THIS IS WHAT A BONG LEAVES IN YOUR LUNGS!!!!

[juicepuddle]

What about the baccy chews with mouth cancer, esophagus, and pancreatic cancer??

Your logic is flawed my brother

Tobacco does cause cancer, feel free to do some reading

Like I said, its how you use it, so if those people weren't chewing it it wouldn't be doing that, it seems your logic is not in check

Also this thread is about bongs and how they filter smoke, not chews, but I get what you were saying.

 

[budbasket]

Again post up the actual study and I will comment on it, I was relying on the source posted. And the information taken from that exact same website only backs up the negative health effects side of smoking. Ill post it again in case you didn't read.....

Pro-cannabis website, have alot to gain without caring much for patients....Even so I found this on the same website....
"The major strategies to reduce the risks of smoking are:
- The use of cannabis strains with high THC content. (...) - The use of pure cannabis. Sometimes cannabis is smoked together with tobacco or other dried herbs. This procedure should be avoided to minimize the inhalation of smoke from burnt plant material.
- The use of pipes. Pipes are superior to cigarettes in some situations in that they easily allow the patient to smoke small amounts of pure high-grade cannabis. The percentage of tars in the smoke is reduced by condensation on the pipe walls. Pipes should be cleaned frequently. Water pipes are inferior to cigarettes and should be avoided. (...)
- The use of cannabis that is free of natural contaminants and adulterants. Only disease-free cannabis should be harvested and air-dried. (...)
- The use of inhalation devices that reduce output of tars. (...) Gieringer tested vaporizers that heat marijuana to 180-190°C vaporizing THC below the burning point of cellulose and other plant material. The production of polycyclic hydrocarbons was reduced. The best vaporizer delivered 10 parts of tar to one part of cannabinoids, cannabis cigarettes yielded a ratio of 13:1 (average), and water pipes an average of 27:1 (...). Thus, the best vaporizers achieved a performance ratio about 25% higher than the unfiltered cannabis cigarette, while water pipes were less favorable than cigarettes. The use of a filter in a cannabis cigarette was not advantageous since it not only filtered the tars, but also the cannabinoids. Indeed, the performance ratio was decreased by about 30% compared to the unfiltered cigarette.
In a new study Gieringer was able to demonstrate that combustion products were substantially reduced by using another vaporizer. The used device produced THC at a temperature of 185°C while completely eliminating benzene, toluene and naphthalene. Significant amounts of benzene began to appear at temperatures of 200°C, while combustion occurred around 230°C or above. Traces of THC were in evidence as low as 140°C. Carbon monoxide and tars were both qualitatively reduced by the vaporizer, but were not quantificated in this study. However, a significant reduction of polycyclic aromatic hydrocarbons was assumed since vaporized cannabis emitted a thin gray vapor and the plant material was left with a green to greenish-brown "toasted" appearance, whereas the combusted sample produced thick smoke and turned to ash. (...)

 

[master shake]

im going to stop smoking, just going to vape for now on.....

this is what happens off of ONE hit from your bong!!!!! the paper towel was completely clogged 1/2 way through the hit!! go ahead a try it!!!!

Good god dude how big of hits do you take? I tried this with a normal rip from my straight bong, no fancy attachments or percolator. I used some cured, flushed organic herb and it made the paper towel brown but not thick with black tar like that.

 

[headband 707]

Okay let me try and put this to rest here in your nose and lungs you have very tiny hair like structures called" silia " They are designed to keep all the dust and crap out of your lungs and nose ect. When you smoke cig. or cannabis you injest tar which completely covers these tiny silia with tar... Your body can't get rid of tar so the tar just adds up in the lung.This is not a good thing...!!!... Now if you happen to get any type of lung problem all these little problems will add up. This is why any doctor will tell you not to smoke anything.. so vap instead if you can... peace out Headband707

 

[juicepuddle]

Your body can't get rid of tar so the tar just adds up in the lung.

You can cough the tar up and I am sure there are other ways to loosen it up and whatnot, just sayin.

 

[headband 707]

You can cough the tar up and I am sure there are other ways to loosen it up and whatnot, just sayin.

