Isomerization of Honey Oil - budder

[malkop_zolkop]

Very interesting, Reeferman told us that some old geezers do make concentrates that are very potent and I guess this is the way to do it? I could be wrong ok but I think he mentioned some methods of making hash/kif/oil that is so strong that its silly.

It could just simply be attributed to good source material too. Lets face it, one man's meat is another man's poison.
I've also heard fractional distillation yields excellent results too but who knows.

 

[Guest]

sorry about that MZ, and also that i don't have any links to back up my satement. i remember this from an isomerization thread on OG, where a very clever guy with access to gas chromatography/mass spectrometry equipment said that all the samples he had tested showed less than .5% CBD by dry weight. the dutch passion website suggests that none of their strains exceed .3% CBD.
http://www.dutch-passion.nl/home.php?p=growinfo&l=en

 

[GoodbyeBlueSky]

Anyways, There is the organic Vs. chemical debate. Imo, i think it's all just THC anyway you look at it.

2 bowls of yours doesn't and can never equal one of mine. not wanting to sould elitest / snobby but delta-6 thc is a different drug, high to delta 9 thc.

now, while isomerization may yield some very pure oil... saying that it's 'a different drug' is kind of niave.

especially for someone with as much chemical knowledge as you seem to have. someone of your level of knowledge should know that thc has VERY little pharmacological effects. elevated heart rate, red eyes due to dialation of blood vessels, munchies, etc... these are what pot does to you. the high that we experience from it is a sort of psychosomatic projection of the way our body percieves these subtle pharmacological effects.

what i mean is best illustrated by the fact that scans of brain activity of stoned people are almost identical, or show negligable difference, to people who are sober. for this reason, pot/hash/oil would be best described as an 'active placebo'... this is what makes it so safe, and why some people love it, while others have horrible experiences.

anyway, bottom line is, you can get just as high with good pot as with good hash or good oil... they'll all feel slightly different, and different amounts may be needed, but similar effects are easily achievable...

peace

 

[malkop_zolkop]

It's all good.
So, it would appear that you are definetly on to something here.

 

[Chiefsmokingbud]

well this all sounds very interesting to me and i would very much like to try it.......but i'm on a steep learning curve when it comes to chemistry. Where do you get the p-toluenesulfonic (tosic) acid from and exactly what is the purpose of the
bromothymol blue indicator solution ? Excuse my ignorance.

 

[Guest]

i'm embarrassed to say it now, but this tek blew my mind when i first saw it on erowid and i couldn't wait to try it out. i gave up after three attempts because it just wasn't working, and i was wasting good oil in the process

 

[jimbob420]

I have never tested it but I always thought that when I made canna-food with the vaporized remains we were only getting the CBD and CBN since we vaporized out all the THC. The goodies always make even the most hardcore smokers really tired and couchlocked. I'm suprized no one here has heard of the Isomizer before.

http://boards.marihemp.com/boards/msg22x139397.shtml

http://64.233.179.104/search?q=cach...246755.html+isomizer&hl=en&gl=us&ct=clnk&cd=9

 

[Sub Nl]

Hi, you like to read?

First i was going to avoid commenting, kinda being dis-appointed with the reception of this thread. People hating, wtf? But 'rosination' is ok? Lolz But fook that.

Few points before we start.

The method of solvent used, and finally oil dissolved in makes huge difference. Xylene and eucalyptus being superior.

THCV and CBDV are the future. Get to know them, love them.

From wiki

Cannabidivarine, also known as cannabidivarol or CBDV, is a non-psychoactive cannabinoid found in minor amounts in the hemp plant Cannabis sativa. It is an analog of cannabidiol (CBD) with the side-chain shortened by two CH2 groups. Under acidic conditions it isomerizes into the psychoactive cannabinoid tetrahydrocannabivarin (THCV). CBDV is the biosynthetic precursor of THCV in the plant
and
Tetrahydrocannabivarin, also known as tetrahydrocannabivarol, THCV, or THV, is a psychoactive cannabinoid found in minor amounts in the hemp plant Cannabis sativa. It is an analog of tetrahydrocannabinol (THC) with the sidechain shortened by two CH2 groups. "
So THCV is in minor amounts in sativa and is psychoactive. This is what we're after with this chemical systhesis process.

