Obama May Change Medical Marijuana Policy

[Rainman]

Sorry but you still got it all wrong. Ronald Reagan could have distinguished between Herb and Coke way back when so the idea that he was in some way helping or someone of his ilk would have holds no water. He was in fact the father of modern day prohibition and his wife helped us along with the "Just say no campaign" I have no idea what a true conservative is but you idea or definaition of a Liberal is completely wrong as well! Below is the definition provided by Wiki for your reading pleasure:

Liberalism is a broad class of political philosophies that considers individual liberty and equality to be the most important political goals.[1]

Liberalism emphasizes individual rights and equality of opportunity. Within liberalism, there are various streams of thought which compete over the use of the term "liberal" and may propose very different policies, but they are generally united by their support for constitutional liberalism, which encompasses support for: freedom of thought and speech, limitations on the power of governments, the rule of law, an individual's right to private property,[2] and a transparent system of government.[3][4][5] All liberals, as well as some adherents of other political ideologies, support some variant of the form of government known as liberal democracy, with open and fair elections, where all citizens have equal rights by law.[6]

 

[IE2KS_KUSH]

Great debate, that's the kind of back and forth the is respectable! +rep for you bra!

Damn, need to spread it around, oh well. I will give it to you here and then make it offical later when I can.
Great post, always appreciate a good well thought out back and forth, as opposed to the mindless rants of some. Although we respectfully disagree, I know I value your post, and appreciate it. Maybe you could teach some of the others here how to do this! LOL

 

[Rainman]

Good posters are hard to find and those with sensible arguments even harder. Respect to you for both.

 

[IE2KS_KUSH]

Sorry but you still got it all wrong. Ronald Reagan could have distinguished between Herb and Coke way back when so the idea that he was in some way helping or someone of his ilk would have holds no water. He was in fact the father of modern day prohibition and his wife helped us along with the "Just say no campaign" I have no idea what a true conservative is but you idea or definaition of a Liberal is completely wrong as well! Below is the definition provided by Wiki for your reading pleasure:

Liberalism is a broad class of political philosophies that considers individual liberty and equality to be the most important political goals.[1]

Liberalism emphasizes individual rights and equality of opportunity. Within liberalism, there are various streams of thought which compete over the use of the term "liberal" and may propose very different policies, but they are generally united by their support for constitutional liberalism, which encompasses support for: freedom of thought and speech, limitations on the power of governments, the rule of law, an individual's right to private property,[2] and a transparent system of government.[3][4][5] All liberals, as well as some adherents of other political ideologies, support some variant of the form of government known as liberal democracy, with open and fair elections, where all citizens have equal rights by law.[6]

Sorry, wiki is wrong. And that definition actually has contradictions within itself.
This would be a good thread though,
Fundamental Liberal Logic
contrasted with
Fundamental Conservative Logic.
What you posted is a very VERY loose and broad definition, and it's not really aimed squarely at what a "LIberal" is in fact.
You seem like a fun guy though, and I would love to jump into a thread with you about this exclusively. Just as you were able to post some points previously, I would love to fill up a thread w/ examples of liberalism as I defined it. It would be a long ass thread LOL! Just promise you won't get all pissy with me!

 

[kcozzzzz]

obama, bush, there all the same ,full of shit, they both had brown eyes,,,, the end of our society is at hand,,,, and to be honest i am not surprized,,, everything is so fucked up, liberal ,conservative , they both suck,,,, politicians suck vote for me i do this they do what the fuck they want,,,,, we dont matter tell election time,,,,,,, watch usa be divided in 4 or 5 parts in 5 years, if mexico fails,,,ever heard of a revolution,,,,, we let the shit happen so what do we do

 

[Tony Aroma]

1. Obama cannot, and does not have the authority to removve cannabis as a controlled substance or reschedule it. He just doesn't.
Who does? Congress, and the AG. That's pretty much it, aside from independant petitions from groups or individuals that are made directly to the FDA I believe. However, when this is done, and 1 is currently under review I believe, they tend to wait about 20 or 30 years before they come back and tell you to fuck off, unfortunately.

Nope, Congress does not have any power. The DEA can and does tell them to fuck off just like everyone else that questions current drug policy. But the AG is a member of the cabinet -- appointed by the president, and can be removed by the president at any time. So via the AG, the president does indeed have the power to reschedule marijuana, albeit a bit indirectly.

