MM X 78Thia was never released by Nevil

[Nexus7]

Yeah that's interesing. Lemon seems to be one of the more dominant terps in most of the plants I've grown ...

That said not much if any in your NHz f3's either.

 

[@hempy]

I like the smell of lemon but not a fan of lemon, but I thought it was odd many have come across strong lemon smelling plants, where I have come across zero.

The only thing I can think of is maybe because I grew and grow mostly sativas and heavy sativa hybrids, other than that I honestly don't know.

 

[Stoneguru]

Just thought to mention no hermies yet in the 2 Deliverance (50% '78 Thai) plants I grew from hempy. Also no signs of any hermie in the outcross of it I'm growing now ...

Also I don't see a whole lot of resemblance to the pictures posted in this thread or pictures of whatever outback hybrid @Stoneguru is growing. That said mine is crossed to NHz and not MM
Many other lines have that longer middle leaf and many other lines have those darker green leaves and I do think I can see a little bit more similarly to Deliverance with lines like Mango thai and some of the modern thai landraces coming out now than what is posted here.

That's to be expected. Even at node 3 ~80 Nevil's haze could be divided by at least 4 distinct Morphological traits with cross over between.

At most there might be 2 or 3 that are almost identical. I expect there will be even more distinct markers as I they progress.

Basically even if a person wanted to select the same Nevil's Haze as he used in Outback or Hempy used they would look quite different.

There are clear differences between the Thai side of Outback and Nevil's Haze.

So far the profile add by the Thai is non descript. The Nevil's side is noticeable with meat and savory on some. Metals, Eucalyptus. Lemon on one. So far if the Thai has a profile it disappears in the Nevil's Haze.

The Trichomes are smaller on Outback than Nevil's Haze as well as more stalkless old world trichomes.

The 3 leaf with leaflet webbing to petiole comes from the Thai side. Never had it on Nev's.

The Thai have a bract sequence of 2 where Nev's tend toward helical and MM will be symmetrical 1:1

Structurally the Thai lended the menorah frame to the ones I grew similar to the males in Hempy's picture here, but more stretch from NH branch length

The top cola of the one one the left was just like the Outback Silk #11. Almost a separate set of branches from the menorah.

Nevs is branchy, but very lateral while the Thai has a distinct menorah when flower early and the top cola almost separate like the male on the left. I couldn't find a better picture, but it's a district characteristic.

I only grew 5 of that particular Outback line and I consider 30 plants the threshold.

It's not singular traits, but the amalgamation of interrelationship that has value for selection along with knowledge of the specific parents used.

Process of elimination is most effective with more data points of which there are plenty.

I haven't studied the Nevil's Haze Hempy selected so I can't offer as much as the Outback which has pictures of the parents.

I can say that Nevil's haze is a huge spread Morphologically so any given selection will change quite a bit.

Dwight and I were going to collab later this year.

Overall the high is what you'd expect and the winners on profile are Nevil's Haze.

 

[Stoneguru]

I like the smell of lemon but not a fan of lemon, but I thought it was odd many have come across strong lemon smelling plants, where I have come across zero.

The only thing I can think of is maybe because I grew and grow mostly sativas and heavy sativa hybrids, other than that I honestly don't know.

There is a lot of diversity in haze profiles.

Many were locked out in the '97 Nevil's Haze and the Mango Haze for that matter. Nevil's haze went further into savory and mango into fruit.

While they are good for what they are...every door opened shuts the door on others.

there is a lot more in there. Some of the best are less than 1:100 for sure.

I don't care for the savory meat liver types.

 

[@hempy]

Nevs is branchy, but very lateral while the Thai has a distinct menorah when flower early and the top cola almost separate like the male on the left. I couldn't find a better picture, but it's a district characteristic.

I only grew 5 of that particular Outback line and I consider 30 plants the threshold.

You haven't grown an F1 Outback have you and as far as I am a wear all you grew was Hybrids of the Outback and at best all I have ever seen you post is a PIC here a PIC of a few plants.

How would you know what my Thai grows like you haven't grown it or has Dwight or any hybrids of it so how would you know what smells it has what traits it has and the waffle your going on about traits is all fiction.

Dwight also doesn't have any hybrids of my Thai.

 

[@hempy]

There is a lot of diversity in haze profiles.