Well small amounts but nah it really stays there this is why they show you pictures of a heathly lung and then a nasty looking smokers lungs .. A pictures is worth a thousands words in this case lol peace out Headband707

 

[Zen Master]

I have cigarette smoking friends (that toke) that are "grossed out" by me hacking up some black shit, meanwhile they keep all theirs inside the lungs.

ciggs are constrictors, cannabis is a bronchial dialator, opens stuff up and gets out the gunk.

I bet the pix of lungs from a pack a day smoker and a 24/7 toker would look vastly different.

your cilia are constantly cleaning your lungs but they can be damaged to the point of no repair

 

[Noobian]

What exactly is the purpose of this thread? Was OP trying to convince people to stop smoking weed? L O FUCKING L

Sorry for your health problems but not really sure what you were trying to accomplish with this "breakthrough"

 

[Frozenguy]

Okay let me try and put this to rest here in your nose and lungs you have very tiny hair like structures called" silia " They are designed to keep all the dust and crap out of your lungs and nose ect. When you smoke cig. or cannabis you injest tar which completely covers these tiny silia with tar... Your body can't get rid of tar so the tar just adds up in the lung.This is not a good thing...!!!...

You can cough the tar up and I am sure there are other ways to loosen it up and whatnot, just sayin.

Well small amounts but nah it really stays there this is why they show you pictures of a heathly lung and then a nasty looking smokers lungs .. A pictures is worth a thousands words in this case lol peace out Headband707

Actually you do cough a lot/most of it up because cannabis and tobacco cigarettes differ in many ways including the fact that nicotine paralyzes the cilia whereas cannabis does not. At least no where near the degree of cigarette smokers. Lungs wont take on that smokers lung look. Sure they may not look exactly like a non smokers lung, but they wont look like a "smoker".

It only takes a matter of days for cilia to reactivate and thats why you hear of tob. smokers cough soon after they quit or if they dont smoke for a day because the reactivation starts a coughing phase.

NOT TO BE GROSS, BUT: I cough up phlegm throughout the day. All of us do we just don't really notice it all the time because it goes right down to your stomach from your airway.
But like you all know, you can actually cough it up. Thats the movement of tars/contaminants from the lungs.

Plus if the lungs couldn't clean themselves, one could argue Michael Phelps wouldn't be such a good swimmer, considering his lungs have to be efficient breathing for an athlete underwater.

 

[Faith-Hope-Love]

Well small amounts but nah it really stays there this is why they show you pictures of a heathly lung and then a nasty looking smokers lungs .. A pictures is worth a thousands words in this case lol peace out Headband707

You are so fucking wrong Headband. Cannabis resin does not cut through the mucus layer of the lungs, thus when the mucus is released from the lungs you are also releasing the resin.

Show me a picture of a non cig smoker who smokes JUST cannabis and has "black lungs" like the pictures you are refereeing to. You won't find one because they don't exist.

 

[Faith-Hope-Love]

Holy shit Frozenguy..... thank you so much for actually "getting it". It's refreshing seeing someone else post that isn't speaking from their arse! You rock buddy!!

Actually you do cough a lot/most of it up because cannabis and tobacco cigarettes differ in many ways including the fact that nicotine paralyzes the cilia whereas cannabis does not. At least no where near the degree of cigarette smokers. Lungs wont take on that smokers lung look. Sure they may not look exactly like a non smokers lung, but they wont look like a "smoker".

It only takes a matter of days for cilia to reactivate and thats why you hear of tob. smokers cough soon after they quit or if they dont smoke for a day because the reactivation starts a coughing phase.

NOT TO BE GROSS, BUT: I cough up phlegm throughout the day. All of us do we just don't really notice it all the time because it goes right down to your stomach from your airway.
But like you all know, you can actually cough it up. Thats the movement of tars/contaminants from the lungs.

Plus if the lungs couldn't clean themselves, one could argue Michael Phelps wouldn't be such a good swimmer, considering his lungs have to be efficient breathing for an athlete underwater.

 

[budbasket]

Taken from MAPS...MAPS' mission is 1) to treat conditions for which conventional medicines provide limited relief—such as posttraumatic stress disorder (PTSD), pain, drug dependence, anxiety and depression associated with end-of-life issues—by developing psychedelics and marijuana into prescription medicines; 2) to treat many thousands of people by building a network of clinics where treatments can be provided; and 3) to educate the public honestly about the risks and benefits of psychedelics and marijuana.


Ok and now the actual information....

