The growing large plants, outdoors, thread...

[Luther Burbank]

Yo pono brah, doesn't matter how much trash talk someone levels on a forum, no need to make implications they better watch their mouth because you might bump into them in real life. We're above that here, no? And certainly don't let a differing opinion drive you away. The ignore feature exists here for a reason!

 

[theJointedOne]

Not sure how many folks in the 530 are using Mr. B's Green trees. Ive never used it but know a few folks that do. Well I found out today that you can go to ag-mart and get a product called "AgPack", supposedly its Greentrees but not broken down as fine granular size. Dude said he saved 2k per tote this season.

Fwiw, personally i think its better to make your own mix, but too each their own.


Also visited a couple gardens in Butte county yesterday. What I saw was interesting.

One garden had well established large holes that have been cultivated for the past 5 years or so. The soil dude adds on this garden each year comes from EWSF. On this garden he said this year he added just 100 gallons of new EWSF soil on top of what are probably 1000 gallon mounds/holes. So not much new compared to what was already there.

The next garden was a new one. Late planted this year. About 50 200 gallon smarties filled with all brand new soil from the EWSF. Not the norcal blend but the one priced below that, as per Royals recommendation for containers supposedly.

The established garden looks awesome. Big plants that looked healthy, were tracking the sun, and probably will reach 5-7 pounds each. These guys use proven genetics, a proven ammend mix and top dress regiment. And lots of good foliars.

The garden with the new EWSF was suffering hardcore, even though they are both the same grower, same genetics, same regiments, ect.

The suffering plants were yellowing, tacoing, had less than optimal growth and overall health.

He didnt run a soil test on the new EWSF before using, but says that hell never buy soil again without testing.

 

[epicorchard]

Not sure how many folks in the 530 are using Mr. B's Green trees. Ive never used it but know a few folks that do. Well I found out today that you can go to ag-mart and get a product called "AgPack", supposedly its Greentrees but not broken down as fine granular size. Dude said he saved 2k per tote this season.

Fwiw, personally i think its better to make your own mix, but too each their own.


Also visited a couple gardens in Butte county yesterday. What I saw was interesting.

One garden had well established large holes that have been cultivated for the past 5 years or so. The soil dude adds on this garden each year comes from EWSF. On this garden he said this year he added just 100 gallons of new EWSF soil on top of what are probably 1000 gallon mounds/holes. So not much new compared to what was already there.

The next garden was a new one. Late planted this year. About 50 200 gallon smarties filled with all brand new soil from the EWSF. Not the norcal blend but the one priced below that, as per Royals recommendation for containers supposedly.

The established garden looks awesome. Big plants that looked healthy, were tracking the sun, and probably will reach 5-7 pounds each. These guys use proven genetics, a proven ammend mix and top dress regiment. And lots of good foliars.

The garden with the new EWSF was suffering hardcore, even though they are both the same grower, same genetics, same regiments, ect.

The suffering plants were yellowing, tacoing, had less than optimal growth and overall health.

He didnt run a soil test on the new EWSF before using, but says that hell never buy soil again without testing.

1000 gallon mounds perform very differently than 200 gallon smarties. The heat tolerance and water needs alone make it impossible to compare.... in my opinion

 

[theJointedOne]

obviously they are treated differently. I wrote that the mix that went into the smart pots was a mix as per Royals recommendation.

I didnt post this for anything other than i found it interesting as I was looking and hearing about these gardens, at the same time the convo here at the mag was going in the same direction.

Sorry to clutter the thread.

 

[Backyard Farmer]

Just figured I'd give every one an update ,

Tom just welcomed a new son in to his family , Born on 8/27 happy healthy and luckily looking more like his mom.

 

[bamboogardner]

The garden with the new EWSF was suffering hardcore, even though they are both the same grower, same genetics, same regiments, ect.

The suffering plants were yellowing, tacoing, had less than optimal growth and overall health.

He didnt run a soil test on the new EWSF before using, but says that hell never buy soil again without testing.

