Malawi x Panama- Journey to Autoflower

[gorilla ganja]

Note: This is a legal medical grow in Canada.

This is the story of how I brought Ace’s Malawi x Panama to Autoflower. I’ve posted most of this on another forum, but I thought I would post it here for anyone interested in learning how I created this autoflower from scratch.

It all starts with great genetics, and first off, I want to give a big shout-out and thanks to Dubi and Ace for creating Malawi x Panama. I found it in their R&D section, and it sounded like a great match-up of two exceptional Sativas. I ran a few of them and found an excellent specimen. It was powerful and uplifting yet had a balanced, relaxed feel with no paranoia or anxiety. It ticked all the boxes for me, and I wanted to create an autoflower version so it could be grown outdoors here in Nothern Canada. It will be in the -30C/-22F for the next week here, so I will have some time to tell the tale of the last 3 years fairly quickly so we can get to where I am now.

Hopefully, posting my story on the Ace forum will be alright @dubi. I’d value your thoughts on the process and if you see any Malawi or Panama traits in this Autoflower version. If not, you can move it to the autoflower section.


So, in 2021, I made three lines from one Malawi x Panama mother and several combinations of my Fantasmo Durban poison F4 auto, which I made and worked with for a few years.
It consists of Fantasmo Express Auto from Mephisto x Durban Poison auto from Reeferman.

MP(1f) x FDP fem(5f)
FDP (5f) x MP fem (1f)
MP(1f)x FDP (3m)

All of my journey so far has been about the one line that I have worked with so far, MP x FDP fem.


Unfortunately, I don't have good pictures of the original plant. Either I didn't take any or can't find them. I do have these pics of the last reveg after I had cloned and grown out the chosen mom for the last time.

All cleaned up and starting to grow after reveging.

Flowered out for the last time.

And here are a couple of pics of what she has evolved into so far.
Malawi Panama Durban auto at F3 being tested outdoors last Summer.

Peace GG

Edit. @nepalnt21 - I forgot to tag you- you mentioned your interest in following along.

 

[gorilla ganja]

Some pics of the (Malawi x Panama) x FDP auto- F1 grown by @repuk . Hope all is well buddy haven't seen you around lately.

 

[gorilla ganja]

Here are a few more pics of the Malawi/Panama x FDP auto-grown by a friend. They are the taller plants in the tent.

 

[gorilla ganja]

I selected 5 F1 MP x FDP auto plants out of about 30. These are clones of the chosen ones lightly pollinated with five reversed females. You'll see that with my breeding style, I usually work with small plants. I only needed a few seeds to search through the F2 generation for the ones that autoflower.

 

[paisajedehierba]

Congratulations gorilla ganja, your plants look very good. I'm happy to find such autoflowering projects here in the ACE context. With my selfmade autoflowering lines, there is a high variability of pheno- and chemotypes, which is to be expected with polyhybrids. Are there traits in your autoflowering line that you would like to stabilise?

 

[gorilla ganja]

With my selfmade autoflowering lines, there is a high variability of pheno- and chemotypes, which is to be expected with polyhybrids. Are there traits in your autoflowering line that you would like to stabilise?

I have also made and worked with many different autoflowers. However, in this thread, I will try to discuss only the Malawi/Panama project. In general, I try to stabilize the following traits: potency and effect, strong branching, overall structure, and consistency in phenotypes.

I've been watching your thread. You're doing some nice work with some exciting hybrids.
It's a lot of fun and very interesting, making photoperiod cultivars into autoflower versions.

P.S.- I will mention my next photo to auto project with Ace Genetics. 6 of these just sprouted the other day. I'm very eager to get this hybrid on its way.

Peace GG

 

[AcrylicGoblin]

Great stuff, GG. You should have mentioned in my thread that you are an expert in the Ace sativa photo to auto game! I'm looking forward to following your work. It's exciting for me to find people working on similar projects. I actually considered using fantasmo as well. It probably would be a part of my autoflower starting point if it had been in stock when I bought seeds in previous years.

How do you feel about your FDPxMP auto? Specifically, has the effect you love from the MP passed down to your resulting auto to a satisfactory degree?

 

[gorilla ganja]

Great stuff, GG. You should have mentioned in my thread that you are an expert in the Ace sativa photo to auto game!

Thanks for the kind words. I try my best, but I still have a lot to learn. Breeding plants is a complex game.

