Pissed off UC

[Mr Blah]

Anyone use these;
http://www.bayteccontainers.com/eco...kmqAmM26fuoXNbVQMxggm4QoaAv4j8P8HAQ#gsc.tab=0
I think they will work. But not knowing the wall thickness it is hard to tell.



Also thought about just putting a drip pan under each bucket site I got in there now, just to catch first initial dripping till the salts seal it up. If they don't, I am not out a lot of mula.
Thoughts????

 

[Mr Blah]

FOund out the square 4 gal buckets I want to use are 75 mil. I used the 5 gal black project buckets from the Home Depot. I am trying to find out how thick these are.

 

[TreehouseJ]

OK THJ, you got me enough to want to take a looksee at what you got. Any pics on system your running?

I'll post flower room pics in 7 hours when the lights come on. Essentially all I've got running right now is a commercial grade air pump in the attic, feeding 2x7 gallon buckets in my closet under 2x600 hps's, and 2x5 gallon buckets in a veg tent in the adjoining room. Each plant under 2.75' x 2.75' modular scrog. I've got big 8 gallon "gorilla tubs" that I'll keep the buckets in for ice water baths. I use floating water level indicators to avoid cutting any holes in the buckets. I fix my scrogs to my bucket lids so I can remove them, and dump rather than drain, again to avoid any drilling and leaking. Hand watering ain't so bad if you got a small water pump to help you out, plus, you get to individually tailor your feeding regimen for each of your girls. DWC isn't near as exciting as UC, but you def get a lot more insurance.

 

[TreehouseJ]

I get all my plastic from usplastic. Good, thick, black, 1,2,3,4,5,6, and 7 gallon buckets. Just don't buy the economy lids. Spend the extra 4 cents. My 2" uniseals worked like a charm for my bio buckets, but I had the drain 3 inches under my feed tube as per big tokes instructions, so it was never under any substantial pressure, and never leaked.

 

[Mr Blah]

I get all my plastic from usplastic. Good, thick, black, 1,2,3,4,5,6, and 7 gallon buckets. Just don't buy the economy lids. Spend the extra 4 cents. My 2" uniseals worked like a charm for my bio buckets, but I had the drain 3 inches under my feed tube as per big tokes instructions, so it was never under any substantial pressure, and never leaked.

That's funny I can't find any thing except round for black buckets...need square for my uniseals to work.

 

[TreehouseJ]

I've hunted for square black buckets. Not an easy find. Make sure you drill backwards next time. I'm pretty sure you would have been fine, if not better off in your round buckets, if you had melted your holes out instead of chopping them out.

 

[TreehouseJ]

I would have also made a test bucket and tested its seals at least overnight before knocking out a dozen buckets or w/e.

 

[TreehouseJ]

haole420
Active Member
to answer your question, no, i don't no of anything better than uniseals to get a watertight seal on a round/curved plastic surface. i love uniseals. they do the impossible, you just have to be very, very precise when drilling your hole (less than 1/8" off).

uniseals can be a bitch if you drill the hole too big or not smoothly enough. i've got a graveyard of bins and garbage cans and buckets i messed up. they do expand when you plug a pipe in them, but not a lot. and they won't fill in chips and large irregularities. the hole has to be smooth. that's key. high speed seems to melt the plastic smoothly after cutting it. practice on the lid if it's the same kind of plastic. every kind of plastic is different and reacts differently to different bits, speeds, torque settings, etc.

i like using a step bit for smaller holes (1-1/4" for 1/2" and 3/4" uniseals), but it's easy to go too far and make the hole too big. make your mark and start on the outside. about halfway through, drill from the inside. drilling it from both sides gives it a burr-free cut. i find that i get a more precise cut when i finish the hole from the inside. having a helper support the plastic so it doesn't flex when you drill it will also give you a more exact hole.

for bigger holes, i use a hole saw with pilot bit. after you pierce the surface with the pilot bit, make sure the cup saw is spinning at a pretty good speed before making contact with the surface to be cut. if it's not spinning fast enough, the cutting edge can snag, and torque the entire drill in an unbalanced, off-axis, dangerous way that gives you an uneven hole that will leak. i like to drill the pilot hole with a plain 1/4" drill bit from the outside, then actually cut the hole from the inside out. obviously, you won't be able to do this with a 5-gallon bucket.

with both methods of cutting holes, precision is the key. not just a consistent diameter, the edge of the hole needs to be perfectly smooth.

