What's new
  • As of today ICMag has his own Discord server. In this Discord server you can chat, talk with eachother, listen to music, share stories and pictures...and much more. Join now and let's grow together! Join ICMag Discord here! More details in this thread here: here.

Transcendental Meditation: Scam or Not?

accessndx

♫All I want to do is zoom-a-zoom-zoom-zoom..
Veteran
So I've heard from many people over the last couple of years how advantageous it is to practice Transcendental Meditation.
I never really distinguished it from meditation in general and never understood the difference at all.
That is until I decided I'd like to learn it. The first thing I noticed was a significant amount of peer reviewed literature about the benefits of TM. The American Heart Association, the American Medical Association, etc. are all on board with the practice citing that it dramatically reduces cardiovascular disease including blood pressure, cholesterol and a host of other things that suck.
In addition to that, there's a never ending supply of 'celebrities' who can't stop talking about TM and how it has transformed their lives.
Everyone from Dr. Oz to Howard Stern promotes it.
They've integrated the practice into public schools to increase focus and even the U.S. Army for PTSD.
The second thing I noticed when attempting to learn TM was that there was NO source of information about HOW TO perform it.
There are no books, no youtube videos, no torrents, no DVDs, nada.
The ONLY place you can learn this esoteric technique is from a certified TM instructor found on their organizational website.
To boot, in spite of the fact it's been taught since the late 50's as a formal discipline....there are only a handful of folks teaching it in various states. There are literally only 3 places to get it in NJ where I hail from. There are possibly a few more in NY and the surrounding areas...which is surprising considering how much folks tout TM.

Apparently to become an instructor you've gotta goto France for 5 months for training...so I guess that's a bit of a hindrance...but still in 50 years you'd think more folks would be out there teaching.

Nonetheless: To begin the practice, you've gotta sit through a 'lecture' that's very similar to those sorts of talks you get when someone is trying to sell you a time share. It's not a 'HARD' sell, but it's not really soft and fluffy either. Then they take you back for an "interview" which is basically them asking some health questions, your motivation for learning TM and then they grill you about the use of Hallucinogenic drugs and recreational drugs.

Apparently they want you to dry out for 15 days prior to learning TM and they're pretty rigid about that.

Their take is that it interferes with the brain's ability to learn or whatever.

TM is a 5000+ year old technique, but it was really kicked into the public consciousness with the advent of the Beatles. When they were all tripping balls and such, they met this Maharishi:

Transcendental-Meditation-Videos-300x200.jpg


He taught them the technique and the rest as they say is history.
Not sure how he got them to curtail their proclivity to take drugs but they clearly never stopped on a permanent basis.

Anyway I've got issues with folks telling me to dry out, but I'm very interested in TM for a variety of reasons relating to the health benefits.

The only thing I can glean from talking with some of these instructors and the spotty info. available online is that you're given a "mantra" or sound that you can focus on...like OHM.

My basic understanding is that focusing on something like the mantra allows the brain and body to achieve deep relaxation.

Now if that's the ENTIRE basis of TM I'm gonna be pissed off because I can sit in a room and chant OHM for awhile without shelling out $ or drying the F.U.C.K. out or having to allocate 4 consecutive days in a row to work with an instructor 1 on 1 (which is the other catch).

I'm curious if anyone out there practices TM and has a take on it that would help me understand better the secrecy of the practice, the almost multi-level marketing B.S. with a splash of Scientology mixed in for good measure.

I can't ignore the myriad of different legitimate medical resources that speak of the benefit and the host of different high profile celebutantes that can't say enough good things. But at the same time there seems to be a lot of nonsense and hoops to jump through to learn it.

I'm frankly shocked nobody has put together a rogue video or book to expose the secrets of the technique to date.

Discuss.
 

St. Phatty

Active member
I used to do it but never got involved in the TM Center.

as far as TM flying ... believe it when I see it.


Personally, I found TM was very useful. Helped me focus when I was in college and people expected me to spend 8 hours a day doing homework.


The organization itself though ... pushing the flying TM thing ... makes me wonder about the TM organization.

Giving a thumbs-up to the practice of TM.


How much do they charge these days, for learning the basic method ?
 

prune

Active member
Veteran
If you really want to blow your mind, try "Mind Games: The guide to Inner Space" by Masters and Houston, it's what John Lennon was referencing to in his hit song of the same name...
 

accessndx

♫All I want to do is zoom-a-zoom-zoom-zoom..
Veteran
I used to do it but never got involved in the TM Center.

as far as TM flying ... believe it when I see it.


Personally, I found TM was very useful. Helped me focus when I was in college and people expected me to spend 8 hours a day doing homework.


The organization itself though ... pushing the flying TM thing ... makes me wonder about the TM organization.

Giving a thumbs-up to the practice of TM.


How much do they charge these days, for learning the basic method ?