How do you feel about your FDPxMP auto? Specifically, has the effect you love from the MP passed down to your resulting auto to a satisfactory degree?

Yes, I would say the MP has passed the effect satisfactorily. Some phenos are closer than others, and it's hard to remember the original exactly. I wish I had kept some around to compare, but that stash went quickly, and I don't keep clones for extended periods.

Having said that, it was only 50% MP genetics to begin with. Now, having worked it for several generations, it has combined and recombined the DNA to become its own beast. I have a few of the original MP seeds, and I also selfed the original Mother plant. I may start over and work this new auto back to the photoperiod MP again. But I only have so much time and space to work on all the projects I would like to do.

It's exciting for me to find people working on similar projects.

Me too. I love learning and sharing info with other like-minded individuals.
I think many of us are on the same quest. To bring the effects of long-flowering "Sativa" cannabis into something that will work outdoors for us. I'm at 55 N, so "Sativa"s won't work outdoors here; in fact, I think probably 90% of hybrids would not finish properly here either.
Hence, my work with Autoflowers.

Lately, I've been wondering if it is possible to bring the exact same cannabinoid profiles to autoflowers. Can an autoflower that takes 10-12 weeks from sprout to flower ever be able to match something that takes 12-20 weeks to flower? Maybe it takes a certain amount of time for some of the hundred or so cannabinoids to form or change form. The science is moving quickly, but I have not found much on this topic. If anyone finds good information, please post it here in this thread.


Peace GG

 

[paisajedehierba]

I keep finding phenotypes in my autoflowering lines that, in terms of high, represent much of what is characteristic of the photoperiodic flowering parents and is therefore the target of selection. However, I have not yet found any whose high lasts as long as that of the photoperiodic parents. Bringing the THC content of the autoflowering plants significantly closer to that of the parents seems to be an undertaking that is either doomed to failure or requires many generations of thorough selection. What is your experience in this regard? Malawi x Panama is very THC-rich line.

 

[AcrylicGoblin]

.
Lately, I've been wondering if it is possible to bring the exact same cannabinoid profiles to autoflowers. Can an autoflower that takes 10-12 weeks from sprout to flower ever be able to match something that takes 12-20 weeks to flower? Maybe it takes a certain amount of time for some of the hundred or so cannabinoids to form or change form.

Based on my research (aka smoking spliffs and chucking pollen), I don't think it can. There's no magical aspect of an autoflower that can speed up the development of the exact same cannabinoid+terpene profiles present in a photoperiod plant. The expression 'there's no such thing as a free lunch' comes to mind.
Flowering times can be reduced through selective breeding in the same way they can with photoperiod plants. But if 15 weeks of development can't be reduced to 10 weeks without losing something in a photo then it can't be done in an auto.
I think the only thing we can gain in autoflowers is a quicker ONSET of flowering. The development of a certain type of flower takes as long as it takes.
I believe, eventually, an autoflowering plant can be 100% as good as it's photoperiod counterpart. The way that is achieved, though, is simply by crossing successive generations of autoflowers back to the original photoperiod (with proper selection) so that eventually all that remains of the original autoflowering plant is the gene or genes that control the onset of flowering. That's a long process; someone will probably just start splicing genes as a shortcut before too long.
I've heard many people say that autos can never be as good as photos because of linked traits, bad mojo, or because God has cursed every breeder who dared to gaze upon a ruderalis...whatever. Until something like that is proven, I have no reason to believe it.

 

[gorilla ganja]

Bringing the THC content of the autoflowering plants significantly closer to that of the parents seems to be an undertaking that is either doomed to failure or requires many generations of thorough selection. What is your experience in this regard?

A few generations of proper selection would do it, I think. However, without lab testing the plants, it becomes difficult. First, smoke-testing many plants and comparing/picking the highest-THC ones is tough. I might like the effect of one plant, but that doesn't necessarily mean it has more THC. Also, the effects are subjective. I might prefer a different one than you. Genetics are the key. Starting with today's higher THC autoflowers makes the task more straightforward than a few years ago.
Higher THC is not always the answer, though. Many of the great Landrace Sativas of yesteryear had lower THC than today's hybrids. There are many things at play when it comes to effects.

 

[gorilla ganja]

I believe, eventually, an autoflowering plant can be 100% as good as it's photoperiod counterpart.

