LED and BUD QUALITY

[Cerathule]

and i dont see plants outside complain about too much light haha do you ?

The sun is tough & harsh, in my first year when I put my plants outside all leaves got bleached within a day, after 3 days all had fallen off.

You may wanna read a few studies about D1-protein photodamage, photoinhibition of PSII from UV or high irradiance, and S3 exciton states that cause internal bleaching via creation of singulet oxygen.

Nature isn't perfect, but plants have adapted to it. Over decades some genetics may have adapted to indoor cultivation as well, with HPS as a standard light that has almost no blue, but "easy" orange, and a metablism driver ingrained (radiative heat).

Not gonna speculate now what's better or worse, just asking out of curiosity bout these "capitate-less" trichs

 

[GoatCheese]

Here’s a good side by side grow thread with lab tests:

CXB3590 vs MH/HPS vs 650W ChilLED
https://www.icmag.com/threads/cxb3590-vs-mh-hps-vs-650w-chilled.332823/

 

[GoatCheese]

My Cree CXB3590 3500K cobs grow chunkier buds with larger resin glands compared to the cool tubed 250W Osram Plantastar i had with under 50% of the energy consumption. And they don’t grow leafier plants vs hps, i don’t know where that idea comes from!?

I don’t know how Samsung etc. chips bloom plants cause i only use my Sammies for veg and blooming small male plants but there’s nothing wrong with my Cree cob buds andi don’t see too much wrong with the buds people grow with their Mars lights.

 

[GoatCheese]

My STARDAWG MANNY TOPDAWG led flower and trichshot coming to the end of there lives from a previous grow link if want to look.

https://www.icmag.com/threads/darksiders-stardawg-manny-sanctuary-rockwool-run.375330/

Nothing wrong with Darkie's led buds, ay! ...where's the extra leafy bud leds supposedly grow or lack of resin/-size???!
...maybe the new guy doesn't really know what he/she is talking about ...but there sure is alot of talk.

 

[snakedope]

The sun is tough & harsh, in my first year when I put my plants outside all leaves got bleached within a day, after 3 days all had fallen off.

You may wanna read a few studies about D1-protein photodamage, photoinhibition of PSII from UV or high irradiance, and S3 exciton states that cause internal bleaching via creation of singulet oxygen.

Nature isn't perfect, but plants have adapted to it. Over decades some genetics may have adapted to indoor cultivation as well, with HPS as a standard light that has almost no blue, but "easy" orange, and a metablism driver ingrained (radiative heat).

Not gonna speculate now what's better or worse, just asking out of curiosity bout these "capitate-less" trichs

You are confusing heating issues with light, i also put plants outside and they died within 3 days, yeah it was very small plants, and maybe if they were bigger they could've dealt with the heat a bit better, still it was 34-38c outside, big no no,
Question, if you put your plants outside in the winter but in a clear sunny days of winter, you think your plants would still die ? a plant is like a human, "ya shall be like the tree in the field" said the lord
What is good for you, is good for him, even humans cant live in 38c conditions for a long time without things that help them survive this conditions, plants are more vulnerable as they dont got the luxury of having feet and running to a shaded place when it gets too hot or any other thing that might hurt them, humans invented ACs, Fans, etc, we took care of ourselves.

The sun is tough and harsh because its responsible for light and heat, one cant go without the other when it comes to the sun, so balance is key, planting in the right seasons and time is key also, finding the sweet spot of plenty of light and just the right heat.

My Cree CXB3590 3500K cobs grow chunkier buds with larger resin glands compared to the cool tubed 250W Osram Plantastar i had with under 50% of the energy consumption. And they don’t grow leafier plants vs hps, i don’t know where that idea comes from!?

I don’t know how Samsung etc. chips bloom plants cause i only use my Sammies for veg and blooming small male plants but there’s nothing wrong with my Cree cob buds andi don’t see too much wrong with the buds people grow with their Mars lights.

Give us some close up pics of your LED flowers please.. show us bigger trichome heads.
Every LED growers claims that their product is superior, nothing new under the sun..
The OP says different, so am i...

EDIT - im not against LEDs or something, people who use and buy LED always thinking we are trying to ridicule or make them a joke for some reason, well, everyone that puts good money on something thinks his shit is the best, no matter what it is, normal human thing..
Excuses there are plenty, when i post comments on people LED grows here or RIU they think i attack them, all i do is point out that their grow is shit in flowering terms ya ? cuz their plant looks awesome but when they switch to flower is the most funny thing i ever saw, for real... like then people smoke this lame ass funny thing and claim its the best ever
its getting to a point that reality is so much blurred by people egos and closed minds that non of us can know what is real and what is not.

