Seedling problems

[icky420]

ORGANIC SOIL: Link to Grow Diary

What STRAIN are you growing? Snow Cap Bagseed

What was the establishing technique? (seed or clone?) seed

What is the age of your plants? 12 days old

How Tall are the plants? 2-4in

What PHASE (seedling, vegetative or flower) are the plants in? Veg

What Technique are you using? (SOG, SCROG etc) n/a

What size pots are you using? 4in round

What substrate/medium are you using? What brand of soil mixture are you
using? Happy Frog..Humus, Peat, Perlite, EWC

What Nutrient's are you using?How much of each with how much water? How
Often? I gave them 1cap Maxi Seaweed on Feb 9th

What is the TDS/EC/PPM of your nutrients used? N/A

What is the pH of the "RUN-OFF"? not known at the moment

What method of pH test was administered? Using Strips? pH pen? N/A

How often are you watering? about every 5 days when the pot is light

When was your last feeding and how often are you feeding? N/A

What size bulb are you using? 250W MH

What is the distance to the canopy? 18in in Air cooled Hood

What is your RH Factor? (Relative Humidity) 30-40%

what is the canopy temperature? 77

What is the Day/Night Temp? N/A 24hr Light

What is the current Air Flow? 35CFM

Is the fan blowing directly at plants? Yes, small osoilation fan

Is the grow substrate constantly wet or moist? moist

Is your water HARD or SOFT? SOFT 100-110ppm

What water are you using? Bubbled Tap water

Has plant been recently pruned, cloned or pinched? NO

Have any pest chemicals been used? If so what and when? none

Are plant's infected with pest's? no


From day 2 of them popping soil they started to look a little pale around the edges so I gave them 1cap:gal Maxicrop Seaweed. They darkened up over the next 2 days. But now they are starting to show the same signs, but this time the newest leaf set(the baby ones) are looking purple.

FYI:
* I inoculated them on Feb 16th with 25ml:2ltr Earth Nector/Earth Ambrosia
* Some have purple stems. (the new stem grow, not the base/main stem)
* Leaves have started to droop.
* Some yellowing more than others
* I have 10 of another stain, same age, same issues, but yellowing more

I have all kinds of Organic nutes and tools so just ask me if I missed something...

WILL HAVE PICS IN A FEW

 

[HeadyPete]

Sounds like they need grow food.

Also, purpling can be a sign that your ph is out. You need to test runoff with preferably a digipen.

The pix will help more.

 

[MynameStitch]

What is your grow room temp, seedlings only get purple hue when the temps around them is cold, if the canopy temps is 77, I would like to know what he temp around them is......

Colder temps cause them to lock out food, because it slows there metabolism down and phosphorus is one nutrient that is badly absorbed when temps are cooler. That is why cannabis shows purpling in some strains when it's introduced to cooler temps.

Or if the temps is not the problem then a pH problem may be it, not knowing your run off is a bad idea, not to mention using humus and peat? Did you add lime to that? If not that soil has to be acidic.

Seedlings should not be fed like that in soil, your mixture should have plenty of nutrients for them along with them having the cotyledons should help them with that, I think you just caused them worst off problems by feeding them really...... Also some strains don't like happy frog, it's too much good stuff for them and they just don't seem to like the mixture sometimes.
Have seen more problems with happy frog than FFOF

 

[icky420]

The temps are preaty much the same all around the box. The hood is cooled so it dosent make much heat. The lowest temps get is 75F.

As far as the Humus Peat thing, I was just mentioning what makes up the soil. I did not add anything to the soil...But yes it does contain Lime.

I have had plants do this purpleing before and they also were from seed. I can say I dont seem to have any problems with new clones and this soil ( I only go back to seed once a yr) But I was thinking it might be the soil also...

They are pretty dry so I will check PH and PPM later today as well as get some pics up....

 

[MynameStitch]

Are you using a temp monitor to monitor the surroundings? Also are you getting night time temps or day time temps?
You should get a digi pen, I remember the problems you had last grow we helped you out last time.......

you need to ensure your pH is in check too.
Humas and peat are both acidic, depending on how much lime is in there, may not be enough to counteract the acidicness. Did you add the lime or was it already in there? Does it say on the back of the soil package containing lime?

 

[HeadyPete]

They are around 3 weeks old now, don't you think they need some N, Stitch? As far as I can tell, there has been no N fed at all, no grow food.

How big are they now? Where/how are they yellowing?

 

[icky420]

UPDATE 2WKS OLD

UPDATE 2WKS OLD

I have check Leaf Temp with an INFARED Temp gun 77F...

I have a Thermo in the room at the canopy level 75-78

They are under 24hr light so there is no night temp...

I added NOTHING to the soil

They are NOW 2wks old...

Last night I tested my run off..Base water 120ppm @ 7.0...Runoff tested 600-650ppm @ 6.8...

I thought that was a little high so I flushed then with plain non-PHed water untill I got around 250ppm...

I then gave each 1/2 cup of a light feed mix:

1/4tsp Metanaturals Base

0.5ML of Metanaturals Calcium

After mixing into 2ltr I had 300ppm @ 6.2

PICS

This is what one root ball looked like last night before watering,just to show when I would usually water


This is the purpleing I was talkin about.(OW plant used for shot)


Heavy Leaf Curl SC #7


Best for last...This plant as well as 1 other are doing fine
SC#8


I just found this pic..Its from an old grow that I used Peat pellets..Same Type of purpleing

Cant thing of anything else...so comment away.

