US hits Iran with toughest penalties since 1979 siege

[dreamdancer]

Now what would a huge US bomb be aimed at?

Nestled deep in George Bush’s latest $190 billion request to Congress for emergency funding for the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan is a tantalising little item that has received scant attention.

The US Department of Defence has asked for an additional $88 million to modify B2 stealth bombers so that they can carry a 30,000lb bomb called the massive ordnance penetrator (or MOP, in the disarming acronymic vernacular of the military). The MOP is an advanced form of a “bunker buster”, an air-delivered weapon with an explosive capacity to destroy targets deep underground. Explaining the request, the Administration says it is in response to an “urgent operational need from theatre commanders”. What kind of emergency could that be?

It’s possible that the US Air Force wants more firepower in the hunt for Osama bin Laden and al-Qaeda as they skulk in their caves in Afghanistan. But that wouldn’t require stealth bombers – the sleek, black-skinned, radar-dodging darts of the US military. The Americans own the skies over Afghanistan and Iraq and could, if they wished, blanket the two countries with all manner of bombardment from a few thousand feet in broad daylight.

So what lies somewhere between Iraq and Afghanistan that might demand the urgent deployment of a stealth aircraft that can quietly drop a 30,000lb bomb and destroy something several storeys below ground? The secret wine cellars in Tehran that house the illicit stash of vintage clarets belonging to the Iranian President, Mahmoud Ahmadinejad? The vast collection of grey polyester suits and Iranian goody bags that lie in wait for the next batch of luckless British sailors?

Pat yourself on the back if you correctly identified the subterranean nuclear enrichment facilities operated by the Iranian Government in its pursuit of an epoch-altering Bomb.

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/comment/columnists/gerard_baker/article2741225.ece

 

[okwildfire]

"Many a man will have the courage to die gallantly, but will not have the courage to say, or even to think, that the cause for which he is asked to die is an unworthy one."

"Neither a man nor a crowd nor a nation can be trusted to act humanely or to think sanely under the influence of a great fear. "

"Patriotism is the willingness to kill and be killed for trivial reasons. "

Bertrand Russell FTW! **** the war mongers.

and a flamming communist???? hmmm???

 

[Guest]

Maybe someone should sanction the US for flying 6 nuclear warheads over everyone's head for no reason. Maybe someone should sanction the US for bombing and occupying a sovereign nation and wiping out 3% of the entire population. Maybe someone should sanction the US for using depleted uranium weapons that are sending our soldiers home with cancer, and causing Iraqi women to give birth to puddles of flesh. Maybe someone should sanction the US for allowing mercenaries to roam and murder freely within Iraq and paying them more than our own soldiers. Maybe someone should sanction the US..........ad infinitum.

Not holier than thou....we (the USA) are among the least holy.

I mean, here we have in the middle east a country with nuclear weapons and over 500 UN resolutions against it, and nobody has batted an eye. They refuse oversight of any of their nuclear programs, steal their water from other countries, and have ousted over 4 MILLION people from their homes with guns and bulldozer forcing them to live as refugees in the middle of a desert in tent cities, but again, nobody has batted an eye. This nation is the FIRST nation to ever pull off a terrorist attack, and has been linked to just about EVERY terror attack the world has seen including the Lucitania, USS Liberty, Estonia, OKC bombing, Columbine, JFK, and even 911 just to mention a few, yet nobody has even bat an eye. That nation is Israel, the leading terrorist nation on the planet....

.....and here we sit today attacking their mortal enemies for them absolutely frickin clueless to what's going on. Sheesh.

 

[zymos]

This nation is the FIRST nation to ever pull off a terrorist attack, and has been linked to just about EVERY terror attack the world has seen including the Lucitania, USS Liberty, Estonia, OKC bombing, Columbine, JFK, and even 911 just to mention a few, yet nobody has even bat an eye.

I think you should put that in your sig.

Israel also shot Martin Luther King and Bobby Kennedy, faked the moon landing, and, since Jews don't celebrate Christmas, they killed Santa Claus.

