Isomerization of Honey Oil - budder

[Sub Nl]

Hi all,

I think a few people think that 'iso', is honey oil made from isopropyol alochol, made in a similar fashion to bho. soak it let it evaporate, smoke oil. BUT

Isomerization (forgive spelling), is an additional chemical step that converts the delta 9-thc, to delta 6-thc. activating a lot of the normally non-active cannibaloids, making the high more psycadellic. like sativas are more head high, and 'laughy', isomerizised oil is almost 99% pure thc, even shake becomes this strong. bho is about 70% thc, bubble hash from buds 30/50%, white russian 22%; obviously the difference between chemical extraction / enrichment of thc Vs. the thc content of trichome, origins of crystal, etc. anyway the science:

Materials:
-xylene (found in paint/solvent areas of hardware stores)
-shake or buds
-p-toluenesulfonic (tosic) acid
-mason jar
-hot plate
-set of beakers
-watchglass
-distilled water
-separatory funnel
-paper filter
-hot plate or precision outdoor electric stove
-NaHCO3 (baking soda)
-pH test strips (or ph test kit)

1. Dry, chill, and finely grind shake and put it in a mason jar.

2. Pour enough chilled xylene into the mason jar that the shake is covered by it or begins to float.

3. Shake for 5 minutes, let it sit overnight (you may shake periodically), and pour it through a filter. Collect shake from filter.

4. Shake for 5 minutes, let it sit overnight (you may shake periodically), and pour it through a filter into the same beaker with the liquid from step #3. Discard the shake or residue.

5. Boil off the xylene on the hot plate, making sure to stop as soon as honey oil begins to precipitate out or create long lasting bubbles. Allow to cool.

6. Add enough xylene to redissolve the precipitate.

7. Add <5% p-toluenosulphonic acid solution, drop by drop, until a pH of 2 is
reached. Test this by observing the appearance of a pH test strip under a definite pH of 2-3.

8. Place solution on the hot plate and place a watch-glass over top of the beaker. Reflux for 3-10 hours. Breaking it into multiple sections may or may not cause problems. It can also allow for stirring without loss of acid upon removal of the watch-glass.

9. Remove beaker from hot plate and allow to cool.

10. Drop by drop, add <5% NaHCO3 until a pH of 7.2 or decidedly above that is reached.

11. Add 3vol distilled water and 1vol xylene. Agitate.

12. Transfer to separatory funnel, allow it to settle, and drain off the bottom layer.

13. Add 3vol distilled water, agitate, and repeat step 13.

14. Repeat step 14 once more for purity.

15. Pour solution through filter with activated carbon on top.

16. Distill this solution at about 140C-150C to yield a large amount of“ (--)-(6aR,10aR)-6,6,6-dimethyl-3-pentyl-6a,7,8,10a-tetrahydro-7H-benzo[c]chromen-1-ol ”.

-Dissolve in eucalyptus oil or sesame oil to dilute. Drops under Tounge.

17. budder is whipping air and freezing isomerizied oil. Please note i read TUG's thread here and at reeferman's. the process is right, but budder is not made from bho, it's made from isomerized bho. big difference in quality and kind of high. DA kine had the iso budder. this is the secret step. making bho look like budder is not enough.

18. Send Subby some in mail ^_*
enjoy!!

p.s. credit to hashmonkey

edited, to update forumla

 

[Keefhead]

Quite a fancy process. But considering that, according to your stats, I can smoke two bowls of bubble - made with water - to match one bowl of yours - made with acids and bases and - well, no thanks.

Yeah, I know, comparing apples and oranges. And your method may be so safe they use it commercially, but I don't like commercial foods. What better second use for hydroponics than to grow fresh veggies?

But I ramble. Sorry. Must be my medicine.

 

[Sub Nl]

Gotta forgive the short term memory with us stoners. I usually think of something to research. launch new tab, open google. damn forgot.

Anyways, There is the organic Vs. chemical debate. Imo, i think it's all just THC anyway you look at it. I think changing the molecular structure to fit out thc receptors makes sense.

2 bowls of yours doesn't and can never equal one of mine. not wanting to sould elitest / snobby but delta-6 thc is a different drug, high to delta 9 thc.

If i smoke bud, i smoke g13 haze. 14 week flower. grown in soil. ladybirds and no chemicals. I also live in amsterdam, and avoid the commercial scene.

BTW, what i talk of is not commercial, can never be (oil is illegal here in NL), is dangerous to make, ie do this OUTDOORS, boom. but for some the high is unparralled.

There's a lot of hype, marketing, 'cups', with weed. The prodecure i share is for the best thc experience available. I share this because i've read the threads about budder and not seen the isomerization process mentioned.

you need to be a chemist to do this, but hey knowledge is power. people are not ready for what i have shared lol.

sub

 

[Keefhead]

If you live in A'dam then you have access to things I only dream of. Including hash for comparison that I'll never try. Not for lack of wanting to.