Disappointingly, waterpipes performed uniformly worse than the unfiltered joint. The least bad waterpipe, the bong, produced 30% more tar per cannabinoids than the unfiltered joint. Ironically, the pipe with the electric mixer scored by far the worst of any device. This suggests that water filtration is actually counterproductive, apparently because water tends to absorb THC more readily than noxious tars. Like the waterpipes, the cigarette filter also performed worse than the unfiltered joint, by about 30%. Researchers speculate this is because cannabinoids are exceptionally sticky and adhere to other solids. Hence, any filtration system that picks up particulates is likely also to screen out cannabinoids.
http://www.maps.org/news-letters/v06n3/06364mj2.html


Another, surprisingly from NORML

A recent survey by the Kaiser Permanente Center found that daily marijuana-only smokers have a 19% higher rate of respiratory complaints than non-smokers.1 These findings were not surprising, since it has long been known that, aside from its psychoactive ingredients, marijuana smoke contains virtually the same toxic gases and carcinogenic tars as tobacco. Human studies have found that pot smokers suffer similar kinds of respiratory damage as tobacco smokers, putting them at greater risk of bronchitis, sore throat, respiratory inflammation and infections.2

Although there has not been enough epidemiological work to settle the matter definitively, it is widely suspected that marijuana smoking causes cancer. Studies have found apparently pre-cancerous cell changes in pot smokers.3 Some cancer specialists have reported a higher-than-expected incidence of throat, neck and tongue cancer in younger, marijuana-only smokers.4 A couple of cases have been fatal. While it has not been conclusively proven that marijuana smoking causes lung cancer, the evidence is highly suggestive. According to Dr. Donald Tashkin of UCLA, the leading expert on marijuana smoking:5.....http://norml.org/library/health-reports/item/norml-s-marijuana-health-mythology

 

[Faith-Hope-Love]

Another, surprisingly from NORML

A recent survey by the Kaiser Permanente Center found that daily marijuana-only smokers have a 19% higher rate of respiratory complaints than non-smokers.1 These findings were not surprising, since it has long been known that, aside from its psychoactive ingredients, marijuana smoke contains virtually the same toxic gases and carcinogenic tars as tobacco. Human studies have found that pot smokers suffer similar kinds of respiratory damage as tobacco smokers, putting them at greater risk of bronchitis, sore throat, respiratory inflammation and infections.2

Although there has not been enough epidemiological work to settle the matter definitively, it is widely suspected that marijuana smoking causes cancer. Studies have found apparently pre-cancerous cell changes in pot smokers.3 Some cancer specialists have reported a higher-than-expected incidence of throat, neck and tongue cancer in younger, marijuana-only smokers.4 A couple of cases have been fatal. While it has not been conclusively proven that marijuana smoking causes lung cancer, the evidence is highly suggestive. According to Dr. Donald Tashkin of UCLA, the leading expert on marijuana smoking:5.....http://norml.org/library/health-reports/item/norml-s-marijuana-health-mythology

This "study" was done by Kaiser Permenente. Need I say more?





If you don't understand why Kaiser would be biased in showing cannabis as harmful, look into how health insurance works.

 

[Noobian]

Smoke is not good for your lungs man. Are you arguing that smoking weed is somehow beneficial to you? The active chemicals in the cannabis smoke have benefit but the smoke itself is not good for your lungs. Doesn't matter if it comes from burning leaves, weed, tobacco, plastic, any kind of smoke is not good for the lungs

 

[Faith-Hope-Love]

Smoke is not good for your lungs man. Are you arguing that smoking weed is somehow beneficial to you? The active chemicals in the cannabis smoke have benefit but the smoke itself is not good for your lungs. Doesn't matter if it comes from burning leaves, weed, tobacco, plastic, any kind of smoke is not good for the lungs

Yes it does matter, in fact it significantly matters, that is my point. The resin from burned solid matter ARE NOT ARE EQUALS. You start smoking plastic and then come back and try and say it doesn't matter.

I am not saying that resin is GOOD for you, nor am I saying that it is healthy to not consistently clean out lungs. What I am saying is that is very possible to clean that resin out of your lungs with cannabis as opposed to other resin. I am also saying that the resin from cannabis simply coats the mucus layer like a film buildup. Once the mucus layer is coughed up (and spit out or swallowed) the resin from cannabis comes with it. Thus, I can do hot yoga, or ride a bike or whatever and have virtually resin free lungs in an hour.

