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Top 44 from seed

Hello people, new to this thread, Ive been watching for a month or so now, and good people here.

Im going to document my first indoor grow that I have full intentions of harvesting. The other times Ive tried to grow things were not in my favor. Horribly ghetto cabinets, poor outdoor locations, things of that nature.

Now nothing is in my way. Ive got the net to guide me, alot better setup, an easy strain to grow, and above all else the net to guide me :D

Heres the setup

4.5sqft cabinet with ~3.75ft of vertical grow space. Thats factoring in the light and the height of the containers. Cabinet has a ghetto mylar job. Im missing a couple spots, but it cover the cabinet pretty good.

A 265 CFM squirrel cage blower exhausting the room. Blows out a window directly to the outside. Air comes into the cabinet though 3 2" passive vents. I have thought about adding another, and more than likely will. What do you people think about that?

250w MH for vegging, anda 150w HPS to add during flowering. Daytime temps are as follows: ~80F in the room, ~90F outside, ~80F inside with the door cracked. When I get my ventilation completely sorted out, I shouldn't run hotter than 85F with the door closed. Right now it runs ~88F with the door closed, but I have issues that will be adressed this week.

Nite time temps are perfect, with both lights on at night and the cabinet closed it gets up to 85F.

The ballast are located outside the cabinet near the window. I have a fan blowing on them. Surprisingly, the 250w MH ballast runs cooler than the 150w HPS ballast. I really think the plants are going to love the mixed spectrum for flowering. I hope that extra 150w of HPS makes a difference. People are getting some pretty nice yeilds with 400w in the same size area (about the same as a c13) so im hoping that by my 3rd grow I can get well over a HP (8 ounces)

Humidity is VERY low, which worries my, but once all the seeds break the surface and start growing it will be alot more humid. Still, right now the humidity inside the cabinet is 25%. I want this number to get up to at least 40%, at the very least. Since Ive never actually monitored the humidity and temp like this, I dont' really know what to expect. Anyway, Im confidant that I will get everything sorted out and dialed in in the first couple weeks of vegging, and as long as everything during flowering goes smoothly I think things will work out.

The plants are 5 top 44 from nirvana, soaked in water for 24 hours, 4/5 popped in that time, ironically the one seed that didnt' pop while soaking broke the surface first. Im going to be keeping my eye on that one. After soaking I planted the seeds in foxfarm soil.

Ill post some pics whe the babies get a little bigger. Right now they are VERY small. A cm tall maybe. When they start to actually look like plants Ill take pics of the whole setup. I must warn you in advance, its not the cleanest setup, but its better than anything Ive had to work with in the past, and I know this cabinet is going to pull through for me. Even if I can't get the heat sorted out, 250w alone is good for over 50w/sqft. More than enough.

Thats all I have for now, Ill have pics when the seedlings get a little bigger. If you have any questions or advice, LMK, like I said, first serious grow, and Im trying to do it right. Ive read alot, but Im learning new things everyday, so if anyone sees me making a mistake, say something before I kill my crop please :)

peace

G o G
 
I'm still a newbie myself, but from what I've learned, it sounds like you're doing great. :) I can't wait to see some pics. Happy growing! :wave:
 

Rabbitt-420

Member
Setup sounds fine to me just add another vent for intake and your temps should be ok.
Youve got more light then i do and i do ok in a small closet so i know youll be happy with your results.
 
Thanks

Thanks

Suppers everyone :wave:

small update:

100% germination rate :D When I woke up today, the last 3 had broke the surface.

Also, I think I forgot to mention that I don't have reflectors for my lights yet, and to be honest, I don't know that Im going to on this grow. I have mylar up, and when I have both lights going it gives me damn near 100w/sqft. Don't get me wrong, I know Im wasting energy, but I think the plants will get plent of light without a reflector.


Any ideas on a cheap and or easy to make reflector? I was thinking about getting one of these... http://www.mdhydro.com/ht-reflectors.html

either the one on top for $20 or the one with a cool tube built on, since I have a MH and a bake a round (I THINK) will be to small. Plus, when I decide to fire up the 1000w HPS I could use the same reflector. Just some ideas Im throwing around.

If anyone has the cool tube one, it would be great if you could give me the deminsions of it. On the site it just says 20", I need to know how deep it is as well. Because if its 20" deep then it won't fit in my cabinet. But if its say 18" deep then it will fit perfectly.


