Rain water and tap water discussion

[Three Berries]

Mine is hard well water at 440 ppm/7.4 pH. But when it rains for a couple days both the ppm count and pH go down. Seeing as the hardness is mostly Calcium carbonate and the pH high to start is good for when the nutes get added as it settles out around 6.3-6.5 when done. Using rain water and a lot of pH up needs to be done.

If your roof has an anti-algae treatment (copper) it may harm with low rainfall. I've got three 55 gallon barrels set up and a 1/4" will fill them up from 1/4 of the roof. So if the rain amount is anything worth talking about it should flush off the bad stuff.

My rainwater is not consistent pH though. But usually is around 6.4-6.5, sometimes 7.0 though. PPM around 20.

 

[Three Berries]

I've been using KOH for pH up. Very strong and doesn't take much. But I found out it strips calcium out of the mix and turns it into CaOH a hard insoluble white solid.

Here is my nute mix with hard well water after I pH it up from 6.0 to 7.0 with KOH.

This the calcium/magnesium in 2L of well water at 440 ppm.

 

[Creeperpark]

My tap water
I can understand folks saying they can't grow with tap water but as you can see I don't have that problem

You have tap from a Spring and that's not the same as City water.

 

[Creeperpark]

Rainwater should not be collected if it comes from a roof cause the roofing materials are probbaly toxic.
If the rainwater was collected in the open away from man made structures it should would be ok. You
may have to raise the pH a little seeing most rainwater is somewhat acidic.

My barn has a clean metal roof and the water ppm is usually between 3 to 14. However, in the Summer the ppm will go to about 25 if it sets very long

 

[Creeperpark]

Here are 2 of the rainwater plants from the above post today, still have about 35 days left in flowering. The other 3 plants were moved outdoors and doing even better. Low light and low ppm feed only work's using pure untreated water. These plants have a strong skunk smell.

 

[gizmo666]

Here are 2 of the rainwater plants from the above post today, still have about 35 days left in flowering. The other 3 plants were moved outdoors and doing even better. Low light and low ppm feed only work's using pure untreated water. These plants have a strong skunk smell.

and dam nice looking too

 

[gizmo666]

You have tap from a Spring and that's not the same as City water.

i did have but recently changed up to main system(for more reliable supply)
thats the readings now but as you say i'm still not on city water as our sources are dam near pure rainwater collected then pumped
i am interested tho in what city you live in and how your water is cleaned/supplied (as you know i'm a plumber that stuff interests me lol) as 500ppm to me is very high
a rough guide for drinking water is
0-150 ppm excellent quality
150-250 good quality
250-300 fair quality
300-500+ very poor not good for drinking
take care
peace

 

[Creeperpark]

i did have but recently changed up to main system(for more reliable supply)
thats the readings now but as you say i'm still not on city water as our sources are dam near pure rainwater collected then pumped
i am interested tho in what city you live in and how your water is cleaned/supplied (as you know i'm a plumber that stuff interests me lol) as 500ppm to me is very high
a rough guide for drinking water is
0-150 ppm excellent quality
150-250 good quality
250-300 fair quality
300-500+ very poor not good for drinking
take care
peace

You're right about my tap water is very poor and the city I live in doesn't care. All large water systems used for a large population will treat the water to cancel the cation exchange capacity. The reason is untreated water that travels miles in pipes will slowly leach out heavy metals into the water. Babies, elderly people and people with immune diseases could be posioned over a long period of time. So to keep the water from leaching out of the metals they buffer the pH and treat with chemicals. Most large Cities will have 150-250 ppm good quality water after treatment. However, the treatment still cancels the exchange capacity because of the buffered state of treatment. Where I live the main component is lime base soil with an alkaline pH and anything that percolates on the ground becomes contaminated and has to be filtered. Water over 500 ppm will get a city in trouble but since water changes so fast it's hard to get anything done about it. Heres my tap water EC with pH at this moment.

 

[gizmo666]

Dam that's harsh even in our city's over here we don't get higher than 200 ppm

 

[Creeperpark]

Soils that aren't alkaline do differently than waters that are and will use different water treatments. If a city is set on sandy loam that lacks calcium the treatment will be different from an alkaline area. Where there's a lot of rain-fall annully the pH will be lower and have to be buffered, but use-less filtering. Low pH is the problem! Any water that travels through pipes can't have a pH under 7 because the hydrogen exchanges with the metals and the metals become mobile in the water. Each region has its own treatment plan suited to the area they get water from. The goal of water treatment is the cancel the cation exchange capacity to prevent metal from leaching from old metal pipes. I have seen clean city tap water that was 150 ppm with a 7.6 pH from citys that care about their water. You can use that water for a growing weed and will work, however, it still lacks the full cation exchange capacity.

