H
Heliopolis
You might find more info here: http://www.colloid.com/AGP/Products.aspx
Seems that most of their products are made with sodium bentonite (apparently the primary form found in Wyoming).
-
As of today ICMag has his own Discord server. In this Discord server you can chat, talk with eachother, listen to music, share stories and pictures...and much more. Join now and let's grow together! Join ICMag Discord here! More details in this thread here: here.
- Status
You might find more info here: http://www.colloid.com/AGP/Products.aspx
Seems that most of their products are made with sodium bentonite (apparently the primary form found in Wyoming).
B
BlueJayWay
Water it if it starts to dry out, absolutely!
Well im glad i didnt shell out the $15 for 5kg of kitty litter.
Now that im using clay based topsoil in my ROLS i guess i have clay covered.
Regarding wicks i would love to see someone have a crack at one of those PPK setups (automated/self regulating wick/passive hydro) but running organic. I was going to have a crack at it but blumats are much easier to setup and may well be superior for an all organic soil based approach. Wicks wont keep the crucial top layer moist. Outdoors this isnt such a factor due to rain and dew. Of course it could be done manually but this can be a PITA!
Now that im using clay based topsoil in my ROLS i guess i have clay covered.
Regarding wicks i would love to see someone have a crack at one of those PPK setups (automated/self regulating wick/passive hydro) but running organic. I was going to have a crack at it but blumats are much easier to setup and may well be superior for an all organic soil based approach. Wicks wont keep the crucial top layer moist. Outdoors this isnt such a factor due to rain and dew. Of course it could be done manually but this can be a PITA!
Whats the verdict on the bentonite heabanger scored?
A bit of experience with the ppk here.
Im working towards wicks and or blumats with rols indoor.
PPK and organic? I dont want to hijak.
Trying to get a price list together to see how many yards of OLS I can afford to make, but then I have to decide exactly what I want in there.
If I can do it quick enough and I can afford it I might throw some outside.
Possibly with wicks.
I bet with some mulch and playing around you could get the wicks to work just fine. Someone mentioned that they have a wicking bed in one of the rols threads....where was that now
Regarding wicks i would love to see someone have a crack at one of those PPK setups (automated/self regulating wick/passive hydro) but running organic. I was going to have a crack at it but blumats are much easier to setup and may well be superior for an all organic soil based approach. Wicks wont keep the crucial top layer moist. Outdoors this isnt such a factor due to rain and dew. Of course it could be done manually but this can be a PITA!
A bit of experience with the ppk here.
Im working towards wicks and or blumats with rols indoor.
PPK and organic? I dont want to hijak.
Trying to get a price list together to see how many yards of OLS I can afford to make, but then I have to decide exactly what I want in there.
If I can do it quick enough and I can afford it I might throw some outside.
Possibly with wicks.I bet with some mulch and playing around you could get the wicks to work just fine. Someone mentioned that they have a wicking bed in one of the rols threads....where was that now
I have not heard of calcium being added...only that there is calcium bentonite and sodium bentonite. The calcium bentonite is more agriculturally friendly..but the sodium bentonite will work as well. The small amount of sodium in the small amount of sodium bentonite to be added to a soil mix or compost won't hurt a thing. Maybe look into the differences as far as cec exchange values..and if sodium plays a good or bad roll as compared to the calcium bentonite.
I have used them both as soil amendments with no problems.
V
vonforne
Gas, I am going on what my supplier has stated in this web page post of the bentonite he sells. I do ingest this one FWIW.
http://www.bestbentonite.com/index.html
http://www.bestbentonite.com/index.html
G
growingcrazy
Regarding wicks i would love to see someone have a crack at one of those PPK setups (automated/self regulating wick/passive hydro) but running organic. I was going to have a crack at it but blumats are much easier to setup and may well be superior for an all organic soil based approach. Wicks wont keep the crucial top layer moist. Outdoors this isnt such a factor due to rain and dew. Of course it could be done manually but this can be a PITA!
Is it possible to run the wicks all the way to the surface of the pot? Maybe get the ends of the wicks up into the mulch layer and the entire container would stay moist?
I would think it would still work even with the end of the wick above soil level... I need to see how that would work out.
I will have to look into the ppk thread more too.
GC
B
BlueJayWay
Cool - just ordered me some bentonite to start feeding my pet soil!