Same problem many, and I mean mucho many people had with EWSF soil. Personally, I think the owners got too greedy, cut corners, and tried to cash in on our expense. There is no way what happened this year with EWSF soil was an isolated incident. 67.80% Potassium, Calcium at 14.42% Ph at 7.0 with 0% Hydrogen and no Nitrogen is not just bad, it is completely horrible and absolutely without question the worst soil anyone could buy. In fact the AEA field rep actually asked me if I paid for the soil, and to completely trash in into a field that was not used at the end of the year. I could not even get it to grow grass seed, that's how bad it is.

I am sure people lost tons of money this year because of EWSF. Never again for me, that's for sure.

 

[Bulldog420]

Just going to throw it out there.....

A couple people were talking about this last year and nobody listened. (about the EWSF) I personally had nothing but good results with the soil last year. I drove 7 hours round trip to grab 4 yards, totally worth it if I had kept the property. Never did soil tests and moved from that property, however the one thing for sure was the quality of the earth worm castings. Super dark, rich, humus filled black gold. A totally finished product.

That is just my experience, with only 4 yards.

 

[goldcountryguy2]

Garbage soil with low quality inputs.....a thing of our past....

 

[Yes4Prop215]

damn i can't get this soil test back soon enough….NEED to know whats going on in there. next year need to make sure to get monthly if not bi weekly soil testing done because its amazing how quick things can turn for the worse. my OG row is suffering pretty bad each day more and more yellowing, compost teas, top dress and foliars aren't doing anything. I'm pretty sure i have a lockout/PH imbalance of some kind.


how are you guys adding gypsum at this point, via top dress? if one went the ammonium sulfate route, whats the best way to apply this safely and what is the lowest dose.

 

[bamboogardner]

damn i can't get this soil test back soon enough….

Not sure if your situation is the same as mine Since the Ph was 7.0+ of the soil and all the other problems such as the Potassium levels, the AEA field rep had me apply 90% Agricultural Sulfur to the soil. It is quite strong but will bring the Ph down quickly. You do not need much. A tablespoon for a 200 gallon smartie. I can give you the figures in a PM if you wish. Obviously I do not need to add any Potassium. Foliar and root drench daily with Ca and Nitrogen stopped the yellow dropping leaves that was happening in JUNE because of the lockout. He had me continue with the foliar program for Solanaceous crops but in decreased quantities except for Ca, which we increased by 8. I lost well over a months growth but things stabilized, but I have to fight it every day. Hope that helps.

 

[bamboogardner]

Let me add that Agricultural Sulfur is hard on the microherd, so go easy. They love the Sulfur though. We also did a drench with Spectrum Extra one time only followed by several applications of Rejuvinate just to make sure the micro herd was happy. Got my Ph down to 6.2 with 15% Hydrogen so what we did worked. Still fighting the lockout with the unbelieveable high K. That is why he told me to trash the soil. Stated it will take 3 to 4 years of growing oats I think it was to suck out all the K. Not worth it for me. Into the trash pile, all 20 yards.

 

[Yes4Prop215]

i might try and to a in field PH test of the soil here soon. my water is coming out at a steady 6.0-6.4 on any day, I've never seen it spike above 6.5….ive been soaking my mounds with the 6.0 water for the last week wouldn't that help bring down PH a bit.

im also leaning towards root rot or fusarium being the cause of some of this yellowing. like i said its not from the bottoms up, like normal leaf drop. this yellowing is literally starting at the crowns of each OG kush plant. and its only hitting certain plants, whereas other strains like the cherry pie, tangie, bubbas, chem4SD, etc all show zero signs of it. its pretty much reserved to my various OG kush crosses that were maybe a little too big and old when they went in, all march seed stock. april seed stock showing zero signs of any stress.

what do people think of MycoStop? got a few friends who swear by it, at this point a little late to the game but maybe can help prevent it from spreading.

