Sealed dep greenhouse

[queequeg152]

oh damn nm i found it in like 10 seconds.

http://www.netafimusa.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/08/G014-PC-Spray-Stakes-Brochure.pdf

see, the stake itself is just an oriface... its no different than a sprinkler head.

the button emitters are what do the regulation of pressure and flow rate... the buttons also are your check valves, so without a button inbetween the stake and the water line... when you shut down, it would just keep driping and dripping and dripping untill your line pressure reaches 0 psi.

also if you had your irrigation line ABOVE the emitters, the emitters would continue to dribble untile the line drained completely...whats worse is any spray stakes connected to a low point in the hose would drip longer than the rest, leading to inconsistent waterings.

this is probably why the system took so long to prime the first time... you are essentially draining the whole line each time.

see in my system with the 3.3gph emiitters, irrigation line iitself stays at like 5-10 psi when the pump shuts down and the solenoids close.

the emitters then immediatly crack open the next time you cycle because there is no air allowed to enter the system, and the irrigation line is already at partial pressure.

lol sorry if id didnt make that clear to you guys way back when i spoke about these things... the spray stake is just no different from a dripper arrow, its just directing and spreading the flow from the emitter.

 

[queequeg152]

But the stakes that speed of green uses are the pressure compensated stakes. Not the regular ones. Those don't need the woodpeckers do they?
Speed of green: what do you think? What would you use on 20 gal bags? Maybe 2 bowtie sprayers?

the pressure compensated spray stakes need the emitter. i cant speak to the non pressure compensated stakes... i never tried them, but im guessing those have a much smaller oriface to throttle the flow, that or you need to regualte the line pressure as a whole instead of at the emitter.

the plum emitters i have have holes like 50 thousandths wide... without an emitter they would flow way way to much.

 

[CrushnYuba]

Thanks guys! Yea, I was looking for info on the netafim site and couldn't find it. So woodpecker off the main line to micro tube to sprayer.

Speed of green: if you want them to spray less hard, I don't think you need a better pressure regulator. You need the woodpeckers if you don't have them according to that brochure.
I couldn't find any info on it anywhere. I hope they work with the micro tubing I got. I'm trying to buy as little as possible.

 

[queequeg152]

i highly reccomend buying the netafim assemblies if you have not bought them yet... the assembly comes with a nice snap on connector that lets you rapidly switch from the on position to the plug position further down the spray stake.

also make absolutly sure you get the right woodpecker emitters... they sell them with and without the microtubing barb... you NEED the micro tubing barb on the top, not the threaded one, or the one with the grooves etc.

also the netafim tubing is VERY VERY good... best microtubing ive ever used.... its not thick and hard to rout, and its very resiliant to uv even though its super flexible... idk what its made from, but some sort of modified urethane id guess, rather than a plasticised pvc like the other sorts.

 

[queequeg152]

also i just want to say to the OP... if you do go and put the wood peckers on your lines, you might run into issues with the pump short cycling very rapidly.

i can see that you have no accumulator tank, so what is likely to happen with the lower flow rates is... your system will rapidly reach the shut off pressure, then rapidly fall below the cut in pressure since you have no hydraulic accumulation.

as it is now, the system curve is probably nearly linear... meaning the system is flowing water as a function of system pressure right now at these low velocities.
so as you pump climbs in pressure, the stem is flowing more and more untill you hit a point
where the pump curve intersects the system curve at x psi and y gpm... when you add these wood pecker emitters your system curve will literally flat line into a horizontal system curve that is a function of emitter numbers and not PSI.... so count your total emitters, multiply times emitter flow rate... and if thats below your pumps capacity it will surely short cycle and you will need to get an accumulator and solenoid.

 

[Noonin NorCal]

Please Inform me limey, i need something that is going to prevent Powder mildew, Bud rot, spider mites, and caterpillars. I have no problem with organic/non chemical but it has to work.

the drip system is all set up, works like a charm. working on trellising tomorrow.

The drip system consists of

100 GPD R/O

275 gallon IBC tote

Northstar NSQ 5 GPH diaphragm pump

12v 17a 180w DC power source

20psi pressure regulator

Check Valve

5/8 plastic tubing

1/4 in plastic tubing

Netafim 3.3 GPH Pressure compensating drippers

The pump takes about 20sec to prime the system and all plants receive even amount of water.