 

[HCSmyth]

So, Santa was real until those bastards did him in!

 

[loflogro]

The American - Thanks buddy... I promise that I got a lot more out of my service than I gave. Hopefully turning up the heat will put an end to it without military action, it has worked with other nations in the past so hopefully it will once again. I do wish that everyone could harness nuclear power without ill intent, unfortunately when you have nations that have vowed to eradicate other groups of people and are led by radicals such as Ahmadinejad, it just can’t be allowed. There are other methods of nuclear power under development, methods that aren’t capable of producing weapons grade material, maybe that will one day be a staple as a source of energy.

PazVerdeRadical - I know you said you wouldn’t respond or debate, I completely respect that, but I do have to respond. IMHO, you are off base with if they can’t have it then nobody can. In a utopian society that would sound like a fair statement, but unfortunately we aren’t at that place and the bottom line is that people who are doing things like openly funding terrorism and advocating the destruction of other nations simply can’t be allowed to harness weapons capable of such devastation. Just like guns and violent offenders, it would be ignorant to allow people with that track record to do as they please and load up at any local pawn shop… granted these people still get their hands on guns, like Iran may very well get their hands on nukes, but how can we stand back and not attempt to stop or hinder this process. I do agree with the safer forms of energy, even nuclear energy via the methods I mentioned earlier.

Nycdfan042 - what about the children?… yeah, they would suffer, as they are now. Welcome to an imperfect world… but maybe their suffering will lead to a better life for the children’s children. We dropped two nukes on Japan, it was a horrible event, although I feel it was necessary, and those children and families definitely suffered. But after the Japanese rebuilding efforts (which the U.S. played a leading role in) look at their society today. They thrive via capitalism, are one of the most technologically advanced nations in the world and have a high standard of living… a standard of living that I don’t believe would be nearly as good had they not gone through that “Tearing down and rebuilding process”.

Farmer Joe - We really can’t afford it right now, on many levels. Hopefully we can get enough of a resolution to these things that we can bring everyone home and focus on fighting to make the homeland better for awhile. I would love to see an America where we focused the majority of our energy on us, but sometimes focusing our energy on other nations is actually focusing the energy on us. We just have to become more wise in deciding which situations fall into that category and more prudent in how we tackle those situations.

USA - I really appreciate your post, very well thought out and presented. I do feel that we have grown soft, but I don’t believe that we aren’t capable of shaking off that demeanor and stepping up when called to do so… we’ve shown we can, just look at the way our nation rallied after 9/11. I do agree our government has gotten way to big, the law books are so cluttered that nothing can be accomplished other than true criminals finding loopholes to get off… and our government continues to try to wrangle in more power and control. Hillary scares the hell out of me, especially with her ideas on a national health care system. We have an amazing healthcare system with some of the most brilliant minds working in it. A lot of them make a lot of money, and I’m OK with that. A combination of love of what they do and financial gains has led to the development of so many procedures and technology that wouldn’t be around if there wasn’t a gain to be had. Look at the incredible skills of a heart surgeon, yes it’s going to cost me out the ass to get a new heart, but I’m happy you’re making a good buck for your skills so I’ll say thanks and go live because of those skills.
I also agree that Israel can take care of themselves. My beliefs are Biblical, which members here may or may not agree with and I respect that stance, but it’s a part of who I am and I would be amiss to leave it out. According to my Bible, Israel won’t be defeated again, so I do believe they will be fine in the long run, but that doesn’t mean they won’t suffer from various actions and reactions. I have served beside quite a few Israeli soldiers, a great group of guys (a few wore cologne in the field which I didn’t appreciate “aim for the smell!”) and I feel that they are close allies, but I’m not so foolish to think that couldn’t one day change. You often have a best friend until you loan him a dollar or some other even creates a divide, then the gloves come off and the past is history.

Zymos - your presentation makes it sound as if we randomly went around dropping nukes for the hell of it. It would be fantastic if all nations could disarm all their nukes and we could live in a world without that fear. Do you think that if we got rid of ours that everyone else would? … of course not. It would just put us in a position to no longer be the strongest nation in the world. It’s an ugly world, someone has got to be on top, and from my standpoint being number one is number one.

