion on the thread some of them are very deep

 

[armedoldhippy]

Gizmo...the bible was written entirely by men, edited by men, and interpreted by men, in a time where women had zero social standing nor rights, nor any place in church. not much different to today, huh? of COURSE they referred to God as a "him". had anyone said "she"..... well, the stoning would probably begin right after the laughter died down as the "righteous indignation" rose to a fevered pitch...

 

[gizmo666]

Gizmo...the bible was written entirely by men, edited by men, and interpreted by men, in a time where women had zero social standing nor rights, nor any place in church. not much different to today, huh? of COURSE they referred to God as a "him". had anyone said "she"..... well, the stoning would probably begin right after the laughter died down as the "righteous indignation" rose to a fevered pitch...

that is a true point
they even tried to eradicate magladene(i think thats right) from the history

 

[St. Phatty]

"God" is a figment of the human imagination.

 

[armedoldhippy]

"God" is a figment of the human imagination.

got a solid source on that?

 

[HempKat]

Thanks for that. I say yammering because it seems to me that our individual efforts and experiences are puny, almost useless. Of course what we've got is all we've got and we have to make do with it.

I broadly agree with you re what is god.

Time though is human. We, that is, you and I can find that out if we take ecstasy or lsd or probably even enough dope. Under the influence of those chemicals time may stretch or shorten or cease to exist until the effects of the chemicals wear off.

Time is the result of our thinking. The result of our thinking that there must be a start and an ending to things. Of course when we say, go for a walk, there is a beginning and an end to the walk and there is the experience of the duration of the walk. But if during the walk we had stopped our internal dialogue and were experiencing each moment completely, wholly ... instead of thinking or expecting the next moment ... then we would not experience Time passing.

We would be experiencing the world as a child experiences the world. I think you will recall those endless days of summer when you were young. My understanding of this lack of awareness of time is that it is the result of enjoying each moment rather than worrying about the future, or one's debts, or one's health, or even ... whether or not there is a god.

(I 've been reading Marcus Aurelius. I 'm sure he has said something about this subject. I 'll copy a quote here when I find one.)

Well I would say that it's more correct to state that our understanding or our perception of time is human even that perception as a child. I do recall though how everything seemed like it took so much longer, having to wait a year for the next birthday or the next Christmas, or the next summer vacation at the start of a new school year seemed like an eternity. Yet as we grow older that time seems to speed up until when you're an adult you wonder where all the time went and you can never seem to find enough time in the day to get things done.

Time however still exists outside of the human experience it's just at a rate our minds have difficulty grasping. What they hope to do with this new Web space telescope is illustrative of that. They hope to be able to see far enough back in time to see the very beginnings of the universe because the light from that time takes so long to reach us and being able to still see that doesn't make sense with our perception of a big bang and the universe expanding in almost an instant.

 

[HempKat]

so thanks everyone for your inputs
tho we are stretching away a bit from the question
anyways this is a reply from a minister on the question
and as usual imo no answer

"Thank you for your question–and I hope you will always want to know more about God. God loves you and wants to help you and be your friend every day of your life.

God had no beginning (just as He will have no end); He has always existed, and He always will. (That’s why He had no father or mother.) I know that’s hard for us to understand, because everything we see around us had a beginning. Even the universe–the stars, the galaxies, even the atoms you can’t see that make up everything in the world–all had a beginning. But God had no beginning. The Bible says, “The Lord is the everlasting God, the Creator of the ends of the earth” (Isaiah 40:28).

And God also never changes or grows old. Have you ever noticed how everything around you changes? People and animals change and grow old; trees grow up and die; even rocks eventually weather and disintegrate. But God never changes; as the Bible says, “I the Lord do not change” (Malachi 3:6). This is one reason why you can depend on Him, because He’ll never change His mind or go back on His promises.

But the most important truth I can tell you about God is that He loves you, and He wants you to know Him and be His friend. How do I know this? I know it because God sent his only son, Jesus Christ, into the world to show us his love. And right now Jesus wants to come into your life and make you part of His family forever. Ask Him to come into your heart today–and He will."

dam even two seperate verses of the bible have him(him as he is always refered to in the bible)as coming from two different places Temen and sinai
its seems i ask i think the unanswerable question

It's been my experience that asking religious leaders (Priests, Reverends, Fathers, Pastors, etc.) are the worst people to ask if you're looking for answers you can't find answered to your satisfaction in the preferred religious text of the religion within which you're asking. The reason being that those people are essentially tools of that religion and they are constrained by what those religions and their Holy Texts say and yet all those things and more are human constructs. They'll never be able to think outside the boxes defined by their religion and dogma much of which is based on primitive knowledge and understanding, For them to suggest anything that is not spelled out in their Holy Texts or taught by their churches is sacrilege and grounds for them to be kicked out of their positions.