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I have one plant with some aphids on the bottoms of the leaves, what works well to eradicate these? Neem?

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you shouldn't have a problem with caterpillars if they are in a greenhouse, you should get a sulfur burner for pm if you run into powder mildew

I burn sulfur in early stages of flowering even if the pm isn't present i think it works as a preventative somewhat, what do y'all think ?

 

[Noonin NorCal]

Sorry i haven't read through the whole journal yet i will later. But you won't have to tarp/cover your GH yet. the days are barely even 12 hours as is with the sun. I do 3 runs per year and usually put them out in the first or second week of April give them a few days to stretch then start covering/tarping at 12 hours. 7 pm cover 7 am uncover

 

[CrushnYuba]

I really second the tank thing.
Allot of us off grid use these 12v rv pumps to pump out of our tanks into or houses. My neighbor was getting crazy chatter using her sinks but not her shower. I fixed it with a tiny 2? Gallon pressure tank.
5gpm is a badass diaphragm pump.

 

[Speed of green]

okay so in for an update, queequeg you are correct that the lines drain out of the spray stakes after the pump is off, in some situations this could present a problem, but for me its not an issue, i water until i get quite a bit of runoff so any extra that leaks out after pump shutdown is just adding to the runoff.

the pump runs the entire time i am feeding, it doesn't cycle off and on, are these pumps designed to shut off when they reach their max psi?

i have 86 emitters at 3.3GPH = 4.73 GPM my pump is 5.5GPM I also have 130' of 5/8 hose that could possibly be acting like an expansion tank.

i had an overwatering issue after the second time i used the system, i hadn't installed the check valve yet and after shutoff the system was very slowly siphoning, i caught it on the second day and pulled the pickup out of the reservoir, everything bounced back a couple days later. since then i haven't had an issue with siphoning, but for now i leave the pickup out of the reservoir when I'm not watering, just in case.

i wish i would have known about the button emitters beforehand, although i think my system is working properly without them, for anyone building a watering system like this i would map everything out and try to source all your parts from somewhere inexpensive online, HD & Lowes are really expensive on some of their drip related items.


The plants are all healthy and flowering, I'm really taking advantage of the daylight hours right now, sunset and sunrise is 7am to 7pm... so for this first week of flower i haven't had to pull the tarp at all so that has been really nice.

all the trellising is in, everything has been treated for bugs and mold, all the lower branches have been pruned, the daytime temps haven't been over 82 inside the greenhouse.

my RH during the day stays around 40-45% nighttime is 50-60%

everything looks really good, the aphids i had are all gone, I'm nervous that I'm going to run out of room, the plants are growing fast and i hope the canopy doesn't get too thick, most of the lowers are gone so maybe that won't be such an issue to have a crowded canopy.

blue dream

Og's

 

[Speed of green]

Lower branches cleaned up

temp & rh right after sunset.

 

[queequeg152]

okay so in for an update, queequeg you are correct that the lines drain out of the spray stakes after the pump is off, in some situations this could present a problem, but for me its not an issue, i water until i get quite a bit of runoff so any extra that leaks out after pump shutdown is just adding to the runoff.

the pump runs the entire time i am feeding, it doesn't cycle off and on, are these pumps designed to shut off when they reach their max psi?

i have 86 emitters at 3.3GPH = 4.73 GPM my pump is 5.5GPM I also have 130' of 5/8 hose that could possibly be acting like an expansion tank.

i had an overwatering issue after the second time i used the system, i hadn't installed the check valve yet and after shutoff the system was very slowly siphoning, i caught it on the second day and pulled the pickup out of the reservoir, everything bounced back a couple days later. since then i haven't had an issue with siphoning, but for now i leave the pickup out of the reservoir when I'm not watering, just in case.

i wish i would have known about the button emitters beforehand, although i think my system is working properly without them, for anyone building a watering system like this i would map everything out and try to source all your parts from somewhere inexpensive online, HD & Lowes are really expensive on some of their drip related items.