So from the isomerization process you get a very concentrated oil witch is 99% THC (d6 or d9) and 0%CBD and other cannabinoids. In the end of the whole process do you really get more THC in weight then it would be in the original BHO (if you were isomerizing BHO) or some will be inevitably wasted in all the process?

Is it worth it? Is it worth it just for the diferent high (more sativa like) or does it last you more than regular BHO?

Yeah, i believe you got the point of the post. You do end up with more thc / different thc than you actually start with or can organically or chemically extract.

Is it worth it? Yes, if you do this prodecure properly in the right conditions. (ie if you did well at chemistry at school, and have outdoor access and proper lab equipment.) The amount of thc + the quality + ,the high, + the use of shake to make good stuff. Does it last longer than BHO? Hmm, subjective, needs qualative and quantative research. My personal correlations become fooked after a few bubbly, oily bowls. Generally cbd's help sustain the thc effect, so more research needed.

This is not for the faint hearted, but immensly worth it to those who know, can. Imhho of course.

a bit off topic, but i took about 10 grams of so-called pop-corn buds and added them to a 500ml bottle of a traditional clear alcoholic drink, 40% alcohol, it has been macerating for 14 days now. you think putting a few drops of this under the tongue would have any good effects? thanks. peace.

woah, sorry for late reply didn't notice this hidden. Erm.. tbh i don't think so. I think that drinking a few shots will get you toasty though. I'm not sure how much of the chemicals would have been absorbed into the alcohol.

I think bastard brewer would be the best person to ask. Last time i was talking to him, he was saying that he's been making isolater for years, but instead of filtering out the small crystals he's remove large plant matter and make wine from the remaining saturated water. His wine is to die for.

Me personally? I'd never drop my buds into alcohol. I'd either smoke them as is, or pull crystals off into kif. And then grind them up and run butane over them for that last goodness.

Hmm, let us know how it turns out anyways. I think you'll get the most out of the buds, but maybe not increase their potency or effect?

MZ is quite correct, isomerization is a waste of time. cannabidiol is virtually absent from modern drug-type cannabis cultivars.

Hi, whats a cultivar? Seriously are we getting the ICNCP invovled? Err. Doesn't medicinal marajuana like cannabiloids for interaction with cb1,cb2 recepters? Or is it the CBN? All i 'know' is that Indica's generally have higher ratio of CBD's to THC, making them more stoney, sativa's are THC orientated, more high. But what about the cbdv's --> thcv's. ! cbnv's?

Random link(aka easter egg): http://www.idmu.co.uk/cbd.htm

Well I didn't say it in so many words, but the absence of any major proof is pretty much all the answer needed. I'm curious. That is all.

OK whatever works for you, your loss i suppose but that's perspective. Any reason for you here bashing my thread? When unscientific threads like 'cough' rosination are well recieved. But let me say this. This drug we all love is very poorly researched and understood. The fact that it's illegal has made it impossible to study it. So no i don't have any studies to refer you to, no peer journal entries, nothing in nature. Fuck all in fact. I bet a lot of what we all think we currently know is wrong too.

My point, until you have first hand experience. What's the point of throwing around other people's outdated ideas? I'm putting out science, i'm giving methodolgy, i'm hoping people will replicate my results. But until then, what proof do you have to refute my work? 'Jeneius'.

Very interesting, Reeferman told us that some old geezers do make concentrates that are very potent and I guess this is the way to do it? I could be wrong ok but I think he mentioned some methods of making hash/kif/oil that is so strong that its silly.

Yeah dude, thanks for the support, i appreciate it. Yes, this method is known to the old schoolers and o'g'ers. Appartently, old issues of High Times used to have a machine in the ad pages for sale that called itself and isomeriser. I had a scan through a few and couldn't find anything. I'm sure there must be some info of this device in the web somewhere.

Yeah, silly would be the right word here. We're taking THC over near the mushroom field, but in a very mild way.

It could just simply be attributed to good source material too. Lets face it, one man's meat is another man's poison.
I've also heard fractional distillation yields excellent results too but who knows.

This method over all requires the lowest quality Source Materials, making it remarkably different to all other methods of cannabis concentration. Kif, bubble, (bho, oil) all depend on quality of cyrstals.

Chemical extraction pulls out the thc molecules from crystals, creating a higher than previously attainable thc percentage in the oil. When you add acids to rotate the carbon chain, you get an even higher, more potent form of the drug.