 

[snakedope]

Not gonna speculate now what's better or worse, just asking out of curiosity bout these "capitate-less" trichs

I am no expert in those capitate less trichs, i just call out what i see with my eyes, not only with my past LED grows which was 95% same like what im talking about, but everyone else also, maybe we give 5-10% exception to those who are doing magic and are able to get good trichome head and size and glue from LED grows, i haven't seen 1 yet, i mean in real life, not pics.
Smoked the entire med weed here, over 100 strains easy, over 15 growers, some from here, some imported from CAN, Portugal, Cali..., smoked also much of the hobby\criminal market here, they have the best gear in terms of genetics, seed junky, in house, exotix, sorry, ALL SHIT, dosent come close to past HID or outdoor grows they used to have.


Also im not into digging in my own opinions, if you can explain this phenomena i will be glad to re think everything i thought i know, im always open for knowledge and opinions.

 

[GoatCheese]

Give us some close up pics of your LED flowers please.. show us bigger trichome heads.
Every LED growers claims that their product is superior, nothing new under the sun..
The OP says different, so am i...

I don't have any photos to compare. I rarely take photos of my plants these days unless it's for a strain review or something, but i don't invent stories. Why would i try to bullshit myself and i'm the only person that counts when it comes to my growing, know what i'm saying. If someone on the internet doesn't wanna believe me when i don't have photos to back up my claims, then fine. I'm too old already to give a shit.

Just go see the plants DeceiverZ grew in that side by side thread i posted earlier, there's plenty of photos in that one + lab test of the flowers.

 

[Douglas.Curtis]

TLDNR...

 

[Douglas.Curtis]

Yes... plump trichs under LED.

 

[Douglas.Curtis]

HPS/LED, does not make any difference for me. Ty very much. Mars Hydro FCE-3000.

 

[snakedope]

Curtis, i now see it more clearly, trichomes on your buds are not developed enough.
Very small heads.

Here is the nug i bought for 30usd, LED ofcourse.

Same problem like yours, very much stalks, plenty of trichome heads, just not there yet, and will never be under LED.
GoatCheese - i will look i promise, and i already know im gonna see stalks with small heads, trust me.
The only place i see real glue is HID grows, and some 40w+ cfls... all else just dont make good flowers, i smoked them all bro, my country is out there, some guys here even buy special strains from us, back to rolling tobacco

 

[Douglas.Curtis]

Dunno what you are looking at, those are fat topped, short trichs. Didja zoom in? lol I see ultra skinny trichs with normal heads in your photo... (tough to see any detail) what strain is that? My photos are of Lerch, with the first being more Lebanese and the second more Frankie's Church leaning.

 

[zachrockbadenof]

The sun is tough & harsh, in my first year when I put my plants outside all leaves got bleached within a day, after 3 days all had fallen off.

u don't take a plant growing indoors, and immed put it outside under the sun.... u need to acclimate it... put it in a shady spot where it gets some filtered sun in the early am, or late pm... over a 5-7day period more it further into the bright sun... no bleaching, or death will occur

 

[snakedope]

Dunno what you are looking at, those are fat topped, short trichs. Didja zoom in? lol I see ultra skinny trichs with normal heads in your photo... (tough to see any detail) what strain is that? My photos are of Lerch, with the first being more Lebanese and the second more Frankie's Church leaning.

Lol thats what im saying, mine also suffer from the same problem
It is Peaches & Cream by exotix, grown under 650w led, i didnt grow it but saw the grow diary of the person who did, his plants looked killer at veg, 5-6 week flower i saw what i was most afraid of, many stalks, very small heads, back then i knew it was gonna bunk..
yestarday (maybe a month over) everything is dry and ready and i bought some (under gunpoint )
and this is the result, smoking it for 2 days now... its peaking in new shit records

About zoom-ins, this field of trichome study under certain intensity and spectrum is still grey area, im pointing it out to people and they laugh at me, but they cant hide the truth for long
If you zoom in enough you can make any trichome head make big and solid
im not saying yours dont get to the point they are not heads, because they are, but size ?
its not something thats easy to spot from pics, believe me, after viewing 1000+ pics from everywhere here and RIU i became a LED - HPS spotter, show me a plant thats flowering and i can tell 95% of the time under what its grown simply by looking at the trichome heads and flower structre.
pics can be misleading, thats why i would like to hear from others.

 

[Douglas.Curtis]

Well awesome, and I hope you find the missing link. Btw... my wife says the same I do, your HPS closeup looks just like my LED. Luck on your quest.

FWIW, I have serious issues with 99% of the cannabis grown by others regardless of their choice of light. Have for decades.