O
Old_Headbanger
Lol pet soil. Plenty alive for sure. Could you top dress bentonite?
Hey guys i just read all 500+ pages of the old thread and burnones sticky in the organics section, unfourtunatley it was a little late and i had allready started this years soil...
Im new to ROLS, ive been an "organic" grower for 2 yrs. now, but recently thanks to a few inspiring members of several differnet sites ive gone actual organic this summer!
Used to use straight pro-mix bx as a base, i watered with the full earth juice line(there full base line, used 7 bottles if memory serves) and added a tea in veg and in flower(usually budwell and there other mix with some cheap compost and molasses)... had OK results in my opinion granted ive only done 2 gruellia grows in maine on my own...
This year ive decided to ditch the bottles and mix some OLS(organic living soil) and go for a water only route(ill apply teas(AACT/botanical) if i fell the plant can take it(no more then 4-6 total)......And i also be doing a 1x-2x a week foliar of protekt/aloe/seed enzyme....hopefully neem as well if the budget allows...
So i mixed this soil/created my plan of attack like 2/3 of the way through my research on organic/ROLS soil and i wish i had waited because i went about it a ass backwards way but i think it should work out thats why im here to ask for a critique...
My plan is in action and is as follows:
16 plants in 60 gal homeade pots in a 30x20 greenhouse(legal medical)
Running 3 strains (O.G. Kush, Chemdawg, And Chemo)
Sprouted seeds in solo cups.
- top 50% was pure pro mix bx
- bottom 50% was (40% pro mix bx 40% roots organic(had it around) 10% high quality BAGGED EWC)
The plants crushed it in these, i just transpanted today 5-4
They were at about 2 weeks from sprouting and root bound(shoulda transplanted cpl days ago)
Solo cups into 5 gal grow bags (10xx10x10")
- top 50% of this mix was (60% roots organic 40% pro mix bx)
- amended with
1 pound powdered azomite per 7-8cuf(amount i needed....)
4 cups powdered dolo lime per 7-8cuft
1 cup rooters mychroziae
- bottom 50% (60% roots 40% pro mix bx)
- amended with
1 pound(4 cups...?) powdered azomite per 7-8cuft
4 cups powdered dolo lime per 7-8cuft
1 cup rooters mychroziae
2 pounds(like 6-7 cups) bio-tone starter (had extra from a soil batch)
Just transplanted into this mix today and the plants are allready starting to point twoards the lights after 3-4hrs(little shock so far...)
They are in a 4x4 tent in my house, if they start to crowd ill take them out of the tent and toss em into a spare bedroom for a few weeks...
Then the plan is to go into the greenhouse once they fill those 5 gal bags in about 3 weeks im guessing. ( they are about 6"x6" right now)
Outdoor soil mix
5gal bags(10x10x10") to homeade (24x24x24") 8cuft/60gal) pot
Ill be spliting these pots into a top(cool) soil and bottom(hot) soil, kinda wish i hadnt cause whn i finsihed my research i relized my downfall(but had allready mixed my base soil as to somone else style, layer growing.....) but by the time i transplant to the final pots the roots will be going directly into my fully amended soil, its just the soil above all the roots wont be as amended as the soil below the roots......
My top 50% will be amended just not as much as the bottom......
I also plan on doing a top dress of all the pots in the first-second week of flowering with the bottom 50% HOT mix...
Bottom soil mix(hot) will make up the bottom 50% of the pot....
I mixed this soil in large batches 20cuft per batch...
The recipe that follows is per 20cuft batch ( i made 4 batches of this and am storing it in large kiddie pools atm) (have 80 cuft/600 gallons)(only need 60ish cuft)
Actual soil
Give or take a bit...
7.5cuft Living Acres Germination mix (its 45% humus peat, 30% aged compost, 25% perlite)
3.5cuft pro mix bx (75% CSP(canadian spaghum moss) 25% perlite)
2.5cuft compressed coc blocks (sri lanka)(broken down completly in water)
2.5cuft buckwheat hulls (aeration amendment, couldnt find rices hulls or even perlite/vermeculite in large quaintys)
2.5cuft coast of maine sea compost (salmon and crab) 1-0-0
1.5cuft High quality EWC
Rooughly: 44% soiless(at a 1-3 ratio of coco-peat) 31% EWC/compost(at a 1-3 ratio of castings to compost) 25% aeration (50-50 buckwheat hulls to perlite)
Amendments per 20cuft
10cups soybean meal 7-.5-2.3
10cups alfalfa meal 2.6-0-2.3
8lbs bone char 0-16-0
6lbs bio-tone starter plus 4-3-3(pluss benficial bateria and mychroziae)
5lbs kelp meal 1-0-0
6lbs rock phosphate 0-3-0
2lbs azomite coarse(trace minerals)
1lb azomite powder
2.5 lb planters trace II (similar to azomite, main ingredient is 15% silicon....)