Otherwise it's the thc actually in the crystals. Isn't BHO considered fractional? And my method calls for distillation. But hey your science > me.

I'm embarrassed to say it now, but this tek blew my mind when i first saw it on erowid and i couldn't wait to try it out. i gave up after three attempts because it just wasn't working, and i was wasting good oil in the process ....

...where a very clever guy with access to gas chromatography/mass spectrometry equipment said that all the samples he had tested showed less than .5% CBD by dry weight. the dutch passion website suggests that none of their strains exceed .3% CBD.

I would be embarrased too. Thats a lot of fucking up.

I don't agree with the methods/ solvents on erowids. What process did you use? If you were using alcohol based solvents you need quick exposure time to plant material. Kinda bullshit if you ask me. A 3-10 hour reflux session is the key. Xylene is the answer. Did you have all the proper equipment, technique etc.?

So he found cbd's in the gas, and what's wrong with that? First of all your facts in my thread are wrong, and 2) whats wrong with CBD's? Take naseau, edge off high slightly. Even if this guy had tested pure isomerized budder and had found CBD's, so what? Was that budder made properly? Did strains have indica in? Was it refluxed? What solvent, process. Should budder have cbds/vs? Or should they have been converted. We need to nail down the specifics. Unfortunately cannabis research is sketchy.

This is important and relevant to you. In the plant, "CBD is a precursor and CBN a metabolite of THC. "

Dude, i know i've been harsh on you, if you tried 3 times before with that method and failed i can understand. And you of all people here could probably be tempted to try this madness, and vindicate me., but i can tell by your attitude and ignorance (ie your facts being well, not facts) you won't.

now, while isomerization may yield some very pure oil... saying that it's 'a different drug' is kind of niave.

Why? I disagree. I think it's easy to break down skunk; indicas and sativas. Stoney and high. Isomerising oil changes the ratio of psycho-active components. If there is more THCV than previously obtainable in any sativa strain. Then it would act like a new drug. Maybe enough to distinguish itself. It's definitetly giggly and trippy like mild mushrooms.

I can easily explain oil or BHO to someone. It just triples the strength of the ingredients. With iso oil, it's unlike any other cannabis experience.

Though i do take your point. I'll leave it open for debate. But not Naiive. You can paraphrase to read 'makes thc affect you in a non-thc way'.

what i mean is best illustrated by the fact that scans of brain activity of stoned people are almost identical, or show negligable difference, to people who are sober. for this reason, pot/hash/oil would be best described as an 'active placebo'... this is what makes it so safe, and why some people love it, while others have horrible experiences.

Woah dude?? i'm having a bowl before answering this puppy. OK, now i don't know where i am or what my name is. I Just remember not to use my real one. Anyhoo..

The way pot affects you is so much deeper than you can imagine.

Firstly, it;s all about erogneous cannabaloid receptors. Cb1s, cb2s affect so many systems. Like the cb1 receptors in the eyes make cannabis benficial for gylcomas. Pain, temperature, digestion are all directly affected by cannabis.

Most imporantly synaptic function. Normally neurons, axons fire from pre-synaptic to post-synatic junctions. Normal thought etc. Cannabis reverses this firing process firing from post to pre. This has the effect of slowing us down, chilling us, even returning hunger to aids patient. We're changing brain functions. Probably changing potassium gates to sodium gates?

It's thought that when the Brain is preparing itself for trama, ie it can sense extreme pain, it releases natural cannabis into the nerves. Trying to deaden their function and much as possible to prevent possible damage.

It's also tied into the preception, anxiety, stress centres of our brains. Alteration of mood, inabilty to think clearly, altered sensory perceptions. These are all things that i can personally attest to. As a marajuana smoker for 17 years now.

Years ago sometimes i wouldn't go into shopping centres because they were too 'hectic' , and i didn't feel like doing anything. (hmm i was young and being sold indicas). These days i've noticed that sativas give me happiness and energy. If i smoke indicas im also aware of the bodily need for sugar.. As my body tries to fight the sleep affect with high-energy substance. Hey it (my body) works on checmical level too.

And my final point, is we don't know shit yet about cannabis. Some brain scans don't mean shit to me, thats not proof of a place'bo effect.

Only times comparing brain activity Vs. Human function / capabilty is when there is actual brain damage and we can study it against normal function. (sub goes to his library of real books) I won't bore you... but corpus callumus spilt experiments where perceptions remaining in one brain half, even though it was seperated from the other.