Yeah, the information you shared is over the head of many of us. But, for the chem majors and those in the know, I suspect it gives a real righteous product.

 

[Reign of Terror]

delta-6THC (also called delta-8THC) is 75% the potency of delt-1THC (delta 9-THC)

http://www.erowid.org/plants/cannabis/cannabis_chemistry2.shtml

so that is pretty much pointless pal

 

[Sub Nl]

from the article that you quoted:

"This Delta-6 THC is a higher-rotating form of tetrahydrocannabinol.
D. Gold (author of Cannabis Alchemy) suggests that the higher-rotating
forms "are more potent than the low-rotating and produce a higher,
more psychedelic and spritual effect." He notes a study done by
Mechoulan (1970) which showed little difference between the
pharmacological effects of Delta-9 and Delta-6. I'll leave it to
the reader to experiment for him/herself."

the fact that isomerization purifies the delta 9thc to 99% purity and rotates the carbon chain to create delta 6thc, doesn't seem like a waste to me.

" Isomerization
>coverts cannabidiol and weak THCs to yer favorite #9. Anywhere from
>double to 5 times original potency."

You have to pepsi challenge it. some people can't tell the difference in beer ie fosters or Duvel. i'm saying make your own mind up.

if you make bubblehash from shake or even bottom bud, you end up with under developed psycho-active compounds, ie the trichomes could have a better thc ratio, and effect. Isomerization converts ALL cannabolids to delta 9!

re-read the article you posted for me, seems to back up what i'm saying. I'm going so far as to say my method is newer and improved. though essentially the same.

Me personally, i make BHO, -> jellyhash, and keef -> hash.

And for the comment about hashes in amsterdam as an comparison. unfortunately the coffeeshop scene is commercial and hyped. only reeferman (rifman) actually cares enough to pay farmers more not to rush-dry their product and to cure it. contaminents are commonplace, jelly hash has never seen oil. barney's rubble is just..PP isolator. :/

I do have a base for comparison, there are some crazy thc junkies here. jon from grey area being my fave dude. he likes to get higher and higher. i always take a batch of my chemistry down for the smoke. boom shiva.

regardless of the organic supporters, this is posted for those who need a good source isomerization info.

It's 11am on a sunny amsterdam morning. a rarity of late. coffee, shower, bong, then to vondel, wester, ooster and rembrandt parks i think. crush some more keef in my shoe. hey life is good, just realised im rambling...

sub

 

[malkop_zolkop]

First of all, Sub NL, it was a news group discussion, NOT an article of note. I tend to be sceptical about absolute truths found on usenet, and to an extent forums which are now pretty much like usenet in bringing hearsay, urban legend and plain lunacy to the fore.
That being said, don't take it up the wrong way but you aren't really quoting your source here. Specifically with respect to this statement:

2 bowls of yours doesn't and can never equal one of mine. not wanting to sould elitest / snobby but delta-6 thc is a different drug, high to delta 9 thc.

I like where you are going with this technique, but if you are going to make brash statements, lets see some basis for the claims that are not anecdotal.
Reign of terror was absolutely correct in pasting the link which you failed to read correctly.
The last paragraph is an update made in 2002 in response to the Usenet thread first spawned in 1993.

Isomerization: The degradation of thc and related compondes. It has been proven through further study that Dr.Gold was incorrect in his findings that delta-6THC is stronger than delta-1. The latest findings I know of are from Leo Hollister in 1974 that I ran across in the book Hashish! by Robert Connell Clarke.
http://www.erowid.org/library/books/hashish.shtml
It states that delta-6THC is 75% the potency of delt-1THC. So Isomerizing at a higher ph at a mild tempature for a short time yeilds the best quilty oil.

Now, if you have some more insight and source documentation, by all means post it.
I for one do see a potential for this "tek" specifically in a scenario involve sub par trim stock, and immature plants. However if the science points to Delta-6 being 25% lower in potency, then it would prove time consuming in the processing of good quality oil.
If the oil is of a substantial quality, why waste time processing for minimal gains?
Firstly, cost vs gain is a negating factor, as is the safety concern. Secondly, I'm wondering if LEAs may attach extra charged for lab equipment associated with this "tek" (Legal folks, please chip in).
I'm now going to read through the links to see if I can make some more sense of this all.
Fantastic discussion, and thank the Lords of Cannabis for it. I was getting sick of shoe boxen and urine discussions.

 

[Sub Nl]

First of all, Sub NL, it was a news group discussion, NOT an article of note. I tend to be sceptical about absolute truths found on usenet, and to an extent forums which are now pretty much like usenet in bringing hearsay, urban legend and plain lunacy to the fore.