8cups Pelletized lime.....(oops)
8cups powdered dolomitic lime (cal/mg)
4lbs epsom salts (mg)
1cup humic acid
1cup sul-po-mg
3cups rooters mychroziae
8teaspoons bio-zues (bacterial and fungal inoculent/booster....)
Top 50% portion of outdoor soil (about 70 cuft, only need 60ish cuft)
Actual soil
Due to cost reasons im doing just straight Pro Mix bx........SIGH
Amendments
I have yet to actually mix this soil i need to do it this week....
I currently have all the amendments listed above and can use them if someone wish to chime in and say hey use that!!!(HINT)
I plan on amending 20 cuft porions at a time and laying it on a tarp....
Per 20cuft
5-6lbs of kelp meal(like 12-14cups)
2lbs planters trace II(like 6-8cups)
and then either plant-tone (@6-cups)
or a combo of fish meal(also have #50 bag of fish meal floatin around) and alfalfa meal at a similar rate....
3cups rooters mychroziae
1cup sul-po-mg(might break this down in water and water it in this time...)
And i ordered a large bag (#30) of neem meal and i will be topdressing all pots about a week after i transplant into the greenhouse to help dter any fungus and pest issues!!!!
2cups per pot of neem meal(topdressed)
Any suggestions on other additons????
I have about 2.5 weeks untill ill need to use the top portion of soil so i have to keep that in mind as far as breakdown times go cant go crazy with amendments....
Botoom 50% has been "cookin" for 3 weeks now, plan on using it at 6 so top needs to be ready in 3.....
Dont Be shy people!!!!!!!!!!!
Im new to ROLS, ive been an "organic" grower for 2 yrs. now, but recently thanks to a few inspiring members of several differnet sites ive gone actual organic this summer!
Used to use straight pro-mix bx as a base, i watered with the full earth juice line(there full base line, used 7 bottles if memory serves) and added a tea in veg and in flower(usually budwell and there other mix with some cheap compost and molasses)... had OK results in my opinion granted ive only done 2 gruellia grows in maine on my own...
This year ive decided to ditch the bottles and mix some OLS(organic living soil) and go for a water only route(ill apply teas(AACT/botanical) if i fell the plant can take it(no more then 4-6 total)......And i also be doing a 1x-2x a week foliar of protekt/aloe/seed enzyme....hopefully neem as well if the budget allows...
So i mixed this soil/created my plan of attack like 2/3 of the way through my research on organic/ROLS soil and i wish i had waited because i went about it a ass backwards way but i think it should work out thats why im here to ask for a critique...
My plan is in action and is as follows:
16 plants in 60 gal homeade pots in a 30x20 greenhouse(legal medical)
Running 3 strains (O.G. Kush, Chemdawg, And Chemo)
Sprouted seeds in solo cups.
- top 50% was pure pro mix bx
- bottom 50% was (40% pro mix bx 40% roots organic(had it around) 10% high quality BAGGED EWC)
The plants crushed it in these, i just transpanted today 5-4
They were at about 2 weeks from sprouting and root bound(shoulda transplanted cpl days ago)
Solo cups into 5 gal grow bags (10xx10x10")
- top 50% of this mix was (60% roots organic 40% pro mix bx)
- amended with
1 pound powdered azomite per 7-8cuf(amount i needed....)
4 cups powdered dolo lime per 7-8cuft
1 cup rooters mychroziae
- bottom 50% (60% roots 40% pro mix bx)
- amended with
1 pound(4 cups...?) powdered azomite per 7-8cuft
4 cups powdered dolo lime per 7-8cuft
1 cup rooters mychroziae
2 pounds(like 6-7 cups) bio-tone starter (had extra from a soil batch)
Just transplanted into this mix today and the plants are allready starting to point twoards the lights after 3-4hrs(little shock so far...)
