Whats 2 come In 2007 part II...Going in Style

[StonedGrunt55]

ok Grunt thats nice bro..i do wanne say you have to dissolve the sugar in warm water first ....its much easyer ..but 6.0 ph ...are you in soilless or something??dont think so ey...so why so low...

Tnkx bro! i didn't warm it, but i kept stiring it till nothing was left.
Oh remember a while back i found that the soil is a little alkaline? thats why. When i checked the soil's ph i found it was around 7.5 so i began immediatly giving them ph 6.0, now the soil ph is coming fine around 6.5...

 

[twistedtree]

i took a look at ya plants...the M2 is male fo sho...and i 'think' the first is female..but i'm not 100% shure on that...the pics is't sharp enough..maybe ya can take a other pic so we can see it better...

I was afraid you were gonna say it was male, and alot of people agree with you, including me...I was just hoping that in some way I was wrong. Oh well, I chopped it, and another C99 that had the exact same growth on it. I think another plant is getting balls, too At least I've got one girl. Her flowers don't look anything like the others. I'll try and get some better pics when the sun comes back up.

 

[Core]

hello Folks...

sorry for the abcence..i'm having some problems with the new gro...i will be posting back when all is in order again...i'm having slight ph issues...
seems i'm using soilless (plagron light) and i woz pooring in 6.3 - 6.5 ph water ...now the pots soil is between 6.5 - 6.7 and must lower it asap....still waiting on the pots 2 dry out well....and then its time 2 poor tru some 6.0 water....
will be back later...dont have the energy 2 update...coz i'm realy bummed out on this ph thing....i woz using this soil before with same MO and had no problems @ all...so now i'm not so shure on lowering the ph that much....

any thought on this ...opinions ..Plz share'm :smile:

 

[TML16]

Core

Hows things going my friend? :friends:

Sorry bout my slight absence there....got caught up in vacation mode, and then the work piled up on me for my return
I've gone back a few pages and consider myself somewhat caught up on your thread now

Did you get a new camera? Pics are looking top notch buddy I see you mentioned you were using a tripod, if that's all it has definately increased the potential to show off your icky sticky buds

Glad noone stole my seat while I was gone...glad I can stick my ass back down here and watch your beautiful show

 

[Core]

not all is well TML...read the above post so you kno what prob i have..

but yea ya seat is still open...and you may chime in on this issue....stupid jackass that i am...

 

[TML16]

I've never even checked the PH of my soil on any of my grows So I couldn't be much help on the issue.
I'm up there for the laziest grower award. Runner up to GMT

I'm sure a resourceful lad like yourself will have things sorted in no time
plus...there are many great growers on here that I'm sure will spread the joy of knowledge just as you have to others in need

I always think of growing the same as life. If it were to be flawless and have no problems...it would probably be pretty boring. It also makes the rewards that much more appreciated. Seems good times are are only highlighted by the bad

Great to be back chattin with ya :smile:

 

[Core]

i had to check TML...new growth is all yellow...and that make deformaties on the new leaves.....and that also makes'm stunned....i know what 2 do...but i'm not shure on what ph 2 use..if my soil is mixed with peat,white peat and perlite and some xtra perlite added....its soilless and 5.8 - 6.2 is used..but i always used higher values in this same mixture....this is trowing me way off here.....i know i need 2 lower but i'm not shure 100% shure to what level...

and you can se it that way TML...but i'm not my usual self when i encouter groprobs..seems my mood is also depending on my grow..lmfao...
its difficult 2 see it as just a minor problem along the way right now...not saying that you are't right here :wink:

yea my friend nice 2 have ya back ...

 

[Browser]

Yo Core,

How's that Karma dude? I'm feeling some weird vibes, not the Core I know! ...and I bet them plans is feeling it too, aight!?

So shake that off, roll a fatty, chill, and take it from the basics once again. Maybe this stuff is happening to help you keep your attention high, and "evolve" into a more versed grower.

I PM'ed you my impressions on your prob. If you would consider it appropiate, feel free to post the relevant parts here.

The important part is to stabilize the ph SLOWLY to where u feel confident. Then again, this comes from a guy that doesn't measure his ph neither. Mother nature has a way of keeping things under balance outdoors, and I leave it to her.

Welcome back TML

Hope that helps, and that your probs are sorted

 

[Browser]

Some extra aid (I hope!)