Get it yet? Not all smoke is created equally!


p.s. no I am not saying it is beneficial resin.... LOL where the fuck did you read that in my post? I said it is not the harmful resin that some are making it out to be. Since when does not so harmful equal beneficial?

 

[40AmpstoFreedom]

Wow, well this was a controversial thread...Gonna go hit my bong, vape, coke can, tinfoil, joint, blunt, apple, and orange pipes for everyone here....I just use whatever is closest, LOL. I got things I can't even describe... Probably go back to vape when it is out of storage 24/7 tho love the Arizer cheap and awesome.

Salute!

 

[Rob547]

Clearly, smoke vs ""clean"" (lol) air is no good for your lungs. I think we can all agree on that much. However, for one, I'm pretty sure THC is water-INSOLUBLE hence the reason we use water not... chocolate milk or something, alcohol.
Also, I was under the impression that it was more or less semi-proven science (give it a few years), not so much that marijuana does not cause cancer, but that THC has considerable anti-cancer properties, actually causing cancer cells to die and stop reproducing and leaving healthy cells alive.

 

[headband 707]

You are so fucking wrong Headband. Cannabis resin does not cut through the mucus layer of the lungs, thus when the mucus is released from the lungs you are also releasing the resin.

Show me a picture of a non cig smoker who smokes JUST cannabis and has "black lungs" like the pictures you are refereeing to. You won't find one because they don't exist.

Oh okay then so what your saying is smoke is okay??? lol..bra smoke is not okay not for the body you would be hard pressed to find one doctor that will tell you different. The resin that you seen on the first picture is the resin the will build up in your ariways, why do you think it wouldn't lol lol??? Smoking cannabis as the deliverly is not right, it's just the way it is you can talk till the cows come home and nothing is going to change this it's a "carcinogen" period need I say more lol ...
When you go to your doctors in the USA do they just say yeah go ahead and smoke your brains out or do they tell you to get a vap? When a guy who is very sick and dying do they tell him to smoke a joint? No, they tell him to get a vap. Smoking is not the prefered method to deliver cannabis to the system. Headband 707

 

[headband 707]

This "study" was done by Kaiser Permenente. Need I say more?





If you don't understand why Kaiser would be biased in showing cannabis as harmful, look into how health insurance works.

Okay you do know I love bud right ? and I'm from Canada or better known as Syberia,, but isn't Kaiser Permenente an Insurance Company lol.. Well if they say it it must be true lol jk.. We all know that cannabis is good that is why we are here but smoking it is still bad,,,, sending good kharma your way peace out Headband 707

 

[budbasket]

Noxious gases known to occur in marijuana smoke include hydrogen cyanide, which incapacitates the lung's defensive cilia; volatile phenols, which contribute to the harshness of the taste; aldehydes, which promote cancer; and carbon monoxide, a known risk factor in heart disease. Previous studies indicate that water filtration may be quite effective in absorbing some of these [Nicholas Cozzi, Effects of Water Filtration on Marijuana Smoke: A Literature Review, MAPS Newsletter, Vol. IV #2, 1993]. If so, waterpipes might still turn out to have net health benefits.

http://www.ukcia.org/research/pipes.php

I can post study after study from PRO-marijuana websites stating that bong usage is detrimental to your lung tissue. I know everyone keeps arguing that its known thc kills cancer cells but your missing the point. Regardless that the test studies were done with extremely concentrated and high doses of thc and cannabinoid extracts. This level is not possible with simply burning leaves and inhaling the results. I really think people should actually read the studies they quote rather than spitting off random pieces of information. This is why I have actually taken the time to post of the pieces I am referring to, here is another one.....

