Mites in the rootzone

[PoopyTeaBags]

imid kills root aphids springtails and soil mites. at least in my experience.. as for what to flush at... id flush with water and about 2-300ppms of just a main nute... flush alot and check consistently...


it usually takes a good amount of water to show wear it truly reads...

 

[PoopyTeaBags]

the long slender bugs and the curved one are exactly the same. i believe they are fungal gnat larvae. they look just like this pic with a black head. and the more little mite like bugs there are, the more gnat larvae and adults are around.
View Image

yes thats fungus gnats larva... while annoying will not kill any plants...

 

[michigan.mmma]

I think the symptoms are enough to diagnose root aphids. Check the root aphid sticky. Good luck. -granger

i have been all over those threads on every forum you can think of. i have tried everything from azamax, imid, met52, bifenthrin, BTI, caps packs, disulfoton, pyrethrin and piperonyl butoxide, spectracide triazicide, beta-cyfluthrin, hot water dunks and a few more i can't think of right now. they always come back and they may not even be the problem.....

the symptoms are similar though aren't they?

*plants treated with systemics and other harsh poisons were destroyed and only used for testing purposes

 

[PoopyTeaBags]

if its bugs... its root aphids... guaranteed by damage...

however... root aphids usually come with green tank beetles with a red ass that just stick onto your roots where they protrude from the side against the pot... the damage is spot on root aphid damage, offgassing, or over fertilizing....

 

[michigan.mmma]

Maybe you are dealing with some sort of off gassing from a hose or a plastic or some other environmental agent / factor - and it has nothing at all to do with nutrition, PPM/EC, or the bugs...

It seems odd to me you would experience the same symptoms in multiple methods - it must be environmental...


dank.Frank

thats what i thought for a long time also and i am starting to think that again. my paranoia starts to take over sometimes and i think the boys in blue left something around to sabotage me but i just dont think that is possible.

currently i am just using coco pots and there is no plastic of any kind in the room.

 

[michigan.mmma]

if its bugs... its root aphids... guaranteed by damage...

however... root aphids usually come with green tank beetles with a red ass that just stick onto your roots where they protrude from the side against the pot... the damage is spot on root aphid damage, offgassing, or over fertilizing....

thanks for taking the time to look at the thread and respond.

i have had aphids the last two seasons on some burning bushes outside my house (they were foliar feeding) and i use bayer tree and shrub one time and it knocks them out for the whole season. i think you are right about the aphids or offgassing. i have done many experiments with very low nute strength side by side and they had the same issues though.

i also want to mention that i have fly paper and yellow cards up and have only caught gnats. i have never seen any type of RA flier in the rooms.

 

[dank.frank]

I don't know - fungus gnat larvae - hard to tell from the pics - is much more slimy and worm like - slender - clear-ish with a black head at one end...

Not to argue right / wrong - but to present a different thought...

Fungus gnats / larvae WILL indeed hurt the plant - they eat holes in the roots, leaving them subject to many various infections - not limited to but most common fusarium wilt and rhizoctonia and pythium root rot.

These viruses are transferable and can become systemic in a plant - I'd not treat fungus gnats any less casually than any other garden pest - and I know this is not a common opinion -

But again - not to argue right / wrong - but to keep providing possible solutions...


dank.Frank

 

[dank.frank]

Environmental - meaning the house it self also - what about radon, etc...formaldehyde from exposed insulation - molds on wood or concrete - think bigger picture...lead paints or something in a drop ceiling panel, etc...


dank.Frank

 

[michigan.mmma]

Environmental - meaning the house it self also - what about radon, etc...formaldehyde from exposed insulation - molds on wood or concrete - think bigger picture...


dank.Frank

thats what i have been thinking lately. i have 3 cats. 1 gets runny nose and lots of mucus and sneezing sometimes. i thought nothing of it as the vet said its probably allergies or she is sensitive to dust. now another cat is doing the same thing. i dont know much about cats but my girl says she has never seen a cat have sneeze fits like these.

i myself dont have any symptoms i have noticed from mold or anything but could that be possible? i was thinking of having the house tested for mold because i am starting to lose my mind here. is there a mold or fungus that could be in the air causing something like this?

