Mulch. Just do it.

[OrganicLearner]

Does anyone sell straight leaf mold? I'm in the process of making some but I'm not sure if im going to have enough when it's all said and done. Its a 1:10 ratio once shredded I was wondering what would be the estimate amount of leaf mold after you have one big bag of shredded leaves? I would like to use this for the humus and mulch departments..

Also can you use unfinished leaf mold in a soil or will it start to compost and heat up roots?


Copied and pasted from other thread, figure it is better off in here...

 

[ClackamasCootz]

OrganicLearner

Creating legitimate black leaf mold is a multi-year process and depending on which type of leaves you're using it can range from 2 - 4 years.

Even in an organic playground like the PNW, I have found legitimate leaf mold 3 times. And I was begging the question on 2 of those.

HTH

CC

 

[OrganicLearner]

Bummer I'm wondering if it would even be worth it to make now or if I should toss these leaves into a regular compost pile ( I only have about 30 bags of unshredded leaves and if I have to wait two years to get only a gallon of leafmold it seems pretty crazy other then the low maintenance part of the leaf mold process) is there anything leaf mold can add to soil that regular compost can't? I would like to incorporate both to have a really rockin humus structure but idk..

 

[ClackamasCootz]

Add the leaves to your compost recipe. Leaves are a fantastic brown material (Carbon)

Black leaf mold is not compost or vice versa.

 

[OrganicLearner]

So compost is superior alone in soil? The both of them wouldn't add anything special combined or does the leaf mold add nothing more then carbon or fungal media to the soil? I was thinking to if adding the leaf mold would be a waste adding to soil because it would get outnumbered quickly by bacteria and the fungal benefits would be lost? This might not make any sense at all.... I also wanted to use leaf mold as a mulch because I heard it is the best mulch, but if I were to topdress often wouldn't the leaf mold disappear quickly and become part of the soil?

 

[ClackamasCootz]

You're misreading what I am trying to explain.

Trees feed themselves by dropping their leaves which have accumulated high levels of Elements. When the leaves decompose those Elements are released.

Use leaves as a Carbon for your compost or make Black Leaf Mold. You can add BLM to your worm bins, part of your soil mix - i.e. it's not an either or dynamic.

For your situation since you're starting out creating your own humus then using the leaves in a compost recipe is the probably the most direct route. Creating BLM is a long-term project that will pay you back in spades. You just can't rush it.

CC

 

[OrganicLearner]

So blm and compost offer the same benefits and elements from the leaves but regular compost is just a more quicker route to getting the benefits from the leaves? None is more superior then another because they both use leaves and use up the elements and benefits from leaves but compost is going to have that plus more and have the advantage of faster turn around; is this what you're saying? Sorry I'm a little slow this morning...

 

[ClackamasCootz]

No - that is not what I'm say at all.

Composting materials creates humus. BIM or any other LAB does not in spite of the claims made by advocates.

Pickled leaves is not humus - never will be. Ever.

 

[W89]

This is what I use for mulch and aeration

http://www.cocoashellmulch.co.uk/

Not that make but same stufff...

Best form of humus is worm castings, then thermo compost

 

[OrganicLearner]

Whaat now I'm confused blm isn't humus? So using the leaves to make compost would make a way better product then just leaf mold?

W89 does the cocoa shells give off a good smell?

 

[ClackamasCootz]

So using the leaves to make compost would make a way better product then just leaf mold?

Not necessarily but that's another discussion. What would be accurate to say is the using leaves in your compost recipe will get you humus several months or years sooner.

And no, BIM, EM-1, et al. does not and cannot create humus under any set of definitions...

CC

 

[OrganicLearner]

And no, BIM, EM-1, et al. does not and cannot create humus under any set of definitions...
CC

but leaves left alone in a pile will break down into smaller bits of organic matter and turn into humus years later similar to compost right? I was led to believe that to make the best humus in a container or raised bed you would have to have a diversity of things like compost, ewc, leaf mold, and rich topsoil..

 

[W89]

The bag smelt nice when I opened it but lost a lot of the smell now, In my compost I use lots of difference sources of organic matter, fast medium and slow to decompose materials, they only become humus when they become stable and wont decompose anymore which could take a long time but remains as humus for a long time also

 

[ClackamasCootz]

but leaves left alone in a pile will break down into smaller bits of organic matter and turn into humus years later similar to compost right?

Basically yes. This is how trees feed themselves as long as Urban Joe doesn't get out there and rake the leaves up, bag them and then pay to have them hauled away.

Leaves accumulate 83+ elements made available, in part, by the deep roots that trees establish resulting in a very rich material. Leaves fall to the ground around the base and decompose which releases the Elements (and other 'things') and creates humus around the trunk. Over centuries you can imagine how rich the humus is in a forest.

Some trees like the Neem & Karanga trees are able to fix Nitrogen in the soil like other plants grown for this such as Clover, Legumes, et al. These two trees are not the only one capable of this and it's not rare, per se, but it is 'unusual' and out of the 'norm'

I was led to believe that to make the best humus in a container or raised bed you would have to have a diversity of things like compost, ewc, leaf mold, and rich topsoil..

And you were given very solid and good advice.

Nothing that I've written is counter to this advice

CC

 

[OrganicLearner]

Is the 1-4 year window to make leaf mold long enough for the leaves to become a humus source? Or if someone had made and completed the leafmold process then added to soil with compost and ewc how long would it take for it to become humus?

 

[ClackamasCootz]

I buy leafmold and use it as a mulch, for the most part, in the outdoor gardens. Mulch is good. Thermal compost is good. Vermicompost is good.

It's not an 'either or' but rather a goal of using as many plant materials as possible.

 

[OrganicLearner]

Man you sure are lucky cootz, do you buy it from a local farmer or something and how much does it usually run you? and would you recommend using the blm indoors as a mulch? And do you have any clue how long it would take for th blm to turn into humus mixed with soil or alone?

 

[ClackamasCootz]

3 yards screened gave me 2 yards which I split in consideration for labor and materials with another.

1 yard, unscreened, was $75.00 and I was happy to pay that amount. This is not a material that is easily sourced. For the amount of time it takes to create legitimate BLM as well as the amount of materials you would have to assemble to make a 'commercial volume' the money just isn't there.

Especially in the cannabis world where everything is price driven. Quality and/or viability doesn't hit the radar screen.

I wanna grow dank but I want to use steer manure from K-Mart!

And that's before they hit the grow store to 'fix' their 'soil' - quite a parade to watch or read

 

[VortexPower420]

So i picked up at the pet store the other day a bag of alfalfa feed hay, I was planing on using as a mulch well i did use it as a mulch on a bunch of transplants. I have been using all my plant clipping from cloning and such, but they diapered very quickly and i was hopping to improve the soil at the same time, but i was thinking about what CC said about "going quietly into that dark night" or something like that and I was just curious if it would be to much?
Thanks
Timbuktu

 

[OrganicLearner]

CC

I would pay that price any day for that much blm! Yeah I can see why no one sells this stuff takes a long turn around to be profitable..." it's my money and I need it now" blahblahblah

Thanks for helping me understand this stuff better coot..