Philips 315w CDM Elite (CMH)

[rives]

Rives, what are your thoughts about the Philips 315w 98v T12 Clear PGZX18 Mastercolor CDM-T Elite Agro HID Light Bulb? It seems in most ways to be superior to the 315w CMH bulb. And the price is marked down by a wide margin making it a worthwhile long term investment.

Thanks.

You need to be doing some more searching around if you want to keep your pocketbook intact! That price is right at double what the lamp is going for from most vendors.

The Agro (frequently misspelled Argo in many ad copies) is an excellent lamp. I've found it to have a slight edge over the standard 930 T9 lamp, but the difference isn't earth-shaking. It does have the double jacket (T12) and can be run in an open fixture where the T9 can only be run in an enclosed fixture safely. I cover this in post #3.

 

[willowz]

You need to be doing some more searching around if you want to keep your pocketbook intact! That price is right at double what the lamp is going for from most vendors.

The Agro (frequently misspelled Argo in many ad copies) is an excellent lamp. I've found it to have a slight edge over the standard 930 T9 lamp, but the difference isn't earth-shaking. It does have the double jacket (T12) and can be run in an open fixture where the T9 can only be run in an enclosed fixture safely. I cover this in post #3.

I guess Philips can do that. I seem to have a premonition that I might be saying that often... haha.

I'll be reviewing this thread. Thank you for your time and lucid explanations. Have you considered taking on a teaching profession? You seem to have an infinite amount of patience, haha.

Thanks!

 

[rives]

Thanks. I trained a bunch of electricians over the years, so I do have some experience in that vein. I'm not sure that my kids would agree about my level of patience, though!

 

[iuredbud]

It says on top of that Sunplix ballast its a CMH ballast. This wont work with CDM Bulbs ?


View Image

I just got 2 of these SunPlix ballast and one failed right out of the box for a Philips 942 lamp. When I tried to get a replacement the importer said he was waiting for stock.

 

[McKush]

At the operating temp and pressure of that bulb i strongly recommended ensuring the proper ballast is used. Close really isnt good enough open or enclosed

 

[Hammerhead]

It gets confusing, but there are a number of terms for these lamps that are used interchangeably - CDM, CMH, and LEC are all pretty common. I think that the ballast will work with CDM lamps, but.....
.

I got ya. I get confused CMH bulbs run a a high Frequency and CDM bulbs run at a low frequency. I did not think you could run them interchangeably? LEC fixtures use CDM bulbs that's what was in mine..

That price for the Agro T12 lamp is way to high. you can get that lamp for 73. Doublr check to make sure you are getting the right bulb from this place. Item info is wrong on these.
http://www.horticulturesource.com/g...color-cdm-lamp-315-w-argo-p-12-cs-t12-p13536/


No I'm not using a Sunplix ballast. I use a Sun System LEC 630 and a Welhink 315 Conversion kit... Both of these are used to veg the big plants. Clones, Seedlings im still using T5.

 

[rives]

I got ya. I get confused CMH bulbs run a a high Frequency and CDM bulbs run at a low frequency. I did not think you could run them interchangeably? LEC fixtures use CDM bulbs that's what was in mine..

The CDM lamps are a unique subset of the CMH family, with their own specific operational characteristics. A CDM is a CMH, but a CMH is not necessarily a CDM. Confused yet?

The following shows the Philips family of Ceramic Metal Halide lamps. The CDM-T's are roughly 2/3 of the way down the page.

http://www.lighting.philips.com/main/prof/lamps/high-intensity-discharge-lamps/ceramic-metal-halide

 

[Jhhnn]

I got ya. I get confused CMH bulbs run a a high Frequency and CDM bulbs run at a low frequency. I did not think you could run them interchangeably? LEC fixtures use CDM bulbs that's what was in mine..

That price for the Agro T12 lamp is way to high. you can get that lamp for 73$
http://www.horticulturesource.com/g...color-cdm-lamp-315-w-argo-p-12-cs-t12-p13536/


No I'm not using a Sunplix ballast. I use a Sun System LEC 630 and a Welhink 315 Conversion kit... Both of these are used to veg the big plants. Clones, Seedlings im still using T5.