Safe, B

 

[StonedGrunt55]

Thats bad news my freind, i don't know much about ph but i found this maybe it'll give a hand

Interpretive Significance of pH and Solution Factors Controlling pH

pH values of natural waters are worthless!!
Yes! As a guide for determining how much acid or alkali needs to be added to change the pH by a required amount or as a measure of buffering capacity or corrosivity, experienced water chemists know that for reasons outlined below, that statement is true - especially when applied to natural uncontaminated waters such as scheme / tap waters and especially bore waters, with pH values within the range 4.5 - 8.2. Further, pH values within that range can be very unstable - i.e. variable over a short time period.
WHAT CHEMICAL CONSTITUENTS CONTROL pH?
a) In Scheme Waters and Bore Waters
Because of its solubility in water, the presence of carbon dioxide (CO2) in the atmosphere has a major influence on the chemistry and pH of water.
The pH of natural, i.e. uncontaminated, waters with pH values between 4.5 - 8.2 is controlled by the concentrations of bicarbonate anion, HCO3- (sometimes referred to as combined CO2) and free carbon dioxide - where the presence of free carbon dioxide in water lowers pH and bicarbonate elevates pH. It is the amount of bicarbonate (i.e. its alkalinity) in a natural water that determines its buffering capacity. Buffering capacity is the amount of resistance the pH of a water shows to additions of acid or alkali.
The presence of free, i.e. uncombined, carbon dioxide tends to lower the pH because it reacts with water to form carbonic acid thus:
CO2 + H2O = H2CO3
Contrarily, the presence of bicarbonate anion elevates pH because it mops up hydrogen ion thus:
H+ + HCO3 - = H2CO3
The overall reaction is represented by:
CO2 + H2O = H2CO3 = H+ + HCO3-
Thus at high CO2 concentrations the reaction is pushed to the right with the production of more H+ (i.e. pH is lowered). High bicarbonate levels (compared to CO2) mop up H+ with the result the reaction shifts to the left and a higher pH value is produced.

However, a complicating factor is that free carbon dioxide concentrations above about 0.5 mg/L in water are unstable when such waters are exposed to the atmosphere at sea level pressures. Under that condition carbon dioxide in excess of 0.5 mg/L will slowly escape from the water into the atmosphere. This is particularly the case with groundwater's which typically have carbon dioxide contents around 50 - 200 mg/L - as a result of biological activity within the aquifer. When these waters are pumped to the surface, the observed pH rises because the excess (acidic) carbon dioxide escapes. The pH will then rise to a stable value solely dependent on the water's bicarbonate content. For example, a bore water with 100 mg/L bicarbonate and 100 mg/L of free carbon dioxide will have an initial pH of 6.3 gradually rising to 8.2 after it has been exposed to the atmosphere and after which the carbon dioxide content has dropped to around 0.5 mg/L.
The same phenomenon although to a much lesser extent (because of their much lower CO2 contents), occurs with scheme (tap) water. Thus the conclusion - because the pH of natural waters are only stable after aeration, it is only the "after aeration" pH value which is stable and has any interpretative significance. To determine that value, aerate the water by tumbling a sample of it from one container to another, 30-40 times prior to measuring its pH.
In conclusion: interpret pH values with caution because a natural water with a lower pH than another may produce the higher pH after both are aerated!!
b) In Hydroponic Nutrient Solutions
Most commercial hydroponic nutrient concentrates contain no artificial pH buffers, free acids and negligible alkaline impurities such as bicarbonates and carbonates. Therefore hydroponic system pH values are essentially determined by the bicarbonate content of the water supply and the Phosphate content of the nutrient mixture only. Thus, with twin pack liquid nutrient mixtures, the pH of the working nutrient solution is usually determined by the pack containing the Phosphate i.e., the final pH is essentially not influenced by the presence or absence of the other pack in the diluted nutrient mixture.

