Tutorial Ventilation 101

[flylowgethigh]

One sensor pod finally stopped talking with the display module. For $27 for the set, and over 3 years, that’s OK with me. I was ordering another when the idea to post the recommendation came up.

I decided to run the dehuey last night to get the RH down. The dehuey heats the air too, so I wanted to be able to see the results as the night progressed, as I lay in bed in the other part of the house. The current run is half way through flowering and humidity is more important I think than cool temps at this stage to prevent mold. I liked the results I saw on the monitor.

During lights on the humidity and temps at the soil are several points different from the tops, but at night they are a lot closer.

 

[growsjoe1]

Thre years is better than I thought.

Thanks flylow. This will be a tool that I add.

 

[flylowgethigh]

I got another set of these cause the old #2 sensor pod quit working. The new #2 transmits on the same frequency and now I have 2 remote displays reading the tent info, and spare #1 and #3 pods. So one display in the lung room, one near my bed at night.

#1 is on the intake air filter, #2 is at soil height, #3 is at canopy height. I can see the air changing as it moves through the tent. This allows me to decide if the lung room or tent devices like fans or the light need to be adjusted.

 

[growsjoe1]

@flylowgethigh Those sensors add helpful info from particular areas of the grow. You have all the goodies to maintain an optimum environment: a humidifier, dehumidifier, good ventilation, a lung room, and proper lighting levels. Having made that effort definitely shows in your grows.

I was wondering. What controller are you using? If any, are you making adjustments based on the sensors?

I like being able to see how things like a Huey or dehuey, wall banger ac unit, space heater, etc… affect the steady state conditions without having to get up and go look during the night.

I got another set of these cause the old #2 sensor pod quit working. The new #2 transmits on the same frequency and now I have 2 remote displays reading the tent info, and spare #1 and #3 pods. So one display in the lung room, one near my bed at night.

#1 is on the intake air filter, #2 is at soil height, #3 is at canopy height. I can see the air changing as it moves through the tent. This allows me to decide if the lung room or tent devices like fans or the light need to be adjusted.

 

[CharlesU Farley]

My tent makes its own humidity because the leaves are transpiring. It can run 20 points of rh higher than the lung room. I distribute the incoming air at the base of the plants and suck it out at the top of the tent. The clip fans make sure the air inside the plants on all the leaves get good circulation.

All that water that the roots take up has to go somewhere

Here's what I do:

 

[flylowgethigh]

@flylowgethigh Those sensors add helpful info from particular areas of the grow. You have all the goodies to maintain an optimum environment: a humidifier, dehumidifier, good ventilation, a lung room, and proper lighting levels. Having made that effort definitely shows in your grows.

I was wondering. What controller are you using? If any, are you making adjustments based on the sensors?

Thanks. I only use a controller for the lights. It is a Growers Choice 2 channel. The fans are on constant settings to get enough airflow and balance the tent pressure. I try to keep the temp and humidity in the lung room as cool and dry as I can. If I can’t get the lung room cool enough then the light power is reduced. The goal is to keep the top temp sensor under 80*F, less is better. I screwed that up the other day and tric balls were hurt. There are 6 fans inside the tent, plus the two exit fans and the inlet fan air distribution.

I put a lot of effort into the water reservoir keeping oxygenated water at 73*F or so, at a 6.3-6.5 pH. It comes from the hot side of the tap.

 

[growsjoe1]

Thanks. I only use a controller for the lights. It is a Growers Choice 2 channel. The fans are on constant settings to get enough airflow and balance the tent pressure. I try to keep the temp and humidity in the lung room as cool and dry as I can. If I can’t get the lung room cool enough then the light power is reduced. The goal is to keep the top temp sensor under 80*F, less is better. I screwed that up the other day and tric balls were hurt. There are 6 fans inside the tent, plus the two exit fans and the inlet fan air distribution.

I put a lot of effort into the water reservoir keeping oxygenated water at 73*F or so, at a 6.3-6.5 pH. It comes from the hot side of the tap.

Yep, you pay attention to the details. I agree water temp makes a difference. Plants don't react well to cold feet.

On your recomendation I already ordered the

ORIA Indoor Outdoor Thermometer with 3 Wireless Sensors 30$, great buy.​

Should be here tomorrow...again thanks

 

[flylowgethigh]

You’re welcome. Take care of their environment and they will grow…. This will make me into an April fool.

 

[LndRcLvr]

Hello guys. Could any UK folk recommend a suitable carbon filter and fan combo to exhaust a 70cm x 70cm x 200cm sized cupboard grow ? I know it's going to be quite small.

 

[exploziv]

Something like a 4inch fan and filter kit from mars dimmed on low could work for that.
Or, if you want better quality, any other good brand fan that is at least 50 m3/h or 30 cfm + a filter that is over that rating in same flange size as the fan. I would get one that is higher capacity but has a dimmer or multiple selectablr speeds if possible.