 

[MIway]

3ma... Sorry to hear bout the situation... all the way around... esp the coppers.

My guess is that you have a few different critters and the likely source is the cuts you are bringing in and to a lesser degree the coir... my mites and springtails came from them... esp if using wet bags of anything. That could also be the source of the gnats... tho those can just fly in thru the door. Root aphids and springtails can also come in wet bags... th soil mites can come in moisture resistant eggs in compressed bales or bricks of both coir and soil. Root aphids are usually gifts from other growers tho. But that's where I'd be thinkin on where and what.

From ur pics though... I'd say it isn't a bug issue... you've got good lookin veg and early flower pics... aphids would hurt you earlier... and ud be able to pic em out. The gnat larvae isn't creating all that damage either... but do indeed gnaw on the roots like dank said... and black heads mean gnat larvae as poopy nailed. Soil mites just aren't doin it... even when they breed by the thousands. Bugs are a reasonable guess tho esp when considering the crop to crop to crop pattern...

I'd check ur runoff first like ptb suggested... will give you an indication if its what dank thought... ph... or high ppm's. It def looks to be a root zone issue effecting uptake. Your veg just looks too good... and the roots are white... don't see the bug issues. What's the feed regiment like?

 

[ballplayer 2]

Michiganmmma, I am so glad you brought this topic up. I am sad that you are dealing with this problem, you have my deepest sympathies. I have chimed in on previous threads regarding this same pest/or similar root zone mite looking pests.

I have be dealing with these pests for sure at least 2 years. I have not had a single successful harvest in 3+ years. I am not sure exactly when I acquired this pest, as I was too busy to notice such small bugs (work, school, gardening) in the rootzone. Suddenly two years ago these damn bugs were running laps around the lips of my containers. There also seems to be a form of this pest(or an associated pest) that is even smaller and white/clear with the same "domed" or rounded shape. This pests numbers are simply overwhelming. They are DEFINITELY NOT springtails, I have had those and they never hurt my garden.

My sypmtoms are identical to those you presented in your discourse thoughout this thread, to the point I am CERTAIN we are dealing with the same pest. Which really pains me, because I have acquired a number of different products (azatrol, Botanigard, Cap's Packs, Merit, and Met52) to have a go at these damn things again. While also letting my room lie fallow for 6 months or better, after disinfection. I have tried letting rooms fallow before with no positive results.

I could always squeak a decent veg out of my plants, though later in the daily veg light cycle some plants would experience some minor wilting that would be gone by the next morning. By three weeks into Flowering cycle things are just not progressing the way I know they should from experience. The flowers never really begin to "stack" the way they should. Plants pretty much quit using water in a normal fashion. Plants seem to be EXTREMELY light sensitive, to the point where I have to keep them nearly 3 feet from my air cooled 600 so the leaves dont burn up. My room has decent ventilation, and air cooled lights on separate systems. I get the burnt leaf tip and random necrotic patches. Other leaves stay competely green and look somewhat unaffected, but the plant itself has OBVIOUSLY lost vigor ad refuses to grow. Root structure is pretty much non-existant, even though it was gangbusters in veg. I dont even bother to harvest, the flowers are basically undeveloped/immature/tiny even after 8-10 weeks.

I used to pretty much effortlessly grow organic using guanos and kelp when I started 8 years ago. Now I cannot even get lucas formula or Pure Blend Pro to work. Like you I have been chasing my tail with nute formulas, environmental adjustments, filtered water/tap water ratio adjustments (the entire range from pure RO to pure Tap), and now pesticides.

If you are in Michigan, then we are basically in the same gardening zone. So perhaps this is some sort of indigenous pest. Gnats were also present when these damn things were around. I will keep up with this thread in hopes of finding a solution. My home has been through a couple floods so that could be a factor as well. However, while cannabis has been an impossibility for me to grow in the area. Tomatoes and peppers have done very well in the same area.

This has been impossibly frustrating and to some degree life shattering for me. My only recourse may be a move, but that would be at least 18-24 months into the future.

Lastly the only other thing i can think of is chronic overwatering. So I was considering a minimal runoff grow. Where I would only give plants of a certan size a designated amount of water, then only achieve runoff say every two weeks once the plants roots SHOULD have filled the container it is in.