Optimum pH for Hydroponics

The solubility of nutrients and their availability for uptake by plants in a hydroponic system is greatly influenced by the pH of the nutrient solution. Contrarily, although soil grown plants can grow successfully at relatively high soil pH values this is not the case in hydroponics where for nutrients to remain dissolved and suspended in the solution and therefore mobile, it is important to maintain the pH between 5.0 and 6.0 with an absolute maximum of 6.5.
Nutrients being constantly drawn from the nutrient reservoir and root exudates entering the nutrient solution can change the pH of the nutrient. Consequently the nutrient pH must be checked and adjusted on a regular basis. pH fluctuations are less at larger nutrient tank volumes.
Keep the pH Between 5.0 and 6.0
It is over this compromise pH range that all growth factors are catered for to produce optimal growth. If the pH is allowed to rise much above 6.0, some nutrients, including calcium, phosphorus, sulphate (and the trace elements copper, iron, manganese and zinc) can precipitate thus becoming immobile and unavailable for transport by the water flow to the roots.
The precise pH at which precipitation starts is determined by the combined concentrations of calcium, phosphorus and sulphate. Except for fertiliser water mixture combinations with low concentrations of these nutrients this problem commonly occurs at pH values of around 6.5.
In spite of this precipitation problem, some references advocate pH values well above 6.5 for some plant varieties i.e., conditions which risk depleted concentrations of the above mentioned elements.
Before following such advice you may wish to test for yourself whether or not this problem will occur with your water and nutrient mixture by performing the following simple test:

Adjust the pH of your diluted nutrient solution to your target pH of 6.5, 7.0 etc., and place about 200 ml in a clean, clear glass container. Stir the contents continuously for approximately 1 hour. Then, immediately after briefly stirring, place the glass in front of a bright light and closely examine the contents. The presence of fine white particles or flocculent/gelatinous particles verifies that precipitation has occurred and that that pH value is too high for optimal results. If uncertain of the results, cover the glass with a piece of paper and allow the mixture to stand for 24 hours. Any precipitate will then be evident by the presence of a white deposit either floating on the surface or on the bottom of the container.
Notes:
(a) The stirring over the 1 hour period simulates the water movement in an NFT system and accelerates the rate of precipitation.
(b) The stirring prior to the visual examination is to ensure that all particles lift up from the base of the glass and into the viewing zone for easier detection. Also, it is much easier to detect the presence of small particles when they are moving.
Comment on Common Recommendation of pH 6.2
Although this is a commonly recommended pH value, it has no scientific basis. It appears to have gained a sort of mythology status from the early days when the only cheap means for hobbyists to measure pH was by using the common bromothymol blue pH indicator sold by pet shops for maintenance of the pH of fish tank water. Because the lowest pH value able to be determined by that indicator is about 6.2, those values have unfortunately, become an entrenched recommendation by the hydroponic retail industry.
High pH values (i.e. above 6.0) are to be avoided more than low values - i.e. say, between 4.5 - 5.0.

Methods for Measuring pH

a) Colour Indicators
Although not precise, i.e. they will not distinguish between a pH of, say, 5.2 and 5.3, wide range colour pH indicators having good colour resolution (i.e. colour change red to orange to yellow to green to blue over the pH range 4 to 8) can be fast, extremely accurate, simple, reliable, user friendly and economical.
The method is based on the principle that the colour produced by the particular dye used in the indicator formulation is dependant on the pH of the solution.
A test is conducted by removing a small sample of nutrient from the nutrient tank, adding a drop of the indicator, mixing, then comparing the final solution colour with those on a coloured reference chart. Because of their fundamental accuracy and reliability, wide range pH indicators are the preferred method for measurement of pH in hydroponics.
Note that pool and aquarium pH indicators are usually not suitable for hydroponics because unlike Flairform's indicator, they produce the same colour at pH 4, 5, and 6 and therefore cannot warn of the need to add pH UP when the true pH is, say, 4.