Well, thats all I have for now, if you guys want Ill take some pics of the seedlings, but personally, I don't find seedlings to be very interesting, so I haven't really taken to many pictures of them. After all, I can always open the cabinet and look at them whenever I feel like it, which is pretty often :D

peace

G o G

EDIT: I forgot that I had a quick question for everyone. My humidity is VERY low. Im VERY worried about it. Im talking 25% to 35%. I know that once the cabinet starts filling up with vegetation the humidity will rise considerably, but until then, should I be worried about the seedlings drying up? I have some water bottles in there with the tops off, but I know that isn't helping much. I was thinking about getting a pan to put in there, but Im not sure how much that would help either.

Anyway, as always, any and all advice is welcomed.
 
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Rabbitt-420

Member
Dont worry about your humidity being low right now.
Your seedlings wont dry out because of it trust me.
Just sit back and watch them grow!
Oh and any pics are good pics in my book. It's alway fun to have something to compare to.
 
PICS

PICS

well, its not much, but I have a couple pics for everyone.

Seeds are 2 days old in the pics. Popped and planted July 9th, broke the surface July 13th.


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Ill post a couple pics here, but I have a question for all the viewers out there. Would you rather I just put the pics in the gallery for everyone to see, that way dialup users aren't stuck with HORRID load times, or do the thumbnails make it OK for you guys. Just trying to make the thread easy for everyone to access. I know for me threads with pics are nothing, but I remember when I was a dialup user, and I remember the LONG loading times that can be a result of pictures.

No real updates today, nothing new or interesting.

Peace

G o G

BTW, mods or site designers or whoever is responsible, I must say I LOVE the process for uploading pics to your gallery and posting them in threads. WAY better than the system over at OG IMO. Keep up the good work.
 
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Man, its exciting watching the little uns grow, but at the same time very boring. I can't wait to see what they look like 2 weeks from sprouting.

I had a minor scare today, not really a scare, but something to cause concern. I woke up in the afternoon, and it was 85F in the room with the cabinet, and 93F inside the cabinet. Needless to say I took care of the situation, and although its still 91F outside, I got the room temp down to 81.5F, and the cabinet temp down to 84F.

Its been 5 days so far, and they're starting on their second node. Ill probably take some pictures tonight. All 5 are going strong, although it seems like I MAY have 2 mutants :( When I take pics Ill show you what Im talking about.


I ordered a 24 inch reflector today, Im thinking Ill probably mount both the 250w MH and the 150w HPS to it. Its plenty big, thats for sure.

Thats all for now, like I said, exciting, but at the same time very boring.
 
pics

pics


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I know my digicam is SHIT, its only 1.5 megapixel
:rolleyes:

Whats a decent digicam going for these days? Ill definatly be getting a new one when flowering starts :D Gotta take some closeups of the nuggage.

Anyway, I know its not much, but theres a couple pics.

If anyone sees anything they think needs attention, please let me know.

To me (i know nothing) it looks like I may be overwatering. But I don't water until the soil is dry 1-2 inches down.

This leads me to believe Im already getting some root bound. Even though it seems pretty unlikely to me, only 5 days old and all, they are drinking EXTREMELY fast, I saturate the soil, and within 1.5 days its completely dry, on all but 1 plant. Roots are coming out the bottom of 2 of the cups.

Anyway, Im a little worried, and I don't want anything to go wrong, so Im going to give them one last watering, then when they dry up (1-2 days) Im going to transplant.

I was hoping they would be happy in the cups for a couple weeks, but its looking more like a week.

As always, if you have an idea about whats going on, LMK.

Thats all I have for now, as usual, its not much, but better than nothing I guess.

Peace

G o G
 

mauie

New member
i grew top44

i grew top44

last harvest, a few mos ago, i grew top44 and blue mystic from nirvana. both were great for smoking but i found that the yield was not so good on either one. i am growing my last seed from top44 this time round and will hopefully be able to revege and clone. the weed is sweet, not skunky at all. it was billed as a commercial strain so i thought i would have gotten a much better yield.

growing in soil 24/7 under 2x40wt fluros for 30 days then ...
600w HPS 12/12 for flowering.

mauie
 
Mauie, thanks for stopping by.

Quick questions for you.

How long did you let the top44 flower for? Nirvana says its a 44 day flowering cycle, but from the grow reports Ive seen it seems to be closer to 50+ days.

Also, how tall were they when you started flowering, and how tall did they finish?