 

[IE2KS_KUSH]

Nope, Congress does not have any power. The DEA can and does tell them to fuck off just like everyone else that questions current drug policy. But the AG is a member of the cabinet -- appointed by the president, and can be removed by the president at any time. So via the AG, the president does indeed have the power to reschedule marijuana, albeit a bit indirectly.

I promise you congress does in fact have the authority to add or remove any substance from the sched. of narcotics. Congress placed cannabis as a sched. 1. Unless something has changed really really really recently, like between the time I made that post and now!
As far as the AG, you are correct. I would just ask that you do a google search for Eric Holder, and Marijuana. I believe will tell you everything you need to know, and I would then remind you, Obama hand picked this shiny turd. So what does that tell you about his intentions? I don't know and can only speculate just like everyone else. But I believe with regard to the AG appointment of Obama, I am making a very compelling argument for what I am saying with regard to his real intent on cannabis/mmj.
I don't believe that the DEA really places or removes any substance from the sched, they are enforcement.

 

[hippie_lettuce]

just my 2cents,
but many people seem to be focusing on "this party is more competent than that one" when the issue shouldn't be that. the bottom line is that a two-party controlled government can never work. america wasn't supposed to have factions, and what do we have now? and it has been said that a representative government will never be a "free government." so, it does not matter which party is in control; we're all subject to the great creation called a "politician."

 

[Tony Aroma]

I promise you congress does in fact have the authority to add or remove any substance from the sched. of narcotics. Congress placed cannabis as a sched. 1.

The Controlled Substances Act states that the AG has the sole power to reschedule substances. The decision is supposed to be based on a recommendation by the Secretary of Health and Human Services, but the final decision is that of the AG.

Check out the Americans for Safe Access web site for several articles about various members of Congress' attempts to influence the scheduling of marijuana and enforcement of the laws. I especially like the letter from Congressman John Conyers concerning raids of dispensaries in CA, to which the DEA essentially told Conyers to go fuck himself.

And yes, I believe appointing Eric Holder AG tells us all we need to know about Obama's real intentions when it comes to the war on drugs. Sad, but not surprising.

 

[Mackawber]

Keep Your Promises OR ELSE

Keep Your Promises OR ELSE

Revolution is brewing on both sides of the Atlantic isn't it? There is now such a disconnect between leaders and followers and with the universal perception that tyranny lords over us, it's just a matter of time.

DONT TREAD ON ME.

 

[Rainman]

Revolution?? We are talking about Weed people! If and when you decide to revolt let the rest of us know cause I want to watch it on TV!!

 

[PharmaCan]

Revolution?? We are talking about Weed people! If and when you decide to revolt let the rest of us know cause I want to watch it on TV!!

ROFL

PC

 

[mjboy]

the spots they raided are right by my house. I was told they had been warned and it was all for show. the good bye if you will

 

[PharmaCan]

Bush was a tool, he was not a conservative. Not in the mold of Buckley or RR anyway.

Google William Buckley, he was the "father" of conservative thought. Kind of the leader of the ideology.
A true conservative adhering strictly to conservative dogma, would in fact not support federal enforcement of drug laws. Federal drug laws fly in the face of the core values of the conservative ideals.
This today has been obscured by the GOP and religious faction in the GOP.
The reason I mentioned RR, was because he is by far the closest anyone has come to representing the true conservative values I am speaking of, although he was not perfect.

But, but... It was Ronald Reagan who unified and empowered the religious right and it was RR who established the various litmus tests that GOP candidates have to put on the pretense of passing. Jeez, limit your representation/candidates to bible thumpers and clowns and you get a bunch of bible-thumping clowns running the government.

In any event, pseudo-conservatives are jumping like lemmings into the Rush Limbaugh mold of pseudo-conservatism. Have you ever noticed that Rush goes along with the idea that "What's good for business is good for America.", regardless of the consequences to the middle class? Have you ever heard Rush say a good thing about a labor union? He is aghast at the idea that labor should be able to compete on an even playing field for its share of the profit. A true conservative would not think that way because a true conservative would understand and appreciate the value to society of a strong middle class. The pseudo-conservatives of today are a bunch of cool-aid drinkers who are leading us down the path to an oligarchy.