if you have to manually deburr, use your fingernail or credit card. don't use a knife.

the second problem people run into with uniseals is difficulty in getting the pipe into the hole.

to get the pipe in the hole, lube it up with plumber's silicon grease. best stuff ever. i use it on both sides of the gasket for bulkheads too. the lubrication lets you really turn the nut with a lot less friction from the rubber gasket. another thing you can do is to slightly taper the edge of the cut pipe. i've seen tools to do this at the hardware store. i've used a utility knife with success to manually cut a 45-degree bevel in the outside of the pipe. doesn't have to be perfect, just enough to get it going, but i don't even do this anymore. just lube up the inside of the uniseal good and plenty and ram it in there. if you get the lube on a surface you're going to glue, use a clean paper towel to wipe off any excess and be sure to use a purple primer before gluing.

if you're not using a ratcheting pvc cutter, then spend the $10 and get one. it gives you easy, perfect cuts. i have one small one and one that can handle up to 2" drain pipes. you can also use a chop saw, but i find the hand cutter easier and faster to work with. pipes cut with hacksaws give you a rough edge that won't insert smoothly. chop saws can chip and melt the pipe, potentially making it more difficult to insert. the ratcheting hand cutters are really the way to go.

hope that helps and you have better experiences with uniseals! if you do find of another product, please update this thread!

haole420, Jan 8, 2013 #5

 

[TreehouseJ]

^^^ this guy gets it, he just doesn't know to drill backwards

 

[Mr Blah]

Thanks...I think I read that somewhere.

The thing is I have 2 large systems in large 27 gal totes using 3" uniseals, no issues.
I do have 12 more black round buckets that I will use taking your advice. They were going to be used for a replacement 12 bucket UC system down stairs but if this works I will buy 12 more.
Honestly the round black buckets cost a lot less than square.

I can't fit my drill and hole saw in the bucket to drill from the inside so it will all have to be done from outside going backwards, on the drill.
Tomorrow I will try 2 buckets connected with one pipe, and test with water pressure.

 

[TreehouseJ]

I saw some guy over in the ppk thread accomplish a water tight seal with a 13/16th hole and a 7/8ths OD hose on his buckets. I chuckled.

 

[RamCTD1027]

I saw some guy over in the ppk thread accomplish a water tight seal with a 13/16th hole and a 7/8ths OD hose on his buckets. I chuckled.

Many people around here are doing it this way. You need to use either Goodyear or continentel neoprene rubber hose. I have been doing it this way for over a year without one drop of water. Okay, I lied. I did kick (i. e. Trip) a hose real hard one time and cracked the bucket slightly. I saw a slow drip but had to run to pick up my kids. Came back the next day to a slow drip with a small puddle under the leak. Changed out the bucked and good to go.

Edit: sorry about the picture orientation. How to I fix it?

 

[Mr Blah]

Many people around here are doing it this way. You need to use either Goodyear or continentel neoprene rubber hose. I have been doing it this way for over a year without one drop of water. Okay, I lied. I did kick (i. e. Trip) a hose real hard one time and cracked the bucket slightly. I saw a slow drip but had to run to pick up my kids. Came back the next day to a slow drip with a small puddle under the leak. Changed out the bucked and good to go.

Edit: sorry about the picture orientation. How to I fix it?

Do you use a heat gun to mold it around the bucket hole?
What do you think about Uniseals on round buckets? 1.5" think it'll work if I drill the hole backwards with the hole saw?

 

[TreehouseJ]

Many people around here are doing it this way. You need to use either Goodyear or continentel neoprene rubber hose. I have been doing it this way for over a year without one drop of water. Okay, I lied. I did kick (i. e. Trip) a hose real hard one time and cracked the bucket slightly. I saw a slow drip but had to run to pick up my kids. Came back the next day to a slow drip with a small puddle under the leak. Changed out the bucked and good to go.

Edit: sorry about the picture orientation. How to I fix it?

Y'all never cease to amaze me. Beautiful room you got goin! I'm unsure of how to reorient your photo, I would try reorienting the camera like a doofus. Either way good look! I'm curious to see if anyone does that with bigger hose.

Mr blah, I think they just cut the neoprene hose at an angle, and shove it in the bucket. A 14/16ths od neoprene hose acts like a uniseal in a 13/16ths hole.