 

[DARKSIDER]

Hello guys. Could any UK folk recommend a suitable carbon filter and fan combo to exhaust a 70cm x 70cm x 200cm sized cupboard grow ? I know it's going to be quite small.

I think exploziv has hit the nail on the head cant go wrong with that suggestion..

 

[Mastermind23]

I like to run an Ac infinity cloudline t6 with 683 m³ airflow on speed 1-4 to exaust an 80x80x180cm growspace.
Level 1 68m³
Level 2 136m³
Level 3 204m³
Level 4 272m³.

I guess the Level 1 and Level 4 won't be used as much as Level 2 and Level 3, but could be useful, too.

Now I need a filter. I have a 480m³ PK Filter which I guess is too big and thus works inefficient for my tent and also would not work on Level 1 ( As it needs 120m³ minimum throughput)
But I could also use it up to Level 7.



So I also have a 5 Meter exaust hose with 3 90° angles and i would use an 125mm to 150mm adapter between the fan and the filter. So am I right, that the Fan looses Air flow through this ??
Anyone can tell me how much % airflow I loose ?

I have passive supplyair two times as big as the exaust and 300W of LED power and want to grow all season.

If I forget to mention something important please let me know. If I am totally wrong please let me know.

 

[exploziv]

A bigger filter means it will run for longer without smell escaping. So, if you can get the air to move through it, it will get cleaned of smells. Or, that'swhat should happen.
I wouldn't fixate too much on the actual numbers but try to get fresh air moving over the plants at all times and also mantain temps. If you do that, there's enaugh airflow.

 

[Ca++]

The AC fan controllers don't start at 10% then 20% and so on. They are quite linear steps though, once they get going. Which isn't a good thing. If you consider your figures, than shifting from 1st to 2nd, is 100% faster. While shifting from 2nd to 3rd, is just 50% faster. Buy the time you shift from 8th to 9th, It's more like 10% faster than the 100% faster incremental change you got between 1st and 2nd. Many people sit in them lower gears all the time (sorry, them lower speeds) and could really use better resolution.
IIRC they start about 22%. I mapped it all out, and how I would fix it. It's here somewhere..

I have never seen a minimum filter speed recommendation, and welcome it. I have long known there was one, and why, but have been unable to factor this into builds. With the right figures, I can no doubt use a smaller filter than I have. And it really might work better. I will circle back to this manufacturer and see what I can draw from their figures. That's a great help.

I have a 4" fan, and a 140 tent. It might be running about 40%, I really don't know. It's a high pressure fan though, a centrifugal EC one, so has no problems with stacking up filters and 90 degree turns. If your fan has pressure figures as your filter likely has pressure drop figures, you can get a better idea of what air volume the two together allow. Expect half what the fan says, for that kinda style. Meaning to shift 120 though, you might be on number 4, after them bends. Maybe number 5. However, you don't need anything like that air movement. Your tent is about a cubic meter, and doesn't need emptying every 30 seconds.
Least, I presume the 120 is per hour. You did say it's big. Which is also an easier job for the fan. as it will have less pressure drop, eroding what pressure a TT can do (about 450pa I guess)

I know I have all this in another thread some place. With examples, using every fan type we can get.

 

[Mastermind23]

The AC fan controllers don't start at 10% then 20% and so on. They are quite linear steps though, once they get going. Which isn't a good thing. If you consider your figures, than shifting from 1st to 2nd, is 100% faster. While shifting from 2nd to 3rd, is just 50% faster. Buy the time you shift from 8th to 9th, It's more like 10% faster than the 100% faster incremental change you got between 1st and 2nd. Many people sit in them lower gears all the time (sorry, them lower speeds) and could really use better resolution.
IIRC they start about 22%. I mapped it all out, and how I would fix it. It's here somewhere..

I have never seen a minimum filter speed recommendation, and welcome it. I have long known there was one, and why, but have been unable to factor this into builds. With the right figures, I can no doubt use a smaller filter than I have. And it really might work better. I will circle back to this manufacturer and see what I can draw from their figures. That's a great help.

I have a 4" fan, and a 140 tent. It might be running about 40%, I really don't know. It's a high pressure fan though, a centrifugal EC one, so has no problems with stacking up filters and 90 degree turns. If your fan has pressure figures as your filter likely has pressure drop figures, you can get a better idea of what air volume the two together allow. Expect half what the fan says, for that kinda style. Meaning to shift 120 though, you might be on number 4, after them bends. Maybe number 5. However, you don't need anything like that air movement. Your tent is about a cubic meter, and doesn't need emptying every 30 seconds.
Least, I presume the 120 is per hour. You did say it's big. Which is also an easier job for the fan. as it will have less pressure drop, eroding what pressure a TT can do (about 450pa I guess)

I know I have all this in another thread some place. With examples, using every fan type we can get.