NYCD042 - a follow up on your other comment. Disarming nukes is simply a dismantling process and storage of the materials, they don’t have to be detonated to be rendered inert. I wouldn’t be surprised if there were bombs dropped on Iran before President Bush leaves office, I pray that it won’t take place, but I also pray that if it doesn’t take place that our next leader will have the gumption to do it if circumstances dictate the necessity.

Northern_Greens - It sure won’t be the same man, but it wasn’t the same as when your Father turned 21 either. Whether the changes are for better or worse, you have to make the decision to rise above the garbage and make the best out of the situation at hand. Sorry to sound like the motivational speaker, but from my van down by the river I’ve been through a lot, and I’ve approached it both ways, from rising above it to wallowing in it… you have to make your own silver lining.


USA - Once again, well said.

Jack D Ripper - There isn’t a soldier who has fought who hasn’t asked themselves if what they are fighting for is a worthy cause. Whether they decide otherwise and speak out or perform their duties is up for debate, but every one of them has questioned their objective and made their peace on way or the other. If that is your view of Patriotism then I truly feel for you, you’re missing out on a great thing.

Kaos! - That was great man, totally unexpected and gave me a great laugh… I needed that when I was knee deep in such a heavy topic… much appreciated.

dreamdancer - Good read, well put together. Couldn’t get the link to work but probably didn’t need to.

Stoned2Death - Once again, presentation leads to misconception… something we run into a lot with our marijuana battles. We weren’t randomly flying nukes over everyone’s head for no reason. Mistakes were made, granted they were horrible mistakes but the danger was over exaggerated. These weren’t detonation ready nukes hovering over, there were more steps needed to render them active. But bottom line is that mistakes were made, whether it was in decision making or in procedure, and if you’ve followed up on the story, a large number of people have been punished, including high ranking officials that lost their positions. No matter how big of a goof, you can’t remove the human factor when humans are involved. Have you ever made a mistake? Were you punished for that mistake? They goofed and were punished and protocol improvements are being implemented to hopefully avoid this in the future.
As far as your other comments, you are way off base on most of it. Which, to a point is understandable. The combination of a horrible media machine fueling false notions and the fact that you just haven’t been there done that, I wouldn’t expect you to have all the facts, nor do I… but I would love to see you do a little research on what you’ve said, and if you prove your statements to be correct, please post links to that information so that we can all be enlightened. Also, I saw a lot of Iraqi babies but never a new born puddle of flesh. I did see a lot of those babies receive a level of health care they had never known and helped build walls for a school where many of them are also seeing a level of education that would have never before been realized by the masses. I also saw some of the most downtrodden women when I first made it to Afghanistan, living in fear of their own husbands and general society rules. When I left I saw a lot of those women wearing uniforms on their way to practice with their new soccer team. Is it all chocolate covered feel good stories like that?… No, atrocities abound. The most sobering thing I heard was when an Iraqi soldier told me “We don’t want you here, but we don’t want you to leave. We want to be free and we want to take care of ourselves, but we can’t do it alone, yet”

Sorry this reply got so long guys… but I love some good debate and possibly allowing people to see things from an angle they may not have before. It takes more than one angle to make a square, and if you don’t have enough angles to look at then your view may not be complete.

 

[dreamdancer]

The Iranian foreign ministry declared today that the sanctions were illegal and would not work.

Spokesman Mohammad Ali Hosseini said: "The hostile American policies towards the respectable people of Iran and the country's legal institutions are contrary to international law, without value and - as in the past - doomed to failure."

Beijing and Moscow have already come out against the sanctions, with President Vladimir Putin of Russia comparing the Bush administration to "mad people wielding razor blades"

The Chinese foreign ministry today said the penalties would "only complicate the issue".

"Dialogue and negotiations are the best approach to resolving the Iranian nuclear issue," it said in a statement.

Growing frustration within the Bush administration at the blocking strategy of Moscow and Beijing against any United Nations measures on Iran is becoming increasingly evident.