 

[44:86N]

The Source of God(s)?

Darkness is the Mother of all Things, including God(s). This is, of course, a Taoist concept.

"The Tao that can be told is not the eternal Tao.
The name that can be named is not the eternal name.
The nameless is the beginning of heaven and earth.
The named is the mother of ten thousand things.
Ever desireless, one can see the mystery.
Ever desiring, one can see the manifestations.
These two spring from the same source but differ in name;
this appears as darkness.
Darkness within darkness.
The gate to all mystery."
– Gia-fu Feng and Jane English translation


"There was something formless and perfect
before the universe was born.
It is serene. Empty.
Solitary. Unchanging.
Infinite. Eternally present.
It is The Mother of the universe.
For lack of a better name,
I call it the Tao.

It flows through all things,
inside and outside, and returns
to the origin of all things.

The Tao is great.
The universe is great.
Earth is great.
Man is great.
These are the four great powers.

Man follows the earth.
Earth follows the universe.
The universe follows the Tao.
The Tao follows only itself."
-- I think this is the Stephen Mitchell translation


Though, the questions I am spending time with at the moment are:

What is Consciousness and what is its' origin? (working with the ideas of Gravity and Electromagnetism)

Where are We? (Giving Homage and Reverence to our Home and MetaOrganism, The Earth/Solar System -- analogous to cellular structures)

What are We? (Understanding that we, and all other forms of life on Earth share the same source, being and evolving for more that 1,000,000,000 years -- in essence, a SuperOrganism whose name is DNA, and to which, we are analogous to cellular structures)

The Geometry of Reality is Fractal in nature.

 

[44:86N]

And then there's Krishnamurti.

The Truth is a Pathless Land

Man cannot come to it through any organization, through any creed, through any dogma, priest or ritual, not through any philosophical knowledge or psychological technique.

Freedom is not a reaction; freedom is not choice. It is man’s pretence that because he has choice he is free. Freedom is pure observation without direction, without fear of punishment and reward. Freedom is without motive; freedom is not at the end of the evolution of man but lies in the first step of his existence. In observation one begins to discover the lack of freedom. Freedom is found in the choiceless awareness of our daily existence and activity.

https://jkrishnamurti.org/about-core-teachings

 

[gizmo666]

It's been my experience that asking religious leaders (Priests, Reverends, Fathers, Pastors, etc.) are the worst people to ask if you're looking for answers you can't find answered to your satisfaction in the preferred religious text of the religion within which you're asking. The reason being that those people are essentially tools of that religion and they are constrained by what those religions and their Holy Texts say and yet all those things and more are human constructs. They'll never be able to think outside the boxes defined by their religion and dogma much of which is based on primitive knowledge and understanding, For them to suggest anything that is not spelled out in their Holy Texts or taught by their churches is sacrilege and grounds for them to be kicked out of their positions.

this i definatly agree with and it makes me mad they wont think out of the box
I even got refused to be married in our local church because of my beliefs ( thankfully we had a better wedding elsewhere as a result)
just because the minister thought it was a sacrilege

amazed at the different thought s from folks on such a sometimes sensitive matter
thankyou

 

[gizmo666]

The Source of God(s)?

"There was something formless and perfect
before the universe was born.
It is serene. Empty.
Solitary. Unchanging.
Infinite. Eternally present.
It is The Mother of the universe.
For lack of a better name,
I call it the Tao.

It flows through all things,
inside and outside, and returns
to the origin of all things.

The Tao is great.
The universe is great.
Earth is great.
Man is great.
These are the four great powers.

Man follows the earth.
Earth follows the universe.
The universe follows the Tao.
The Tao follows only itself."
-- I think this is the Stephen Mitchell translation

i find this enthralling and thankyou for posting this

 

[D. B. Doober]

I'm pretty sure Jesus helped me recently. I believe.

 

[gizmo666]

I'm pretty sure Jesus helped me recently. I believe.

you werent that bad on your test was you???
lol

 

[exploziv]

I'm pretty sure Jesus helped me recently. I believe.

Did he take the wheel?

 

[D. B. Doober]

you werent that bad on your test was you???
lol

You should've seen the questions...not even about driving or signs...instead under 18 junior operator penalties and garbage. Couldn't believe it. I'm 41 what's that crap have to do with me? But somehow I got 18 right out of 25

 

[D. B. Doober]

Did he take the wheel?

Dude I must say Jesus the Dude of Dudes has ridden with me at least once man. Crazy shit happens

 

[exploziv]

For sure, bro. I think he guided me a bit on some ocassions as well.