As for updates, nothing new or exciting going on. I switched to 18/6 to help deal with the temp issues. Its consistantly 95+ outside where I live, so the few hours of dark REALLY helps with the temps. Even with the lights off, during the middle of the day its still 80F in the cabinet. I have the blower running 24/7.

My reflector should be here tomorrow, I was actually excpecting it today, but eh, no biggie.

Peace

G o G
 
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update

update

Its been a few days so I figured Id update. Still early, and not much is going on.

I got my reflector set up. Only the 250MH is under it now, but shortly the 150w HPS will be under it as well. Looks like the 2 bulbs will fill the 24in reflector perfectly.

I transplanted all but one plant 2 days ago to 1.5 gallon pots.

I BELIEVE I was overwatering while they were in the 12oz cups. The texture of the leaves is odd, and they are kinda droopy. HOPEFULLY Ive since stopped the overwatering. I say HOPEFULLY, because being the noob that I am, Im not 100% sure that Im not still overwatering.

How fast should the plants show changes?

The new growth is alot better, and non existant on one of the plants

heres some pics, crappy in bad lighting, but pics none the less. My camera is crap, and in all honesty a 2 inch plant isn't much to look at. When I get to flowering, Ill try to get a better camera.


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best one so far, least signs of overwatering


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see the twisted single finger leaf?


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this one has the texture that I speak of, if I could take a better pic I would show you. If the problem persists Ill take a better pic


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Last 2

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Group photo

Thats all until next time, please, don't everyone answer my questions or help me out all at once ;)

JK, but really, please fell free to offer your insight. I am a noobie, and your help is likely whats going to get me through this, hopefully to a sucessful harvest.

Only time will tell.

EDIT: forgot about a question I have.

If I lower my light to ~6 inches, the soil temps get really high, 90-95F. Im guessing its because the soil is dark and absorbs the light. Should I wait until the plants keep the soil shaded to lower the ligh (~10in now) or are high soil temps not an issue?

Thanks
 
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omega7

Member
Hey GOG the seedlings are looking good so far but can I make one suggestion. Fill your containers almost to the top. It will give your plants more room for roots and makle transplanting a lot easier and when you water you dont disturb the soil close to the roots as you would in a a container with less soil. It is something that I see with new growers all the time. Although yours is filled more than most I see which are half full. I totally understand that soil is expensive and not easy to lug around without arousing suspicion so if it it that reason then just disregard what I said. Otherwise they look healthy and has nice tight internode spacing. A trick for watering while you are still getting used to the weights of the containers is to use a bathroom scale. Someone on OG mentioned it, wish I could remember their name for the credit. One of those obvious things no one thinks of, but a great idea non the less. Weigh the container when it is dry and then weigh it after a good watering.

Good luck
 

deZerTomB

Member
How fast should the plants show changes?

How fast should the plants show changes?

not much changes till they get taller & start to show growth at the nodes then you can look for sex. but relax,looks like a ways to go yet.

How long did you let the top44 flower for? Nirvana says its a 44 day flowering cycle, but from the grow reports Ive seen it seems to be closer to 50+ days.

I grew some I think in the top5 indoor mix & they didn't grow much at all in flower, buds just get bigger & bigger. It was one of my first grows so I was harvesting pretty quick, you can always let go longer, but you'll lose some potency.

get a dope scope from radio shack (60-100x microscope catolog#63-1133) to check trichomes for cloudiness.

Nikon coolpix is the SHIT. I think 8500 is top of the line, but middle of the road models rock also, just make sure you can take macro shots. I'm in the market for a digi cam & camcorder, too cheap to spend money. check out www.streetprices.com for good price comparisons.

hope this helps

stay green & safe

deZerTomB.
 
THANKS

THANKS

omega and dezer, thanks alot.

omega, I actually have a bag of soil sitting in the grow room, I will fill the pots the rest of the way when the lights come back on.

Thanks for the kind words, Im not to worried about my babies right now, as long as they look good in a couple weeks that is.

The bathroom scale idea is great as well. I think Ill be using that method. Its kinda like eyeballing a sac, at first its kinda hard to guess good, but after youve weighed enough bags you can guess withing a bowl every time.


dezer, thanks alot for the insight on the grow, as well as the digi cam recomendation. Since I have no idea whats good and whats not, your post is very valuable to me.

Ill be getting a mag glass or something to check the trichs, I just need one anyway so I can get a better look at all the herb in my area. I actually have the hook at radio shak, so Ill probably just get the item you listed. You even listed the sku #. Gotta love it.

Quick question about the top 44.

