Tutorial Organics for Beginners

[jaykush]

not all of the nutrients in guano are soluble. when i used to use guanos, the bag said 10-20% soluble N for example. the rest needs something to decompose it and make the nutrients available ( meaning your soil needs to process it)

 

[iGro4Me]

Searching for near perfect...

Searching for near perfect...

Hey Burn...I know we've been over this already...but...

I was just thinking about my beautiful babies that are about 2 weeks away from going in their 3.5 gallon pots full of LC's #1 and a thought occurred to me.

I realize the ideal place to contend with pH issues is in the medium, but let's say for instance that my tap H2o is extremely hard (9+) and until I get the RO system, I'll have to use it.

Wouldn't it be prudent to get the water as near to nuetral (7.0) as to not "tax" the medium ?

I mean, a few drops of natural citric works wonders and seems like a good place to start, neutral pH that is.

Thoughts ?

TIA

Gro

 

[BurnOne]

I use a nylon stocking to put the guano in. I mash it against the side of the bucket with a large paint stirring stick every time I steep the stocking. The pellets turn to mush.
Burn1

 

[BurnOne]

iGro4Me-
You can do whatever you want. It's your grow. But if you ask me, I wouldn't worry about it.
What are you using for plant food? If you mix that water with Maxicrop or guano, the pH will change.
I've seen crazy pH with PBP and guano teas. It's never caused me any problem. Ever!
The more you grow the better you'll get at it. But first you have to grow. Don't try to over analyze it. Just get a plan and stick with it. That's why I started this thread. To give growers a starting place. In a year you'll be doing something completely different.
Burn1

 

[iGro4Me]

iGro4Me-
You can do whatever you want. It's your grow. But if you ask me, I wouldn't worry about it.
What are you using for plant food? If you mix that water with Maxicrop or guano, the pH will change.
I've seen crazy pH with PBP and guano teas. It's never caused me any problem. Ever!
The more you grow the better you'll get at it. But first you have to grow. Don't try to over analyze it. Just get a plan and stick with it. That's why I started this thread. To give growers a starting place. In a year you'll be doing something completely different.
Burn1

Ohh man...I've been hard at work brother, elbows deep in the dirt...setting up my new 1200K Flower chamber....stepping up my game.

I some how knew you were gonna say the pH is a none issue Just good to hear it

As far as feeding goes, I was gonna do the EWC/NH tea, early veg I'm still not sure (looking for some readily available ingredients).

I know it's one of those things that the more you do it, the more you feel comfortable with decision making and the process overall.

I figured if anyone had the answer...

Peace Brother,

Gro :friends:

 

[growclean]

Here are some tried and true recipes for getting started in organic growing. Pick one of the first two soiless mix recipes for your grow medium. Then, choose a nute recipe that will work best for what you have available.

LC's Soiless Mix #2:
6 parts Pro Mix BX or HP / Sunshine Mix (any flavor from #1 up)
2 parts perlite
2 parts earthworm castings
Powdered (NOT PELLETIZED) dolomite lime @ 2 tablespoons per gallon or 1 cup per cubic foot of the soiless mix.

Now for the plants organic food source

Choose one of these organic plant food recipes to add to LC's Soiless Mix.

RECIPE #1
If you want to use organic nutes like blood, bone and kelp...
Dry Ferts:
1 tablespoon blood meal per gallon or 1/2 cup per cubic foot of soil mix
2 tablespoons bone meal per gallon or 1 cup per cubic foot of soil mix
1-tablespoon kelp meal per gallon or 1/2 cup per cubic foot of soil mix or Maxicrop 1-0-4 powdered kelp extract as directed
1 tablespoon per gallon or 1/2 cup per cubic foot of Jersey Greensand to supplement the K (potasium) in the Kelp Meal and seaweed extract.
Mix all the dry ferts into the soiless mix well and wet it, but don't soak it with Liquid Karma and water @ 1 tbs./gal. Stir and mix it a few times a week for a week or two so the bacteria can get oxygen and break down the bone meal and make it available. And don't let the mix dry out, keep it moist and add water as needed. It'll also have time to get the humic acids in the Liquid Karma going and the dolomite lime will be better able to adjust the pH of a peat based mixture too.
With this recipe, all you need to do is add plain water until harvest.
When I'm working with seeds, I punch a hole in the bottom of 16 ounce cups and fill them with plain LC's Mix. Lightly wet the mix in the cups and germ one seed in each cup. At the same time I mix enough LC's mix along with the blood/bone/kelp to fill all the 3 gallon flower pots I'm going to use for the grow. After about two weeks, the seedlings and the blood/bone/kelp mix are ready. I transplant the seedlings into the 3 gallon pots and just add water until harvest.
When you go to flower and pull up the males, save the mix in the pots. It is ready to be used again immediately. Just remove the root ball and transplant another seedling into it.