PC

 

[scaramanga]

Funny shit from a bunch of pseudo-politicos; no offense intended.

Never trust a politician to do anything but what's in their best interests.

Altruism is not a trait shared by many in the political arena.

As for Revolution, I think not. Most people from industrialized nations nowadays are a bunch of apathetic panzies. Not that they could anyways, as only a handful of countries even allow their citizens to own or possess firearms. Revolution, now that's funny, and count me in.

 

[drow]

A quote to sum it all up;

Prohibition will work great injury to the cause of temperance. It is a species of intemperance within itself, for it goes beyond the bounds of reason in that it attempts to control a man's appetite by legislation, and makes a crime out of things that are not crimes. A Prohibition law strikes a blow at the very principles upon which our government was founded. - Abraham Lincoln, Dec 18, 1840.

 

[dubwise]

What a great thread! Very thought provoking. I am a conservative, and I happen to study and believe in the Bible. I love God and I love weed. I love that God gave us weed. I love that we are able to have this type of back and forth without any recourse. However, I don't think that Obama will legalize it, nor do I think it will be decriminalized. The pharmaceutical companies own the USA, and therefore I feel we will never truly be free. Not when these so called representatives don't represent the people.
I don’t want to get hassled by the man, worrying about my grow or my smoke, and if it takes legalization for medication, so be it. I don’t care…I can find a doc who can write a script for my ailment. I have to agree with ikush that there are no real conservatives in the GOP, and I’d have to agree with kcozzzz, those tricksters up there are all crooked. But a revolution is a bit much...just free up the ganja!

 

[kittykronic]

i have been an independent since i could register to vote..but kcozz is right a revolution is coming you can feel it..if mexico does fail watch out..i fear as well the usa will divided into several regions..where i live in middle america there is great dissention among the masses..as far as obama goes i just read an article in the usa today about how he is thinking of putting meters in homes to monitor and regulate the amount of electricity used..check it out..scary...as far as republicans and democrats go legalizing marijuana is not a priority..do you really think evangelicals will let a conservative legalize weed your as crazy as they are if you do..keep it on the down low and be safe all...peace

 

[hippie_lettuce]

i think a revolution should come. this isn't just about marijuana. there are too many injustices in our political system (that, in turn, pressure our social system). i'd like to call this modern age the age of idle consent. we'd like to think that other people will do the work for us, so that we can sit around and hope that what we want freed will be freed by others. the spirit that organized this nation is still found in this nation today, but all that tinder needs is a spark.

as for the electricity meters, i don't think putting in meters in homes to monitor the amount of electricity used will do much "damage." in fact, that's basically what the electric companies do now, but they really don't care about how much electricity people use as long as they pay their bills. those meters will only be installed in certain appliances that people often leave on or use too much, such as washers, dryers, dishwashers, etc.

 

[smokesalot420]

Wow this thread is awesome, but it's all over the place so I don't know where to begin to respond.....

The electricity "meters" are for the smart grid we are trying to implement (Boulder, CO will be the first to go on-line soon with this technology) and I'm not scared of them.... what is going to happen is that they are going to charge different rates for electricity, more for peak times and less for off-peak times such as midnight.... I will just switch my light cycle to night time so it will be cheaper!

I used to be a republican, my time in the US Army and after changed my views on politics and the world in general... I'm now independent, I decide things on the issues rather than party crap. I see that this country has been splitting pretty badly, it started getting bad after 2000, got better for a little bit following the attacks in 03, but went to being bad shortly after, and got worse as time went on..... I have thought that our country was headed to harder times, not just economically, but when money gets tight, crime goes up, that's just how it is and has been historically. At least Obama is always trying to listen to and include everyone, rather than the "You're with us or against us" approach.... I mean, the world was on our side at that time but we had a jackass leading us so we got what we got (and anyone who claimed they didn't know anything about Bush Jr. before he got elected doesn't know how to read- he bankrupted most of the companies he controlled and people were stupid enough to let him control our country.... who are the REAL idiots?).

Hopefully things will change, although no one should expect anything overnight. We just need to keep our government accountable, what ever happened to people standing up? I agree with the people who earlier called people today apathetic, and if the world went all crazy, most people wouldn't know what to do. How many people can live off the land without electricity? I can, but I'm getting off-track so I'll WRAP IT UP!