They are in a 4x4 tent in my house, if they start to crowd ill take them out of the tent and toss em into a spare bedroom for a few weeks...
Then the plan is to go into the greenhouse once they fill those 5 gal bags in about 3 weeks im guessing. ( they are about 6"x6" right now)
Outdoor soil mix
5gal bags(10x10x10") to homeade (24x24x24") 8cuft/60gal) pot
Ill be spliting these pots into a top(cool) soil and bottom(hot) soil, kinda wish i hadnt cause whn i finsihed my research i relized my downfall(but had allready mixed my base soil as to somone else style, layer growing.....) but by the time i transplant to the final pots the roots will be going directly into my fully amended soil, its just the soil above all the roots wont be as amended as the soil below the roots......
My top 50% will be amended just not as much as the bottom......
I also plan on doing a top dress of all the pots in the first-second week of flowering with the bottom 50% HOT mix...
Bottom soil mix(hot) will make up the bottom 50% of the pot....
I mixed this soil in large batches 20cuft per batch...
The recipe that follows is per 20cuft batch ( i made 4 batches of this and am storing it in large kiddie pools atm) (have 80 cuft/600 gallons)(only need 60ish cuft)
Actual soil
Give or take a bit...
7.5cuft Living Acres Germination mix (its 45% humus peat, 30% aged compost, 25% perlite)
3.5cuft pro mix bx (75% CSP(canadian spaghum moss) 25% perlite)
2.5cuft compressed coc blocks (sri lanka)(broken down completly in water)
2.5cuft buckwheat hulls (aeration amendment, couldnt find rices hulls or even perlite/vermeculite in large quaintys)
2.5cuft coast of maine sea compost (salmon and crab) 1-0-0
1.5cuft High quality EWC
Rooughly: 44% soiless(at a 1-3 ratio of coco-peat) 31% EWC/compost(at a 1-3 ratio of castings to compost) 25% aeration (50-50 buckwheat hulls to perlite)
Amendments per 20cuft
10cups soybean meal 7-.5-2.3
10cups alfalfa meal 2.6-0-2.3
8lbs bone char 0-16-0
6lbs bio-tone starter plus 4-3-3(pluss benficial bateria and mychroziae)
5lbs kelp meal 1-0-0
6lbs rock phosphate 0-3-0
2lbs azomite coarse(trace minerals)
1lb azomite powder
2.5 lb planters trace II (similar to azomite, main ingredient is 15% silicon....)
8cups Pelletized lime.....(oops)
8cups powdered dolomitic lime (cal/mg)
4lbs epsom salts (mg)
1cup humic acid
1cup sul-po-mg
3cups rooters mychroziae
8teaspoons bio-zues (bacterial and fungal inoculent/booster....)
Top 50% portion of outdoor soil (about 70 cuft, only need 60ish cuft)
Actual soil
Due to cost reasons im doing just straight Pro Mix bx........SIGH
Amendments
I have yet to actually mix this soil i need to do it this week....
I currently have all the amendments listed above and can use them if someone wish to chime in and say hey use that!!!(HINT)
I plan on amending 20 cuft porions at a time and laying it on a tarp....
Per 20cuft
5-6lbs of kelp meal(like 12-14cups)
2lbs planters trace II(like 6-8cups)
and then either plant-tone (@6-cups)
or a combo of fish meal(also have #50 bag of fish meal floatin around) and alfalfa meal at a similar rate....
3cups rooters mychroziae
1cup sul-po-mg(might break this down in water and water it in this time...)
And i ordered a large bag (#30) of neem meal and i will be topdressing all pots about a week after i transplant into the greenhouse to help dter any fungus and pest issues!!!!
2cups per pot of neem meal(topdressed)
Any suggestions on other additons????
I have about 2.5 weeks untill ill need to use the top portion of soil so i have to keep that in mind as far as breakdown times go cant go crazy with amendments....
Botoom 50% has been "cookin" for 3 weeks now, plan on using it at 6 so top needs to be ready in 3.....
Dont Be shy people!!!!!!!!!!!
i think you can just about top-dress everything but clay benefit is really going to come from mixing it in
smoooth
Active member
Well my first batch is underway. Can say I couldn't be more excited!