They charge $240 per session standard fee. 4 sessions are required.
$180 for spouses/couples session (when one person has paid standard fee of $240). $90 for full-time students.
 

fulltimehuman

Active member
I never did TM but isn't meditation merely being present to this moment and its sensations?
What 'training' would help accomplish that besides confronting your own mind and allowing it to spin off by itself....while you watch? I always like walking meditation....walking is fun.
have fun!
 

accessndx

♫All I want to do is zoom-a-zoom-zoom-zoom..
Veteran
its basic mantra meditation

I'm not 100% sure about that. ONLY because they compare TM against "MANTRA MEDITATION" as a classification in peer reviewed articles. Clearly TM involves a mantra but I'm confused if they're calling out other forms of meditation including MANTRA as not being as beneficial. This is in literature provided BY the TM organization as well as 3rd party reviewers.

Here's the other kicker: they go a long distance in explaining how TM is NOT a philosophy or religion. They beat that dead horse mercilessly.
THEN as a requisite for your 1st session you're supposed to bring the following:

6-12 fresh flowers
2-3 pieces of sweet fruit
1 clean white handkerchief

They apparently use these things in a ritual of thanks and then they give it back to you. They say that you don't have to participate in the ritual but insist you bring those things above....
They even sell white handkerchiefs on site in case you don't know where to purchase one.

So if it's NOT a religion and there's NO philosophy, why is it steeped in Hindi religious practice? RITUAL kind of infers some formal system of worship or practice.

It's exceptionally contradictory to say on one hand there's no religious nonsense and then the first thing you see is some sort of religious rite...regardless of the intent.

I'm not actively attempting to denegrate the practice here, I'm just a bit confused by the mixed messages I keep receiving from practitioners and overall I'm turned off by the culty atmosphere that is apparent in spite of statements to the contrary.
 
I was interested in TM a long time ago when I was going through my "all things dharma phase" and made many of the same observations the OP did.
At the end of the day, I decided that it was mostly a scam - maybe not 100% scam but close enough.
You can find studies that support/not-support just about everything. Sure TM can relax you, slow down your heartbeat etc. but so can a hot shower. It promises way more than it delivers. They start out gently with you to reel you in and then later you'll find out about extra fees, and a whole plethora of guru-approved shampoos, lotions etc - good ole fashioned capitalism meets warmed over Indian religion soup. The final kicker was yogic flying. They even showed me some videos that supposedly showed highly advanced yogis doing it - but in reality it was obvious that those yogis were just bouncing up and down on a mat by flapping their knees while sitting in the lotus position.

Dont walk away - RUN.

If your interested in meditation for physical health benefits, try some hatha yoga. Some folks do best with an instructor - its nice to be spoonfed - but you dont even need that if you are motivated enouigh to learn on your own.
 

HidingInTheHaze

Active member
Veteran
I think to get the most out of your journey it is important to detoxify the body, once you cleanse the body, mind and soul then familiarize yourself with your chakras.

I think it is possible to explore higher levels of consciousness, but so much pollution in our environment clogs up our doorways.

Purity of the body leads to purity of the mind, purity of the mind leads to a greater sense of consciousness, awareness and intuition.

If your chakras are polluted you will be rendered immobile.
 

CosmicGiggle

Well-known member
Moderator
Veteran
Forget TM and try Science of Spirituality, they have meetings everywhere. You'll learn the same technique FREE of charge and with no rituals.

..... of course, all of those groups teaching meditation want you to give up drugs and meat, they're not big on competition!:tiphat:

Me personally, I find meditation to be really, really boring and prefer the mind expanding drugs.:dance013:
 

accessndx

♫All I want to do is zoom-a-zoom-zoom-zoom..
Veteran
Heechops: I saw all the lotions and potions in glass cabinets of the main sitting area. I saw folks already postured to purchase. Not my cup of tea. Not buying into that shit.

I still think there has to be a nucleus of good stuff in the center of the marketing.
I'd rather do without the pomp and circumstance but it may not be avoidable.

Here's the thing I DO NOT UNDERSTAND:

There are HUGE organizations that back up TM. There's NO apparent benefit for them to do so and frankly their assertions that TM is valuable makes them culpable for any negative stuff. So I doubt the American Medical Association, the American Heart Association, countless Universities and even the government would get on board with something that was without significant clinical efficacy. They do compare and contrast this technique against other forms of meditation and even against other sorts of activities that could be considered 'relaxing'.

There's a clear line in the sand where TM stands out against it's competitors.

I'm just having a really hard time dealing with the dichotomy between clinical benefit with high profile support and the sketchy cult controlling the practice.

How have they insinuated themselves into all these high level medical organizations if they're totally bunk? Something doesn't compute.
 

Weird

3rd-Eye Jedi
Veteran
I know for many people who suffer from like mental disorders it is the only thing that works

I understand how it works as I get the same relief from weeds but I understand that some people don't get the same relief from substances (legal or otherwise) so this is a great practice.