Many were locked out in the '97 Nevil's Haze and the Mango Haze for that matter. Nevil's haze went further into savory and mango into fruit.

While they are good for what they are...every door opened shuts the door on others.

there is a lot more in there. Some of the best are less than 1:100 for sure.

I don't care for the savory meat liver types.

What are you talking about Stoney how was the diversity of Haze locked out in the first Nevil's Haze made in 97 for the first time ?

The Mango Haze is a 50% Haze hybrid again have you even grown it to understand the line I have and right now I have 4 plants in flower 2 are at week 17 of flower the other 2 were put into flower a few weeks after, and they are nowhere near finished.

All you do is post up opinion peaces like a critic and act like they're facts, how many documented grows have you done and how many of the lines you put down have you even grown ?

Nevil's Haze used both the HzA and HzC and if you have grown it and grew enough of it you would have seen the ancestral types.

 

[@hempy]

My apology as I don't have an Edit feature as it was removed long ago after I edited my post and I removed my pics (Thanks Cosmic) I need to post it as I can't simply edit my post.

Not F1 meant S1 Outback.

 

[ninox33]

There is a lot of diversity in haze profiles.

Many were locked out in the '97 Nevil's Haze and the Mango Haze for that matter. Nevil's haze went further into savory and mango into fruit.

While they are good for what they are...every door opened shuts the door on others.

there is a lot more in there. Some of the best are less than 1:100 for sure.

I don't care for the savory meat liver types.

I like your posts @Stoneguru and appreciate your detailed observations you share. I have worked professionally as a botanist and enjoy your descriptions, opens my eyes more when I hang with my girls.
Please excuse Hempy, his digital Tourette’s gets beyond his control at times, as his Yiayia spoilt him too much, he became the human being we all have grown to love.
I agree with your 3rd sentence not from the point of view you expressed but in general cannabis and the tragedy of bag appeal on modern genetics.

 

[@hempy]

I have worked professionally as a botanist

So you're a botanist, care to point out to Stoney why the diversity of Haze was not locked out of Nevil's Haze, since you chimed in ?

I am happy to but since you posted go for it.

 

[ninox33]

No, you’re doing fine, it’s your thread, I’m trying to remain a neutral observer, plus I’m retired. A geneticist would be better.
From my limited understanding, I wouldn’t imagine the diversity of haze would be contained in NH. That’s certainly not reflected in the large NH vegging in my garden, especially when compared to the small OH and A5 specimens in another corner.

 

[ninox33]

PS Hempy I’ve said my peace, I’m just along for the ride now, Charlie Chaplin style

 

[Stoneguru]

Before anything else @HEMPY . This can be a breakthrough moment. You can fall into my trusting arms big guy.

In your previous 2 messages you are noticably upset that I would make assertions about a line that I haven't fully experienced.

This is entirely valid position Hempy.

It makes you feel irritated and infringed upon. Who is this pompous arrogant Stoney person who believes his beliefs have greater merit then your own experiences? Who invalidates what you have learned through your own 5 sense, risk and hard work?!

Who is this narcissist who believes he can bend reality by overriding your own experiences and invalidate them through partial understanding and iron assertions?!

Hempy. I don't believe the previous posters just want to target you as a person and I doubt most want your beans. We all have our own projects and goals

I don't see them bickering among each other. I see civil discourse. Comparing notes. A general understanding that as gardeners we are on an experiential journey of life long learning. Differences can add a holesome tension that yields greater understanding for both

"Though I am an old man, I am but a young gardener". Thomas Jefferson

This isn't just the reality of what we discover, but a lesson in how to discover. The open observation, Wonder and posture of a child. This allows us to discover more through flexibility and curiosity. In the end to return to the soil grateful.

I do not dislike you as a person hempy. I don't think those holding you accountable do either. We our community of experientialists.

This is a PH issue. No matter how many nutrient combinations you try people are letting you know that your PH is cutting off absorption.

Adjusting pH will allow growth.

How you feel about me can be your lesson too. Recognizing that icky you have is an energy conduit moving both ways is a key understanding.

Do you want others to feel about you the way you feel about me right now? or do you want them to recognize the value of what you can share of your experiences and insights?

On your other specific points I will answer them in context because it does matter and worth clarifying.