 

[Wall]

some varieties respond very well to LEDs and others less well.. quite simply. Not all genetics respond super well to LEDs or HPS...there's nothing new with that. And the development of trychomes does not only depend on the lamp used. Having 1000w does not change anything. Some will respond wonderfully and others less... To have discussed it with mike from Mandala 2 or 3 years ago, he told me the same thing. Quite simply... depending on the genes, Asian or not, exotic or not. The same plant under LED explodes (and less under HPS) as another will do the opposite ) lol! But LEDs make magnificent trychomes... 15 or 20 years ago it was SHIT! Everything was PINK / PURPLE, it looked like dollhouse lamps! Now the LEDs do the job as well (if not better) than an HPS... the HPS remains the QUEEN for me! It's clear. With its inconveniences... but LEDs these days are ultra efficient!

 

[GoatCheese]

Lol thats what im saying, mine also suffer from the same problem
It is Peaches & Cream by exotix, grown under 650w led, i didnt grow it but saw the grow diary of the person who did, his plants looked killer at veg, 5-6 week flower i saw what i was most afraid of, many stalks, very small heads, back then i knew it was gonna bunk..
yestarday (maybe a month over) everything is dry and ready and i bought some (under gunpoint )
and this is the result, smoking it for 2 days now... its peaking in new shit records

About zoom-ins, this field of trichome study under certain intensity and spectrum is still grey area, im pointing it out to people and they laugh at me, but they cant hide the truth for long
If you zoom in enough you can make any trichome head make big and solid
im not saying yours dont get to the point they are not heads, because they are, but size ?
its not something thats easy to spot from pics, believe me, after viewing 1000+ pics from everywhere here and RIU i became a LED - HPS spotter, show me a plant thats flowering and i can tell 95% of the time under what its grown simply by looking at the trichome heads and flower structre.
pics can be misleading, thats why i would like to hear from others.

You can’t be comparing HPS vs leds without taking into account the growing method- soil vs hydro or other factors and the possible stress issues. The same cut grown hydro style will have larger resin glands and more resin on leaves vs. the same cut grown in soil cause there’s larger amount of water in hydro plant’s system and it will puff up the resin quite abit.

..also hydro grown plants grow more leaf than the same cut grown in soil, and this also affects the bud structure no matter what light source you use.


Some plants have very small resin size no matter what light source you use. Alot of landrace strains are like this, sativas and affies. And there can be huge difference in resin content between plants from the same pack of seeds.



Have you actually grown the same cut under a hps and then under leds yourself? ..or are you just looking at photos on the internet?

The way you write about these things suggests to me that you’re not very experienced grower with a particular cut or that you haven’t gone thru larger amount of seeds of the same variety ...maybe i’m wrong. But you write alot about buying weed and looking at photos but you don’t talk alot about growing stuff yourself.

I have been growing the same cuts for over a decade. My oldest keepers - grown out of seeds by me- are over 10 years old – much older than my led lights - and i know them quite well. Alot of stuff you're claiming just isn't adding up to me; i don't see it at home or on other peoples' grows here on ICMAG.

 

[delta9nxs]

well snakeshit! here's some led grown flowers. the strain is ethos "orange kush cake". 1680 watts of walmart's finest household light bulbs.

by the way, everyone who has ever done any extracting will tell you trichs heads come in all sizes, largely depending on genetics.

i have been growing 26 years and i have not seen a correlation between light type and trich head size.

 

[snakedope]

Wall and delta, im sorry if you got offended .. ?
Your flowers just show me the same thing, under developed heads.

i agree genetics play a good role here, thats what i was saying about the duckfoot that did do quite good under the LEDs, but i also believe there is a threshold of light needed in our case.
You just dont get it, im not bashing led or something you have me all wrong..
My friend dosent believe in LED anymore, and i can understand him.. everything is no good these days, unless u do it on your own with proper lights.

Again, my point is !
you can use any type of lights you want ! i prefer LEDs all around, but now its not possible as to their limitations, Now, the tests are already been done 50 years and still counting, people grow with shitty spectrum and deliver great bud.

So, taking that in mind, i opt for the best solution which is LED for the win in veg (until they raise the power of them) and CFL (40w+) or HID in flower depending what setup i have.

Its not me saying this, everyone that will follow science (not NASA), will see that the higher the intensity the better, you dont just up the ppfd when u switch to flower for nothing...
Simple things that are known for years.

 

[delta9nxs]

you are not seeing "underdeveloped" trich heads. this is a plant that was run 10 weeks under a light so powerful that it will produce 1500 umols of flow at 26".

my sunlight supply de's produced 1500 umols at 20" for comparison.

the only commercial light i know of that even comes close is the new 2000 dollar fohse offering.

the combined spectrum of these 2700k and 5000k bulbs is superb.

i own a par meter and these plants received 40-50 total moles per diurnal period.

you don't know what you are talking about.

does anyone else think these trichs are "underdeveloped"?