U.S. Government spying on entire U.S., to nobody's surprise

[gaiusmarius]

Ron Paul warned about this in 1984
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o2ku8a3DvFA&feature=youtu.be


But we libertarians are told we are wearing our tin foil hats and we get called names. Well, you republicrats can go fk yourselves too.


Here's another tinfoil hat prediction, you know the online backup services like carbonite or the credit protection services? Yup, no doubt about it.


Lastly, So what about all this? What are you going to do about it? Twirl a sign somewhere? Seriously what are you going to DO about it? Write to your congressman LOL ? What? Revolution? No you're not. Wil anyone Do anything even remotely similar to what we did in the late 60's and early 70's when real protests were going on?
The answer is nothing. A whole generation who "protests" by typing on message boards and volunteering for the military.No balls, no brains and definitely no integrity. LOL
You don't get what you want, you get what you deserve.

NONE of this comes to any surprise to anyone who has been following libertarian views or austrian economics. Try reading the Freeman sometime from Foundation for Economic Education and learn how all of this is connected and if you are appalled by this now, wait, they're just laying the groundwork to fuck us all real good.

There's only one possible way to change this and that's not going to happen.

this thread will not survive if you make posts like this. you insult a whole generation and a political party. you need to post your point of view without insulting anyone, specially not only 1 of the parties. either they are all crap, or it's political.

this big brother 1984 shit, has been run by both parties, so plenty of blame to go around. i know it's tempting to go further, but we need to stay on topic if we want this discussion to remain possible.

edited to add after later reread : oops i seem to have misread tudo's post. thought he singled out the reps when the word was actually republicrats. my bad.

 

[Hydrosun]

ideology, philosophy, and human rights. playing for a red or blue team helps the status quo. nationalism is just as evil as arguing blue or red. we are all humans, born into unequal slavery. improving the total human condition without immorally scarfing anyone is a worthy goal for all of us, young and old a like. this 29 year old former government employee has my thanks and admiration.

 

[bentom187]

Home Depot Co-Founder: We Should Throw Edward Snowden a Party -

[YOUTUBEIF]7rMtKgLMEl8[/YOUTUBEIF]

 

[CannaBunkerMan]

this thread will not survive if you make posts like this. you insult a whole generation and a political party. you need to post your point of view without insulting anyone, specially not only 1 of the parties. either they are all crap, or it's political.

this big brother 1984 shit, has been run by both parties, so plenty of blame to go around. i know it's tempting to go further, but we need to stay on topic if we want this discussion to remain possible.

Or what? You'll censor it? Let the conversation take it's course. We may have to put on our adult pants, and ignore trolls as surface.

 

[redbudduckfoot]

Lol. Art imitating Life.

Rbdf

 

[gaiusmarius]

Or what? You'll censor it? Let the conversation take it's course. We may have to put on our adult pants, and ignore trolls as surface.

if not the thread will be in violation to the terms of use which we all agreed to abide by when we joined this site. threads that go over the line tend to get binned yes. we don't like to encourage topics that cause extreme friction between the members, hence no politics and no religion.

this is not a matter of my opinion, this is a matter of experience, even if i don't bin it, admin or another supermod will do so. so take my words in the friendly way they were meant. i'm enjoying the conversation, last thing i want is to see such an important issue get binned because people couldn't keep the discussion insult free.

 

[Grass Lands]

Or what? You'll censor it? Let the conversation take it's course. We may have to put on our adult pants, and ignore trolls as surface.

you beat me to it...well said CBM.

 

[Hermanthegerman]

I don´t care, aren´t we living in a Matrix?

 

[Hydrosun]

I don´t care, aren´t we living in a Matrix?

We are living in the matrix, so we shouldn't stick to the Agent Smith script. Nationalism or parasitism only serve to enslave us. We should explore how best to help our neighbor be free from tyranny instead of justifying one immoral political party / nationality. We are all born equal and our level of freedom depends a lot on the quality of our birth and the morality of our neighbors.

I wonder how well the NSA has attached Hydroson to my real life identities? Scores of people (pot heads mostly) know me IRL and as HS. Under the laws of this lawless nation a schedule ONE drug criminal such as myself is supposed to be caged, therefore I am not a big fan of government spying. That goes for ALL GOVERNMENTS and ALL POLITICAL FACTIONS.