b) Electronic pH Meters
pH meters employing a glass electrode are useful for precise pH measurement but require frequent calibration, proper storage and handling to ensure accuracy and reliability:
The principle on which such meters operate is based on the fact that when glass separates 2 aqueous solutions having different hydrogen ion concentrations, a voltage is developed between the two faces of the glass. The electronic meter itself is simply a very sensitive voltmeter to measure that voltage and is calibrated in terms of pH units instead of volts.
CALIBRATION
To ensure their accuracy, pH meters must be regularly 'calibrated' (i.e. tested and adjusted for accuracy) using, so called, standard pH buffer solutions which are made to an internationally agreed recipe. These are stable solutions that possess a specific pH value.
Proper calibration must always be conducted using at least two pH Buffers that differ in pH by at least three pH units over the pH range being used. This is to ensure that the correct, so called calibration "slope" is obtained.
Further, although it is a common practice amongst growers to only use one calibration buffer (usually buffer pH 7.0) it is a hazardous practice. This is because a normal/common result after calibrating using only pH buffer 7.0, is that if the electrode is placed in a pH buffer 4.0 solution the meter will read, say 4.4, instead of 4.0 - i.e. the software does not have the correct "slope".
This result simply empHasises that two pH buffers, differing by around 3 pH units, must always be used to guarantee proper calibration.
Note that although some manufacturers claim their pH meters require only a single point calibration that claim is simply not justifiable if high accuracy is desired.
pH Meter Problems
a) Accuracy Problems with pH Meters
Note that despite being properly calibrated it has been my frequent experience that different pH meters will produce significantly different pH readings on the same solutions - by as much as 0.5 pH units. This is especially the case with low conductivity waters and drinking waters with low total alkalinity.
This result simply shows that the specificity of the glass electrodes for hydrogen ion is not perfect.
b) Solving pH Electrode Problems
STORAGE
For a pH meter with a single combination electrode to work properly there must be an electrical connection between the electrode filling solution (usually potassium chloride - which is electrically conductive) and the sample solution. This is achieved via the use of a porous frit or wick in the glass wall separating the inner filling solution chamber from the sample. Both these devices allow the free (very slow) flow of the filling solution into the sample solution.
The most common cause of pH meter failure is due to failure of the electrode via blockage of this porous frit or wick. This is usually caused by dry storage of the electrode or leaving the electrode immersed for too long in supersaturated solutions. Dry storage causes dehydration of both the glass electrode and precipitation of salts within the interstices of the frit itself.
The results is reading drift, slow response times and decreased sensitivity.
To avoid these problems the electrode tip must be permanently stored in a specially formulated storage solution such as Flairform's pH Electrode Storage Solution. Further always perform all readings as quickly as practical. Also, do not immerse the electrode in the sample solution to a depth such that the level of the sample is above that of the filling solution on the inside of the electrode. Such a result will permit the sample solution to weep back into the electrode itself.
NOTE: Water or pH buffers are not suitable for long term storage of electrodes.
CLEANING
The glass tip of pH meter electrodes invariably become coated with impurities causing symptoms such as reading drift, slow response times and decreased sensitivity. Contamination may be so severe that re-calibration is not possible without prior cleaning. Minimise this problem by filtering potentially problem (i.e. greasy or highly turbid) water samples prior to performing a pH measurement. Inorganic based film deposits can be removed by using Flairform's pH Electrode Cleaner. Alternatively, grease etc. can be removed with acetone, methylated spirit or toluol. If toluol is necessary, rinse subsequently with acetone or methylated spirits and finally water.
Other more aggressive and successful methods of cleaning have included boiling (!!) nitric acid and caustic soda.
pH Adjustment
Before measuring the pH ensure that the nutrient is well stirred, especially after pH UP and DOWN are used.
If the nutrient pH is too high then add pH DOWN. Phosphoric acid is optimum for this purpose because it increases the nutrient's pH buffering capacity (helps minimise pH fluctuations) and is relatively safe to handle. Alternatively nitric acid has zero buffering capacity and is hazardous to use. Nevertheless, its use is preferable where high alkalinity waters are being used.
If the nutrient pH is too low then add pH UP. It is essential to pre dilute the pH UP dose into about 1 litre of raw water then stir the nutrient as you add this mixture. Failure to do this may cause permanent precipitation of essential nutrients. Also, when using "pH UP", precipitation problems can be minimised by ensuring the nutrient mixture is agitated rapidly near the point where the reagent strikes the surface of the nutrient. Also, if accidental overdosing to above 6.5 occurs, to prevent permanent precipitation and loss of essential elements, reduce the pH back, as quickly as possible, to below pH 6.0.
pH Up: pH Up contains 40% w/v potassium hydroxide. Contains no nuisance chemicals.
pH Down: pH Down contains 80% w/v phosphoric acid. This product is far safer than nitric acid and adds pH buffering capacity to the nutrient to help minimise pH fluctuations.

To tell the truth i didn't read it ALL but i found somethings intresting in it...goodluck core! i'll try to find something else for u...

 

[Core]

thx guys ..I just called the store i bought them in...i askt the clerck how this soils like the ph and he said 5.8 ......i've been adding 6.3 - 6.5 for over 2 - 3 grows ..
maybe it has had a good buffer in the soil...or something and it is failing now......i'l be flushing 2 night at 5.8...with a full feeding for there size...