Or when the hippocampus is damaged and memory goes. Or damage to the Broca's / wernickle area's. Damage to broca's impairs speech but leaves comprehenshion of speech. Damage to Wenickle leaves people talking fluently but with no content.

Omg, the brain, our understanding of it, thc our knowledge, who know's what's right? (apart from i'm not on a placebo)
Hence my infinitist philosphy. Everything's possible.

well this all sounds very interesting to me and i would very much like to try it.......but i'm on a steep learning curve when it comes to chemistry. Where do you get the p-toluenesulfonic (tosic) acid from and exactly what is the purpose of the
bromothymol blue indicator solution ? Excuse my ignorance.

I think a link for the tosic was mentioned on the first page of the thread. I've not tried that link so i can't comment. I have a friend that works for a college so i order through him. I'm sure those places that supply schools could help, maybe yellow pages?

Please make sure you have proper equipment like separtory funnel and watch glass etc.. makes difference.

Good question about the Bromothymol blue, It's actually superfluous for the process. I've revised the process and have removed it. Thanks for pointing it out to me.

I really hope you try this and have success. Damn i need someone else trying this.

New TEQ,

Materials:
-xylene (found in paint/solvent areas of hardware stores)
-shake or buds
-p-toluenesulfonic (tosic) acid
-mason jar
-hot plate
-set of beakers
-distilled water
-separatory funnel
-paper filter
-hot plate or precision outdoor electric stove
-NaHCO3 (baking soda)
-pH test strips (from hot tub)
1. Dry, chill, and finely grind shake and put it in a mason jar.
2. Pour enough chilled xylene into the mason jar that the shake is covered by it or begins to float.
3. Shake for 5 minutes, let it sit overnight (you may shake periodically), and pour it through a filter. Collect shake from filter.
4. Shake for 5 minutes, let it sit overnight (you may shake periodically), and pour it through a filter into the same beaker with the liquid from step #3. Discard the shake or residue.
5. Boil off the xylene on the hot plate, making sure to stop as soon as honey oil begins to precipitate out or create long lasting bubbles. Allow to cool.
6. Add enough xylene to redissolve the precipitate.
7. Add <5% p-toluenosulphonic acid solution, drop by drop, until a pH of 2 is reached. Test this by observing the appearance of a pH test strip under a definite pH of 2-3.
8. Place solution on the hot plate and place a watch-glass over top of the beaker. Reflux for 3-10 hours. Breaking it into multiple sections may or may not cause problems. It can also allow for stirring without loss of acid upon removal of the watch-glass.
9. Remove beaker from hot plate and allow to cool.
10. Drop by drop, add <5% NaHCO3 until a pH of 7.2 or decidedly above that is reached.
11. Add 3vol distilled water and 1vol xylene. Agitate.
12. Transfer to separatory funnel, allow it to settle, and drain off the bottom layer.
13. Add 3vol distilled water, agitate, and repeat step 13.
14. Repeat step 14 once more for purity.
15. Pour solution through filter with activated carbon on top.
16. Distill this solution at about 140C-150C to yield a large amount of“ (--)-(6aR,10aR)-6,6,6-dimethyl-3-pentyl-6a,7,8,10a-tetrahydro-7H-benzo[c]chromen-1-ol ”.

-Dissolve in eucalyptus oil or sesame oil to dilute. Drops under Tounge.

Credit to hashmonkey, See first post in thread for budder info.
Anyone read all this? Thanks
'ole subby

 

[Guest]

Anyone read all this? Thanks
'ole subby

I did and unfortunately I think I have to read it again.
... and this is for another time. First and maybe
I follow your thread


Afghan Bondage :

 

[Sub Nl]

...comedy...[/img][/url]

thanks for reading and for the laughs.

some more info on isomerization from around the web: this is a start to get you interested. lol love the nuclear explosion reference.

from overgrow!! come back all is forgiven.

3. Direct isomerization

Sometimes if pot is totally rank and crappy, or you're dealing with a bunch of roaches, trimmings, or some other inferior source of THC it is desirable to go well beyond what a simple volatile solvent or super critical fluid extraction can do. You want to convert all those free available cannibidiols into more potent THC analogs and cannabinols.