 

[exploziv]

I would guess cities that change their pipe infrastructure to hdpe plastics can then just filter the water? No need for this alkali treatment?

 

[gizmo666]

I would guess cities that change their pipe infrastructure to hdpe plastics can then just filter the water? No need for this alkali treatment?

Thankfully we done that years go when we got rid of lead pipework

 

[Creeperpark]

I would guess cities that change their pipe infrastructure to hdpe plastics can then just filter the water? No need for this alkali treatment?

The only way that could happen is if every single metal pipe was replaced with PVC and that would be impossible. Looking below you can see how many people are involved in water systems.

• New York City, NY (Population: 8,622,357)
• Los Angeles, CA (Population: 4,085,014)
• Chicago, IL (Population: 2,670,406)
• Houston, TX (Population: 2,378,146)
• Phoenix, AZ (Population: 1,743,469)
• Philadelphia, PA (Population: 1,590,402)

 

[exploziv]

I thought only main lines need to be upgraded, not the building installations as well. I was originally thinking that is why they deployed plastic pipes in most of the EU..

 

[Three Berries]

Chicago has a big lead pipe problem. Up until the EPA banned it in the late 70s lead pipe was required for code from the main to the house meter.

 

[Creeperpark]

You ain't kidding TB, the metal pipe is very dangerous when acidic water runs through them. All metal pipes will leach traces of metal at some point because of the hydrogen in the water. However, if the pH is in a high range and treated with chemicals it will have a high hydroxyl content which overrides the hydrogen and does not affect the pipes as much.

The most common sources of lead in drinking water are lead pipes, faucets, and plumbing fixtures. Certain pipes that carry drinking water from the water source to the home may contain lead. Household plumbing fixtures, welding solder, and pipe fittings made prior to 1986 may also contain lead. Google

Copper seldom occurs naturally in ground or surface water. Most often, it enters a household water supply through dissolution of copper from plumbing fixtures, pipes and fittings. Too much copper can cause adverse health effects such as stomach cramps, nausea and diarrhea. Google

Is it safe to drink water from old galvanized pipes?
As galvanized pipes age, the zinc coating erodes and pipes corrode. Lead, a dangerous toxin, may build when the pipes corrode. Galvanized plumbing could pose a dangerous health hazard if not replaced with updated, safer pipes. Google

Galvanized steel will eventually start to corrode and can pose a hazard for drinking water, which makes it unsafe for drinking water in the long run. The problem isn't the zinc coating but lead and cadmium, two heavy metals that can exist in the zinc because of the galvanizing process. Google

A water resource specialist is an expert in water supply, quality, and the regulations that are set to ensure quality and supply needs are met. These experts may have various job titles such as hydrogeologists or water resources engineers. Google

Hydrogeologist designs a special treatment plan for each water treatment. Safety over quality, is good for people but not best for plants.

 

[Three Berries]

In Michigan and north of me a bit south of Chicago they switched water sources an did not adjust their buffering chems. The lead went through the roof and the water companies act stupid.

I worked for a local water bottled for a while. The used city water sourced from a well. We tested the incoming water for the usual stuff and quite few times had to call them up and complain about chlorine being too high

The bottler drilled a 12" well and were going to use that but it was so high in iron the city water was a better deal. There was a meteor impact just a few miles away back in the day.

 

[blondie]

I picked up more rainwater in a deluge we had the other night. Just had a look at my gal and she’s doing good. Only a few lower leaves took the hit. I’m going to bleach the water here before long so no algae. I think I recall something with copper strips with the gutters. I better look into this. Good stuff here.

 

[Creeperpark]

I picked up more rainwater in a deluge we had the other night. Just had a look at my gal and she’s doing good. Only a few lower leaves took the hit. I’m going to bleach the water here before long so no algae. I think I recall something with copper strips with the gutters. I better look into this. Good stuff here.

I never add bleach to any water because the exposure will kill the microbial populations in the soil. Rainwater is good for a long time, as long as it doesn't hit the ground or get contaminated with anything. As the rainwater sets, it will rise in ppm from dust and carbon dioxide exposure and only a few ppm. Plants have their own RO systems and can purify the rainwater very easily.

 

[Creeperpark]

Plants have their own inner RO systems and can filter out contaminates as long as it's not more than their holding capacity can manage. Using tap water the plant's RO system gets clogged from all the hydroxyl content from the high pH and ppm. Each plant has a purifying system that can manage impurities to a point. When the plant gets more hydroxyl than it can purify then the plants purifying ability will shut down and go into survival mode. Survival mode is the cannibalism of itself or bronzing of the leaves.