Nicholas Burns, US assistant secretary of state, suggested that Russia and China are propping up President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad's regime.

"The Russian government should stop selling arms to Iran and the Chinese government should stop investing in Iran," he told the BBC.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2007/10/26/wiran226.xml

 

[Guest]

You're not going to justify the war in Iraq for any reason with me. We have no business in Afghanistan or Iraq. Neither had anything to do with 911, and Israel is the terrorist state pulling off these attacks. Once you realize that, your whole argument goes out the window.

The US's job is NOT policing the world, and we do NOT have the right to attack sovereign nations and bring about regime change.

Also, I'm not going for a "human error goof" when we're talking about nuclear warheads. Those things were loaded on that aircraft on purpose. If you're from within the military you know damn well missiles with nuclear warheads don't just "accidentally" get attached to aircraft and flown across the country. That's total bs.

 

[WoW maannnn]

. im sure theyre gonna bomb iran b4 bushi jr leaves office..thatd be a nice poll LOL

or do it so he DOESN'T leave...

 

[mark6699331]

He Loflogrow, i don't belive personally for the reasons we are in irag, but i want to thank you for being willing to serve for me my family and my country. Whether i agree with you or the administration, i do support our boys and girls and give you a heart felt thank you.

m

 

[Yummybud]

what's weird is I was watching this local Iranian program and this guy was talking about how in the U.S 50% of iranians are actually for a U.S invasion of Iran and 50 are against it.

this guy hosts the local iranian program here

he was saying how most Iranians want the current gov't overthrown but they don't want the U.S to do it because of it's effect on national pride.

most Iranians including my Iranian family don't go back to Iran because of the ****ed up gov't after the Islamics revolution. Most of Iranian population outside of Iran are all immigrants that left after the revolution started and now Iran is run by an arab loving gov't. Iran won't ever be a great country again until there is another revolution to overthrow the Islamic government. A U.S invasion will just turn the country into a flaming shithole like Iraq.

Iran is still a cool country other than it's lame government and rules.

 

[Yummybud]

 

[mark6699331]

Wow yummybud what a beautifull country. THose mountain backgrounds are awesome and nice snow pics. Makes it more human. What a catch 22 delimna for the iranian citizens. I'd love to visit if it were possible.

m

 

[nycdfan042]

yea man i agree id love to be able to visit iran one day without getting put in jail or killed or something...

 

[Yummybud]

doubt you'd get jailed, unless you start protesting about the gov't or spreading anti-gov't propoganda or if they think you're a spy.... otherwise you should be safe.

people in the U.S especially get brainwashed and think Iran and other foreign countries look like "kazakstan" as Borat and others portray, with horses pulling cars and so inferior to the U.S.

some more cool pics of people and scenes.

 

[Pops]

So,Yummy, when the war starts, which side will you and your nerdy,Chinese boyfriend be fighting on?

 

[Yummybud]

lol I knew old pops was going to make the chinese knee toucher joke again.

yes pops I have a chinese boyfriend, we are going on a romantic cruise to China soon.

(joking if anyone doesn't know what I'm talking about lol).

 

[okwildfire]

lol I knew old pops was going to make the chinese knee toucher joke again.

yes pops I have a chinese boyfriend, we are going on a romantic cruise to China soon.

ohhhh dddaaannnggggg..well have fun i guess? boom chica bow wow..que the 70's porn music..

 

[mark6699331]

Reminds me of prague. Beautifulll country. Thanks much for enlightening us about this modern country. TOo bad we all can't get along.

m

 

[Yummybud]

well Iran also has a lot of ancient villages. that are 2000 years old.

I'd hate to see an american invasion as we all know what's going to happen after..... there will be a taco bell and BK on every street corner and everyone will be talking about the latest news on Paris Hilton. Actually before the Islamic revolution there were Mcdonalds etc in Iran lol. I'd like the Islamic gov't removed but wouldn't want Iranian culture replaced with U.S culture. Not that there is anything wrong with the U.S... but it's wrong to ruin an ancient civilization and culture.