RECIPE #3 (My favorite)
If you want to use guano tea and kelp...

Guano Tea and Kelp:

Seedlings less than 1 month old nute tea mix-
Mix 1 cup earthworm castings into 5 gallons of water to make the tea.
Add 5 tbs. Black Strap Molasses.
Use it to water your seedlings with every 3rd watering.

Veg mix-
1/3 cup Peruvian Seabird Guano (PSG)
1/3 cup High N Bat Guano (Mexican)
1/3 cup Earth Worm Castings (EWC)
5 tsp. Maxicrop 1-0-4 powdered kelp extract
(That makes the "dry mix". You can make all you want and save it to use later.)
Mix with water @ 1 cup of dry mix into 5 gallons of water to make the tea.
To that 5 gallons of tea add:
5 tbs. Liquid Karma
5 tbs. Black Strap Molasses
Use it to water with every 3rd watering.

Flowering nute tea mix:
2/3 cup Peruvian Seabird Guano
2/3 cup Earth Worm Castings
2/3 cup High P Guano (Indonesian or Jamaican)
5 tsp. Maxicrop 1-0-4 powdered kelp extract
(That makes the "dry mix". You can make all you want and save it to use later.)
Mix with water @ 2 cups of dry mix into 5 gallons of water to make the tea.
To that 5 gallons of tea add:
5 tbs. Liquid Karma
5 tbs. Black Strap Molasses
Use it to water with EVERY watering.

Burn1

OK, So I am sorry, but I still don't 100% understand... I have chose to use soilless mix #2 and then recipe #3.

So for this combination do I just mix up the soilless mix and then feed with the appropriate food from the #3 recipe list? Do I not do any premixing and wait a couple of weeks like the food recipe #1 states?

Sorry, but this is my first grow this way.

Also, I am being told to expect MUCH less weight from an organic method like this then with non-organic nutes. Is this completely true??

Thanks!

 

[growclean]

B1,

Thanks for the reply. I did see it up there somewhere! I will definitely "percolate" my teas (planning on buying KIS 5 gallon from the guy on here), but what I wasn't clear on was my soil preparation prior to planting. Do I just mix up that soilless mix #2 and call it good, or do I need to add something to it and then allow some time for everything to activate? This is what it seemed like if I used the "food recipe #1", but not for the food recipe #3?

Thanks for the help!

 

[BurnOne]

growclean-
We are having technical difficulties with the software. My posts may go anywhere.
The only reason to wet and wait is if your use bone meal in the recipe. LC's Mixes are ready to use right away for any stage of growth. Mothers, clones, germination, veg and flower.
Burn1

 

[mikemoister]

is this good for nitro

is this good for nitro

i went looking for blood meal today and stumbled upon alfalfa meal(2-.5-2), the box says it supplies long lasting gentle nitrogen. i know that it can be used instead of blood meal but do you recommend it or should i stick to the recipe...and if you do think it is good, how much should be applied.

Thanks

 

[growclean]

B1,

Thanks for clarifying. There is alot of info to digest here, but I am excited to start trying! By the way, what does LC stand for in terms of LC's mixes? Was it a user on here?

 

[BurnOne]

i went looking for blood meal today and stumbled upon alfalfa meal(2-.5-2), the box says it supplies long lasting gentle nitrogen. i know that it can be used instead of blood meal but do you recommend it or should i stick to the recipe...and if you do think it is good, how much should be applied.

Thanks

Use it just like you would blood.

