Making tropicanna cookies f3s and tc x lemon tree

[Somatek]

If its illogical to assume they're worth breeding with, does it not follow that its also illogical to assume they aren't?
If they turn out nicely, and you made a few seeds, you're a generation ahead. If they dont turn out as hoped, you can throw the seeds away. Its a no lose possible win scenario.
On the other hand, if you wait to find out, you then start with cuts, and needing time to get to a point you could have been at months ago.

Objectivity is key to good breeding, not working from assumptions about what you have but from experience growing the plants, understanding their strengths and weaknesses and matching them to potential mates. The fact he reacted with such vitriol when it was pointed out he's working from assumptions, not fact (like asserting it is lemon tree based on someone's opinion and nothing else), which is an easy way to get mislead. I've had others from the nugswap/reddit group tell me they had Matt Beren's authentic Sunshine cut when I know it came from me (not getting into the fact that sunshine is a sweet skunk S1). People need a reality check, get over names and focus on understanding the plants their working with instead of focusing on their beliefs about those plants.

 

[GMT]

I think your looking at an ideal commercial point of view, rather than a guy who's not commercial, making himself a few seeds.
Besides, there's no guarantee Einstein's kids would be any brighter than the carpenter's from down the road.
Your argument that its not about names, and that he may not have the named cut, cancel each other out.

 

[yahooman]

If its illogical to assume they're worth breeding with, does it not follow that its also illogical to assume they aren't?
If they turn out nicely, and you made a few seeds, you're a generation ahead. If they dont turn out as hoped, you can throw the seeds away. Its a no lose possible win scenario.
On the other hand, if you wait to find out, you then start with cuts, and needing time to get to a point you could have been at months ago.

EXACTLY!!!
NO HARM NO FOUL

 

[Somatek]

Your argument that its not about names, and that he may not have the named cut, cancel each other out.

True, but the point being if you're focused on the superficial over substance, chances are your more a poser then anything. There's lots of newbs deciding to be "breeders" now that don't understand the plant well enough to understand their own ignorance. Assuming that because you bought pollen/clones from someone validates your experience/expertise is how we end up with all the hack "breeders" pumping out over hyped drivel that ends up wasting peoples time.

 

[yahooman]

Hey I never called myself a breeder....ever
U guys take this shit way too seriously.. this is just a fun breeding project for me..seeds won't be sold,just grown by me and friends..
So what's the problem here??

 

[GMT]

Caveat emptor. Must admit, I'd run a couple of the seeds, but wouldn't pay for them or fill the grow with them. I'll also admit to chucking worse pollen at worse mothers 20 years ago.

 

[yahooman]

True, but the point being if you're focused on the superficial over substance, chances are your more a poser then anything. There's lots of newbs deciding to be "breeders" now that don't understand the plant well enough to understand their own ignorance. Assuming that because you bought pollen/clones from someone validates your experience/expertise is how we end up with all the hack "breeders" pumping out over hyped drivel that ends up wasting peoples time.

Your problem is that you assume way too much

I'm going to breed what I want,when I want.....period
Free country dude

If your just gonna talk shit I'd appreciate it if you just stop posting here man...your just a downer

 

[yahooman]

What about the tropicanna f3s.. came from sealed breeder pack..I know its tropicanna. And I know the pollen is tropicanna as well cause my best friend grew the male from a sealed pack

So you guys gonna question that too???

I post here to have fun...and some people just dont get it...

 

[yahooman]

This is why I hardly post on the forums anymore...

 

[GMT]

Hang on, I've been supporting you here. If that's not welcome you can write to yourself in your thread of one.

 

[yahooman]

Hang on, I've been supporting you here. If that's not welcome you can write to yourself in your thread of one.

Sorry gmt....I absolutely wasn't referring to you

 

[Somatek]

What about the tropicanna f3s.. came from sealed breeder pack..I know its tropicanna. And I know the pollen is tropicanna as well cause my best friend grew the male from a sealed pack

So you guys gonna question that too???

I post here to have fun...and some people just dont get it...

So because you know the breeder you know the plants will be what you want? That's the logical fallacy I was pointing out, usually people wait until they've flowered them and know what the plants are actually like before deciding if their worth breeding.

If you're just looking for validation and people to agree with you, the forums probably aren't a good fit and you may want to stick to social media. You need a pretty thick skin and willingness to have you opinions challenged.

 

[GMT]

I was too snappy yahooman, its all good.