Until cannabis is free and UNREGULATED I will have a lot to hide

 

[Tudo]

Vintage Twilight Zone Episode In Full:

The Obsolete Man

http://vimeo.com/15365268

 

[Storm Shadow]

http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread952817/pg1

ECHELON The Real Threat To Our Privacy!

 

[bentom187]

Why Metadata Matters


In response to the recent news reports about the National Security Agency's surveillance program, President Barack Obama said today, "When it comes to telephone calls, nobody is listening to your telephone calls." Instead, the government was just "sifting through this so-called metadata." The Director of National Intelligence James Clapper made a similar comment last night: "The program does not allow the Government to listen in on anyone’s phone calls. The information acquired does not include the content of any communications or the identity of any subscriber."

What they are trying to say is that disclosure of metadata—the details about phone calls, without the actual voice—isn't a big deal, not something for Americans to get upset about if the government knows. Let's take a closer look at what they are saying:
•They know you rang a phone sex service at 2:24 am and spoke for 18 minutes. But they don't know what you talked about.
•They know you called the suicide prevention hotline from the Golden Gate Bridge. But the topic of the call remains a secret.
•They know you spoke with an HIV testing service, then your doctor, then your health insurance company in the same hour. But they don't know what was discussed.
•They know you received a call from the local NRA office while it was having a campaign against gun legislation, and then called your senators and congressional representatives immediately after. But the content of those calls remains safe from government intrusion.
•They know you called a gynecologist, spoke for a half hour, and then called the local Planned Parenthood's number later that day. But nobody knows what you spoke about.

Sorry, your phone records—oops, "so-called metadata"—can reveal a lot more about the content of your calls than the government is implying. Metadata provides enough context to know some of the most intimate details of your lives. And the government has given no assurances that this data will never be correlated with other easily obtained data. They may start out with just a phone number, but a reverse telephone directory is not hard to find. Given the public positions the government has taken on location information, it would be no surprise if they include location information demands in Section 215 orders for metadata.

If the President's administration really welcomes a robust debate on the government's surveillance power, it needs to start being honest about the invasiveness of collecting your metadata.

 

[DreamsofTesla]

The American Civil Liberties Union Tuesday filed a lawsuit against the National Security Agency, claiming its surveillance of Americans' phone calls is unconstitutional. The suit said the data collection violates the rights of free speech, association and privacy.

http://www.usnews.com/opinion/artic...be-held-liable-for-violating-the-constitution

 

[bentom187]

NSA leaker Edward Snowden: U.S. targets China with hackers


HONG KONG — Edward Snowden, the self-confessed leaker of secret surveillance documents, claimed Wednesday that the United States has mounted massive hacking operations against hundreds of Chinese targets since 2009.

The former contractor, whose work at the National Security Agency gave him access to highly classified U.S. intelligence, made the assertions in an interview with the South China Morning Post. The newspaper said he showed it “unverified documents” describing an extensive U.S. campaign to obtain information from computers in Hong Kong and mainland China.



Gallery




Who is Edward Snowden? The 29-year-old government contractor who admitted that he was behind recent leaks of classified intelligence has vaulted from obscurity to international notoriety.




(Kin Cheung/AP) - A TV screen shows news of Edward Snowden, the former NSA contractor who leaked top-secret documents about sweeping U.S. surveillance programs, at a restaurant in Hong Kong on June 12.



.

“We hack network backbones — like huge Internet routers, basically — that give us access to the communications of hundreds of thousands of computers without having to hack every single one,” he told the newspaper.

According to Snowden, the NSA has engaged in more than 61,000 hacking operations worldwide, including hundreds aimed at Chinese targets. Among the targets were universities, businesses and public officials.

The interview was the first time Snowden has surfaced publicly since he acknowledged in interviews with The Washington Post and Britain’s Guardian newspaper Sunday that he was responsible for disclosing classified documents outlining extensive U.S. surveillance efforts in the United States.

Senior American officials have accused China of hacking into U.S. military and business computers. Snowden’s claims of extensive U.S. hacking of Chinese computers tracks assertions made repeatedly by senior Chinese government officials that they are victims of similar cyber-intrusions.

Snowden’s claims could not be verified, and U.S. officials did not respond to immediate requests for comment.

In the interview w ith the Morning Post posted online late Wednesday, Snowden said he stood by his decision to seek asylum in Hong Kong, a semiautonomous city, after leaking documents about a high-level U.S. surveillance program.

“People who think I made a mistake in picking Hong Kong as a location misunderstood my intentions,” he said in the interview. “I am not here to hide from justice; I am here to reveal criminality.”