Yes it´s per hour. You mean active carbon filters needs 22% minimum airflow ?
So my 480m³/h Filter ( prima Klima K1603) needs 105,6 m³/h Fan to filter the odor sufficiently?
So you think the odor will be already filtered with the 136 m³/h the fan offers on Level 2 ?

As I won't prbly use Level 5+, because of the noise, I think I could go with a 260m³/h (prima klima K1602) and be cheaper, more silent and efficient.

The question with the K1602(260m3/h Filter) is : Would it still work on Level 4 as the fan exceeds 260m³/h delivering 272 m³/h, which is sigtly above the Filter maximum.

So if Level 4 of the AC Infinity T6 ( 272m³7h) still works with the K1602 (260m³/h) it´s a nobrainer for me.

Anyone has experience if the filter will work with a slightly higher airflow`?

 

[Mastermind23]

A bigger filter means it will run for longer without smell escaping. So, if you can get the air to move through it, it will get cleaned of smells. Or, that'swhat should happen.
I wouldn't fixate too much on the actual numbers but try to get fresh air moving over the plants at all times and also mantain temps. If you do that, there's enaugh airflow.

Makes sense. I have heard the usage of a filter with low airflow( out of the producers given optimal range will shorten the lifetime,too) So it won't run longer, if this is right.

So best would be to use a Filter which is working within the optimal range most of the time.
So if I need Level2 and 3 most of the time I should go with the smaller one right ?
I did not mention it yesterday but I just want to know which Filter I should opt in.

These are the ones that are available here:
Prima Klima IndustryK1603(max.480m³/h) or the Prima Klima industry K1602 (max.260m³/h) or a PK ECO-filter with 360m³ max.

Rhino Pro is also available here, but last time this one just did not filter anything, so I would like to go with Prima Klima more likely. Could be a Monday-filter, but I had better experience with Prima Klima Industry Line.


I have written an email to the manufacturer.

 

[exploziv]

I think the low range is for when flow it so restricted the filter barely works. If you get enaugh air through a filter that you can clearly feel it on the other end, it is enaugh. If it's clearly barely going, then yeah any ammount of clogging will put more strain on the vent so that is not a safe use anyway. Generally, more surface means less strain. You just have to overcome minimum pressure needed to go through. So yeah, good to keep those numbers in mind. But you might try it and it could work even at lower speed/capacity. I generally get big filters and big vents but speed selectable or dimmable ones. Now the vents are well rated for the filter but most of the times I run pretty low on the dimmer and they still work wonderfully for many years.

 

[Ca++]

Yes it´s per hour. You mean active carbon filters needs 22% minimum airflow ?
So my 480m³/h Filter ( prima Klima K1603) needs 105,6 m³/h Fan to filter the odor sufficiently?
So you think the odor will be already filtered with the 136 m³/h the fan offers on Level 2 ?

As I won't prbly use Level 5+, because of the noise, I think I could go with a 260m³/h (prima klima K1602) and be cheaper, more silent and efficient.

The question with the K1602(260m3/h Filter) is : Would it still work on Level 4 as the fan exceeds 260m³/h delivering 272 m³/h, which is sigtly above the Filter maximum.

So if Level 4 of the AC Infinity T6 ( 272m³7h) still works with the K1602 (260m³/h) it´s a nobrainer for me.

Anyone has experience if the filter will work with a slightly higher airflow`?

Your fan can't go below about 22%

Number one, isn't 10%. Number one, is the slowest speed, about 22% of the fans maximum.

Number two, is a big step from number one. About 40% iirc.

I looked for the thread I did, but while I did find one of duct losses as a follow up thread, the actual thread was missing from my reasults

 

[Ca++]

Found it. It was part of another thread

Free Fan, Save Money and reduce noise massively.

Okay, a bit heavy on the headline. Many will know, from posts like the 3~ pumps thread, that motors are changing. Like our electric bills. A typical 1.2 tent uses a 6" fan, rated around 80w. Costs about 70-120 for a proper rvk style. The new kid on the block, is the EC motor. It uses...

www.icmag.com

Speed1=23.5%
Sp2=31.5%
3=39
49
56
64
72
80.5
88.5
98



The problem is, moving from speed1 to speed2 isn't a 10% increase. From 24-32 is near 40% faster.
1-2 = +40% faster
2-3 = +30%
3-4 = +25%

+10%
+10%
+10%

40% Jump is an oversight. If I can only go from 24 - 99 in 10 steps, I would like 15% steps

 

[exploziv]

Simple map range coding on any microcontroller to achive that. Should be supported by the used hardware, unless they went super cheap with no microcontroler. Honestly it's the same for lights, the percent means nothing if you don't check power draw or light output to know what the knob did.