I dont know, I really am at a loss for exactly what we are dealing with. Good luck, and I will continue to keep up with and chime in on this thread.

 

[shmalphy]

looks like it could be mosaic virus...

try garlic spray, it triggers an immune system response in the plant. I would also add in some fresh aloe, but spray right away, aloe ferments within 20 minutes.

 

[wingdings]

I am a Michigan patient as well. Ive dealt with root aphids for years also. You have root aphids. The bottom line is imid, met 52, etc don't kill aphids. They will knock them back. New protocol, I treat with imid early veg, orthene 97/ riptide dunks for 20 minutes before flower and 4 weeks into flower, beneficial nematodes in flower. If I don't stay on top of a treatment regiment I get another aphid outbreak, they will never be completely gone. Never. I stared at roots for hours at a time before when I kill a male looking for movement lol. Welcome to my nightmare.

 

[RockyMountainHi]

Looks like root aphid damage.

As near as I can figgure, mine came in brand new rockwool from the local hydro store. Now who would do that???? hmmmmmmmm. And how?????? hmmmmmmmm.

I started dipping my rockwool cubes in boiling water - it's a good clean flush on the used blocks and insurance on the new ones!

They have changed the formulation on most products containing Imid fairly recently - a little searching on line you can find several that are about 1.5% or so with no other additives.

 

[bad gas]

Where possible, NAPA floor dry can be used as a preventative. Bugs hate diatomaceous earth. P/N 8822 instead of perlite.

I also foliar spray a lavender tea every 3 days as a preventative for mites. Can't hurt.

Good luck. bg

 

[inreplyavalon]

mmma lots of good info being shared with you in this thread. That last post of Miway is filled with good advice. Read it again!

I suffered from Root aphids in coco, and recently when looking for them with my usb scope discovered lots of Mites in my root balls. LOTS. Tiny little white guys. I can direct you towards a video if your interested in viewing them. I do treat all my coco with Met52 and it is my belief that these soil/coco mites in fact are feeding on fungus. I have watched a lot of them through my scope and never seen them on roots. The root aphids on the other hand , i used to see sucking my roots regularly.

I also switched to bagged coco after i got root aphids, because i was using compressed bricks to avoid getting them, so when i got them, i ditched the hassle of breaking up the bricks...

When i discovered the aphids, my veg plants all about 3-4 feet tall stopped growing and were dead in their tracks.

 

[WishDoctor]

That's classic root aphid damage in the pics of your plants
NOT GNATS!!!

you have a serious infestation
READ THE ROOT APHID THREAD!!!!

nothing more nothing else.

root aphids are not the same as outdoor aphids, not even the same bug
just because the term aphid is in the name

mm you need to study more

get imid now!!!

root aphids

 

[Arthritis_sucks]

Yupp had the same problem in the mother room. They would walk the edge of the pot rims in my veg/mom room. I tried dunks and they did nothing, then I grabbed a bottle of Bayer Tree and Shrub (Imid) and they didnt come back after that but this was only used on mothers and not plants going in to flower as this stuff tends to stay in the plants longer than I would like. They can cause a ph flux also so check your runoff. In high infestation my moms showed the same difficency as your plants do. Like in Organics when your benes die off and give nutes, these guys can be doing the same messin with the medium ph and possibly locking out what the plant needs. Just a thought. Good luck on the bug front.


After you dose with IMID I would suggest some kind of emzyme product to turn your dead roots to food. I used cannazyme and they came back to life.

 

[MacGyver420]

you have some other options that i have not heard stated yet.

--this goes especially for the poster who said he has had these bugs for 3 years....

the easiest and most foolproof method to get rid of the bugs is to get rid of the garden.

throw everything away; bleach what is left. vacuum thoroughly.

don't plant anything new for at least 6 months;

once you do start-up again; pretreat your soil with met-52; lots of earth worm castings; and go buy a bunch of nematodes. water with nematodes on a regular schedule to keep their numbers up in your pots. (you could skip the met-52 and just go with the earth worm castings and nematodes they are very effective!)

its not ideal, but sometimes you gotta do what you gotta do to continue on.

good luck to you.

 

[GeorgeSmiley]

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