To be honest somatek, I think the mistake a lot of people make is to assume a great plant will create great offspring and a poor plant will create poor offspring. I know that's the staple belief system in our world, and I've been guilty of agreeing with it in the past too. But now I believe, and I may be wrong, that its the line that's important not the individual.
If a line of genetics give rise to certain traits that you're looking for, then odds are, and that's statistical odds, the genes that generate those traits are within that seed line. The differences in individuals are less likely to come from spontaneous mutations, but the precise combinations of those genes. Therefore, if looking to precisely copy an individual, you have to clone. Any breeding is going to take you away from it, but if you're looking for a specific trait, any plant carrying those genes, can give rise to that trait being present in its offspring. Not all offspring, but that's where selection starts. First you need a batch of seeds to search through. Making them is a hell of a lot cheaper than buying multiple packs.
In that case, any pollen chuck, so long as both parents are from a line which carry the traits, can create something special somewhere in the seed batch it creates.
Again, just a personal view, but one born of a lot of pollen chucking and a lot of reading.

 

[troutman]

Good Luck

 

[Somatek]

I was too snappy yahooman, its all good.

To be honest somatek, I think the mistake a lot of people make is to assume a great plant will create great offspring and a poor plant will create poor offspring. I know that's the staple belief system in our world, and I've been guilty of agreeing with it in the past too. But now I believe, and I may be wrong, that its the line that's important not the individual.
If a line of genetics give rise to certain traits that you're looking for, then odds are, and that's statistical odds, the genes that generate those traits are within that seed line. The differences in individuals are less likely to come from spontaneous mutations, but the precise combinations of those genes. Therefore, if looking to precisely copy an individual, you have to clone. Any breeding is going to take you away from it, but if you're looking for a specific trait, any plant carrying those genes, can give rise to that trait being present in its offspring. Not all offspring, but that's where selection starts. First you need a batch of seeds to search through. Making them is a hell of a lot cheaper than buying multiple packs.
In that case, any pollen chuck, so long as both parents are from a line which carry the traits, can create something special somewhere in the seed batch it creates.
Again, just a personal view, but one born of a lot of pollen chucking and a lot of reading.

If that's the logic you're using then you should be doing open pollination to increase diversity in the initial offspring instead of artificially limiting it by making selections before harvesting. For thatto be really applicable the seeds have to be stable enough on the hardy weinberg equilibrium or else you don't know what's being passed on. Often that isn't the case and unless you have experience with the seeds itvs a gamble. Which is why most people make selections after having grown the seeds and seeing what expressions are in them, not deciding before hand what to cross.

Out of curiosity have you made any seeds outside of pot? Growing heritage veggies and saving seeds is a good way to broaden your experience and see what truly stable seeds are like, something a lot of people would benefit from as being definition of "stable" seems very contextual.

 

[GMT]

In regards to open pollination, well, the principle of o.p. is to generate as many parental combinations as possible. And under those initial circumstances, that is the desired principle yes I agree. But I don't ever agree with the practice itself as you have no idea which male was the father of any one seed. So personally I'd collect the pollen, and dust the girls individually with one male at a time. Over a couple of rounds with the female clones, in order to give batches of seeds. That way you can track lines. But yes, that is the best starting principle to use prior to identifying the better parentage.
Nah, never played with anything other than weed. Never intended to play with weed in terms of breeding, it just became a necessity then an obsession, and now a cost saving hobby.

 

[yahooman]

What I do know is if I make f3s say and I grow say 70 of those seeds out I'll find exactly what I'm looking for

 

[yahooman]

If that's the logic you're using then you should be doing open pollination to increase diversity in the initial offspring instead of artificially limiting it by making selections before harvesting. For thatto be really applicable the seeds have to be stable enough on the hardy weinberg equilibrium or else you don't know what's being passed on. Often that isn't the case and unless you have experience with the seeds itvs a gamble. Which is why most people make selections after having grown the seeds and seeing what expressions are in them, not deciding before hand what to cross.

Out of curiosity have you made any seeds outside of pot? Growing heritage veggies and saving seeds is a good way to broaden your experience and see what truly stable seeds are like, something a lot of people would benefit from as being definition of "stable" seems very contextual.

Look man I've done this a hundred times...
I do it cause I enjoy it...I do it cause I like pheno hunting....I dont really care about the science of it at all....this is not my job or do I take it extremely serious...
You are trying to teach me things I dont care to learn

If I want to grow awesome.e pot I'll put my gelato or mandarin cookies or creamsicle into flower

 

[yahooman]

I asked u nicely to refrain from this thread somatek.....
Your taking all the fun out of it

 

[yahooman]

In regards to open pollination, well, the principle of o.p. is to generate as many parental combinations as possible. And under those initial circumstances, that is the desired principle yes I agree. But I don't ever agree with the practice itself as you have no idea which male was the father of any one seed. So personally I'd collect the pollen, and dust the girls individually with one male at a time. Over a couple of rounds with the female clones, in order to give batches of seeds. That way you can track lines. But yes, that is the best starting principle to use prior to identifying the better parentage.
Nah, never played with anything other than weed. Never intended to play with weed in terms of breeding, it just became a necessity then an obsession, and now a cost saving hobby.

Why does GMT get it and not somatek....