the emitter assemblies are only like a dollar each at the high end places like greenhouse mega store. if you go elsewhere, you can find them cheaper, but they want you to buy 100's, and they generally have weeks long turn arounds... greenhousemegastore is nice in that they actually warehouse the spray stake assemblies, but yea they charge over reatil for them i think.

there might be more places selling the spray stake assemblies now? idk like i said im running the same bunch i bought back in like 2012 and 2014. they only break when i step on them.

its very possible that your pump would not short cycle with 86 emitters... just check your pump specs, these pumps are not TRUE positive displacement pumps like say a steel rod pump or even crazy PD pumps like ruby rod pumps... so yea they do have a bit of a drop off at high psi so its possible that at 4.73 gpm @ 50psi the system curve( nearly horizontal due to the emitters) and ( again nearly horizontal) would actually intersect before the pump cuts off.

even if iit does not though, just install a simple 5gallon accumulator and solenoid, its that simple. an additional pressure regulator would be ideal, but not mandatory.

re: siphoning,

again the emitters would solve this... but so would a check valve/air gap on the suction or discharge. however you would still have the issue of the residual pressure and elevation in the supply lines causing the spray stakes to continue to dribble after the pumpp is shut down.

the emitters are the way to go imho... they just make everything work much better. i think your spray stakes are probably running like 12gph now, and at pressures high enough to cause all the atomization that you mentioned earlier.

 

[Speed of green]

okay so here is the first hiccup, I am having some leaves turning yellow, starting from the bottom of the plant moving up, it looks like nitrogen deficiency. I am at 1.2ec - 6.3ph Jacks 5-12-26 & calcium nitrate. I am thinking to bump the feeding to 1.5-1.6 ec and dropping the ph to 6.1.

any thoughts or ideas? the yellowing is strain dependent, the og's are the worst, where the blue dreams are only slightly yellow on the bottom leaves.

 

[Speed of green]

could this yellowing be related to the pot size? What are some symptoms of root bound plants?

 

[queequeg152]

what is your nitrate at?

i run toms and melons at around 300 mg/l, but i run peat-lite or coco-lite not any organic mixes.

test your lechate as well... the leachate should be like 20-30% minimum higher than the feed conductivity. if the lechate is less than the feed then you are over watering, or you need to space out your irrigation events. in the heat, you tend to back off the runoff concentration to reduce osmotic stress when the plants are transpiring heavily, but during normal weather the leachate should be much higher.

i used to run like 8 irrigation events for rockwool toms... each watering was less than a coke cans volume lol, but its the only way to keep the medium at optimum moisture-oxygen permeability.

looks like classic nitrogen to me btw.

 

[delta9nxs]

could this yellowing be related to the pot size? What are some symptoms of root bound plants?

they could need more feed. is there a chance the bottoms are staying too wet?

how are you mixing the jack's?

 

[CanniDo Cowboy]

First, if your plants are flowering, they dont require as much nitro. Be careful of loading up formulas as watering early spring pots won't dry out very rapidly which can cause all kinds of other problems. Ummm, if youre running an EC of approx 1.5 which equals a ppm of say, 800-900 (maybe higher) you should be in the ballpark.

If youre outdoors right now, even in a greenhouse, if you dont have supplemental night time heat, the yellowing may be a result of nite time temps being too low i.e. cold nights, nothing more...??cc

 

[Speed of green]

I am feeding every three days or so, The bottoms are dry when i feed. I get a lot of runoff everytime.

the lowest temp is 61 at night, ill try to bring this number up.

I mix the jacks and calnit by volume. jacks first till it completely dissolves and then the calnit.

The roots look okay to me, nice and white. its hard to get a decent picture by myself.

 

[Speed of green]

 

[Speed of green]

well i upped the feed to 1.5ec or 750ppm .5 scale 6.1ph Hopefully i will see some improvement in a day or so. The yellowing leaves will not get better correct? they just won't get worse if the issue is corrected?

 

[queequeg152]

lol is weed really that nutrient adverse? or are you running an organic soil?

i run my toms at 2.2 ec.

fuck i ran a Tennessee burly tobacco one year at close to 3ec, with shit loads of nitrate. tobacco is fucking savage on nitrogen. grows like nothing ive ever seen.