Several studies produced exciting new leads in the search for anticancer treatments using cannabinoid-related drugs. Plant-derived (THC), synthetic (HU210, WIN-55,212-2), and endogenous (2-AG, AEA) cannabinoids modulate tumour growth, apoptosis, migration and neoangiogenesis in various types of cancer (Bifulco & Di Marzo, 2002; Guzman et al., 2002). However, studies performed to investigate marijuana-smoking effects on carcinogenesis and tumour growth produced contradictory results (Table 2): THC failed to induce mutagenicity in the Ames test (Hall & MacPhee, 2002) and in skin test in mice (Chan et al., 1996), whereas cannabis smoke was mutagenic in vitro (MacPhee, 1999; Marselos & Karamanakos, 1999). The Ames test is a sensitive biological method for measuring the potentially carcinogenic effect of chemical substances on microrganisms, cells and tissue cultures. This test by itself does not demonstrate cancer risk; however, mutagenic potency evaluated by Ames test does correlate with the carcinogenic potency for chemicals in rodents. These results show that THC have no carcinogenic properties, at least as purified compound. Moreover, evidence showed that smoking of cannabis preparations caused cancer of the respiratory and oral tracts or, at least, potentiated tobacco smoke-induced damages. Various mechanisms have been involved in these processes: direct THC-induced damage of the bronchial epithelium (Barsky et al., 1998), induction and regulation of the carcinogen-metabolizing enzyme CYP1A1 (Roth et al., 2001), alteration of the balance between apoptotic and necrotic cell death (Sarafian et al., 2001), increase of cellular oxidative stress (Sarafian et al., 1999), CB2-mediated immune suppression (Srivastava et al., 1998; Zhu et al., 2000). Recently, Hall et al. (2005) extensively reviewed the results of epidemiological studies reporting inconsistent association between cannabis smoking and lung cancer. The author highlighted the need of a case–control cohort larger than those previously examined, excluding concomitant risk factors as alcohol use or tobacco smoke. Furthermore, the cannabis smoking and the medical use of cannabinoids have been largely mistaken in public debate: the recreational long-term cannabis smoking, potentially but to date ambiguously connected with respiratory and oral cancer, is not univocally associated with pharmaceutical cannabinoids exploitable for medical purposes.

The immunosuppressive properties of plant-derived cannabinoids could enhance tumour cell proliferation (Zhu et al., 2000; McKallip et al., 2005) and accelerate cancer progression in patients, but the biological response to cannabinoids critically depends on drug concentration and cellular context (Hart et al., 2004). Nevertheless, different therapeutic strategies could be developed on the basis of peculiar characteristics expressed by several malignancies. Jones & Howl (2003) suggested as therapeutic target for tumour intervention some distinctive properties: (1) in cancer, such as malignant astrocytomas, gliomas, breast, thyroid, prostate, where cannabinoid receptor expression is enhanced, strategies aimed at raising levels of endocannabinoids could be a successfully treatment; (2) in colorectal carcinoma, the increased expression of endocannabinoids suggests that inhibitors of endocannabinoid metabolism could be used as therapeutic tools; (3) upregulation of CB2 receptor expression in malignant astrocytomas and gliomas and/or the increased CB2/CB1 ratio in tumours of immune origin could suggest the use of cannabinoid-based drugs devoid of psycotropic effects. Moreover, there is at present no obvious universal mechanism whereby cannabinoids affect cell viability and proliferation; furthermore, the immunosuppressive properties of cannabinoids or their effects on COX-2 expression, even if incompletely demonstrated to date, could represent cons evidence for medical use of cannabinoids, at least in lung carcinoma.
Indeed, cannabinoids have the advantage of being well tolerated in animal studies and they do not present the generalized toxic effects of most conventional chemotherapeutic agents (Guzman et al., 2003). Routes of cannabinoids administration have been recently studied. THC is rapidly absorbed after inhalation and its effects become apparent within minutes. Grotenhermen (2001) showed that THC oral administration was associated with slow onset of action and with accidental overdosage. In fact, maximum THC serum concentration measured after smoke intake (Huestis et al., 1992) is 2–3-fold higher than maximum serum concentration achievable with oral or rectal THC administration (Consroe et al., 1991; Brenneisen et al., 1996). The inhalation may have pharmacokinetic advantages, but it requires use of higher potency cannabinoids and strategy aimed at eliminating carcinogenic products combustion: for this purpose, Gieringer (2001) proposed the vaporization lacking the carcinogenic compounds formed during combustion. The trans-dermal route could be eligible for pain, nausea and vomiting treatment in chemotherapy patients giving a continuous steady dose (Stinchcomb et al., 2001).

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1617062/?tool=pubmed


Basically it says combusted cannabis contains carcinogens it also says that only concentrated and refined products will be of medical value(made my pharma companies).