I think many are already.

The way that is achieved, though, is simply by crossing successive generations of autoflowers back to the original photoperiod (with proper selection) so that eventually all that remains of the original autoflowering plant is the gene or genes that control the onset of flowering.

I think that's how it has been done in the past, with breeders only wanting the autoflower trait from the ruderalis and nothing more. Wild ruderalis having many characteristics that are not desirable. Wispy/tiny buds, low THC, etc., but nowadays, autoflowers can bring something to the table as well.
So, at least for me, it is not always about trying to make an exact copy of the photoperiod plant with the autoflower trait. It is like any other breeding project, taking two plants and trying to make something better than either of the parents. It doesn't always work out that way, but that has always been my goal.

 

[gorilla ganja]

The journey continues...
So now we are on to the second generation and hunting for autoflowers. I looked through a few Malawi/Panama x FDP auto F2. Expecting about 25% full autoflower that I will pick the best from and reverse to lock in the auto trait. 5 plants were reversed, and I pollinated 5 different females to make these F2 seeds. These seedlings are from mothers #3,4,5. The pollen was going to be used on autos from mothers #1,2.

 

[paisajedehierba]

wow, that's nearly100 plants. Out of such a number of plants, I bet, you would have found healthy, auto-flowering males and females even without sex reversal. It helps enormously that you are legally allowed to grow so many plants. This gives the opportunity to select for other traits in addition to autoflowering in the early generations. Fine project!

 

[gorilla ganja]

It helps enormously that you are legally allowed to grow so many plants. This gives the opportunity to select for other traits in addition to autoflowering in the early generations. Fine project!

Yes, it makes things much easier and less stressful. However, there are never enough plants. I wish I could grow a thousand outdoors to really examine genetics.
Running a hundred regulars at F2 will give you about 25 autoflowers and only 12 or so females to select—not enough, in my opinion. That's why I work almost exclusively with female plants.

 

[gorilla ganja]

These seedlings are from mothers #3,4,5. The pollen was going to be used on autos from mothers #1,2.

So this step in the project was done in Feb. last year. The original plan was to do the above.
But plans changed, and I took a different path.
I reversed 5 plants. 2 died off due to root rot. 1 was much later in reversing, so only two mothers(fathers) were used. I used that pollen on 2 autos and 8 non-autos.
I used these non-autos because they stood out from seedlings as having nice NLD traits.
It adds another step, but I think it was ultimately worth it.

Reversed females

Two autos on the left were the ones I used. left and right have been topped. 52 days from sprout.

Pics of some of the non-autoflowers used.

4 of the 8 non-autos at 60 days they all were topped.

 

[AcrylicGoblin]

So this step in the project was done in Feb. last year. The original plan was to do the above.
But plans changed, and I took a different path.
I reversed 5 plants. 2 died off due to root rot. 1 was much later in reversing, so only two mothers(fathers) were used. I used that pollen on 2 autos and 8 non-autos.
I used these non-autos because they stood out from seedlings as having nice NLD traits.
It adds another step, but I think it was ultimately worth it.

Reversed females
View attachment 19156311 View attachment 19156313

Two autos on the left were the ones I used. left and right have been topped. 52 days from sprout.
View attachment 19156317


Pics of some of the non-autoflowers used. View attachment 19156314 View attachment 19156321
View attachment 19156323

4 of the 8 non-autos at 60 days and being topped.
View attachment 19156325

All looking good! What are the strains of the 8 non-autos used in this pollination?

 

[gorilla ganja]

What are the strains of the 8 non-autos used in this pollination?

All the above are Malawi/Panama x FDP auto-F2. I used to call the F2 plants that do not autoflower photoperiod plants, but it is misleading as 50% still carry the auto gene. So, I call them non-autos until I can think of a better term.

 

[gorilla ganja]

So, after the last step, I had a small amount of seeds from 10 different mothers. Two of which were autoflower and produced autoflower offspring. I tested those outdoors last Summer and a couple of friends grew them inside. We will get to those soon. But for now I will post a few pics of the MPD autos at the end of the season.

The three at the far end are a different variety. Next to those are a couple of runts of the MPD auto. All of these were transplanted, which may have stunted those ones.

 

[gorilla ganja]

You can see they much preferred being in the ground compared to pots, which got too hot and were a pain to keep up with watering. I will dig through some more pics and find some close ups.