 

[sirgrassalot]

Hot soil

 

[MynameStitch]

IU am not wanting canopy level I am talking about room temps, the area surrounding them.

FEeding them was a mistake, those purple hues ONLY come out when temps are too chilly for them. DO you have a fan on them or something?
NEver before have I seen those purple temps come out unless certain conditions are met.

Those plants are also very droopy looking, how often are you watering and when you water them is there run off from the bottom?
TThe overwatering could also be causing them to become a little moist in the area which could help with temps too.

You will always have night temps even if the lights stay on, cause depending on where you live if it gets chilly at night temps will fall a bit . If you fed them, that was a mistake.
The mixture is a little hot for seedlings I will say that for sure, if temps are not causing this then something in the soil is.

Get a room temp what temps are your room at. Is it winter or cold out where you live?

 

[icky420]

^^I understand what you are saying about night temps, but mine dont vary that much. The box manages to stay within 2*F at night.

Yes I do have a fan blowing on them, its a small fan, on low. osilating.

As far as watering...I'm watering about every 5 days.(Picture above shows what the soil looks like before I water.

We are having a unseasonably warm Winter here....Only goes down to like 30F outside

I will say I'm starting to think that there just may be a problem with my bag of soil. I have 3 other plants as well as 1 mother that are in this soil from the same bag and they seam to be showing that same types of problems. My local store told me they was having a problem with NEMATODES in FFOF (Ocean Forest) So maybe thats not the only one?

 

[MynameStitch]

No, I would doubt it's the soil.... try doing this, try removing the fan off the plants for a few days, when you have a fan blowing on you you are colder than your surrouding temps.

So take the fan off them, because if the air around them is cooler and if fan is blowing on them it will be cooler and your readings will be off.

REason why I am so sure of this, those purple hues never come out unless the temps are cooler around them, never seen this happen when it was NOT too cold.

 

[icky420]

OK, per Stitch recommendations, last night I turned the fan off...The temps WILL now be, Day 81F...Night 78..We will see how things go, I just have to remember to put the fan on low if/when I turn the house heat up. Wouldnt want them getting to warm...

 

[MynameStitch]

Ya, you don't want them to be too warm, the temps are fine for how young they are.

If this does not solve the problem, then something else is causing them to lock out P which then it would have to be the soil.

Oh, don't ya mean "stitch" instead of "snitch" lol

 

[icky420]

Ya know if I didnt keep changing things(Upgrading) around my garden I feel I wouldnt have half these problems...

I just took the plants out the other night and had them under some warm/cool light mix, and well...I can see a problem with how I was looking at things. I guess I didnt realize HOW blue this MH was, so no matter what, the plants looked yellow.

So...The plants werent that yellow the other day...but now I look at them today and one of the plants that was the most green is turning yellow on the new growth.

I was thinking of giving them some Metanaturals Base witch has some micros in it. Whada ya think?

I'm demoting myself back down to Newbie after this sht... Please hold my hand

 

[-ShutterBug-]

I'm demoting myself back down to Newbie after this sht... Please hold my hand

This made me laugh, what an awesome thing to say, thanks for the smile icky

 

[MynameStitch]

Well, if you do use a very small dose of it thats for sure.....

You got pics of them?

 

[icky420]

Quick Pics

Quick Pics

I will post some more info/questions after dinner.....

 

[MynameStitch]

Yup, time to feed them guys, make sure the first dose is small though

 

[icky420]

I just want to update that the seedlings as well as the other plants seam to be looking much better. (Thanks Stitch for pointing me to the cold) The temps are avg 82F with the thermometer placed at canopy level. I can tell things are much warmer just by the feel of the bottoms when I pick up the pots.I just hope that they can recover, I planed on one of these being this years mother...

Yesterday I mixed up a 2ltr bottle with 1/4tsp Metanaturals Base 3-3-3 and 1/4tsp Metanaturals Nitrogen 16-0-0 Plus 2 drops of Metanaturals Calcium. After mixing I had 500ppm @ 5.6, I upped the PH to 6.7 using a few pinches of EJ PH UP (Potasium Carbonate) I let it sit for a few hours to make sure ph did not drift. Ph held 6.7.

I watered the plants until a small amount ran out the bottom. I also moved the light further away because I seen a few signs that looked like light burn/bleaching.

I will take some pic tomorrow if things look any different.

Some Thinking Ahead

I just picked up a bag of Light Warrior today for my mix. While I was there I got into a little small talk with another grower that was shopping that happened to be using Happy Frog alone with just some Coco Croutons at the bottoms of the pots, and he LOVES it. So I plan on taking that idea and giving it a try being that I have a bag of Croutons already.

Soil Mix per Gal:
3 Parts Happy Frog
1 Part Light Warrior
Maybe 1 cup Croutons Mixed in the soil? as well as at the bottom of pots

I'm new to this whole Coco thing (1st time using in mix), but I am liking it because I feel its more "Natural" than adding Perlite. That stuff takes forever to go away

 

[MynameStitch]

coco croutons? you mean small pieces of coco?


Good, sounds like you are on the track for getting them in the correct direction
Light warrior is great mixture for seedlings too.