 

[Yes4Prop215]

really hoping my K levels aren't that out of whack. thats scary he said to trash it...

damn labor day delaying my test….is there anywhere in the 530 that has quicker soil testing turnaround than 5 days?

 

[milkyjoe]

You can buy water soluble AS...I forget the exact number but something like 1 gram in 1 gallon of water is gonna be 40-50 ppm N. Simply water it on...3-4 grams per gallon.

Probably got to topdress gypsum...finest grind you can find.

Again a personal friend but custom hydro has both and ships generally same day you order.

But...without a soil test kinda shooting in the dark. Don't forget albion ca or jh biotech...foliar the fuck out of it if you are sure ca is really low.

Or...if both ca and n are low calcium nitrate provides both in soluble form if your ec is not too high. The plant will immediately take it up. 1 gram is 41 ppm N and 48 ppm ca

A bit of a crap shoot without data...so judge for yourself

 

[milkyjoe]

Any chance you can get a tissue test? That will tell the real story.

 

[bamboogardner]

what do people think of MycoStop?

If you have some, use it. It can hurt nothing but help you if indeed there is a problem below. Peaceful Valley has it but you have to have a Ag card to get it. If you are close, I have some. You can order direct from the manufacturer on Amazon and have it in 2 days, guaranteed fresh. That may be your best bet. Keep me informed. I love helping others out. Just gave a person I never met before a large container of Forbid so he could save his season.

 

[Yes4Prop215]

thanks milky, yea its rough having to wait for this soil test when i want to get out there NOW and fix things.

what are you using for calcium nitrate? maybe i can lightly add some of that in there.

hesitant to add more sulfur because I've already laid some on….and also added gypsum 3 weeks ago but maybe i didn't use enough. how much should i top dress per yard of soil.

thanks again, the last week really woke me up. my crew got a little complacent this august due to having such healthy july plants and focusing on an indoor project. in one week plants went from green to yellow….farming aint easy! i am tired of guessing games to figure out whats wrong i absolutely must do more soil testing down the line.

 

[Yes4Prop215]

i would love to get a tissue test or sap analysis…but seems kind of hard unless there is a ab that can do marijuana. I've been having to submit all my soil and stem samples under hops.

 

[milkyjoe]

If it is a root disease you end up no longer feeding the soil. Then bacteria do not mineralize things and the plant is not fed. Foliar and/or soluble nutes can at least mitigate that to some extent

I will pm you a couple of phone numbers

 

[Dave Coulier]

i might try and to a in field PH test of the soil here soon. my water is coming out at a steady 6.0-6.4 on any day, I've never seen it spike above 6.5….ive been soaking my mounds with the 6.0 water for the last week wouldn't that help bring down PH a bit.

im also leaning towards root rot or fusarium being the cause of some of this yellowing. like i said its not from the bottoms up, like normal leaf drop. this yellowing is literally starting at the crowns of each OG kush plant. and its only hitting certain plants, whereas other strains like the cherry pie, tangie, bubbas, chem4SD, etc all show zero signs of it. its pretty much reserved to my various OG kush crosses that were maybe a little too big and old when they went in, all march seed stock. april seed stock showing zero signs of any stress.

what do people think of MycoStop? got a few friends who swear by it, at this point a little late to the game but maybe can help prevent it from spreading.

If you want to reduce the pH of your media, you'll need to neutralize the alkalinity within. You can use Ammoniacal N, Urea, Sulfuric Acid, Nitric Acid, etc. Id lean towards Sulfuric Acid after hearing the symptoms you described.

Ive never used Mycostop myself, but Ive used Bioworks Rootshield Plus, and that stuff is amazing. Ive used it when transplanting clones who had root pathogens, and within 2 weeks problems were gone with amazing white fuzzy roots everywhere. Its more of a preventative, but it is definitely helpful if you get hit with root rot.

Ive also used Truban30wp to success, but I really like the Bioworks product. Products like RSP like these really should be used on a regular basis to keep your roots inoculated against root pathogens. Which reminds me, I need to buy some more RSP.