This technique also will render a fully decarboxylized end product, as well as destroying many terpenes and aromatics which can improve or destroy a product depending on the original quality. It is important to understand this is not a full conversion to ƒ´9-THC, but to THC analogs and more active cannibidiols, and is included in this discussion more as an educational exercise. Basic isomerization takes place with a quick reflux of your cannabinoids in the presence of any H+ source (acid).

1. Treat your stuff as if it were a volatile solvent or critical fluid extraction.
2. With the remaining resin, dissolve it in a non-polar solvent. Be sure to use one that separates easily from water such as naphia or white gas.
3. Treat this mixture with sulphuric or hydrochloric acid until a pH around 1-2 is reached (approximately one drop of concentrated acid per gram of extract).
4. Place this in a reflux apparatus and cook it for about an hour. In case you¡¦re not familiar this is basically just Pyrex breaker with a large looped tube plugged into the top. This will cause the solution inside to be exposed to elevated pressures as well as temperatures, as well as preserving all of the original contents. Simply simply boiling the mixture in a small strong covered vessel can mimic it.
5. Wash what¡¦s left with water, keep the oil layer.
6. Neutralize your mix (bring it to pH 7.0) with a little Sodium Hydroxide solution (pH 9.0) or baking soda then rewash it with water. Save the oil layer again.
7. Allow your oil to evaporate and you should be left with a sticky amber liquid that contains almost pure THC.

I would recommend an extraction for a starting point, since if you start clean your product can only get much better. Once you¡¦ve obtained nearly pure THC, converting it to an acetate is supposed to produce more psychedelic like effects.

More THC analog modifications can be made (to yield pure ƒ´9 or ƒ´6 THC), but generally the consumption of the original products in these reactions makes them hardly worth while (usually 5-20% yeild, so it may be half as psychoactive but you have 5 times as much of it in the beginning).

from cannabis.com

Cannabinoids are chemicals apparently unique to cannabis, consisting of THC, CBN and CBD, and a set of relatives with similar effects, THCV, CBV and CBDV. Many plants contain both sets of chemicals, and in common practice only the first set of abbreviations are used. THC is responsible for the ``high�� the plant produces, and there are several different versions of THC from different plants. CBN is said to increase the THC effect slightly, and CBD actually blocks the THC effect. CBD can be converted into THC by treating extracted oil with sulfuric acid, a step in the oil trade called ``isomerization��.

from some ozzie growers forum Scuzz credit maybe?


Sulfuric and Hydrochloric are too strong an acid to use for such an application and when diluted they still have the same effect only lessened. Both Sulfuric and Hydrochloric will turn your oil to a puddle of slimey substance(like thickened honey only clear with white patches) and if you're going straight from green, it will also strip the chlorophyll straight out and leave you with nothing buy a skeleton and green slushy oil.

Whereas when using diluted Sodium Hydroxide(5% max) it will allow you to isomerize completely without having to worry about burning your product, and your internal organs when you inject/smoke the product.

You can even crystallize the oil from Sodium Hydroxide, and smoke some nice clear/amber crystals. Trust me, one 0.02 gram crystal of D9-THC will give you some of the strongest hallucinogenic effects you'll ever feel.

First you extract the oil, usually solvent extraction works the best as you can gain the last of the oil.
Then to the oil you add anhydrous ethanol or isopropyl alcohol(rubbing alcohol) to the oil, about twice as much as you have oil.
Then add a diluted solution of sodium hydroxide until the PH is about 7-8(neutral)
Let the solution evaporate and you will be left with some very pure very nice oil, or if you take it a step further and vacuum distill the solution to get a very clear, liquid.
Personally, it's not worth the effort. Although it can make Marijuana last a very long time. It's just the simplicity of being able to dip your finger in and lick your finger to get stoned.