Not quite. Growers' high freq electronic ballasts have nothing to do with CMH. That's a different realm, a different conversation entirely. All CMH lamps are low frequency lamps. Other than the mastercolour elite CDM series, a subset of CMH, they're all designed to operate on a 60 hz sine wave & lamp specific voltages in existing commercial/ industrial magnetic core & coil luminaires. They're backward compatible upgrade lamps. In contrast, 315 CDM operates on a 100 hz square wave at 100v from specially designed electronic ballasts. They're not intended to be backward compatible electrically at all.

 

[Hammerhead]

I can fire any 600 CMH conversion bulb using any of my Digital 600w ballast(high frequency). At least all the 1's I have tried work fine. This is what I used for years before I swapped over to LEC. From what I was told I cant use those ballast to fire a CDM bulb. This is why I bought a Welthink 315 ballast(low frequency). 1 doesn't work with the other.

 

[Hammerhead]

The 315 lamp is uniquely designed to run at low frequency and virtually all of the other available electronic ballasts are high frequency. Also, CMH lamps run at extremely high internal pressures (2500-3000 psi) and can grenade in a spectacular fashion when they fail.

Is this not correct then ???

This is what I said as well.

 

[rives]

HH, I think that the 600w lamps that you have been using are MH, not CMH. Metal Halide vs Ceramic Metal Halide. MH lamps have a quartz arc tube, where the CMH has a sintered aluminum arc tube similar to what HPS uses.

 

[Hammerhead]

That's prob true, I was always under the impression they both are high frequency.. CDM bulbs are specialty bulbs that run low frequency..

 

[CMH]

I just got 2 of these SunPlix ballast and one failed right out of the box for a Philips 942 lamp. When I tried to get a replacement the importer said he was waiting for stock.

Where did you buy the SunPlix ballast? Thank you.

 

[willowz]

I got these two images regarding the SunPlix ballast. They go into detail about the specs of the ballast:

 

[willowz]

And:

 

[willowz]

Where did you buy the SunPlix ballast? Thank you.

I don't mean to be a shill and think it to be wiser to order from ATL or even wait until they offer a newer version with the 60,000h lifespan of a bulb. Anyway, they (the SunPlix) ballasts are listed under a well known internet auction site. That's all I think I can say.

Thanks!

 

[willowz]

rives, quoting your second post:

"For whatever it's worth, I think that Philips/Advance would be very difficult to beat. They are industrial quality equipment, which is on a substantially different level than most gear aimed at growers or coming out of China."

This is what has been available from ATL; but, do you think the length of time a bulb can be used is also comparable to that claimed by the GEL ballasts? Also, do you think the newer and much more rich on blue blue and red spectrum CDM lights for the T12 fixture can be used?

 

[rives]

It's interesting that the Sunplix claims 91.4% efficiency and draws 353.9 watts while the Philips claims 93% and draws 342 watts.

 

[willowz]

I also have a final question, do you think ATL will offer the CeremaTek 315w ballast in the future? I don't think they can be beat to extend lamp lifespan. If not, then is there anyone one can buy them individually?

Thank you sensei.

 

[rives]

rives, quoting your second post:

"For whatever it's worth, I think that Philips/Advance would be very difficult to beat. They are industrial quality equipment, which is on a substantially different level than most gear aimed at growers or coming out of China."

This is what has been available from ATL; but, do you think the length of time a bulb can be used is also comparable to that claimed by the GEL ballasts? Also, do you think the newer and much more rich on blue blue and red spectrum CDM lights for the T12 fixture can be used?

I'm not sure which ballast you are referencing here - "This is what....", and the T12 used with what? I think that you are referring to the Philips, so..

I'm skeptical of ALL of the extended lamp longevity claims by other manufacturers. 50k hours is 5.7 years of operation at 24 hours a day. These ballasts haven't been around long enough to run those kind of hours, much less determine that is what the average life will be. There are obviously going to be early failures, so average connotes that there must have been some that went far longer. Both GEL and Cycloptics have dropped that particular ballast. Hmmm..... Philips developed the technology, has been around for years as an industrial supplier, and in my opinion, has the most believable specs.

The T12 lamps should be usable behind any ballast that will run the T9. The difference lies in the physical envelope of the lamp, not in the operating characteristics.