I agree, I tend to be skeptical about any information regardless of source. I'm also a cynical, realist which is like a double bullshit barrier. Even if the BBC, reuters, The goverment, people i respected, growers, breeders were all telling me one thing. i would still want to see it with my own eyes. And even if it all looked right, then i'd still only accept it as one possible correct answer or truth.

I believe in multiple answers and perspectives, (see infinitism under schools of philosopy). Point being, i don't even believe one study. At university i was told to examine research methods and validities. Marijuana research is shaky at best. fuck we don't even know enough about the long term effects of presciption drugs. Hey did you know our brain produces it's own cannibaloids in response to it anticipating possible brain truama, explains why we have thc receptors naturally huh? kinda like our opiate system. but OT i know.

with the advice that i am giving i am trying to stay balanced, though i'm obviously not. I was trying to encourage people to try and make up their own minds with respect to delta 6 thc. even the link that i quoted in a previous post hinted at a control group not being able to tell the difference between delta 9 and delta 6.

The comment about 2 bowls to 1 bowls was meant in this contrext., 2 bowls of indica cannot give sativa effect. 2 bowls of sativa cannot give delta 6 effect.

I would argue that it is very hard to quantify the effects of high potency THC ie bho, and isomerized. I knoked myself out for 6 hours mid-afternoon over the weekend by smoking oil. I would classify myself as a heavy smoker. Ie a lot of people in amsterdam won't smoke with me because they consider my joints too strong. chainsmoking pure sativa joints is not big or clever to me. my tolerance to thc is annoying... but i digress..

I think that if you can smoke my jelly with me and not pass out you're up for the challenge.

The main benefit of isomerization is that all cannabaloids get converted into the delta 9 thc that everyone here loves. that means 99% potencty from shake. If you make Ice/water/ Hash with shake you get low grade ice-so-later. if you isomerize shake it makes it twice as strong as THC made from pure bud/flower ice-so-lator. 4 to 5 times stronger for free!

Even if Delta 6 is 75% strength of delta 9. that is still acceptable to me. Even if sativas were 50% the strength of indicas i would still only smoke sativas. EVen if sativas took longer to flower, produced less and cost more $$$, i would still, hey you get the analogy. But look 15% thc shake gets converted to 99% thc shake, and then the 75% delta 6 is still compartatively stronger than any bubble, jelly, ice , keef available. And the high is different. to me the high is going more in the sativa direction which is why i like it.

strong sativas make you want to laugh at nothing, make you feel amped, energetic. even trip out. That to me is the start of the psychadellic effect of the delta 6. similar to how the chemistry changes in indica/sativa and flowering time.

But look at my method and look at the newsgroup method. Mine is scientific, proper equipment, times. The newsgroup one is still talking about using alochols and ethers....and homemade bong like dis-tillers. that shit is going to kill someone. mine uses flammable materials, because you need them, but look at the difference.

I read your comments about whether this is worthwhile or not because of the delta 6. please re-read the section concerning isomerization turning all non-active cannabolids, actively into delta 9. this leap in potency makes this method not only economical. but also yields the best quality product from the lowest quality starting material. delta 6 is a pleasant higher rotating carbon chain.

anyway, im probably rambling, feel free to bring me up on any points.

sub

PS. My old grandad used to piss on his roses to make them flower nicer. apparently the nitrates in the piss used to...hey maybe we should...if anyone ever told me they pissed on my b uds i was smoking, why i'd...It's bad enough when i pull my shoe hash out in the coffeeshops. people love it!, but only when they don't know how i've squished it. eh?

 

[dozer]

Great post Sub Nl! You are right this is way more scientific and properly equiped than any isomerization recipe I've read online.

So from the isomerization process you get a very concentrated oil witch is 99% THC (d6 or d9) and 0%CBD and other cannabinoids. In the end of the whole process do you really get more THC in weight then it would be in the original BHO (if you were isomerizing BHO) or some will be inevitably wasted in all the process?

Is it worth it? Is it worth it just for the diferent high (more sativa like) or does it last you more than regular BHO?

.

 

[malkop_zolkop]

Hell yeah, I'm gonna give this a shot. SubNL, Where would I find p-toluenesulfonic (tosic) acid?

Tosic Acid:
http://www.chemolink.com/buyersguide.php?product_id=4000&column_name=product&string=TOSIC+ACID

This came from google, so I don't know about the validity of the link, or the legal implications. Use at your own risk.

 

[malkop_zolkop]

I agree, I tend to be skeptical about any information regardless of source. I'm also a cynical, realist which is like a double bullshit barrier. Even if the BBC, reuters, The goverment, people i respected, growers, breeders were all telling me one thing. i would still want to see it with my own eyes. And even if it all looked right, then i'd still only accept it as one possible correct answer or truth.