B1,

Thanks for clarifying. There is alot of info to digest here, but I am excited to start trying! By the way, what does LC stand for in terms of LC's mixes? Was it a user on here?

LC is Lavender Cowboy. He started this forum and named it himself. Back in the Overgrow days, Bongaloid and LC were all we had to learn about organics from. Those two guys knew more about this stuff than anybody. I miss 'em.
Burn1

 

[Hal]

This is the mix I have chosen to use:

LC's Soiless Mix #2:

6 parts Pro Mix BX or HP / Sunshine Mix (any flavor from #1 up)
2 parts perlite
2 parts earthworm castings
Powdered (NOT PELLETIZED) dolomite lime @ 2 tablespoons per gallon or 1 cup per cubic foot of the soiless mix.
If you use a 3 qt. saucepan as “parts” in the amounts given above, it equals about 1 cu. ft. of soiless mix and you can just dump in a cup of powdered dolomite lime.
But, a "part" can be anything from a tablespoon to a five gallon bucket. Just use the same item for all of the "parts".

And, the organic ferts that will be added:

RECIPE #2

If you want to use guano in your soil mix...
Bongaloid's Guano Mix.
Use all these items combined with one gallon of soil mix.
1/3C hi N Guano (Mexican Bat Guano)
1/2C hi P Guano (Jamaican or Indonesian Bat Guano)
1TBS Jersey Greensand
1TBS Kelp Meal

Given the above, how long (generally speaking...) would the nutrients be expected to last before needing to add additional ferts? I’m probably going to go with a fairly long veg phase this next time, about 6 to 8 weeks is likely.

Do I need to wait for actual physical signs in the plants leaves, or can I guestimate the delivery date of the next round of ferts by the length of time the plant has been growing in the mix? For example…the plants have been in the mix for 6 weeks, do I add the next fert dose at that point before seeing any nute deficiencies? Or do I wait to actually see the deficiencies.

What is the best way to add the next round of ferts? I water from the bottom by soaking, so top dressing would not be the best way for me to do it. Should I just make a tea with the ingredients in recipe #2, maybe cutting back on the hi N guano a bit? If done with a tea like this, how quickly can those nutes be expected to be available to the plants?

 

[BurnOne]

Hal-
That mix is for people who up pot. The grower needs to keep a close eye on his plants and supplement as necessary.
A better option might be Recipe #1 or Recipe #3.
Burn1

 

[Hal]

ahhhhhhhhh....

OK, thanks B1.

 

[VerdantGreen]

my mix is pretty similar to that one and i find that (assuming the guano amounts are roughly equivalent to mine) they go most of the way without feeding - dependant on strain.
just watch out leaves going yellow and feed em with with a bit of N guano scratched into the surface. read the 'better yields with guano' thread in the reference library sticky. there are a couple of great posts by crazy composer and other good info - or check my grow diary as i think i copied them into there.

V.

 

[Hal]

Ok, Verdant. Thanks for that suggestion.

Off I go to the better yields with guano thread.

 

[growclean]

B1,

Hey, I just wanted to give a quick THANK YOU! from a new member. I just read some posts in the design forum from a super helpful poster that was getting bummed and wanted to make sure that the "leaders" of all the forums know how helpful they are. I have read hundreds of post by you and Suby and many others on here that are extremely helpful. In fact, impossibly so, because without them and this forum I wouldn't even be considering doing some of the things that I am (like going organic or vert!). I hope to one day be able to contribute in any one area on a public forum like you do here, but probably will never have that much specialized knowledge in one area. So in short...

THANK YOU!!!!!

 

[longy]

Hi just wondering if there is a good substitute for greensand im in australia and have never heard of it or does it have another name
CHEERS

 

[BurnOne]

Hi just wondering if there is a good substitute for greensand im in australia and have never heard of it or does it have another name
CHEERS

You don't need it. It's just there if you want to use it. I may remove it from the recipe.
Burn1

 

[VerdantGreen]

we dont get greensand here either (UK). i think it's main addition is potassium and i use rock potash instead. i think it also holds water and has some trace elements too - which would hopefully be covered by the seaweed meal.

V.