 

[TreehouseJ]

Main point here is that if you can get your cuts clean enough, they should seal. I'm a contractor for Nike, Prada, Saks, Apple, Victoria secret, you name it, I put up all their fixtures and flat screens and sometimes the stores themselves. I'm a dilettante at best when it comes to hydro set up, but I know how touchy and finicky drills can be. I didn't learn to use one right 'til I was 20. It takes practice and patience. Don't rush your cuts if they are supposed to be water tight. Sit down in front of the tv with your buckets and patiently de-burr and inspect them. Whenever you are working with saws you need to take a handful of chill pills, and test everything first so you don't ruin all your material. Also, get a few drip pans like you were describing above because what you think is a tiny teaspoon per day leak could be a couple liters, or vise versa. Hard to tell on my nice wood floors. -.-

 

[RamCTD1027]

No, a heat gun is not required. Like I said above, you can only use the Goodyear of Continental neoprene rubber hose. Neoprene rubber is used in many different light duty sealing applications. The wall thickness on the hose, combined with drilling the hole in the bucket undersized creates enough radial pressure to make a seal without doing anything other than lubing up the hose and bucket (i used dish soap) and inserting the hose. I also cut the hose at a 45-degree angle to make the job easier.

Uniseals were designed to be used on curved surfaces. I've successfully used them in the past, however, if I had a choice, I like flat surfaces and bulkheads.

I have no experience drilling plastics in reverse so I won't advise this, but I do have experience machining plastics. Most 5 gallons buckets are made from high density polyethylene. HDPE machines best with low speeds and heavy feed rates. In my opinion, running in reverse would only heat up the material, locally soften that area, and not drill a precise hole. I would recommend sharp sharp tooling, running at low speeds, with high feed rates.

 

[RamCTD1027]

For deburring, I use one off these:

http://www.mcmaster.com/#bur-tools/=11n5qpm

You can find them all over, including Amazon. They take a little practice to use so I'd recommend practicing on some of your old buckets before you attempt to deburr the new ones.

 

[TreehouseJ]

No, a heat gun is not required. Like I said above, you can only use the Goodyear of Continental neoprene rubber hose. Neoprene rubber is used in many different light duty sealing applications. The wall thickness on the hose, combined with drilling the hole in the bucket undersized creates enough radial pressure to make a seal without doing anything other than lubing up the hose and bucket (i used dish soap) and inserting the hose. I also cut the hose at a 45-degree angle to make the job easier.

Uniseals were designed to be used on curved surfaces. I've successfully used them in the past, however, if I had a choice, I like flat surfaces and bulkheads.

I have no experience drilling plastics in reverse so I won't advise this, but I do have experience machining plastics. Most 5 gallons buckets are made from high density polyethylene. HDPE machines best with low speeds and heavy feed rates. In my opinion, running in reverse would only heat up the material, locally soften that area, and not drill a precise hole. I would recommend sharp sharp tooling, running at low speeds, with high feed rates.

Don't knock it til you try it! The cuts come out looking like the work of a laser. I drill all my plastic in reverse with Milwaukee blades and hilti drills, high-speed low feed. Melts it like a laser without any shaking.

 

[RamCTD1027]

Don't knock it til you try it! The cuts come out looking like the work of a laser. I drill all my plastic in reverse with Milwaukee blades and hilti drills, high-speed low feed. Melts it like a laser without any shaking.

I won't knock it, but like I said, I won't advise it either. Maybe it works in this situation where precision is not as important as a smooth surface. The Uniseal creates so much radial pressure on the bucket and the PVC in the ID of the seal, that it can tolerate the hole drilled in reverse. It would NEVER fly to machine plastic in reverse that is held to any sort of tighter tolerance.

 

[TreehouseJ]

I won't knock it, but like I said, I won't advise it either. Maybe it works in this situation where precision is not as important as a smooth surface. The Uniseal creates so much radial pressure on the bucket and the PVC in the ID of the seal, that it can tolerate the hole drilled in reverse. It would NEVER fly to machine plastic in reverse that is held to any sort of tighter tolerance.

In my experience, using hand drills, I get tighter tolerances in reverse. I am imagining this is because the drill can't "bite" the plastic. If you were going low speed, high feed, I am imagining you would need a drill press and some good clamps to avoid the bite, and achieve your tighter tolerance. With a good drill press and clamps, going backwards does seem awfully counter-intuitive. I'll graciously buy whatever you are selling because you are clearly a mad man, but I've drilled a thousand holes both ways, and in my backwards universe, I get better seals going backwards with both bulkheads and uniseals.