 

[StonedGrunt55]

oh 2-3 grows & still u made a damn good job lol... atleast my soilless mixes ph is between 6.0 & 7.0). good u figured it out.

 

[Core]

yea seems this soil has a good buffer..the guy even said 2 me i did't had 2 ph 'm anymore...lol that weirdo from the shop ..hes trying 2 BS me ..ohw yea i said to the guy...then why is my ph level staying at 6.6 aprox i said 2 him.....'a moment passed' .....5.8 he said ...Lmao ...strange explenation ey.....

well i went tru and flushed the girls with 6.1 - 6.2 water for the first phaze...dont wanne hurt them 2 much....things are greening up as it is....its going slow but i think there's progress again after a night...when the pots dry out i'll be adding 6.0 water 2 correct things even more...

ohw went down this morning and cut my a other MF indica pheno...trichs where just milky...at week 9
i'm leaving the sativa pheno for a other week...seems she likes it a little longer...but man the sativa pheno has tops bigger then my fist ...about a colacan thick

 

[twistedtree]

Hey Core glad to hear things seem to be getting better. Say, you got any wisdom on caterpillars? I need more of a preventative attack. I've got neem oil, but it doesn't say anything about 'pillars on the label. Any home remedies you've come across?

 

[Core]

yea man here's some articles you need 2 read Twisted....

first is what you could use...and second link is a recepie by master thai..
http://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=53353

http://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=41330&highlight=mace

 

[twistedtree]

Dude...I love you :friends: Strictly in a growing pot sorta way Gonna blast them with some neem tonight and keep that up for a few days. If that doesn't work, it's time to bust out the BT. Thanks again, buddy! How's your garden going? Get everything worked out pH wise?

 

[Dr Dog]

so bro what is up with teh plants? need an update

 

[Core]

lol Twisted..your Twisted man...j/k ...that means it had some info you could use i guess ? hope you get'm soon :smile:..
and the ph thing..i think its going better...but i have 2 ride it out now i flushed them....untill they dry i can't do anything else...gonne take soil ph again in the morning 2 see if it keeps that way...just 2 be shure...



Hello Dr.Dog...
yea man its overdue...but this problem is geting in the way....i'll take some pics but its not all a pretty sight ..like i burnd the little PeeWee's whit the neem they are stunned also ..but that woz 2 be expected...
i a few my friend i'l update in a few :wink:

 

[Browser]

Hiya Core!

I'm glad to hear that your ph thing is sorting out. Very strange that the guy from the shop was so way off. Seems that doesn't happen only here on IC, hehe

Just a word of caution on the PW. Since you treated her with neen, you might want to wait 4 weeks (at least?) or so to make sure that it's been biodegraded. Else you could get a not so tasty surprise. On a side note tho, I don't know if the plant has to be "alive" when you count the days, or if part of the "safety time" can be counted while you cure it

On another side note, the cousin of the PW, PB has now officially started to flower outdoors. I think that she might just make it before mold is a big prob


Anyways, yeah, it's time for a photo update. Show us some real buds!

 

[Core]

he woz't wrong B..its just that the soil does't buffer as good as he would like 2 believe i think..but thing are turning for the better...my luck :smile:..

and i'm not worried ..it will take longer then 4 weeks 2 finish 'm...

and nice of ya 2 drop a pic of th PB ...hope she does't take 2 long on ya...you know the weather here ey...and it does't look good for a aftersummer

and a little update for you guys....
i'l show you the plants that had some probs...took a few 'bad' spot pics...growth woz stunned ....but they took off so you'll see the diffrence....


this is them now.....



but it seems its passing...see the new growth..and i just flushed them....they took right off again



they will make it..i hope :smile:

then just the girls that are finishing up....

TW x StrawD



2 MP5k's...1 more week aprox... trichs are getting milky as we speak



and the PeeWee...2 side branches broke off 3 or 4 days ago..i'm testing a quickdrynug....its not bad at all but it needs a week more...verry tasty..and nice smell...



then i'll finish with the last Mental floss i have...the sativa pheno..she's putting some nanners out on her last week..pitty though..but i think i'm gonne keep her...aswome thick tops she has...a fist+ thick ....just take a look...





well hope the probs are gone for ever ..but that would be 2 much 2 ask i think ..
Nway thanks for joining the adventures once again