Trimmed for brevity.
Still pretty much anecdotal, which is ok. One man's meat is another man's poison and all that.

You seem set on the Sativas, so how about looking at it from this perspective:
How much of this is "tek's success" is due to the occurence of THCV?

 

[Sub Nl]

Trimmed for brevity.
Still pretty much anecdotal, which is ok. One man's meat is another man's poison and all that.

You seem set on the Sativas, so how about looking at it from this perspective:
How much of this is "tek's success" is due to the occurence of THCV?

Yeah, i'm saying do your own research and make your own mind up.

I'm confused over your usage of the word 'tek' , please explain.

i looked up THCV (6aS,10aS)-6,6,9-trimethyl-3-propyl-6a,7,8,10a-
tetrahydro-6H-benzo[c]chromen-1-ol

looks like a friendly molecule, i dig the psychoactive part.

but i'll save the ramblings until i understand 'tek', i'll go off on tangent otherwise.

sub

 

[Sub Nl]

Great post Sub Nl! You are right this is way more scientific and properly equiped than any isomerization recipe I've read online.

So from the isomerization process you get a very concentrated oil witch is 99% THC (d6 or d9) and 0%CBD and other cannabinoids. In the end of the whole process do you really get more THC in weight then it would be in the original BHO (if you were isomerizing BHO) or some will be inevitably wasted in all the process?

Is it worth it? Is it worth it just for the diferent high (more sativa like) or does it last you more than regular BHO?

.

Thanks dude, i appreciate your comments, makes writing all this down worthwhile.

Yes you end up with highly concentrated thc oil, that is actually better than the sum of all it's parts.

I would say this procedure is worth it, but only if you feel comforable with the equipment, method and safety aspects. this is dangerous after all.

isomerizing activates normally non-active cannabaloids.

You'll know the quality if BHO varies due what plant is used, what parts of plant etc.. like good BHO comes from sativa flowers only. Butane extraction strips thc from cyrstals. Isomerization, will then super charge this oil. (especially if bho comes from trim)

Isomerization is worth studying...loving, fearing,

If you like bho, i would recommend this to you.

sub

sub

 

[PazVerdeRadical]

a bit off topic, but i took about 10 grams of so-called pop-corn buds and added them to a 500ml bottle of a traditional clear alcoholic drink, 40% alcohol, it has been macerating for 14 days now. you think putting a few drops of this under the tongue would have any good effects? thanks. peace.

 

[jimbob420]

I would like to see a picture of this stuff... and also isnt this just the same thing as that old as tool they sold back in the 70's called the isomizer or some such thing? I know someone else has heard of the isomizer

 

[malkop_zolkop]

Yeah, i'm saying do your own research and make your own mind up.

I'm confused over your usage of the word 'tek' , please explain.

i looked up THCV (6aS,10aS)-6,6,9-trimethyl-3-propyl-6a,7,8,10a-
tetrahydro-6H-benzo[c]chromen-1-ol

looks like a friendly molecule, i dig the psychoactive part.

but i'll save the ramblings until i understand 'tek', i'll go off on tangent otherwise.

sub

"tek" is merely what most folks on shroomery and mycotopia contract technique to. I am not fond of contractions, but I seem to have caught that disease.
Sorry for the confusion.

 

[Guest]

MZ is quite correct, isomerization is a waste of time. cannabidiol is virtually absent from modern drug-type cannabis cultivars.

 

[malkop_zolkop]

Well I didn't say it in so many words, but the absence of any major proof is pretty much all the answer needed. I'm curious. That is all.
Anyway, CBD is an important part of medical cannabis, and while I am not a medical user, I do believe that CBD has some important properties that are quite beneficial to the average smoker. For instance, if I feel anxious... I smoke. CBD takes the edge off.
If I feel sick. I smoke. CBD takes the edge off of that pukey feeling.

Now, if it was a way to reverse the oxidation of THC into CBN... Hell then that would be something.

In otherwords, yeah great it converts CBD. But where is the documented evidence that this is a good thing? When there is a heap on info pointing to the benefits of CBD.

 

[Farmer John]

Very interesting, Reeferman told us that some old geezers do make concentrates that are very potent and I guess this is the way to do it? I could be wrong ok but I think he mentioned some methods of making hash/kif/oil that is so strong that its silly.

 

[malkop_zolkop]

cannabidiol is virtually absent from modern drug-type cannabis cultivars.

I'm not at all sure of this but I believe you may be onto something there.
I tend to find the CBD like effects when I smoke stuff like Malawi, DP, Swazi, more pronounced than when I smoke a bred indica.

You've given me something to read up about. Thanks. Like I don't have enough to do already.