I will try to explain it in the rudimentary language I understand it in

hopefully it articulates to understanding

When you achieve a transcendental state you are disconnecting your impulsive mind and putting all your energy in to the higher consciousness. I am sure it translates to our core brain (reptile core?) and outer cotex (I hope I am using right terminology).

For someone whose core brain is always sending out improper emotional signals or can be so dominant that my emotions over ride my rational thought it becomes so painfully overbearing that when its painful emotion it can become too painful to want to live.

If I get out of that core mind and into my other mind ( I know i sound so uneducated it sounds hippy but i am sure it translates to two core brain regions as ive heard from psychiatrists)

I was once at a seminar where it was explained that our "core brain" works as a spark plug and when it gets too "hot" it shuts down the cortex region over riding it. Potentially has to do with fight or flight and other functions of that core mind being over stimulated.

evolutionary in process is a bitch but everyone experiences it

the only issues I have with meditation like this is that it is the same with exercise (which I used for a time to manage my phych issues) is that for me it takes alot of time out of my day to use it to be functional and I can't afford to spend my day engaged in maintaining my mental health.

Many people report 45 to an hour makes a big difference for them.

I have over time found incorporating a bit of all mantras (eat right, sleep right, bit of exercise, healthy non toxic things to disengage the core mind from being over stimulated, social engagement, mediation, Buddhism, etc

marijuana as well as bio ethogens have really helped me as well but I feel they work best as tools not when relied on as en entire vehicle. Having a something to focus on in conjunction really takes it to the next level. For me chanting Buddhism resonated with me quite profoundly and helped me get really turn some corners I couldn't with substances alone.

I think when we live to find our full potential it is also reliant upon us having healthy balanced lives and we unfortunately 'live in healthy balanced world.

Happy New Year btw
 

prune

Active member
Veteran
I think to get the most out of your journey it is important to detoxify the body, once you cleanse the body, mind and soul then familiarize yourself with your chakras.

I think it is possible to explore higher levels of consciousness, but so much pollution in our environment clogs up our doorways.

Purity of the body leads to purity of the mind, purity of the mind leads to a greater sense of consciousness, awareness and intuition.

If your chakras are polluted you will be rendered immobile.

And that's pretty much "The Fourth Way" on/by Ouspensky, the Greek philosopher. Hardest read ever...
 

prune

Active member
Veteran
I never did TM but isn't meditation merely being present to this moment and its sensations?
What 'training' would help accomplish that besides confronting your own mind and allowing it to spin off by itself....while you watch? I always like walking meditation....walking is fun.
have fun!

Once you're able to use the tools to properly chill, then you can move on to the really cool stuff like remote viewing, time dilation and mind melding.

Read the book.
 

shithawk420

Well-known member
Veteran
Im not trying to be a dick,but the only thing your gonna get is the placebo affect.yes,the placebo affect works,but it can only work for so long.its all in your minds,and yes it does work for a little while ,but when the placebo affect where's off your back to where you started from.this is how chemicals in the brain work.this is basically fact,but I'm open to ideas of course
 

accessndx

♫All I want to do is zoom-a-zoom-zoom-zoom..
Veteran
Im not trying to be a dick,but the only thing your gonna get is the placebo affect.yes,the placebo affect works,but it can only work for so long.its all in your minds,and yes it does work for a little while ,but when the placebo affect where's off your back to where you started from.this is how chemicals in the brain work.this is basically fact,but I'm open to ideas of course

Not sure you can chalk the entire phenomena up to placebo effect especially when there are studies comparing the practice to placebo.
 

waveguide

Active member
Veteran
i realise it's not as classy as paying $240 periodically, which, if you'll notice, is like the anti-420, but there's this weird place called youtube where people talk loads of crap you can shovel and swim through gleefully, like a shovel nosed youtube burrower swimming gleefully.

for me, the core of buddhism will always be stopping listening to someone else.
 

LEF

Active member
Veteran
I believe in meditation and its benefits

The doing it is the hardest part

Taking the time to go from gogo mode to chill mode or knowing how, remembering how

Thats why they call it a meditation practice, gotta get into it regularly

I dont personally

I think its gotta do with my herb smoking
I hear its better to stop for a couple of days before getting into it

I want to explore entheogens a little more, i find that on psychedelics/mind altering stuff i will go into meditation as i feel it can take me pretty far

And also they can take you pretty far even without meditatioN from my experience

I feel that attaining different dimensions without the use of an external source would be in a way advantageous, not havin to rely on something to propel you

But, plants and substances i believe could be somewhat of a shortcut or easy way to do it
Without years of effort but still with some kind of effort
 

LEF

Active member
Veteran
Oh but paying that amount.. I dunno

Meditation course over here, some are done for free

There is a big healing movement going on, some scam artists, some not

I go to the people that have the medicine and are not looking to capitalize on it

Its okay to charge a little but too much draws me away

You can charge as much as you want, imo

Not saying they might not have something good but i am not in a situation where i can throw 100-200$ around

Apparently schizophrenics only exist in salary societies.
 
Top