I have ~2ft of verticle grow space, a little more but I like to leave room for error. You think Ill be ok flowering them at 12in, or should I do it sooner?

Also, did you train them at all (top or tie down) or did you just let them grow single cola?

As dezer said, stay safe, and stay green

Peace

G o G
 

deZerTomB

Member
single cola

single cola

i think you want single cola, they don't top too good, but you will get one large bud. It was a long time ago so I'm not certain but I think about 16" into flower will end up at about 2 ft. in the end.it grew about half again in flower. Not much stretch at all. I saw a pic in og of a whole greenhouse full of top44, all with one big bud, short bushy plant. So I think you got some time, but at least wait till you see alternating nodes, usually about 12inches, anything after that is fine.

stoned, green & safe

deZerTomB
 
Man, thats pretty incredible. 4 inches of stretch that is. Ill take your advice and just let them grow a single cola.


All the babies except one are looking very good. The only one thats looking kinda bad is the only plant I didn't transplant. I transplanted that plant tonight. Hopefully in a couple days Itll perk up a bit like the others did.

I got a scale to weigh the pots. Its great for watering, because now I know exactly how much water Im giving them, and how fast theyre drinking. I actually watered last night, gave them all about 8flozs of water. I know the dry weight of the pots too, so no more overwatering :) (THANKS OMEGA)

Its looking (I know its early) like I have at least 2 phenos. 4 of the plants pretty much look the same, but 1 is an oddball, and ironically, it was the first to crack, and the first to break the surface. I have high hopes for this one. Of course Im hoping its a girl. Keep your fingers crossed. The leaves on the oddball are considerably shorter and broader than the rest of the plants.

Oh, and one plant is growing kinda twisted. Im not to worried about it though, its looking very healthy, just twisted.

A quick question for all. During the first half or so of lights one, the soil temp is over 90F. The light (250w MH) is 10 inches from the plants, and the cabinet temps never go over 85F. I want to lower the light a bit more, but Im worried about those soil temps. I can hold my hand withing 3-6 inches of the bulb without getting to hot, but if I lower it that much the soil temps get into the mid to high 90s. Heres the question (finally) Are soil temps even an issue?



One more thing before Im done. I found 6 seeds last night. They are over 2 years old and have been in my bathroom completely exposed to the humidity that can build up. Ive got them soaking as we speak, we'll see if any of them pop. I hope they do, because the strain is pretty decent. An old friend bread it, its supposedly skunk#1 crossed with nl #5. I don't actually think its 100% true, although it is possible, but I can tell you that this strain is STANKY. I had 2 or 3 of these growing under a 150w HPS in a similar cabinet with no ventilation, and when the plants were about 10 inches tall, they got so stinky it made my entire house smell, NO JOKE. They were still on 24/0 too. I can't imagine what the odor would have been like into flowering. Never got that far.

Im really hoping I get lucky and a couple of these beans pop and I get a female from that. Ive smoked the strain, and its very good herb. Very stanky, a huge sativa influence. Only time will tell.

Ill take some more pics when I get around to it, probably when the current node gets a little more grown if that makes sense??? Also, maybe Ill take a comparison of the 2 phenos that I see so far.

Until next time

G o G
 

deZerTomB

Member
8 inches

8 inches

I keep my lights at least 8 inches from plants, but I use 400watters. I burned one in flower when I transplanted to a larger pot and did not raise the lights accordingly. Fried the top of the bud. So be careful lowering lights on babies.

Soil temps shouldn't get too high, but I've never read or seen a discussion of this subject.

stay green & safe

deZerTomB.
 
Pics

Pics

Heres some pics


16 days old

All are doing well but one



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^^the runt



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^^^check out the tight growth


You guys think I should start feeding these suckers? I think its about time. Unless someone has a good reason not to, Im gonna give them a 1/4 strength feeding next watering. I just watered yesterday, so that should be in 3 or 4 more days.



One of the seeds I found popped, but its not looking very good. It hardly popped, and isn't showing any vigor what so ever. I put it in a rockwool cube anyway, soaked it in some 5 pH water, and the rockwool brought it up to 6.3 pH. I doubt it will sprout, but eh, you never know. Im trying the paper towel method for the rest of the seeds, since Ive had success before with that. I must say, I wish I wouldve kept these guys in a better place, but eh, you live you learn.

Enjoy the pics. IMO the plants are doing very well, especially compared to when I was overwatering them. Im glad theyve recovered so well.

Until next time

G o G
 

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