The effects of THC acetate are suspected to be different than those of THC. Has anyone here tried THC acetate to confirm this?
So basically you grind your grass, foilage, etc, use appoximately 20g of anhydrous methanol for every gram of suspected oil.
Extract 3x, reduce volume 1/3 via distillation.
Perform the isomerization at refluxing temp (65c) by titration of sulferic acid (1 drop per 1 gram of extract)
Allow this to cool and add an equal amount of distilled water
Take a non-polar, petroleum ether or toulene, and add an equal volume to the water/organic layer and mix all the phases extensively.
Allow this to settle and tap off non-polar layer in a sep funnel
Repeat this extraction of the organic layer 1 more time using 25% less non-polar. Then combine the non polars.
Wash the non polar with 4 volumes of 5% sodium bi carbonate and 1 gram of sodium bi carb in 20g's of distilled water (dh2o) Mix.
Allow this mix to settle then tap off non polar phase again. DIscard the aquous phase.
Wash with another equal amount of distilled water and let seperate.
Tap off non polar again, and evaporate this by fan, or by rotovap, or by distillation or by distillation under high vacuum or by nuclear explosion.
You will then be left with hash oil in which all CBD's have turned into THC and THC to Delta-9-THC by means of isomerization.
This hash oil can then be vacuum distilled under high vacuum to afford a clear oil, according to ScuzZ.

 

[Keefhead]

thanks for reading and for the laughs.
.
.
.
and is included in this discussion more as an educational exercise.
.
.
.

Yeah, right, if I understood 1%. But I'll keep reading and, hopefully learning. You really have my attention with the 0.02 gram comment. Man, that's not a bowlful.

 

[Sub Nl]

Some updates from 'hashmonkey' , And i would never advocate the selling, dealing, shipping of illegal substances. BUT imo thc isn't illegal, the world is just wrong. make nicotine and alcohol illegal too, then we'll talk.

"Thanks man! I think people like it... I don't much feel like joining, but could you tell them that soon I will be bottling it in discrete packages as THC spray? It makes it so that youcan spray it in a drink, on food, on your tongue, on a bowl, in a cigar, or on a hotknife. It will get you FUCKED at a very low *****. I estimate potency increases 4x over just smoking the initial product, and i'll be using shake. It is purified by the step of mixing water with the xylene/isomerized oil solution, so using shake does not really affect thc/cbd ratio."

"Oh and please tell them that isomerization IS worth it and is necessary since it is meant to be dissolved in ethanol and used as THC spray or tincture, it combats the lazy stoner effects of ingesting weed as opposed to smoking it."

EEK. I've kinda stepped on business toes for doing this. I hope you all appreciate the lesson in how to make the essence for free. And for all of that can't do the science, ie 95% of us, then maybe the internet could help somehow....

c'mon put your wizard hats on

sub

 

[Farmer John]

"Yeah dude, thanks for the support, i appreciate it. Yes, this method is known to the old schoolers and o'g'ers. Appartently, old issues of High Times used to have a machine in the ad pages for sale that called itself and isomeriser. I had a scan through a few and couldn't find anything. I'm sure there must be some info of this device in the web somewhere.

Yeah, silly would be the right word here. We're taking THC over near the mushroom field, but in a very mild way. "

I too remember old HT having these ads about isomerisers to make oil that is much more psychoactive, and what my father and his friends tell me is that back in late 60's/70's the oil that they got here was more liquid-like and much more potent, more psychoactive is a better term, modern oil like bho etc. just tends to give me the same effect than good hash, the way the tell the oldskool oil used to work was like the onset of a mushroom trip, with very small doses.. and not many concentrates have given me that effect, some pure sativas maybe, it would be great to use some afruican/indian sativas for making oil like this I guess, the trichomes from these varieties seem to have much more of the cannabinoids etc. that make the herb/hash much more minbending/trippy/psychoactive than typical indicaxsativa-dutch/european/american crosses etc....anyway, enough rambling, would be great to try out some of it someday..

 

[cooked cook]

hmmmm, interesting

hmmmm, interesting

Wow...some serious stoner science here!
FJ, I remember the isomerizer ads you mention. In fact, I have an old HT with ads for 2 different isomerizers, in which both ads rag on the other machine, calling it crap
Whereas this seems like a lot of work for a small ammount, I could see where it would be a bit more worth all the trouble with larger batches.
Interesting stuff!
I'd like to see someonbe do a thread using one of these oldschooly isomerizer machines. Hell, I seem to remember someone at one of the sites mentioning having one of these in their attic
cc

 

[Farmer John]

Yeah man, and now that I think of it i saw a pic here by someone showing these gadgets...very interesting indeed..

 

[gaiusmarius]

very interesting thread, i'd love to try some of that end product, sounds amazing. just rather complicated to make. maybe if i re read this thread 5 times i might start to get the idea lol.

peace out
gm

 

[jimbob420]

I read on OG before that the isomizer was no different than redissolving the bho mix in iso and then running it through a carbon filter. It gives you a more reddish oil but other than that it is not much different....