Definitely seems that Malibu compost is slipping on their quality control. The bags I got were half black half brownish like was previously posted. The vermiblend was all black and felt and looked good so I will probably be using this in the future. Lesson learned.
Also need to get more fish meal, fish bone meal, and glacial rock dust next time since I burned through all of what I had mixing this up and was a little under
Definitely seems that Malibu compost is slipping on their quality control. The bags I got were half black half brownish like was previously posted. The vermiblend was all black and felt and looked good so I will probably be using this in the future. Lesson learned.
Also need to get more fish meal, fish bone meal, and glacial rock dust next time since I burned through all of what I had mixing this up and was a little under
FunTimesIndeed
Member
Could it be the bu's blend is just a little dried out? Do they still hold their Demeter certification?
Hey xmobotx thanks for chiming in!!!
As far as i know pro mix bx is a nutrientless medium...
Heres the label just google it mang:
Components:Canadian Sphagnum Peat Moss(80-85 % / vol.) Dolomitic & Calcitic Limestone(pH adjuster)Endomycorrhize (Mycorise® Pro) Perlite, horticultural grade Vermiculite, Wetting Agent
Other then that you dont see any issuse with what i have going on???
Was worried about the lime after i read the ROLS thread(didnt know icmag existed until i had allready mixed my bottom "hot" soil)....
O
Old_Headbanger
granite dust
granite dust
So I'm mixing up a little more than a yard of soil for outside. I'm using the 4cup per cubic foot ratio for the rock dust, which in my case is granite fines from a local monument company. The math works out to be about 7.5 gallons of powder.
Here's my thing. I just started adding it in slowly, about 2 gallons so far. It smells of eggs (sulfur?). Not too bad yet, but i haven't added everything in yet. Anyone with any experience with granite dust notice this? I seem to remember jerry using granite dust? Can't remember shit, so I don't know who it was. Does this sound like a concern? I can't imagine that minerals will compost?? Maybe get absorbed by the humus?? Idk wtf I'm talking about, really.
Red flags as soon as I could smell something funny. I'll wait out this ingredient until the end. Any input is appreciated.
granite dust
So I'm mixing up a little more than a yard of soil for outside. I'm using the 4cup per cubic foot ratio for the rock dust, which in my case is granite fines from a local monument company. The math works out to be about 7.5 gallons of powder.
Here's my thing. I just started adding it in slowly, about 2 gallons so far. It smells of eggs (sulfur?). Not too bad yet, but i haven't added everything in yet. Anyone with any experience with granite dust notice this? I seem to remember jerry using granite dust? Can't remember shit, so I don't know who it was. Does this sound like a concern? I can't imagine that minerals will compost?? Maybe get absorbed by the humus?? Idk wtf I'm talking about, really.
Red flags as soon as I could smell something funny. I'll wait out this ingredient until the end. Any input is appreciated.
RanchoDeluxe
Member
If your pile of soil gets any light spread some clover seed on it and water em in. It would be even better if you can put all the soil into the pots you will be using and then plant the clover while you wait for the soil to cook. But yeah, at least keep it moist.
FunTimesIndeed
Member
OHB, a quick search on where sulfur forms resulted in the following:
"In sedimentary environments in evaporate and salt dome environments, where it is often a product of break down of sulfates caused by certain bacteria. In volcanic deposites in hot springs and fumaroles as a product of sublimation. Also occurs in igneous basalt rocks of recent volcanic activity."
Sulfur is the only mineral i know of with a rotten egg smell and it isn't found in granite (orthoclase, quartz, plagioclase, muscovite, biotite, and amphibole are what's in granite). My guess would be that you have a rock dust that maybe a landscaper would call granite, but not a geologist. Unless it was a slab o' granite with a fumarole passing through it.
"In sedimentary environments in evaporate and salt dome environments, where it is often a product of break down of sulfates caused by certain bacteria. In volcanic deposites in hot springs and fumaroles as a product of sublimation. Also occurs in igneous basalt rocks of recent volcanic activity."
Sulfur is the only mineral i know of with a rotten egg smell and it isn't found in granite (orthoclase, quartz, plagioclase, muscovite, biotite, and amphibole are what's in granite). My guess would be that you have a rock dust that maybe a landscaper would call granite, but not a geologist. Unless it was a slab o' granite with a fumarole passing through it.
- Status