He added, “I have had many opportunities to flee HK, but I would rather stay and fight the United States government in the courts, because I have faith in Hong Kong’s rule of law.”

By speaking with Hong Kong’s oldest English-language newspaper, Snowden seemed to be directly addressing the city he has chosen as his safe harbor. And by disclosing that he possesses documents that he says describe U.S. hacking against China, he appeared to be trying to win support from the Chinese government.

Snowden told the Hong Kong newspaper that he was describing what he says are U.S. cyber attacks on Chinese targets to illustrate “the hypocrisy of the U.S. government when it claims that it does not target civilian infrastructure, unlike its adversaries.”

Some in Hong Kong are responding to his campaign. A rally is being organized Saturday to support the 29-year-old former government contractor, who has been in the city since May 20. A Web site, www.supportsnowden.org, has been set up with details about the event, which will include speeches from human rights activists and local legislators.

Activists in Hong Kong said they admired Snowden’s effort to shed light on his government’s practices.

“He is a brave man. The authorities cannot use the ‘anti-terrorism’ excuse to invade people’s privacy without boundaries,” said Yang Kuang, a prominent Hong Kong activist. “I hope more and more people will stand out and expose such practices.”

Snowden said in his interview that he has “been given no reason to doubt [Hong Kong’s] legal system.”

“My intention is to ask the courts and people of Hong Kong to decide my fate,” Snowden said.

Snowden is up against an extradition treaty between the United States and Hong Kong that many view as being clear — that in the vast majority of cases, Hong Kong must cooperate with U.S. government requests for help apprehending suspected criminals.

The United States has yet to file a formal extradition request, although there are other ways for the governments to be cooperating.

James To Kun-sun, a Hong Kong legislator and solicitor, said that even without an extradition request, the United States can ask Hong Kong law enforcement to watch Snowden while the U.S. Justice Department moves on its investigation. The FBI has a legal attache in Hong Kong, and Snowden has also identified a CIA presence in the city.

“I suspect in this case . . . the FBI tells the HK police, ‘The request will be very soon,’ and [they can] ask police to keep an eye on him,” Kun-sun said.

Once an extradition request is received, a judge here will decide whether it falls under the treaty and whether Hong Kong law enforcement should help the United States by, for example, collecting evidence or carrying out an arrest. Snowden could also appeal any decision, so the process could be drawn out.

“As long as I am assured a free and fair trial, and asked to appear, that seems reasonable,” Snowden said in the interview.

He added that he plans to stay in Hong Kong as long as the city will have him.



Liu Liu contributed to this report from Beijing.

 

[gaiusmarius]

in the end there is no where where he is beyond reach, maybe the Chinese or the Russians could keep him safe if it was worth their while. but i don't see him being safe in Hong Kong. they will extradite his ass so fast if they are asked. they are known to have helped have people sent to Libya to be tortured in the war on terror, so what makes him think he'll be safe there i wonder? maybe he has offered the Chinese some kind of incentive to pressure Hong Kong to let him stay? at least you'd think he'd be safe from drones in Hong Kong.

 

[bentom187]

well he does have one thing going for him ,and that is the world is watching.

 

[Pinball Wizard]

where's all the pity for Pvt. Manning? (Private Cannon Fodder)

 

[DreamsofTesla]

where's all the pity for Pvt. Manning? (Private Cannon Fodder)

I don't know where you're looking, I see it every day, literally.

 

[Pinball Wizard]

I don't know where you're looking, I see it every day, literally.

yeah I seen it too...it's over whelming. Fort Leavenworth is lovely this time of the year.

(he's already been granted comp time for being in that Marine hole)

 

[OrganicBuds]

I really don't see what's so hard to get, what else would you expect any Democrat to say? Especially in light of the fact that the Republican's are trying their best to say it's all Obama's idea. This all goes back to that Red and Blue two step SpasticGramps was talking about most of the country being distracted by.

The bottomline is that the republicans put it in place and started it and then the democrats prolonged it and expanded it. It probably played out much the same way when they took what was supposed to be a temporary income tax to fund the civil war and made it into a permanent income tax that funds whatever they feel like spending it on.

Really? This is what amazes me. So since Rep put it in place it's ok for Dems to do it also? NO! The problem is the two party system, and both parties are evil. What would I expect a dem to say? How about, "yea I f-ed up voting for this party, but the other party is dirty also. How about we end this and all turn back to the constitution." Sounds good to me!