 

[Guest]

Sub Nl, stop wasting your time.

 

[Guest]

I'm getting lost in my thoughts with this thread

SatGhost : I interpretated it as Sub Nl has already finished isomerization ? ? ?

gaiusmarius : I know for sure that 5 times ain't enough to get me there. I hope for you that you get there earlier and wishes you much strenght en courage. 'Cause either way : it's a killah thread.

Let's go to the third round reading.

I noticed that some there memory started to work again. As being a young old fart I only remember some stories from the old smoke brotha's about very strong ~in a psychedelic way~ oil.
I do also remember an oil fanatic from OG, named Motorhippie. In the last days that OG was up, Motorhippie told us a story about goin' to Amsterdam and buying a book : Cannabis Alchemy, which included a recipe to increase the potency twice. Some weeks ago I asked him if he had been succesfull with it, but he hasn't try it out, cuz he had difficulties to buy acetic anhydride.
Pics posted by Motorhippie on OG :

Right now I think it's the same technique that Sub Nl describes here.
Hoping on some enlightment around this tek to clear my view.


_ ° 0 _

 

[Sub Nl]

very interesting thread, i'd love to try some of that end product, sounds amazing. just rather complicated to make. maybe if i re read this thread 5 times i might start to get the idea lol.

peace out
gm

It is too complicated for it's own good, the need for lab equipment is a good sign of that.

Good luck when you try. and remember safety first.

Sub Nl, stop wasting your time.

Dear mr coast to coast,

please stop posting in my thread. on the other hand, if you want to 'contribute' then please feel free.

btw, what should i do with my time if i wasn't wasting it? I operate in 'subbytime' anyways. High on sativas, hiding behind my oakley's, watching the weeks disappear. the worlds a joke anyways, who are you to tell me what to do, spunky?

I read on OG before that the isomizer was no different than redissolving the bho mix in iso and then running it through a carbon filter. It gives you a more reddish oil but other than that it is not much different....

Lol, i wish the original poster of that comment was here to talk to. but thanks for relaying the information.

I don't know 'shit' about this machine, I think it just the equilivant of the refluxing stage in my process. The machine may help, but until i see it, know what it does or doesn't do, i can't comment. I think advertising for them was banned though.

If you noticed the 2nd revision of the process, adds a carbon filter step?

I'd imagine that just taking BHO, redissolving it oil, or running it through a carbon filter alone wouldn't be enough to complete this process. (or make a difference)

Thinking about this machine. I bet it's along the same outdated methodolgy's as the 70's recipes. times have changed.

Motorhippie told us a story about goin' to Amsterdam and buying a book : Cannabis Alchemy, which included a recipe to increase the potency twice. Some weeks ago I asked him if he had been succesfull with it, but he hasn't try it out, cuz he had difficulties to buy acetic anhydride.
Pics posted by Motorhippie on OG :

Yeah, i rate D.Gold, Starting point for a lot of this science. And i wish some overgrow chemists would read this.

"The first reaction, Cannabidiol --> Delta-9 THC, is, I think, what is generally referred to as isomerization. This can occur in an absolute ethanol solution with .05% HCL boiled for 2 hours (the "hash" oil is in solution in the ethanol, obviously). The increase in potency you'll get depends on the relative amounts of Cannabidiol and THC in the original oil. If there were 1 part THC and 1 part Cannabidiol, then you might expect a doubling of potency after isomerization.

The second reaction, Delta-1/9 --> Delta-6/8, is an additional step to get the allegedly more potent higher-rotating form of THC. It requires more vigorous conditions. D. Gold notes that in a toluene solution with p-toluenesulfonic acid for 10 hours at 100 degrees C there is a 90% conversion rate of Delta-1 to Delta-6 (the THC/hash oil is in solution in the toluene)."

tosic acids? toluene? 10 hours refluxing? Sounds like my method.

Any chance you could get Motorhippie to check this thread please? ANd did he buy his book from Sensi Seeds? They have the best collection.

sub

just found this link

http://www.beyond-the-illusion.com/...-Archive/drugs/faqs/FAQ-Clandestine-Chemistry

talks about the books, hype about chemistry. seems to rate Dr.Gold and Isomerization though.

and about acetic:

http://scifun.chem.wisc.edu/chemweek/AceticAcid/AceticAcid.html